The “rebuild” isn’t working

[FidelioJet]

3 hours ago, Claymation said:

This year is a learning one for Zach, and if he's worth his salt, he'll get better as the season goes along. That's what a rebuilding year is.

The Jets had more total yards than NE, more rushing yards, more passing & better at 3rd efficiency. The difference was Zach threw 4 interceptions. They lost the turnover battle 4-0. NE fumbled twice yesterday, one they recovered and the other the referee called the receiver down.

Zach's passes were consistently high & missed quite a few open receivers. It's up to Zach and the CS to fix that.

This is what was most concerning.  I don't mind him taking shots, being aggressive and making mistakes.  That was going to happen and I'm totally cool with him being agressive.

The problem is he was not accurate at all.  Even the completions weren't precise.  

Not sure you can fix that..

[Charlie Brown]

28 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

No, that is incorrect. I may of pulled him yesterday so he could regroup, humble himself and reset. 

Flacco played in a Super Bowl, having him review tape with Zach is more comforting to me then having Mike White break down tape with him. Just my thoughts. 

Also, its the Jets so I always think injuries. This team with Mike White is where the wheels come off the burning vehicle. That is good for no one. 

Just a thought....If folks can't read between the tea leaves  ---

 

IMO Joe Flacco UNDERMINED Darnold and that is why he no longer on the Jets and that experience unfortunately scarred JD and hence why no Vet QB was put on the roster!

Otherwise NOT having a veteran QB on the roster makes ZERO SENSE!!!!

[jgb]

4 minutes ago, Big_Slick said:

JD's rebuild strategy is the correct approach for building a consistently good team that will be playoff contenders most seasons.

It's JD's execution that sucks. He can't draft or sign FA's and lets our good players walk.

If it wasn't for Pete Carroll having a senior moment and giving away the farm for Jamal JD hasn't done anything in 2.5 years.

This describes me playing golf. I know it is the correct approach to use a fairway wood on some shots but every time I do I slice it 200 yards into the forest.

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

3 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

This “rebuild” is failing.

WAY TOO EARLY to make this claim.

The first two weeks have undoubtedly been an unmitigated disaster, but it is way too early to call the rebuild a fail. I would have liked to have seen more cohesion on this team, but we are dealing with a first time HC, a first time OC, rookie QB, and wide receivers who haven't played more than a few snaps of pre-season football with their rookie QB. 

The defense is already playing better than expected while losing out on their stud pass rusher. In terms of the defense, the rebuild is working out just fine. 

If we are in game six and we haven't seen improvements on offense, I'd start to get nervous.

 

[#27TheDominator]

32 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

No, that is incorrect. I may of pulled him yesterday so he could regroup, humble himself and reset. 

Flacco played in a Super Bowl, having him review tape with Zach is more comforting to me then having Mike White break down tape with him. Just my thoughts. 

Also, its the Jets so I always think injuries. This team with Mike White is where the wheels come off the burning vehicle. That is good for no one. 

What's Mike White gonna do?  Throw 6 INTs?  The wheels are off.  They've been off.  We are trying to see what pieces there are.  I get that, as @jgbs points out, we need some level of functionality to judge everyone else, but I don't think that is something we can complain about until it happens.  I get your concern and you have a right to express it, but maybe Mike White would be fine. 

Neither Flacco or Siemian seemed worthwhile to me and they have both been competent or better in the league.  The team looked horrid under both of them. I keep seeing Luke Falk thrown around like these guys have some penchant for running into the season with zero at backup QB, but they went with Flacco and Siemian.  Luke Falk was the 3rd QB.  HOw many teams have a 3rd QB with NFL experience?  The Jets actually do with Josh Johnson. 

[jgb]

38 minutes ago, carlito1171 said:

That is a nightmare scenario man....and one I hope doesn't come true

Because that's exactly where we were after 1 year of Sanchez/Geno/Darnold 

This is the Jets. Expect the nightmare.

[kevinc855]

1 minute ago, #27TheDominator said:

What's Mike White gonna do?  Throw 6 INTs?  The wheels are off.  They've been off.  We are trying to see what pieces there are.  I get that we need some level of functionality to judge everyone else, but I don't think that is something we can complain about until it happens.  I get your concdern and you have a right to express it, but maybe Mike White would be fine. 

Neither Flacco or Siemian seemed worthwhile to me and they have both been competent or better in the league.  The team looked horrid under both of them. and I keep seeing Luke Falk thrown around like these guys have some penchant for running into the season with zero at backup QB, but they went with Flacco and Siemian.  Luke Falk was the 3rd QB.  HOw many teams have a 3rd QB with NFL experience?  The Jets actually do with Josh Johnson. 

So you are saying we went into the season with wheels off correct? 

[doitny]

1 hour ago, jgb said:

Really a head scratcher. Especially when you see how cheap guys like Tyrod Taylor/Minshew/Trubisky were had for. Any of those guys would've been a very reasonable option for the 2021 Jets. I'm worried if Zach misses time it puts our skill players' development into stasis.

problem with that is if you benched Zach yesterday and Minshew or Trubinsky came in and we won what do we do next week? back to Zach? ok and if we lose but he doesn't do to bad then what. soon the fan base will want to go with the vet who really aren't that old to begin with and bench Zach for the season. but the kid has to play to get experience. so we waste the year.

they why bother drafting Zach. might as well just went with those guys. see i think Minshew and Trubinsky are good and young enough that they can keep a rookie on the bench.

Flacco would have been perfect if he couldn't find a team where he could start. 

 

[jgb]

2 minutes ago, doitny said:

problem with that is if you benched Zach yesterday and Minshew or Trubinsky came in and we won what do we do next week? back to Zach? ok and if we lose but he doesn't do to bad then what. soon the fan base will want to go with the vet who really aren't that old to begin with and bench Zach for the season. but the kid has to play to get experience. so we waste the year.

they why bother drafting Zach. might as well just went with those guys. see i think Minshew and Trubinsky are good and young enough that they can keep a rookie on the bench.

Flacco would have been perfect if he couldn't find a team where he could start. 

 

I'm not talking about wishing we had someone to play for Zach yesterday. I'm saying it's dereliction of JD's duty not to have someone if Wilson misses time for whatever reason. 

[nyjunc]

22 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

I’m just amazed of how many seasons fans are willing to concede for “next year” 

We have a rooky HC and rookie QB, they gave nothing to do with the results of 2012-2020.  We are 2 weeks in, what is more amazing is how fans give up after 2 weeks.

[kevinc855]

28 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

We have a rooky HC and rookie QB, they gave nothing to do with the results of 2012-2020.  We are 2 weeks in, what is more amazing is how fans give up after 2 weeks.

No ones giving up but 20 points in 2 games is not good enough. You HAVE to put a better product on the field 

[Dunnie]

No ones giving up but 20 points in 2 games is not good enough. You HAVE to put a better product on the field 

Not giving up is the key ... and yes the product is unacceptable to this point.

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[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

On 9/20/2021 at 8:07 AM, kevinc855 said:

What’s the plan?! Seriously been asking this for 3 years with ridicule till the last few weeks people started taking notice.

We have stripped this team of any talent at all justifying it with “draft capital” Well how’s that  working out for us? 
 

We have gutted all veteran talent with trades or cuts for “cap space” Well how’s that working for us?

We decided to throw a QB on an NFL field without a real oline and zero mentorship with a veteran. Well how’s that work out for us?

This “rebuild” is failing. The boo birds were out in game 1 of 9 home games. The Jets cannot continue to put garbage on the field and get a pass yet again how some “rebuild” plan we never see the results from. 
 

I seriously don’t know or understand the “rebuild” 

[DonCorleone]

On 9/20/2021 at 8:36 AM, kevinc855 said:

I’m just amazed of how many seasons fans are willing to concede for “next year” 

Next year never comes.

[jgb]

Just now, DonCorleone said:

Next year never comes.

[Peteo]

Based on what I have seen so far this is a 5 win team at best if things don't make a dramatic change.

[kevinc855]

45 minutes ago, Peteo said:

Based on what I have seen so far this is a 5 win team at best if things don't make a dramatic change.

The way we are trending hard to see us beating Broncos D or the Titans. Maybe we can pick up a win against Atlanta. 

Just writing that proves how bad we have become. Its really disheartening to a loyal fan base. 

[MyFavoriteMartin28]

On 9/20/2021 at 8:19 AM, kmnj said:

yep that is why I posted the question -folks want u to wait though the standard 3-4 years when some of his guys are not on the team and others are not eve playing-imagine drafting a high pick wr and year 2 he can't get ahead of berrios on the depth chart

He can't get ahead of Berrios on the depth chart because they play different positions. Mims is not a slot receiver he plays outside. Berrios is a slot receiver. 

 

You guys have to relax. yes JDs 2020 draft is not looking good, his first draft as a GM. His second draft is looking much better. We need a longer rebuild because of the disaster Mac left us with. The defense that is "void" of talent allowed 25 points in a game where there were 4 turnovers. We have a rookie QB that is only eight quarters into his career and lost his qb coach midway through the offseason. Lets give him some time to develop chemistry and learn the speed of the NFL. 

[Bruce Harper]

On 9/20/2021 at 8:07 AM, kevinc855 said:

What’s the plan?! Seriously been asking this for 3 years with ridicule till the last few weeks people started taking notice.

We have stripped this team of any talent at all justifying it with “draft capital” Well how’s that  working out for us? 
 

We have gutted all veteran talent with trades or cuts for “cap space” Well how’s that working for us?

We decided to throw a QB on an NFL field without a real oline and zero mentorship with a veteran. Well how’s that work out for us?

This “rebuild” is failing. The boo birds were out in game 1 of 9 home games. The Jets cannot continue to put garbage on the field and get a pass yet again how some “rebuild” plan we never see the results from. 
 

I seriously don’t know or understand the “rebuild” 

When I read these kinds of post I realize why the divorce rate is so high in this country:  people expect too much and are unreasonable and unyielding.  The present coaching staff and QB have had exactly two games.  GM has had two drafts and the talent level is improving, despite some misses.  You have to be patient for a bit longer.  Or switch to a team that wins most of the time.  

[Bruce Harper]

23 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

This is what was most concerning.  I don't mind him taking shots, being aggressive and making mistakes.  That was going to happen and I'm totally cool with him being agressive.

The problem is he was not accurate at all.  Even the completions weren't precise.  

Not sure you can fix that..

He is an accurate passer who had a really bad day.  Don't jump ship yet.

[SAR I]

14 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

Don't jump ship yet.

SAR I

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

I mean…it kinda is actually. But sure. 

[kevinc855]

18 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

When I read these kinds of post I realize why the divorce rate is so high in this country:  people expect too much and are unreasonable and unyielding.  The present coaching staff and QB have had exactly two games.  GM has had two drafts and the talent level is improving, despite some misses.  You have to be patient for a bit longer.  Or switch to a team that wins most of the time.  

There is nothing unreasonable about wanting to see this team look halfway competitive against very average teams. 

Speaking of divorce rates, maybe some women and men should actually "try" to make their partners happy. Would love to see more effort and try on the Jets side of the Team/fan relationship. It's not like this is the first down year in our rocky relationship. 

[Origen]

Salary Caps are a thing people.  Remember those dumb-ass contracts that got handed out before JD?  Well, for 2+ years about 90% of the contracts he has given out are 1 year prove it deals.  This CLEARS OUT CAP SPACE.  This allows you to have more money moving forward to fill spaces in your roster.  Part of this tear down was to get to the bottom with rookies and draft picks and play the young guys this year and see what you have.  Then next year use all the draft picks and plethora of cap space to fill in with bigger fish and complete with the big dogs now that you have a solid crew of guys who are the center of your team built from within.  It's really not hard to see the plan.  Now, have all the draft picks worked perfectly?  Nope.  Look at the history of NYJ drafts, I found 4 since 1992 that were remotely okay, the rest were all complete trash.  2 of the 4 were because we has so many #1 picks it was hard to screw up, even though we still did.  So, chill out and at least give it half a season before you freak out, or do us all a favor and freak out to yourself quietly.

[FidelioJet]

27 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

He is an accurate passer who had a really bad day.  Don't jump ship yet.

I sure hope you're right.  

[Jet2020]

On 9/20/2021 at 7:07 AM, kevinc855 said:

What’s the plan?! Seriously been asking this for 3 years with ridicule till the last few weeks people started taking notice.

We have stripped this team of any talent at all justifying it with “draft capital” Well how’s that  working out for us? 
 

We have gutted all veteran talent with trades or cuts for “cap space” Well how’s that working for us?

We decided to throw a QB on an NFL field without a real oline and zero mentorship with a veteran. Well how’s that work out for us?

This “rebuild” is failing. The boo birds were out in game 1 of 9 home games. The Jets cannot continue to put garbage on the field and get a pass yet again how some “rebuild” plan we never see the results from. 
 

I seriously don’t know or understand the “rebuild” 

We don’t pay for that good player, prefer to trade him for draft busts and if we hit on any of those picks, we don’t pay for that good player, prefer to trade him for draft busts and if we hit on any of those picks, we don’t pay for that good player, prefer to trade him for draft busts and if we hit on any of those picks, we don’t pay for that good player, prefer to trade him for draft busts and if we hit on any of those….

sh*t, that’s Jets. 

[kevinc855]

10 minutes ago, Origen said:

Salary Caps are a thing people.  Remember those dumb-ass contracts that got handed out before JD?  Well, for 2+ years about 90% of the contracts he has given out are 1 year prove it deals.  This CLEARS OUT CAP SPACE.  This allows you to have more money moving forward to fill spaces in your roster.  Part of this tear down was to get to the bottom with rookies and draft picks and play the young guys this year and see what you have.  Then next year use all the draft picks and plethora of cap space to fill in with bigger fish and complete with the big dogs now that you have a solid crew of guys who are the center of your team built from within.  It's really not hard to see the plan.  Now, have all the draft picks worked perfectly?  Nope.  Look at the history of NYJ drafts, I found 4 since 1992 that were remotely okay, the rest were all complete trash.  2 of the 4 were because we has so many #1 picks it was hard to screw up, even though we still did.  So, chill out and at least give it half a season before you freak out, or do us all a favor and freak out to yourself quietly.

So fill us in? When does he actually intend to fill in the roster? 

[Origen]

Tomorrow.  He will sign every free agent to a max deal tomorrow.  That seems to be the only thing that would make anyone happy.  It's not like that got us a 10-6 season for a year and then garbage afterward the last 5 times we did that.

[Copernicus]

Rebuid isnt working?

Starting QB in place

Vera Tucker starting, improvement from weeek 1 to 2

Michael Carter RB, big improvement from weeek 1 to 2

Elijah Moore, starting,  improvement from weeek 1 to 2

Guidry, Echolls, Michael Carter II, Bryce Hall, Pinnock, Dunn all with significant contributions, havent given up a TD (Jets are only 1 of 3 teams currently)

Sherwood, Nas start

Jeff Smith and Huff contributing

Amendola 2/3

Yeah, Failing miserably 

[FidelioJet]

4 hours ago, nyjunc said:

We have a rooky HC and rookie QB, they gave nothing to do with the results of 2012-2020.  We are 2 weeks in, what is more amazing is how fans give up after 2 weeks.

Exactly.

I know it's hard for Jet fans as we've been through this so many times but this was always what this product was going to look like in the first half of this year.

You have a new HC, new OC, new DC...a big armed aggressive rookie QB with rookies and 2 year guy starting everywhere.

This should have been expected...Many here and even the coaches and GM's made clear to keep the expectations low.

Like it or not, this is year one of the rebuild.  JD's first two years were basically tearing down what Mac left them.

[phill1c]

On 9/20/2021 at 8:14 AM, kmnj said:

Joe d supporters how many players from his first draft were on the field and playing yesterday?

one player yep one player

that is not how the rebuild works especially after getting rid of talent that we had

 

I disagree. You draft for the current system. We just got a new current system. So, why the hand wringing after two games? 

WHAT TALENT WE HAD? Sam Darnold? Robby Anderson? Leonard Williams? You guys didn't like them when they were here...and they didn't win.

[rex-n-effect]

I get this is brutal to watch again but what can you expect when you wipe out everybody and start anew? There will be growing pains. 

It's kind of like buying an older home that's had a series of bad owners. One owner doesn't keep the home in great shape and sells it to the next who does the same thing followed by two more. By the time you buy the house you have no real idea how much work it will take to undo the previous damage. You can slap on some paint but that isn't going to fix structural issues from neglect. By 2011 the salary cap was a total mess of bloated contracts. Every GM since could tear down the last guy's mistakes but didn't rebuild a system that worked. The next guy inherited a poor partial rebuild. Sadly with the removal of Gase and the Johnsons giving JD the ability to install his head coach choice is the first time the owners have done the right thing and not forced a marriage and created a litany of other problems. JD might not be the solution but he's following a decade of poor choices all the way around by the owners. 

 

[#27TheDominator]

One thing that I find disingenuous is complaining that he traded all that talent away for draft capital AND LOOK AT THE LACK OF TALENT ON THE ROSTER!  Yes the drafts have not looked great, but many of the picks they got for that "talent" are not yet on the team.  They have a 1st coming for Adams, a 2nd and 4th coming for Darnold, a 4th for Herndon, a 5th from the Steelers for Avery Williamson.  

Yes they traded a pick for Shaq Lawson.  They got that for Jordan Willis.  Yes, they gave the Vikings back a 6th in the Herndon deal.  They got that for McLendon.  They will have to draft better to succeed, but they have not gotten all they will get for what they traded away yet either. 

[phill1c]

YOU CAN'T JUDGE A REBUILD AFTER TWO GAMES!!

[phill1c]

2 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

One thing that I find disingenuous is complaining that he traded all that talent away for draft capital AND LOOK AT THE LACK OF TALENT ON THE ROSTER! 

I don't really see a lack of talent. I see a lack of continuity and a lack of identity. For example, I look at the CB position. This position is holding up well and looks good, IMO. Same for the OL, starting to look like a OL that you can compete with. 

If it were that easy to put people together and have them perform well after 4 games together, two of them preseason, well, every team would win a SB every year. But it's NOT that easy. And players need time, like an orchestra, to play well together.

Duh!