Albert Breer: Woody Johnson stepped in on the first round pick (not Zach Wilson)

[Adoni Beast]

50 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said:

Amazing how much leaking has been going on since "Mr Anti-leak" Rodgers showed up.

[slimjasi]

I heard him say this - I assumed he was talking about taking Ickey over Sauce Gardner  

[Adoni Beast]

7 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

I heard him say this - I assumed he was talking about taking Ickey over Sauce Gardner  

Yes I don’t think it was the Zach Wilson draft either.

[section314]

If Breer is right, whether it was the Zach pick or Sauce pick, is there still a Jet fan on this planet that doesn’t think this Rodgers disaster is 100% Woody?

[doitny]

5 hours ago, football guy said:

I'm not saying Breer is wrong, but he's being way too loose with his phrasing of what happened.

There were discussions where the Jets considered sticking with Sam Darnold and trading down. Douglas was very much a believer in Darnold, as was the coaching staff, but they also were smitten with Wilson (as was most of the NFL). They weighed the possibilities and figured that while bringing back Sam and trading down (Kyle Pitts and Penei Sewell being the players they highlighted) would bring more immediate results, they felt drafting Zach and landing 2nd + 4th round picks for Sam had by far more upside long-term. Ownership absolutely was involved in the deliberation process, but to characterize it as if ownership blocked Douglas from going the Sam Darnold/trade down route is bogus. I realize its a he-said, she-said and battle of "sources", but all I can say is that I'm 100% sure that Douglas wasn't "forced" to trade Sam Darnold and take Zach Wilson, or any specific QB for that matter. 

Fans have to remember that when Saleh and JD had their first draft, they figured it was going to be a 3 year rebuild. I don't think either of them rationally believed things would escalate the way it did last year with the defense being one of the top units in the league and starting out 6-3. It put a brighter spotlight on the offense which was holding the team back, so Saleh and the staff decided they wanted to be ultra conservative and ride the defense in effort to get to the dance, but naturally we had all the distractions, shattered confidence, coaching-player dysfunction, etc. and the season ended on a horrible note. That led ownership coming together with coach and GM demanding we do something at QB, then landing Rodgers, and well the rest is history. 

ok thats fair, but what happend when Rodgers went down?

every team carries 3 QBs, usually 2 on the roster and one on the PS. now unless we think JD is a total moron why did it take a month to sign someone and then come up with Sieman. that to me smells like Woody.

i believe after Rodgers went down Woody wanted to ride with Zach. with all these rumors of a so called Zach succession plan Woody would be soon faced with giving Zach a 2-3 yr contract around top backup money ( 5-8 mil a yr). i dont think Woody wanted to give him that contract or even trust Zach with the team after Rodgers with his 2022 performance being the last thing he seen of him.

does that sound about right?

was it last year when our RB went down he signed Robinson from Jax to replace him? his 1st year he gets Kahlil off his couch to play center. this year they think Hall will need a few weeks to be ready he signs Cook. but the most important position on the football field gets hurt 4 plays into the season and he just sits on his hands and does nothing for 4 weeks when he had a guy like Flacco he knew and that would have came back here and he doesnt call him? i cant believe that JD would do that. 

of course theres the other rumor that when Rodgers went down Woody told JD he was not investing any more money in the QB room so make out with what you have.

[doitny]

40 minutes ago, section314 said:

If Breer is right, whether it was the Zach pick or Sauce pick, is there still a Jet fan on this planet that doesn’t think this Rodgers disaster is 100% Woody?

JD values draft picks like there gold. of all the QBs out there this year he would have never took the one guy who would cost him draft picks. and really good ones to boot.

your right, Rodgers was 100% Woody

[Matt39]

14 minutes ago, doitny said:

ok thats fair, but what happend when Rodgers went down?

every team carries 3 QBs, usually 2 on the roster and one on the PS. now unless we think JD is a total moron why did it take a month to sign someone and then come up with Sieman. that to me smells like Woody.

i believe after Rodgers went down Woody wanted to ride with Zach. with all these rumors of a so called Zach succession plan Woody would be soon faced with giving Zach a 2-3 yr contract around top backup money ( 5-8 mil a yr). i dont think Woody wanted to give him that contract or even trust Zach with the team after Rodgers with his 2022 performance being the last thing he seen of him.

does that sound about right?

was it last year when our RB went down he signed Robinson from Jax to replace him? his 1st year he gets Kahlil off his couch to play center. this year they think Hall will need a few weeks to be ready he signs Cook. but the most important position on the football field gets hurt 4 plays into the season and he just sits on his hands and does nothing for 4 weeks when he had a guy like Flacco he knew and that would have came back here and he doesnt call him? i cant believe that JD would do that. 

of course theres the other rumor that when Rodgers went down Woody told JD he was not investing any more money in the QB room so make out with what you have.

Zach Wilson and Woody compromised on Rodgers with the caveat that Wilson would be the unquestioned backup. The goal was to hide zach(as they did even in preaseason games) while putting up the facade that he was still a salvageable “talent.” Their cover got blown once Rodgers got hurt and Wilson had to play and they couldn’t pivot off of it due to their agreement in place. Obviously the right football move was to bring in someone else once Rodgers went down like Douglas has done at other positions.

[bitonti]

1 hour ago, slimjasi said:

I heard him say this - I assumed he was talking about taking Ickey over Sauce Gardner  

 

1 hour ago, Adoni Beast said:

Yes I don’t think it was the Zach Wilson draft either.

Why would woody care about a corner from cinci or a tackle from NC state? Like he knows the difference? 

Tebow, Favre, Zach, Aaron

Woody is a meddler at qb 

[SickJetFan]

3 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Zach Wilson and Woody compromised on Rodgers with the caveat that Wilson would be the unquestioned backup. The goal was to hide zach(as they did even in preaseason games) while putting up the facade that he was still a salvageable “talent.” Their cover got blown once Rodgers got hurt and Wilson had to play and they couldn’t pivot off of it due to their agreement in place. Obviously the right football move was to bring in someone else once Rodgers went down like Douglas has done at other positions.

All you guys give Woody Johnson too much credit

Lets explore an alternative view of the guy

The guys claim to fame is convincing his mother to buy a sports team in a fire sale - the big deal he put together to buy the Jets.  He didnt do it... the lawyers did and mommy's money

with all this guys money and resources this is his only claim to fame over 2 decades ago. You guys make him out to be this big schemer and business man.  Take away mommy and daddy money what is he.  He bought an ambassadorship and let me ask you did you ever see 1x where he was speaking in that capacity...**** no the guy is a dolt.

he is akin to telling your kids you are going to McDonalds and they get all excited - but then you change your mind and say taco bell and they get excited, ok maybe Carvel

 

[Matt39]

5 minutes ago, bitonti said:

 

Why would woody care about a corner from cinci or a tackle from NC state? Like he knows the difference? 

Tebow, Favre, Zach, Aaron

Woody is a meddler at qb 

Nah he was big on Sauce because of the nickname. There was a video of him during the predraft gushing over the Jets having the “secret sauce” marketable player with a nickname who wears #1. Revis Island thing was I’m sure influential too.
 

 

[k-met57]

7 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Hopefully there wasn't already a thread on this that I missed, but interesting tidbit I saw from Albert Breer (Sports Illustrated/MMQB) from a spot on Colin Cowherd's show last week.

"I'll tell you this Colin, they had wanted to draft an offensive tackle a couple of years ago, and I think ownership may have stepped in and may not have wanted them to do that. You know, so you give Joe Douglas another chance to get the offensive line right..."

Given we did in fact make the Becton pick in 2020 this very much reads to me like Douglas wanted (or is at least retroactively telling Albert Breer he wanted) to take Penei Sewell or one of the top OL at the top of the 2021 draft and Woody stepped in and forced the Zach pick. I can't think of any other pick where Douglas or anyone in the Jets front office would be leaking that to Breer.

Pretty bad look for the org whether you believe it or not, but if the Zach pick was Woody's it 1) helps explain the bizarre loyalty the org has shown him and 2) helps explain Woody not firing the guys who have been hamstrung by the fact that he sucks.

Jets bit starts at 8:28, the line about Woody stepping in is at 9:50.

 

 

1. JD was a highly desirable hire, he would never come to the jets unless he had autonomy on major draft decisions

2. Woody (say what you will) is not dumb, he isn’t making his GM make franchise altering picks he doesn't want to make

[Adoni Beast]

11 minutes ago, bitonti said:

 

Why would woody care about a corner from cinci or a tackle from NC state? Like he knows the difference? 

Tebow, Favre, Zach, Aaron

Woody is a meddler at qb 

If you remember Woody was on video pre draft saying “anyone want some saaaauuuce?” + look at the marketing Sauce has been involved in since he’s been in the league.

Woody getting a big chain and taking pics with Sauce. He’s all about this.

He has a big personality and Woody loves marketable players.

[slimjasi]

12 hours ago, bitonti said:

 

Why would woody care about a corner from cinci or a tackle from NC state? Like he knows the difference? 

Tebow, Favre, Zach, Aaron

Woody is a meddler at qb 

We’ll never agree on this, Mr. Jet Blue, but I don’t think woody forced anybody to take Zach Wilson. I think Douglas and Saleh fell in love with Zach’s arm talent at the combine. 
 

Either way, I don’t think Breer’s story was likely about the 2021 draft because, IMO, if the Jets didn’t take a QB at 2, they were going to trade down, not take an OT at 2. 
 

edit: I meant pro day, not combine. Zach had all the hype after his 70 yard throw in shorts 

[JustInFudge]

2 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

You're voicing an opinion on Fields as a prospect, which of course you're entitled to - I'm not saying you're wrong.

But I was simply pointing out to someone that stated the talk about SF trading to two for Wilson wasn't true because Fields was a better prospect.

My point was - SF traded to #3 and didn't take Fields.

You can think what you want, I can think what I want, he can think what he wants - but it's clear SF didn't think Fields was a better prospect than Lance and by all accounts wanted to trade up to 2 to take Wilson.  That wasn't a lie.

All I'm saying is - Zach didn't cut it as an NFL QB and was a bust - but the revisionist history that it was just the stupid Jets otherwise no one wanted him is simply untrue. 

With that said and as you pointed out and I completely agree - Jets made a bad choice and then compounded the error by not knowing how to properly "reach and recover".

This isn’t a revisionist history as many stated it then and it is now proven fact.  He was the better prospect then and is now the better pro.  No different than when Trubisky and Mahomes/Watson.  For whatever stupid reason some stupid GM for some stupid team decided otherwise, well, that’s on them but fact is fact.  And those that stated it then were right and those who said otherwise were wrong. 

[Bleedin Green]

16 minutes ago, k-met57 said:

JD was a highly desirable hire

Was he though?  I mean I know that was the narrative at the time, but the guy had also just wrapped up getting rejected for every GM job in the league for the second straight year, which was the entire reason he was still on the market in May.  Sure, he had done enough to get consideration, but when push came to shove, no decision-makers in the league thought he was actually good enough for the job except the brilliant minds of Chris Johnson and Adam Gase.

JD was essentially just the Brian Schottenheimer of assistant GMs back then.  A guy who got enough media talk to get interviews for possible promotions, but when doing further digging everyone decided neither was good enough for a promotion.  The Jets were just the only ones to eventually not know any better in JD's case.

For as much of a convenient narrative it is to feed the confirmation bias of those who sucked JD dry to now blame his 5 years of incompetence solely on others, the truth is he was just a poor hire who has been a consistent failure.  He is going down in flames more gloriously than any of Parcells, Bradway, Tannenbaum, Idzik, and yes even Maccagnan, despite them all having the burden to work under the evil puppet-master Woody as well.

With all of that said, nothing against what I know your point actually was @k-met57, as I do fundamentally agree.  Sorry, I simply couldn't help myself with that one piece, only because it seems like a lot of the ridiculous narratives going on lately (like this thread) are entirely driven behind this need to find a way for nothing to be JD's fault, solely to justify false preconceptions from many 5 years ago.

[hawk]

Woody is the only common denominator.  

[Maxman]

7 hours ago, JetPotato said:

Yep.

Bottom line: until Woody dies, we have no shot.

I locked the other thread. I know you posted this one first.

Let's not go the death route here.

Thanks.

[Maxman]

41 minutes ago, bitonti said:

 

Why would woody care about a corner from cinci or a tackle from NC state? Like he knows the difference? 

Tebow, Favre, Zach, Aaron

Woody is a meddler at qb 

Sanchez too.

[T0mShane]

41 minutes ago, bitonti said:

 

Why would woody care about a corner from cinci or a tackle from NC state? Like he knows the difference? 

Tebow, Favre, Zach, Aaron

Woody is a meddler at qb 

Guessing it would have been Saleh/Ulbrich wanting Sauce and Douglas wanting Ekwonu and Woody breaking the tie.

[JetPotato]

6 minutes ago, Maxman said:

I locked the other thread. I know you posted this one first.

Let's not go the death route here.

Thanks.

Not wishing it. Just pointing out the facts. He's not selling and he's not going to change while he's here. There is only one point in time in which anything will ever be different. It's just reality.

[Maxman]

16 minutes ago, JetPotato said:

Not wishing it. Just pointing out the facts. He's not selling and he's not going to change while he's here. There is only one point in time in which anything will ever be different. It's just reality.

Got it. Just wanted to stop that other thread because others start to chime in and things spiral quickly.

[CanadaSteve]

9 hours ago, HawkeyeJet said:

If this is true, and I think many here have speculated as such previously, I find it hard to give a fair shake to JD and even Saleh, who I don’t particularly care for.

If you connect all previous rumored dots, plus this, both Saleh and JD appeared to have wanted to keep Darnold, take an OL(or trade down presumably).   if they were in lockstep and the owner forced their hand, this franchise has no chance until he’s gone.  And I’ve never, ever bought into anything other than Woody just doesn’t know how to hire people.  I’m starting to believe though he truly is one of those owners who can’t help themselves from meddling.

That makes me ill, if it’s true.  It’s one thing(although I don’t like it either) to keep him on the roster at Woody’s wishes, its entirely another thing to force your staff’s hand in making such an important decision.

Woody is the one consistent in all of it.  If I was a cop working a case, and Woody's name kept popping up every time there was a robbery, I might look at him as a suspect.  I think it would be prudent for Jets fans to do the same when it comes to all this.  

 

[Rich Thornburgh]

13 hours ago, Matt39 said:

Yeah but where’s the PROOF?

The past 3 God-awful years

[Rich Thornburgh]

13 hours ago, SickJetFan said:

It will all come out eventually there is lots of loose lips but I have my doubts about JD not being a part of it too.  He had just drafted Becton who had a pretty good rookie year - he needed another 1st round tackle? not buying that.

Penei Sewell was the pick.  Elite offensive lines can make mediocre QBs look good.  That was how we got to back to back AFCGs with a scrub like Mark Sanchez

 

Woody like the idiot he is bought into the manufactured media hype about Zach Wilson.  Chugged the Chris Simms kool-aid.  An undersized one year wonder in college who put up stats only against bottom feeder competition and was never good facing a ranked team. And he still thinks Zach Wilson is the real deal and will bring him back next year as QB2.  
 

Woody Johnson has ruined the jets.  He has ruined Falls for me.  The worst owner in the NFL.  The worst owner in all of pro sports.

 

F Woody Johnson

[Warfish]

12 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

100%.

Didn’t try to hide it at all.

Why would they need to hide it? Lawrence was a sure thing at #1, everyone knew that too. We were at #2 and desperate at QB. The entire world knew we were taking one. This “maybe stick with Darnold” was not a thing at the time outside a small group of fans. All the stories about anyone in the org wanting that are all post-Wilson busting.

[k-met57]

8 hours ago, Bleedin Green said:

Was he though?  I mean I know that was the narrative at the time, but the guy had also just wrapped up getting rejected for every GM job in the league for the second straight year, which was the entire reason he was still on the market in May.  Sure, he had done enough to get consideration, but when push came to shove, no decision-makers in the league thought he was actually good enough for the job except the brilliant minds of Chris Johnson and Adam Gase.

JD was essentially just the Brian Schottenheimer of assistant GMs back then.  A guy who got enough media talk to get interviews for possible promotions, but when doing further digging everyone decided neither was good enough for a promotion.  The Jets were just the only ones to eventually not know any better in JD's case.

For as much of a convenient narrative it is to feed the confirmation bias of those who sucked JD dry to now blame his 5 years of incompetence solely on others, the truth is he was just a poor hire who has been a consistent failure.  He is going down in flames more gloriously than any of Parcells, Bradway, Tannenbaum, Idzik, and yes even Maccagnan, despite them all having the burden to work under the evil puppet-master Woody as well.

With all of that said, nothing against what I know your point actually was @k-met57, as I do fundamentally agree.  Sorry, I simply couldn't help myself with that one piece, only because it seems like a lot of the ridiculous narratives going on lately (like this thread) are entirely driven behind this need to find a way for nothing to be JD's fault, solely to justify false preconceptions from many 5 years ago.

Yeah i dont remember ever one article about JD being rejected for jobs. I do remember about 50 about the jets pushing for Howie Rosemans top lieutenant, with ties to Newsome and the Ravens. In fact JD turned the jets down multiple times due to the ownership situation, which is why they ended up giving him full control over football operations and a 6 year deal.

[Trotter]

10 hours ago, SickJetFan said:

All you guys give Woody Johnson too much credit

Lets explore an alternative view of the guy

The guys claim to fame is convincing his mother to buy a sports team in a fire sale - the big deal he put together to buy the Jets.  He didnt do it... the lawyers did and mommy's money

with all this guys money and resources this is his only claim to fame over 2 decades ago. You guys make him out to be this big schemer and business man.  Take away mommy and daddy money what is he.  He bought an ambassadorship and let me ask you did you ever see 1x where he was speaking in that capacity...**** no the guy is a dolt.

he is akin to telling your kids you are going to McDonalds and they get all excited - but then you change your mind and say taco bell and they get excited, ok maybe Carvel

 

Tom carvel was an icon

[jetsfan56]

 
https://sportsnaut.com/afc-exec-2021-nfl-draft-zach-wilson-qb-legends/
Zach Wilson draws Patrick Mahomes, Aaron Rodgers comparisons from AFC exec
http://content.invisioncic.com/y326398/monthly_2023_12/image.png.a69c401b5860ca4a359788d7501b4d95.png
 
https://www.outsider.com/sports/tony-romo-thinks-new-york-jets-zach-wilson-next-legendary-quarterback-dan-marino-super-rare/
Tony Romo Thinks New York Jets’ Zach Wilson is the Next Legendary Quarterback Like Dan Marino: ‘I Think He is Super Rare’
http://content.invisioncic.com/y326398/monthly_2023_12/image.png.5945c979a982877835b4385a6435d354.png
 
https://247sports.com/Article/NFL-Draft-2021-Zach-Wilson-compared-to-Patrick-Mahomes-Josh-Allen-by-David-Carr-161720541/
David Carr compares Zach Wilson to Patrick Mahomes, Josh Allen
http://content.invisioncic.com/y326398/monthly_2023_12/image.png.46181ae7d7dcee09c3c22f2527ccf4b3.png
 
https://www.nj.com/sports/2022/08/ex-pro-bowl-receiver-compares-jets-zach-wilson-to-chiefs-patrick-mahomes.html
Ex-Pro Bowl receiver compares Jets’ Zach Wilson to Chiefs’ Patrick Mahomes
http://content.invisioncic.com/y326398/monthly_2023_12/image.png.8c07b6b0145c2f3c3c90b53058d83b23.png
 
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2935209-cfb-coach-compares-zach-wilson-to-russell-wilson-patrick-mahomes-ahead-of-draft
http://content.invisioncic.com/y326398/monthly_2023_12/image.png.b1f9886baeea46a77fe2dc561ed360ea.png

When the bandwagons move lots of people jump on me included


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[Matt39]

1 hour ago, k-met57 said:

Yeah i dont remember ever one article about JD being rejected for jobs. I do remember about 50 about the jets pushing for Howie Rosemans top lieutenant, with ties to Newsome and the Ravens. In fact JD turned the jets down multiple times due to the ownership situation, which is why they ended up giving him full control over football operations and a 6 year deal.

Douglas was about to be fired by the Eagles. They brought in Andrew Berry at the time.

[k-met57]

8 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Douglas was about to be fired by the Eagles. They brought in Andrew Berry at the time.

this is completely untrue, and u literally will not be able to find any legitimate information online to back this up.

[slimjasi]

7 minutes ago, k-met57 said:

this is completely untrue, and u literally will not be able to find any legitimate information online to back this up.

He’s been spewing this nonsense since Douglas was hired without a shred of evidence to support it. 
 

The reality is that Douglas was one of the hottest GM candidates at the time he was hired. But like everything else the Jets do, he’s been underwhelming, to say the least.

Douglas has missed at HC, QB, and LT. Hard to recover from that. 

[Matt39]

14 minutes ago, k-met57 said:

this is completely untrue, and u literally will not be able to find any legitimate information online to back this up.

Mike Lombardi literally reported it. The Eagles brought in Andrew Berry (now Browns GM) and Douglas was on his way out. 

[Lurker89]

A lot of conjecture in this thread. 

[k-met57]

5 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Mike Lombardi literally reported it. The Eagles brought in Andrew Berry (now Browns GM) and Douglas was on his way out. 

you either have reading comprehension issues, or you don't understand the meaning of "about to get fired"

 

"Everybody tells me it’s Joe Douglas. I mean, look, Joe Douglas, he’s going to have options. Joe Douglas wants to leave Philly. I don’t think Joe Douglas is really that comfortable in Philadelphia in this current setup. The Eagles are going really extensively, they hired (former Browns exec) Andrew Berry. They’re going to go really with the analytics. Now, I think they’re going to do both; I think they’re going to do, to  have an analytics department and have an old school personnel department and see if they can bridge the two gaps. I don’t think Joe Douglas is sitting there, singing kumbaya every single day going in the office. Everybody tells me (the Jets GM gig) is his job. I can’t believe it’s somebody else."

[slimjasi]

8 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Mike Lombardi literally reported it. The Eagles brought in Andrew Berry (now Browns GM) and Douglas was on his way out. 

Lol, no . . . He literally didn’t.