Calijah Kancey, DT, Pitt

[bitonti]

I'm not the first to suggest this, but I think this player deserves his own thread. 

For years the Jets have been hamstrung by the idea of the 3-4 defense - that the DT/DE had to have a certain size and length to occupy blockers while the LBs make the plays

Under Saleh, the Jets have become an attacking 4-3, with Quinnen Williams getting doubled most of the time on passing downs

There are alot of threads talking about OT and WR at 13. And that very well might happen.

 

But let's imagine the Jets taking Calijah Kansey at 13, just for a moment.

He's a physical freak, #9 on Bruce Feldman's freak list, to be exact. But unlike Mazi Smith (#1 freak from Michigan), Kancey impacts the box score. 

Kancey ran a 4.67 at Indy, the fastest time for a DT since 2003. But he's not just fast. He's also verted 32" and benched 425 for scouts last year

Calijah Kancey is young, a red-shirt junior. He's not like a Nathan Shepherd 25-year-old. JD Loves size/speed guys, and Kancey has an insane ratio.

He's also the first defensive tackle to make unanimous All-American since Aaron Donald. Another undersized Pitt DT, another 13 pick, as it goes

but Bitonti, I hear you asking, isn't Kancey too small to be such a high pick? 

Long story short, no. You don't use a high draft pick on DT to stop the run. It's about the pass rush in the first round, where Kancey makes his money. 

He won't be your nose tackle on 4th and Short, but like Donald, John Randle, Ed Oliver, and even Joe Klecko, Kansey has the leverage to get under these heavy-legged waist-bending guards. He's making plays going around people, not through them. Saleh's defense will send him through a gap, and that's what he does best. Kancey has rare first-step quickness that you can't teach. He's like a DT with borderline RB skills. 

And as for need, this is a massive hole on the roster, with Rankins and Shepherd gone and Solomon Thomas penciled in as a starter. Unlike OT and WR, this player would be handed a starting job based purely on the depth chart. 

You've probably had enough of my verbals. So here's some video. Check it out, it's impressive stuff.

 

Note that the NYJ themselves put the video of Kancey running his 40 on their site. Probably not an accident. 

https://www.newyorkjets.com/video/dl-calijah-kancey-pittsburgh-runs-a-4-67-second-40-yard-dash-at-2023-nfl-combine

 

Here's a 7 min highlight of his best plays at Pitt

 

 

[LAD_Brooklyn]

21 hours ago, bitonti said:

I'm not the first to suggest this, but I think this player deserves his own thread. 

I'm not sure if I'm the first but I have been the most vocal. Not sure why others are scared to jump on board. Glad to see another believer to spread the gospel. 

Your 100% right. This isn't similar to the past in which we drafted 5 techniques DT/DE. Kancey is a pass rush demon. 

This season he earned a 92.4 (!) pass rushing grade and an insane 22.7 pass rush win rate. 

For comparison 

Jalen Carter 16.3%

Bryan Bresee 14.5%

Mazi Smith 11.4%

Keeanu Benton 13.3%

Siaki Ika 12.2%

Gervon Dexter Sr. 8.5% 

The one red flag about him in his arm length. 

"It's all scheme specific. If you're running a one-gap penetrating kinda scheme, arm length is significantly less important. If you're running a two-gap scheme, though, where you're asking your linemen to manipulate blockers, arm length becomes EXTREMELY important."

So if we were to clean house and switch coaches and scheme, Kancey would become a huge liability for the next coaching staff.

It also unfortunate that we're negotiating with Q-Will regarding an extension with only one other DTs on the roster with the other one being Thomas :-(. That's not say we should draft a DT to help with negotiation with Q as I can see someone misquoting me, just bringing up the obvious. 

[Dcat]

Yup...  his draft position likely out of rd 1 due to size.   My gut reaction is, as you said, tied to the old size issue cause I'd feel better with Mazi or Benton for sure.  You make some excellent points here, BTW.  Thanks.  Too much of my thinking here was definitely old fashioned.  A lot to consider.  Good post

[jetstream23]

Wouldn't both Quinnen and Kancey be attacking 3-Tech type DTs?  I know Saleh loves to attack and rush the passer but any team with a good rushing attack, big OL and a power-blocking scheme might salivate when looking at the Jets starting a 281 lb. DT next to QW.  Derrick Henry might rush for 4.7  (that's miles) during the game. lol

 

[RedBeardedSavage]

I actually love it. I started watching YouTube clips of him after the combine and yea, I'm just a dude who watches YouTube clips but I like Kancey a lot.

Investing heavily into pass-rushing d-lineman, wherever they play, seems wise.

Granted, I'd still take Paris Johnson over Kancey, but that's probably it.

[bitonti]

3 hours ago, Dcat said:

Yup...  his draft position likely out of rd 1 due to size. 

My guess is not only will he be a first Rd pick he's a decent bet for top 20

 

[bitonti]

3 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

Wouldn't both Quinnen and Kancey be attacking 3-Tech type DTs?  I know Saleh loves to attack and rush the passer but any team with a good rushing attack, big OL and a power-blocking scheme might salivate when looking at the Jets starting a 281 lb. DT next to QW.  Derrick Henry might rush for 4.7  (that's miles) during the game. lol

 

QW is diverse and can play the nose if needed. It's a different way of thinking from what Jets fans are used to 

They don't stop the run with pure bulk anymore.

They scheme the players into the right spot through slants and stunts and the players make plays. It's aggressive not just sitting back "read and react" 

They send the players to a spot with intention and players like kansey have the leverage to get there 

Because let's be real kansey is giving up 50 pounds on the college level too. These clips are against Tennessee and Miami big time programs. But he's still very effective in the run. 

Not that you draft a guy in Rd 1 for run stopping. You draft him as a sack merchant 

[Dcat]

34 minutes ago, bitonti said:

My guess is not only will he be a first Rd pick he's a decent bet for top 20

 

Ok, You surely might be right. But that's not where he is going in all the mocks.  Occasional 1st.  I like the prospect.  You don't have to convince me.  

[LAD_Brooklyn]

4 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

Wouldn't both Quinnen and Kancey be attacking 3-Tech type DTs?  I know Saleh loves to attack and rush the passer but any team with a good rushing attack, big OL and a power-blocking scheme might salivate when looking at the Jets starting a 281 lb. DT next to QW.  Derrick Henry might rush for 4.7  (that's miles) during the game. lol

 

Kancey is no push over and can hold his own. This is more of a general question regarding a guy his weights being able to defend against the run rather then pointing out a particular series of plays in which he's failed to defend the run. Also keep in mind he's replacing Rankins not  Kris Jenkins. Rankins has sucked vs the run both seasons as a Jets and was at the very least a good pass rusher the final year. Which made wonders as fare as Q-Wills producing this season. He's also short with a low center of gravity. But in a short yardage situation, it's better to kick him out to DE or sub him out until he proves otherwise. 

[Barton]

So jets gonna pay Quinnen 20+ mill a year and then draft the same position with a top 15 pick and sign him to a big deal if he pans out, tying up 40-50 mill in defensive tackles? How about no. 

[jetstream23]

7 hours ago, Barton said:

So jets gonna pay Quinnen 20+ mill a year and then draft the same position with a top 15 pick and sign him to a big deal if he pans out, tying up 40-50 mill in defensive tackles? How about no. 

Kancey would be on a 4-year rookie deal (with 5th year option) slotted to the middle of Round 1.  If QW signs a longterm deal + Kancey works out then QW might be tradable in Year 3 or Year 4 of his new deal, just in time to extend Kancey.  That's how I would think about it.  If anything, drafting Kancey creates optionality and maybe even some leverage down the line.

[bitonti]

7 hours ago, Barton said:

So jets gonna pay Quinnen 20+ mill a year and then draft the same position with a top 15 pick and sign him to a big deal if he pans out, tying up 40-50 mill in defensive tackles? How about no. 

Aaron Donald was 6'1" 280 and 3x DPOY, 7x All Pro, 9x Pro Bowl 

I believe the Rams had a significant portion of their cap tied up in D-tackle when they made their run

Not fair to compare Kansey to Donald but the impact D-tackle can be almost unguardable 

coaches and QBs can try to throw away from a dominant CB like Sauce but when interior DT go off, there's no adjustment

 

 

[chirorob]

8 hours ago, Barton said:

So jets gonna pay Quinnen 20+ mill a year and then draft the same position with a top 15 pick and sign him to a big deal if he pans out, tying up 40-50 mill in defensive tackles? How about no. 

Well, you sign Q to a 5 year extension.   You draft a kid here, he gets an extension in 5 years (if he works out) when Q's contract is essentially done.

[BCJet]

22 hours ago, chirorob said:

Well, you sign Q to a 5 year extension.   You draft a kid here, he gets an extension in 5 years (if he works out) when Q's contract is essentially done.

100% correct, no idea how someone couldnt do this math

[BCJet]

On 4/5/2023 at 4:56 PM, bitonti said:

QW is diverse and can play the nose if needed. It's a different way of thinking from what Jets fans are used to 

They don't stop the run with pure bulk anymore.

They scheme the players into the right spot through slants and stunts and the players make plays. It's aggressive not just sitting back "read and react" 

They send the players to a spot with intention and players like kansey have the leverage to get there 

Because let's be real kansey is giving up 50 pounds on the college level too. These clips are against Tennessee and Miami big time programs. But he's still very effective in the run. 

Not that you draft a guy in Rd 1 for run stopping. You draft him as a sack merchant 

Lot of interesting points here.

I agree that QW is diverse enough to play the nose and can be a nice complement to someone like Kancey who both would require a lot of attention from the OL, it would just be schematically different handling 2 guys like this vs someone like Jordan Davis. 

To touch on the run stopping, IMO Davis was not a good use of a first round pick as he is only on the field 25% of the time and holds a significant injury risk. Id rather someone like Kancey with elite physical upside.

With respect to our scheme, the issue I see is not necessarily with 2 DTs like QW and Kancey - I think that while we would make big plays we would still have some exposure to counter/power runs and I think thats where the issue of Mosley and our other LBs not being good enough to clean up if these guys do overshoot a play.

I do think we need to realize how good JJ and Clemons are vs the rush.  They are elite edge setters which could help to mitigate any lack of interior size.

If we did want to continue our DL rotation (lower snap %), we could easily rotate Jefferson, QW and Kancey to keep them fresh and have a great IOL pass rush all game.  I also wonder if Kancey could play some DE?

[SickJetFan]

On 4/6/2023 at 2:21 PM, bitonti said:

Aaron Donald was 6'1" 280 and 3x DPOY, 7x All Pro, 9x Pro Bowl 

I believe the Rams had a significant portion of their cap tied up in D-tackle when they made their run

Not fair to compare Kansey to Donald but the impact D-tackle can be almost unguardable 

coaches and QBs can try to throw away from a dominant CB like Sauce but when interior DT go off, there's no adjustment

 

 

funny when you look back at Darnold draft profile

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/aaron-donald/3200444f-4e13-4977-da01-4e2f082de38b

 

I like Kansey but yes unfair to compare to Darnold but without Darnold success from Pitt he would probably get the same draft profile Darnold did

 

I do like Van Ness better tho.

 

[Dcat]

Kancy going in late rd 1 almost everywhere now.  I did a little video watching.  Kid has an unreal highlight reel.  Still think he struggles to get to that point n NFL.  FOr where he is likely to go, the Jets would need to trade back from 13 or up from 42

[maury77]

My preference would still be Johnson, Jones, Wright or trade down, but if those are not options I'm perfectly fine with Kancey at 13 for all the reasons others have already stated. Having a run-blocking DT is nice, but you can find those types of players on day 3 of the draft or even in free agency sometimes (Damon Harrison). 

[Barton]

This league is about offense. Marcus stroud and John Henderson part 2 isn’t gonna move the needle. Especially on a team that only has 1 probowl skill player on the offensive side of the ball. 

[NYDreamer]

On 4/8/2023 at 3:31 PM, SickJetFan said:

funny when you look back at Darnold draft profile

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/aaron-donald/3200444f-4e13-4977-da01-4e2f082de38b

 

I like Kansey but yes unfair to compare to Darnold but without Darnold success from Pitt he would probably get the same draft profile Darnold did

 

I do like Van Ness better tho.

 

It is interesting, but he also reminds me of Ed Oliver https://www.nfl.com/prospects/ed-oliver/32004f4c-4929-0385-df1c-0f8e40559b5a

Donald went pick 13 to the Rams and Oliver 9 to the Bills.  Both players had their playing weight of 280 as a weakness for the position they play.  But the reality is both have had a tremendous impact on this game for their respective teams.  Klancey seems like this guy.

[SickJetFan]

12 hours ago, NYDreamer said:

It is interesting, but he also reminds me of Ed Oliver https://www.nfl.com/prospects/ed-oliver/32004f4c-4929-0385-df1c-0f8e40559b5a

Donald went pick 13 to the Rams and Oliver 9 to the Bills.  Both players had their playing weight of 280 as a weakness for the position they play.  But the reality is both have had a tremendous impact on this game for their respective teams.  Klancey seems like this guy.

I think it is 50/50 shot for him - he will be either real good or JAG

tough to project  - and risky IMO - thats why I like Van Ness better

[David Harris]

I'd hate him at 13 but love him at 42.

[Greenseed4]

I’d rather draft Kancey at 13 than one of the Centers if we can’t trade down. 

But ideally, we trade down into the 20’s and get our pick of IOL (JMS please), then grab Kancey,  Mazi Smith, or Ika at 42, and have an extra pick from the drop to recoup our lost third.

 

[Greenseed4]

But yeah, Kancey is a beast.

We have Edge players that are great at containing the run, we can bring our rush up the middle with TWO freaks and bring unique pressure in passing downs.

[Beerfish]

Good player good prospect, ill hate it if we take a DT at 13

[LAD_Brooklyn]

On 4/17/2023 at 11:15 PM, Beerfish said:

Good player good prospect, ill hate it if we take a DT at 13

As Saleh would say, "pass rushers don't grow on trees." To get one that can rush from the interior is a rarity. Then on top of that can make splash plays in the run game sounds too good to be true. 

Which is exactly why we made an aggressive offer to Fletcher Cox. We can possibly even trade down some and still select him. 

[Beerfish]

34 minutes ago, LAD_Brooklyn said:

As Saleh would say, "pass rushers don't grow on trees." To get one that can rush from the interior is a rarity. Then on top of that can make splash plays in the run game sounds too good to be true. 

Which is exactly why we made an aggressive offer to Fletcher Cox. We can possibly even trade down some and still select him. 

The way the jets use their dline it is not worth it.  We traded up for a pass rusher at salehs behest last year and he played like 40% of the dsnaps.

We are so rotation heavy that the top players simply do not get on the field enough for me.

I could for sure see the jets taking him though

[32EBoozer]

10 hours ago, Beerfish said:

The way the jets use their dline it is not worth it.  We traded up for a pass rusher at salehs behest last year and he played like 40% of the dsnaps.

We are so rotation heavy that the top players simply do not get on the field enough for me.

I could for sure see the jets taking him though

This draft is very deep for DT. I could see taking Mojo Oromo in 4th to play beside QW

Use those 1st 3 picks on OT, C & LB if we keep those picks.

[LAD_Brooklyn]

23 hours ago, Beerfish said:

The way the jets use their dline it is not worth it.  We traded up for a pass rusher at salehs behest last year and he played like 40% of the dsnaps.

We are so rotation heavy that the top players simply do not get on the field enough for me.

I could for sure see the jets taking him though

JJ plays a position in which we were relatively deep in. So much to the point we had to trade one of our edge player away in Martin. We didn’t know Lawson was going to make a smooth comeback. Then we had Bryce Huff emerge from the grave and took snaps away from everyone. Lastly JJ is a below average to average pass rusher going back to his season at FSU despite his sack total as his pass rush and win rate were bad. 

Kancey on the other hand has the highest pass rush win rate and pass rush grade in the nation. If Kancey can play 60-70% of the pass rushing snaps then that should be satisfying. But I get your overall dissatisfaction in our rotations but it works, so I wouldn't mind rolling with it and keeping guys fresh. 

[LAD_Brooklyn]

 

[derp]

10 hours ago, LAD_Brooklyn said:

 

Some rumbles Kancey may fall out of the first. Know not everybody is a fan of him at the first but I imagine there’d be less pushback if he’s there at 42/43.

They use so many body types on this DL that I end up thinking a lot of tweeners could fit. Kind of interesting for a four man front.

[Bowles Movement]

On 4/5/2023 at 1:50 PM, jetstream23 said:

Wouldn't both Quinnen and Kancey be attacking 3-Tech type DTs?  I know Saleh loves to attack and rush the passer but any team with a good rushing attack, big OL and a power-blocking scheme might salivate when looking at the Jets starting a 281 lb. DT next to QW.  Derrick Henry might rush for 4.7  (that's miles) during the game. lol

 

JFM plays DT and he is 287.  You think the 6 lbs make that much of a difference? As a young player I could see Kancey s frame filling out with a season of NFL training too.

[David Harris]

PFN

 

Calijah Kancey Falling After Zero Top-30 Visits?

During the pre-draft process, all 32 teams can bring in 30 prospects of their choosing for a 24-hour visit with coaches and the front office, overall spending a significant amount of time with the player.

Teams value these visits because they can check boxes in their evaluation process, go over film, and use them to evaluate character concerns, as most did with Carter.

Not every player drafted is given a 30 visit with a team before the draft, but it’s unusual for a player considered a first-round talent not to get one. Pittsburgh’s Kancey spoke on NFL Now about how he received zero invites to meet with teams as a 30 visit.

 

Not having your name on these lists doesn’t mean a team is not interested in drafting the specific player. It could be so teams keep it private that there is genuine interest in someone like Kancey.

[Guilhermezmc]

Its scary how small he looks on film.

Really a boom or bust prospect

[PepPep]

Too early for the jets at 13 and he wont be there at 42. If they trade down I would imagine their top target would be JMS. But you never know, Kansey could be an option.