A real catch-22 for Jets fans the next month or so

[Dunnie]

Best case scenario, Mims is a STUD, we start scoring more points, Darnold even starts clicking but the defense can't hold up their end & we keep squeaking out losses. We KNOW the defense sucks. 

But let's spend all of our draft capital on offense

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[Dunnie]

Choosing to keep Gase is like choosing to keep colon cancer.

No .. it's really not.

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[Jetster]

12 hours ago, CTM said:

Teams with Qb, wr1 and Lt playing good football generally dont go 1-15

Sure they do if the defense can't stop a nosebleed & that's where we are. I've said this before, the last time we had a defense this bad guys like Alex Gordon were running around out there. 

[Jetster]

2 hours ago, Dunnie said:

But let's spend all of our draft capital on offense

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That SHOULD BE THE PLAN! Not all of our draft capital just HIGH PICKS this time on offense instead of defense. We picked defense 9/10 years in the 1st round & have nothing to show for it. Defense gets the later picks until we build a Oline & have weapons around our QB. 

[PepPep]

15 hours ago, HawkeyeJet said:

I've been thinking a lot the last few days about how the next month or so could be really difficult for us Jets fans, but in a different way then it's normally difficult.

We are start to finally see some of our Young pieces on the field, together.  Becton, Mims, Perine and even probably guys like Zuniga and Hall.  That's actually relatively exciting and reason to watch.  

But what if all of them turn out to show promise?  It's entirely possible that if they all play well(along with Darnold improving), we could kiss that #1 pick goodbye.

On the other hand, if they all underwhelm, then yippee we get the 1st pick, but are not any closer to a competitive roster than we were a year ago. And the GM would have some questions to answer.

Then again, Gase is the coach so maybe both things can happen and he just costs us the game from his ineptness. 

So I think if the young players show promise, along with Sam playing well, and the teams wins a few games and loses out on the #1 selection then you roll with Sam and build around him. You kind of have no choice. Hopefully you can still land Sewell and if not maybe you could trade down and add draft picks to fortify the roster with young talent. I don't think that's such a bad option. And I don't think that will necessarily save Gase's job. I think everyone has seen what a bad coach Gase is. A few wins down the stretch won't be enough to move the needle. Either Jet brass have committed to him regardless of how awful he has been or they are already planning on moving on from him in the offseason. 

If they lose out, you fire Gase, take Lawrence and field trades for Darnold. Start all over again with the hope that Lawrence is the answer, has a short learning curve, will have a better coach and JD knows what he's doing (unlike Macc). 

[Torus34]

Gaining the # 1 draft pick and not using it wisely is kind-a like having a credit card and not knowing where to find a store. Grabbing the crème de la crème and not having a team to support him results in one high-ticket disgruntled player seeking to be traded -- and nothing more. First priority's team-building, no matter the draft pick. 

[jgb]

5 hours ago, slimjasi said:

You are entirely correct - nobody knows for certain what any college player will become - including Lawrence 
 

But the other big issue is financial. Having your QB on year 1 of his rookie contract is an enormous advantage going forward 

It’s easy to list the QBs that hit outside of top 2 of draft in hindsight. Fact is they fell for a reason. Just like Lawrence isn’t going to fall for a reason. This is Jets best chance to score a legit FQB in a long time.

[GreenFish]

I wouldn’t mind it at all if Darnold and our young guys play well from here on out. I’d prefer that then getting the number 1 pick. We’d be leaving this season confident in Joe Douglas and Sam Darnold. Gase JD getting fired regardless. 

[Lith]

2 hours ago, Jetster said:

That SHOULD BE THE PLAN! Not all of our draft capital just HIGH PICKS this time on offense instead of defense. We picked defense 9/10 years in the 1st round & have nothing to show for it. Defense gets the later picks until we build a Oline & have weapons around our QB. 

I agree with this.  Especially if we pick #1 overall and draft Lawrence.  We need to do everything we can to put him in a position to succeed.  And that means spending valuable draft resources on offense.  If Lawrence is our QB next year, I don't care if we give up 30+ points per game if we can surround our QB with a competent set of NFL weapoons and an above average OL.  And if it takes more than one offseason to build that offense, then I would have no issue if we drafted Lawrence and sat him for most of his first season.

[Larz]

Don’t over think this 

JD sent away all the leaders with an intense desire to win

this team mailed it in opening day and it’s just going to get worse 

the only thing to worry about is when they become the talk of the league for being an automatic win and how it’s unfair to have them on your schedule 

[32EBoozer]

2 minutes ago, Lith said:

I agree with this.  Especially if we pick #1 overall and draft Lawrence.  We need to do everything we can to put him in a position to succeed.  And that means spending valuable draft resources on offense.  If Lawrence is our QB next year, I don't care if we give up 30+ points per game if we can surround our QB with a competent set of NFL weapoons and an above average OL.  And if it takes more than one offseason to build that offense, then I would have no issue if we drafted Lawrence and sat him for most of his first season.

Agreed. Give Sammy some weapons who actually see the field, build up his trade/compensatory value and let the rookies get playing time. Trade Sam at deadline or let him walk. TL era begins from that day forward 

[More Cowbell]

18 hours ago, HawkeyeJet said:

I've been thinking a lot the last few days about how the next month or so could be really difficult for us Jets fans, but in a different way then it's normally difficult.

We are start to finally see some of our Young pieces on the field, together.  Becton, Mims, Perine and even probably guys like Zuniga and Hall.  That's actually relatively exciting and reason to watch.  

But what if all of them turn out to show promise?  It's entirely possible that if they all play well(along with Darnold improving), we could kiss that #1 pick goodbye.

On the other hand, if they all underwhelm, then yippee we get the 1st pick, but are not any closer to a competitive roster than we were a year ago. And the GM would have some questions to answer.

Then again, Gase is the coach so maybe both things can happen and he just costs us the game from his ineptness. 

Only on the Jets could young players showing promise and the QB improving be a bad thing

[More Cowbell]

14 hours ago, slimjasi said:

If we are 1-15, Darnold didn’t play well enough to move forward with. That’s the bottom line. 

Darnold probably has to win a minimum of 4-5 games to keep his job, IMO. 

Otherwise, Douglas will be staring at one of Lawrence, Fields, or Lance with a chance to reset the rookie QB contract window.

What is this obsession with resetting the rookie deal on the QB. There is nobody on this team due for a big payday including Sam. How could anyone justify giving him a big contract. He would probably get a deal in the area of 15 Mill. That would be peanuts for a young QB. We are also sitting on a ton of cap. This thing about having cap space is only important if you have vets you want to resign. There are none of those on the Jets. 

[DetroitRed]

Those kids can play well and we can still lose


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[CTM]

10 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

Yup, I probably painted an idealistic scenario.  But I'd still like to see a good group of the guys who expect to be here for at least a couple more years demonstrate some competence and competitiveness.....and lose a lot of close games.

 

I mean, I'd love to see all 3 of them play like all pros and we go 8-2 down the stretch. It's far preferrable to losing out, and then getting back on the QB merry go round again. It's just not likely unforuntately

[jetstream23]

9 hours ago, slimjasi said:

You are entirely correct - nobody knows for certain what any college player will become - including Lawrence 

But the other big issue is financial. Having your QB on year 1 of his rookie contract is an enormous advantage going forward 

Agree with that 100%.

[jetstream23]

27 minutes ago, CTM said:

I mean, I'd love to see all 3 of them play like all pros and we go 8-2 down the stretch. It's far preferrable to losing out, and then getting back on the QB merry go round again. It's just not likely unforuntately

Yup. Win something like 6-8 games.....or win 0.

We don't want the in-between.

[Lith]

44 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

Yup. Win something like 6-8 games.....or win 0.

We don't want the in-between.

A lot depends on Darnold.  If some of the young guys play well, but Darnold still plays like the 32nd ranked QB in the NFL, which he is npw per QB rating, then we will be in discussion for 1 overall throughout the season.  If he eleveates his play as he gets some weapons back and guys like Mims, Becton, Edoga, Clark, V Smith, J Simth can play.  Then  we probably win enough to lose out in the Lawrence sweepstakes.  And that would not be a bad outcome.

Worst case scenario to me is we suck, but win a couple of fluky games, and despite the worst roster in the league we end up picking 5 or 6.  And it becomes even worst when we win 2 of our last 3 and the Johnsons's retain Gase because of how a 3-13 team rallied around thier Coach.

[slimjasi]

3 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

What is this obsession with resetting the rookie deal on the QB. There is nobody on this team due for a big payday including Sam. How could anyone justify giving him a big contract. He would probably get a deal in the area of 15 Mill. That would be peanuts for a young QB. We are also sitting on a ton of cap. This thing about having cap space is only important if you have vets you want to resign. There are none of those on the Jets. 

The fact that Sam hasn’t earned a big payday yet is precisely the problem. We have to make a decision on Sam one way or another next year and he hasn’t shown the consistency necessary to prove that he can be the guy. 
 

So, if Sam doesn’t start playing really, really well like right now, we will basically be heading into next year with Sam having one season to prove himself before having to either make a big financial commitment to him or lose him for nothing. 
 

But if you draft Lawrence, you now have an awesome QB prospect who you don’t have to commit to long term for several years. 
 

This is Sam’s third year - he has to put it together now. That’s the way the NFL works, unfortunately. You don’t get half a decade to develop into a franchise QB on one team.  

 

[slimjasi]

It’s really simple friends - If Sam wants to be here next year, he has to carry us to enough wins to keep us from drafting his replacement.

This would unavoidably require that he play a lot better going forward than he has so far this season. 
 

 

[Warfish]

21 hours ago, HawkeyeJet said:

I've been thinking a lot the last few days about how the next month or so could be really difficult for us Jets fans, but in a different way then it's normally difficult.

We are start to finally see some of our Young pieces on the field, together.  Becton, Mims, Perine and even probably guys like Zuniga and Hall.  That's actually relatively exciting and reason to watch.  

But what if all of them turn out to show promise?  It's entirely possible that if they all play well(along with Darnold improving), we could kiss that #1 pick goodbye.

On the other hand, if they all underwhelm, then yippee we get the 1st pick, but are not any closer to a competitive roster than we were a year ago. And the GM would have some questions to answer.

Then again, Gase is the coach so maybe both things can happen and he just costs us the game from his ineptness. 

Root for the Jets, since we're all Jets Fans.

The Draft will be what it will be.  

Rooting for losses....man, what a miserable way to watch your team, getting mad when they do good, being pissed if they win, why bother at that point?  May as well just not watch at all.

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Root for the Jets, since we're all Jets Fans.

The Draft will be what it will be.  

Rooting for losses....man, what a miserable way to watch your team, getting mad when they do good, being pissed if they win, why bother at that point?  May as well just not watch at all.

 

Woah hot take alert!

[More Cowbell]

27 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

The fact that Sam hasn’t earned a big payday yet is precisely the problem. We have to make a decision on Sam one way or another next year and he hasn’t shown the consistency necessary to prove that he can be the guy. 
 

So, if Sam doesn’t start playing really, really well like right now, we will basically be heading into next year with Sam having one season to prove himself before having to either make a big financial commitment to him or lose him for nothing. 
 

But if you draft Lawrence, you now have an awesome QB prospect who you don’t have to commit to long term for several years. 
 

This is Sam’s third year - he has to put it together now. That’s the way the NFL works, unfortunately. You don’t get half a decade to develop into a franchise QB on one team.  

 

The problem with that is we have been trying to evaluate Sam with his shoe laces tied together. I think Sam can be the guy but if the chance to draft Lawrence presents itself, it makes sense to go that direction and let some other team develop Sam. I just don't want to see this team draft Fields so we can reset the QB clock and have another QB prospect no better than Sam. 

[riggy001]

You are correct, tough spot, and also throw in the small chance, they play well , go 5-5, and keep gase. Brutal.

[slimjasi]

57 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

The problem with that is we have been trying to evaluate Sam with his shoe laces tied together. I think Sam can be the guy but if the chance to draft Lawrence presents itself, it makes sense to go that direction and let some other team develop Sam. I just don't want to see this team draft Fields so we can reset the QB clock and have another QB prospect no better than Sam. 

I agree.

I wouldn’t necessarily take Fields or Lance over Sam, but I would be very tempted. 
 

If JD thinks Fields or Lance can be the guy, he should take one of them. If not, trade down and try to build a legit team around Darnold.

I’m good with whatever Douglas decides if Lawrence is off the table. I’m honestly not overly opinionated on Lance or Fields one way or another. 

[slimjasi]

15 minutes ago, riggy001 said:

You are correct, tough spot, and also throw in the small chance, they play well , go 5-5, and keep gase. Brutal.

If the Jets won 5 straight against Buffalo, KC, NE, LA, and Miami, it would legit be one of the most shocking turnarounds in NFL history. All bets would be off at that point.

Nice to day dream about, but not happening. 

[slimjasi]

1 hour ago, Warfish said:

Root for the Jets, since we're all Jets Fans.

The Draft will be what it will be.  

Rooting for losses....man, what a miserable way to watch your team, getting mad when they do good, being pissed if they win, why bother at that point?  May as well just not watch at all.

I contend that 99% of the people here who now say they are actively rooting against the Jets aren’t actually rooting against the Jets. 

You can know in your head that the jets are better off in the long run getting the top pick than wining 3 or 4 games and still feel sick to your stomach watching Joe Flacco take a 30 yard sack or Gase call an off tackle run down by three scores in the second half on 2nd and 26. 

[Jetster]

Trevor Lawrence is a stud. He threw his 1st pick in like some crazy azz long time.

He’s an outlier, a prodigy, who has gotten better every year, has played beyond his incredibly high expectations as the best QB prospect in the nation. He’s played a sh*t ton of games unlike Darnold & he’s more physically gifted than Darnold being 6-6” to see more of the field. 
Tom Brady’s height was a huge help to his vision of the field at 6-5”. 
Lawrence runs like a gazelle when he has to eating up huge junks of real estate quickly. 
There is no way in hell that Sam Darnold in his 3rd year here has shown enough consistency to remain the QB of the Jet + get a 5th year option & a new contract if we are in the top spot in the draft come 2021. 
I personally don’t think we’ll have the 1st pick, I think it will be Jacksonville & if that’s the case Minshew will have a new uniform.