The All Things Zach Wilson Thread: MERGED

[FidelioJet]

10 minutes ago, jgb said:

I don’t speak for him but please don’t rob me of the dopamine hits I get when I see in my notifications that you’ve given me the dirty down digit, the Nero salute, the ol’ Georgie Porgie.

 

You got it!

[jgb]

6 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I believe you want him to do well....but i believe you're blinded to when he does.

He hasn't been perfect...he hasn't been good most of the time...but if you're being honest he has shown clear progress.

Weeks 1-3 he had no chance - the OL was a mess

Week 4 - he was rookie of the week

Week 5 - bad first half, good second half - rallied the team and was in a position to win the game and likely would have if the D came up with a stop on 3rd and 12

Week 6 - two of his first three drives put the team in scoring position - missed FG, ball to the 1 and got hurt.

Week 11 - wins the game - bad two first drives - settled in and played good, conservative smart football - helping his team win the game.

His Int's have been way down - he has played smarter football.

He has to fix that short game thing - it's really bad...

But just saying he sucks - and hasn't done anything well and hasn't gotten better is simply untrue.  

This is a process - not an all of a sudden one day he's going to get it.  He's going to take small steps...two steps forward, one step back kinda thing...It's what should be expected. 

 

Im not blinded. I just don’t believe in flashes for any QB. The minimum NFL salary is $650,000. Anyone paid that (or in most cases many, many times more) to throw an oblate spheroid can flash. It’s the entry level job requirement. 
 

I need to see consistent quality to believe. Until then, I play the odds that most dudes don’t become FQBs. It doesn’t have to be complicated to be accurate. And it certainly isn’t personal. Except for Geno — I hate him.

[undertow]

Just now, jgb said:

Can’t blame them there. It would be like Arby’s taking out an ad to finally acknowledge that fast food roast beef is an absolute abomination against the laws of God and man.

I'm not talking about official Jets Youtube channels I'm talking about independent fan channels.....If this message board is considered negative these Youtubers are the opposite....it's like a bunch of fideliojets. lol

[More Cowbell]

12 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

 

Was it a conservative call?- for sure. 

But it's pretty standard in the NFL.  Especially when your running game has been pulling off chunk yardage all game and the defense playing shut-down.  

Did it work? Absolutely, they won the game.  The strategy worked.  So again, somehow, you come away with this as a knock on the QB. 

You really don''t see that as strange?

I'm sorry, the odds of that last running play getting the first down were maybe 5%. A pass had a much higher chance of success. As far as the defense, a million things could go wrong by giving them the ball back. A defender could fall down or run into each other and cut someone loose. There could be a long PI penalty, the punter could have shanked the kick and given them the ball at mid field. Going for the first down through the air is the call for at least 30 of the teams in the NFL. If the Texans were in that position, I am positive they are throwing there. 

Yeah, we won and it worked out bit that was not the call that should have been made unless the Saleh told the OC to keep it on the ground.

[jgb]

1 minute ago, undertow said:

I'm not talking about official Jets Youtube channels I'm talking about independent fan channels.....If this message board is considered negative these Youtubers are the opposite....it's like a bunch of fideliojets. lol

I misunderstood. I’m glad I finally got the roast beef thing off my chest, though.

[Jimmy 2 Times]

1 hour ago, HawkeyeJet said:

The only thing worthwhile to come out of Australia is Bluey

 

Burleigh Bars.  

I installed set of roller bars for my Harley last year. 

[GangGreened]

Geez I can’t wait until one year from now 

[undertow]

Just now, jgb said:

I misunderstood. I’m glad I finally got the roast beef thing off my chest, though.

I had Arbys for the first time in a decade a few months back the roast beef isn't what it used to be. lol

[jgb]

Just now, GangGreened said:

Geez I can’t wait until one year from now 

“Bum or Ruined?” Series 4.

[All Gas, No Gase]

Some of you are just proving to be haters. He mentioned a lot of bad Zach did which we all know about. He also pointed out a couple areas where he showed improvement. Except for one person in particular, most see a lot of problems Zach needs to work out. 

Chances are he will bust unless he dramatically improves. I don’t understand how a Jets fan react so negatively to any positive news about Zach.

[jgb]

1 minute ago, undertow said:

I had Arbys for the first time in a decade a few months back the roast beef isn't what it used to be. lol

Oh it’s exactly what it used to be. You’ve changed. Bet you don’t drink the same sh*t beer from high school, either.

[FidelioJet]

2 minutes ago, jgb said:

Im not blinded. I just don’t believe in flashes for any QB. The minimum NFL salary is $650,000. Anyone paid that (or in most cases many, many times more) to throw an oblate spheroid can flash. It’s the entry level job requirement. 
 

I need to see consistent quality to believe. Until then, I play the odds that most dudes don’t become FQBs. It doesn’t have to be complicated to be accurate. And it certainly isn’t person — except for Geno I hate him.

I’m not raking about flashes. I’m talking about progress.  

Did you see any forced deep balls Sunday? No

Did you see check downs when the initial read wasn’t there? Yes

did you see him throw the ball away when the deep ball wasn’t there? Yes

Thats clear progress from where he was. 
 

He still needs to make short throws accurately 

he still needs to get rid of the ball more quickly (although he was better this week of not running around - he did some of it, but not as often)

I just think you’re expecting to see him play like an all-pro one day. Like some light goes on and he’s an all-pro. 
ir doesn’t work that way. It’s small steps and they start to add up. Tough to even see week-over-week.  

[jgb]

2 minutes ago, All Gas, No Gase said:

Some of you are just proving to be haters. He mentioned a lot of bad Zach did which we all know about. He also pointed out a couple areas where he showed improvement. Except for one person in particular, most see a lot of problems Zach needs to work out. 

Chances are he will bust unless he dramatically improves. I don’t understand how a Jets fan react so negatively to any positive news about Zach.

Because it’s a lot less “hateful” (your word, not mine) to believe Wilson is dragging down the Jets than to believe roughly 100 players, coaches, staff, and executives are all failing Zach and responsible for his struggles.

[More Cowbell]

15 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Or maybe because you want to kill another 45 seconds?  I mean what the ****?  They were up 7 points. 

The Texans had literally done nothing on offense.  I think they had 2 1st downs in the 2nd half, both in the 3rd quarter.  They hadn't scored since like 2 minutes into the 2nd quarter.   The Texans needed a TD.  Making that sh*tty team drive the length of the field with only 20 seconds on the clock made way more sense than trying to go for it and potentially giving them the ball with a minute and already at a distance where Taylor could reach the end zone.

If the pass os an incomplete,  then you are still punting it and still making them drive 80 yards or more. I mean they had no time outs and if things were so one sided as you say, what was the danger in trying to throw and not give the ball back unless you thought,  let's  not risk a pick here. 

[jgb]

2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I’m not raking about flashes. I’m talking about progress.  

Did you see any forced deep balls Sunday? No

Did you see check downs when the initial read wasn’t there? Yes

did you see him throw the ball away when the deep ball wasn’t there? Yes

Thats clear progress from where he was. 
 

He still needs to make short throws accurately 

he still needs to get rid of the ball more quickly (although he was better this week of not running around - he did some of it, but not as often)

I just think you’re expecting to see him play like an all-pro one day. Like some light goes on and he’s an all-pro. 
ir doesn’t work that way. It’s small steps and they start to add up. Tough to even see week-over-week.  

I can’t believe in a QB until he demonstrates at minimum a satisfactory degree of touch and placement on short and intermediate WCO concept routes. Sorry, just haven’t seen it. At least not yet.

[FidelioJet]

2 minutes ago, jgb said:

I can’t believe in a QB until he demonstrates at minimum a satisfactory degree of touch and placement on short and intermediate WCO concept routes. Sorry, just haven’t seen it. At least not yet.

Fair post.  
That’s all I ask.  It’s the constant he sucks stuff that drives me crazy. Already call him a bust, wanting to bench him etc.   
 
Don’t believe in him yet. It’s a reasonable position.  

i see it differently but can understand that position.  

[GangGreened]

11 minutes ago, jgb said:

“Bum or Ruined?” Series 4.

We’ll likely be looking at new QBs and the usual suspects will be pointing out “flashes” from Zach which are just a few routine NFL passes

but I’d be happier if they ended up being right 

[Hex]

25 minutes ago, undertow said:

Jets Youtube channels are basically Zach Wilson and Joe Douglas hero worship.

Except Colin Cowturd, except that might just be to cover up his Darnold relationship

[#27TheDominator]

20 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

If the pass os an incomplete,  then you are still punting it and still making them drive 80 yards or more. I mean they had no time outs and if things were so one sided as you say, what was the danger in trying to throw and not give the ball back unless you thought,  let's  not risk a pick here. 

if the pass is incomplete then you add 40 seconds to the clock.  You're giving them 200% more time.  I was literally the Daryl Lamonica of U21 coaches and I would have done the same.  

[More Cowbell]

4 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

if the pass is incomplete then you add 40 seconds to the clock.  You're giving them 200% more time.  I was literally the Daryl Lamonica of U21 coaches and I would have done the same.  

You can have it both ways. You jist posted how Houston had not done anything the entire half, now you are worried about 40 seconds. By this tway of thinking, we probably get the ball back after they go 4 and out

[Hex]

3 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

You can have it both ways. You jist posted how Houston had not done anything the entire half, now you are worried about 40 seconds. By this tway of thinking, we probably get the ball back after they go 4 and out

Even if they don't do anything for the whole half, for some reason teams surge or melt down in the final seconds, so 40 seconds is a ton

[Peace Frog]

Just now, More Cowbell said:

You can have it both ways. You jist posted how Houston had not done anything the entire half, now you are worried about 40 seconds. By this tway of thinking, we probably get the ball back after they go 4 and out

Past performance is no guarantee of future returns. 

You NEVER leave time on the clock. You always try to bleed as much time as possible. 

How is this thread still a thing? 

[Uncle Nicco]

31 minutes ago, jgb said:

I can’t believe in a QB until he demonstrates at minimum a satisfactory degree of touch and placement on short and intermediate WCO concept routes. Sorry, just haven’t seen it. At least not yet.

Watch his college career, pre season, weeks 1-4 for the accuracy you want. He’s got the yips right now. 

[Peace Frog]

Just now, Hex said:

Even if they don't do anything for the whole half, for some reason teams surge or melt down in the final seconds, so 40 seconds is a ton

I can’t believe folks are still arguing this point. Unless the entire premise of your argument is to dump on our rookie QB.  

RUN RUN RUN PUNT. 

Geezuz. 

[Hal N of Provo]

On 11/29/2021 at 10:50 AM, rangerous said:

wasn't wilson an only so-so college qb before his final year at byu?  he worked on his game and had a stellar year.  the same can happen to him with the jets.  i think we'll find out in a few more games if he can be the guy they want.

Nah.  Lots of crap gets parroted here so much it’s accepted as fact.  
 

I can’t remember who said it, but someone said they thought he’d win the job and be a 1st round pick before the season started his freshmen year.  BYU doesn’t let freshmen win the QB job or have 1st round picks, so I didn’t believe it, but he had buzz early at BYU.  

Bowl game his freshman season:

On 11/29/2021 at 11:13 AM, Saul Goodman said:

If we’re being honest, neither Sanchez nor Darnold were this bad as rookies. Zach is missing receivers by 3-5 yards at times. Bouncing balls off the turf. It’s Tim Tebow caliber accuracy. 

It would behoove Joe Douglas to start thinking about competition next season. Bring in another rookie or a vet with upside and have them complete with Zach in training camp. It would be irresponsible, and unfair to the other players, to automatically grant Zach the starting quarterback position for 2022. 

Zach had a head scratcher short throw probably once a game his senior season.  It’s the price of the weird angle thing.  I think he’ll clean it up, but I see Tom Brady make bad throws sometimes too.  

11 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Agreed that Moore is invisible when Zach is playing quarterback and we can’t draw any correlation from that.

Moore is WAYYY better when he lines up on the inside.  

11 hours ago, T0mShane said:

He was targeted 8 times, corralled four of them, and had the other four bounced to him. Even on the play he slipped, he would have had the TD if Zach waited a fraction of a second. I think Moore skulking off the field in the first half when Zach threw a worm-burner at his feet was a pretty good indicator of Moore’s opinion about whom he’d prefer play QB for the NYJ.

Zach haters like to make stuff up.  Show me video of 4 worm burners to Moore.  (Sorry in advance for any drops you will see that don’t fit your narrative as you look for it.)

9 hours ago, CanadaSteve said:

As of right now, we pick 4-5, with Seattle's pick being the first.  We could legitimately have two top ten picks, and 4 in the top 50.  

It might be worth taking another QB and having a QB competition.  Best QB wins.  Again, if Arizona got a #1 on the potential of Josh Rosen, we could get that for Zach.  The only problem is, are the QB's coming out next year worth a 1st?  Howell, Rattler, Slovis....they have all seemed to disappear this year.  Is Matt Corral any better a prospect than Wilson was?  

While I was razzing you about being a homer after we had won the game in your Russel Wilson thread, I too wonder about Zach.  This is why I think you have to draft and let them sit.  For every Hubert that makes a seamless jump from college to the NFL, 10 of them fail.  They don't get a chance to actually learn because there is no minor league system in the NFL.  Its sink or swim, and most of them sink.  

Trading Zach to a good team would be great for him.  The Jets suck.  I believe they will get better and this is going to work, but if they dump Zach I’ll laugh my ass off when they get the Elway/Eli treatment from the next Rookie QB. 

[Hex]

5 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

I can’t believe folks are still arguing this point. Unless the entire premise of your argument is to dump on our rookie QB.  

RUN RUN RUN PUNT. 

Geezuz. 

I honestly don't know what the original argument was, I just jumped in randomly. Probably shouldn't have done that

[#27TheDominator]

14 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

You can have it both ways. You jist posted how Houston had not done anything the entire half, now you are worried about 40 seconds. By this tway of thinking, we probably get the ball back after they go 4 and out

I truly have no idea what you are talking about.  You are winning you shorten the game.  You are losing you lengthen it.  Their O hadn't do anything, so you want to give them another 6 or 7 plays to heave it deep?  It makes zero sense.  None.  It's coaching 101.  If the OC sees something that he KNOWS he can take advantage of, okay.  I'm not going to crucify a pass attempt, but the idea that the ONLY reason to run is because you distrust the QB is asinine. With a capital ASS.  The drive prior they let him throw a bunch of times and they were up 4.  

[Peace Frog]

1 minute ago, Hex said:

I honestly don't know what the original argument was, I just jumped in randomly. Probably shouldn't have done that

Yeah me too. Seems to be a continuation of the “if you’re afraid to let your QB throw you don’t have a QB” nonsense thread. 

Let’s not play to win the game, let the dude everyone was sh*tting on for playing hero ball earlier in the season….play hero ball. 

Rather than just play like a normal NFL team trying to run out the clock. 

Moronic. 

[Peace Frog]

3 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I truly have no idea what you are talking about.  You are winning you shorten the game.  You are losing you lengthen it.  Their O hadn't do anything, so you want to give them another 6 or 7 plays to heave it deep?  It makes zero sense.  None.  It's coaching 101.  If the OC sees something that he KNOWS he can take advantage of, okay.  I'm not going to crucify a pass attempt, but the idea that the ONLY reason to run is because you distrust the QB is asinine. With a capital ASS.  The drive prior they let him throw a bunch of times and they were up 4.  

Do you enjoy banging your head against a wall?

It was 100% the correct strategic decision. 

[More Cowbell]

13 minutes ago, Hex said:

Even if they don't do anything for the whole half, for some reason teams surge or melt down in the final seconds, so 40 seconds is a ton

All the more reason not to give them the ball back. Look, I get that we won and I'm happy for that but imo, the CS made a statement about how much they trusted Zack. I dare to say every other team tries to end the game with a first down

[More Cowbell]

17 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

Past performance is no guarantee of future returns. 

You NEVER leave time on the clock. You always try to bleed as much time as possible. 

How is this thread still a thing? 

Well, you're  still here. 

[Peace Frog]

Just now, More Cowbell said:

Well, you're  still here. 

Waiting for my Shanghai pork to sear. 
 

 

[Uncle Nicco]

1 minute ago, More Cowbell said:

All the more reason not to give them the ball back. Look, I get that we won and I'm happy for that but imo, the CS made a statement about how much they trusted Zack. I dare to say every other team tries to end the game with a first down

I honestly question if you’ve watched football before this year. No team in their right mind throws the ball in that situation. 

[More Cowbell]

10 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I truly have no idea what you are talking about.  You are winning you shorten the game.  You are losing you lengthen it.  Their O hadn't do anything, so you want to give them another 6 or 7 plays to heave it deep?  It makes zero sense.  None.  It's coaching 101.  If the OC sees something that he KNOWS he can take advantage of, okay.  I'm not going to crucify a pass attempt, but the idea that the ONLY reason to run is because you distrust the QB is asinine. With a capital ASS.  The drive prior they let him throw a bunch of times and they were up 4.  

Sorry, I just don't  agree with giving them the ball and a chance to score when you have an opportunity  to get one first down and it's over. 

[More Cowbell]

4 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

Waiting for my Shanghai pork to sear. 
 

 

Making tuna steaks here.