Replacing the chains with tech

[THE BARON]

5 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

https://www.nfl.com/news/nfl-moving-closer-to-replacing-chain-gang-with-new-technology-to-measure-line-to-gain

NFL moving closer to replacing chain gang with new technology to measure line to gain

Published: Jul 31, 2024 at 11:25 AM

 

Associated Press

 

The NFL is moving closer to replacing the chain gang with new technology to measure line to gain.

NFL executive Gary Brantley told The Associated Press the league will test Sony's Hawk-Eye technology during some preseason games. The system most likely wouldn't be ready for full implementation until next season, though it could happen sooner.

"We're in the installation phase for all of our stadiums, really getting them calibrated and up to date," said Brantley, the NFL's senior vice president and chief information officer. "We're just really getting to a place where this system is as accurate as possible and really calibrating across our multiple stadiums. ... We have multiple stadiums with multiple dimensions inside of those stadiums with different age. So we're really just going through the installation of putting in the infrastructure and making sure these cameras are installed."

Sony, which was named the NFL's official technology partner on Wednesday, has expanded its sports technology through Hawk-Eye Innovations to support officiating and the development of on-field and sideline technologies, including a new coach's sideline headset that will debut in 2025.

Its Hawk-Eye tracking services for line-to-gain measurement adds cameras to stadiums to track players, officials and the ball. The optimal tracking system notifies officials instantly if a first down was gained after the ball is spotted by hand.

"We're reducing a significant amount of time, 40 seconds for each time of use that basically is making the game that much more impactful," said Neal Manowitz, Sony president and chief operations officer. "And then also the system is accurate down to less than half an inch, which is incredibly, incredibly accurate. Hopefully the fans appreciate the objective view, or at least half the fans each play will be appreciating it."

The NFL has long used two bright orange sticks and a chain to measure for first downs. That method would remain in a backup capacity.

Beyond new technology for line-to-gain measurement and new headsets for coaches' communication, Sony is partnering with the NFL to enhance sideline photography, broadcast cameras and production, and more.

"The NFL has incredibly high standards and really what we're talking about in this relationship is together, at the highest level, how do we change the future of sports," Manowitz said. "How we change line to gain is a great example, and that's where. ... we get the creators of the game, all of the people of the ops team, the coaches, the players, how do we get that community as close as possible to our engineers, and how do we bring them and then ultimately provide a much better experience for fans."

good idea. And another idea.  Put a sensor net in the football itself.  Not kidding.  You'll be able to tell exactly where the furthest most part of the football is when the runner is down.  You'd also be able to tell when the ball itself hits the ground or does not.  

[#27TheDominator]

We are going to miss players tripping over the chain and leveling the chain gang?  Boo!

[The Gun Of Bavaria]

2 hours ago, JiFtheOracle said:

They are stealing all of the XFL/USFL stuff, which is a good thing.  Their product is 100x better, just doesnt have the talent.  I'd love for them to do the booth reviews the same way too.

The NFL: The Original XFL Is A Joke

The NFL: The Original XFL's SkyCams are a great idea lets steal it. 

[JiFtheOracle]

14 minutes ago, The Gun Of Bavaria said:

The NFL: The Original XFL Is A Joke

The NFL: The Original XFL's SkyCams are a great idea lets steal it. 

I'm not kidding when I say they have a better product.  The only difference is the NFL has better talent.  From a pure viewership experience, dude, it's not even comparable.  The UFL is 1000x better.  Everything they do to captivate the audience is just flat out better.  They have better tech, they have better sideline interviews , they have better announcers, they have better rules, they bring you in the booth when plays are being reviewed, the camera angles, the kick offs, officiating.  

The NFL is cheap AF or being the cash cow that is and they refuse to get updated to make the experience better for the TV viewer.  It's honestly astonishing the lack of concern they have for the viewing audience when 80% of their revenue comes from TV. 

[RutgersJetFan]

First the AI came for the copywriters, and now they're coming for the first down marker guys?!?!?

[Sperm Edwards]

3 hours ago, SomebodytoAnybody47 said:

I do enjoy the drama of them holding the ball and lifting the chain over. 

I do not enjoy the horrible spots. 

Don't think this solves any of that. 

Imagine the sticks lit up green or red when spotting for a 1st down. Refs just going back and forth depending on who they want to screw.

3 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

For a long time I've wondered how inaccurate the refs' spotting of the ball was.  There's obviously no way to tell and I highly doubt tech can even figure it out (though I'm sure it can help).  I wonder how many games have been decided by these types of decisions.  One bad spot can be the difference between a 1st down vs a punt, for example.  Football has to be the most difficult sport (by far!) to ref.

2 hours ago, THE BARON said:

good idea. And another idea.  Put a sensor net in the football itself.  Not kidding.  You'll be able to tell exactly where the furthest most part of the football is when the runner is down.  You'd also be able to tell when the ball itself hits the ground or does not.  

I was thinking of that, too, but that light-up doesn't say if it crossed the plane before the ball carrier's knee is down. You'd need sensors all over the field and on the players' bodies for that.

[viffer]

3 hours ago, JetPotato said:

Spots are challengable

And what does that have to do with chains vs. tech? How does the technology make the spot more accurate?

[viffer]

47 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I was thinking of that, too, but that light-up doesn't say if it crossed the plane before the ball carrier's knee is down. You'd need sensors all over the field and on the players' bodies for that.

Yes, that is the problem. A sensor in the ball is easy (look at sensors on any race car today). Determining when the player is down is the hard part. It could possibly help with replays, since the ball position would be constantly recorded by the sensor, and during a replay they could get the time stamp when the knee, or whatever body part, is down, and then get the ball's exact position at that time stamp.

[HighPitch]

keep the chains and get rid of coaches challenges and all reviews

[Bleedin Green]

As others have pointed out, not having this also account for ball spotting is a huge miss and long overdue, which takes away a lot of what could be potentially gained. However, with that said the inaccuracy of the chain gang is also an often overlooked reality simply because people (understandably) focus more on the subjectivity of the refs.

However, are you really telling me any of you feel confident in the precision accuracy and not even the slightest shift when those guys are running to the far side of the field, acting as if that's not moving at all when then making a decision by an inch?

It's certainly not anywhere near enough, but a little something hopefully starts to step the league closer to eventually eliminating all the incompetence they are currently built upon.

[THE BARON]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I was thinking of that, too, but that light-up doesn't say if it crossed the plane before the ball carrier's knee is down. You'd need sensors all over the field and on the players' bodies for that.

True that, but it many cases, it would help.  It would also be a lot of fun to watch.  

[JiFtheOracle]

I see that posters are talking about putting in tech in to know the exact spot of the ball.

Guess what league does that too?

Yup!  The UFL.  

 

 

[THE BARON]

11 minutes ago, THE BARON said:

True that, but it many cases, it would help.  It would also be a lot of fun to watch.  

I don't know what made me remember this, but why not... Along similar lines with technology and football.  Years ago I had an odd dream when I fell asleep watching a football game.  It was some sort of football game of the future.  The players were wearing full body armor including a full helmet.  It was totally enclosed.  There were also invisible mines on the field that could be strategically activated by the coaches.  They could pick one mine per play.   They would not kill or injure the players, but the mines would blow them into the air about ten feet.  Caused fumbles and so on.  When there was a ball carrier or WR running free with the ball, the db's had a club they could deploy from their armor suit to bring down the ball carrier.  Wild dream.  Imagine Breece getting blown 10 feet into the air or Sauce and DJ bashing a ball carrier with high tech clubs ???

[More Cowbell]

This tech has existed in Tennis for over a decade. It's  about time the NFL adopted it. 

[Sperm Edwards]

4 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

This tech has existed in Tennis for over a decade. It's  about time the NFL adopted it. 

This isn't going to change/fix much at all except it takes a little less time.

[BornJetsFan1983]

man I cant wait for the 100% happening argument about where the line is start of line, middle of line, ball has to pass through, just tough or be past etc...but @morecowbell is right, long past due for some tech. can we get some sensors on the sidelines/goal line people. Did it break the plane etc.

[Dunnie]

For a long time I've wondered how inaccurate the refs' spotting of the ball was.  There's obviously no way to tell and I highly doubt tech can even figure it out (though I'm sure it can help).  I wonder how many games have been decided by these types of decisions.  One bad spot can be the difference between a 1st down vs a punt, for example.  Football has to be the most difficult sport (by far!) to ref.

Ball should be trackable by this point ... And tracking forward progress of the ball during live play should be possible.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Wit]

Maybe they will use a hologram post card.


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[Bronx]

As long as these as$wipes are in charge...

 

[Smashmouth]

13 hours ago, slats said:

I agree. I could see the league not wanting to lose the anticipation of the moment when the ref pulls the chain tight, but ultimately this would be a time saver and keep the game moving. The tech probably isn’t much different than the first down line we get on TV. There will still be challenges to where the ref put the ball in the first place, though, of course. 

SO if they have 3 close calls during a game what exactly do they save ?  Less than 2 minutes ? This is the dumbest implement of technology I have heard yet. The strike zone in baseball would be great because we have seen that in action and how much the Umpires suck along with all their inconsistencies but measuring a first down is ridiculous.

[Joe W. Namath]

 

[WestCoastOffensive]

17 hours ago, SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN said:

Soon , football is going to be one big flag football video game . OH , to bring back the old days .

Yes, bring them back. I can still get deep. I applaud this tech.

[More Cowbell]

On 8/2/2024 at 2:51 PM, Sperm Edwards said:

This isn't going to change/fix much at all except it takes a little less time.

I think it will be more accurate. If you look at how they use Hawk Eye in Tennis, they can spot the exact location where the ball lands. This will be a knee and they will know where in the field it hit. 

[Sperm Edwards]

14 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

I think it will be more accurate. If you look at how they use Hawk Eye in Tennis, they can spot the exact location where the ball lands. This will be a knee and they will know where in the field it hit. 

Except they’re not using it for spotting the ball. It’s whether the spotted ball is over the plane or how far it is from there. It’s just replacing the sticks/chain. It sounds like the accuracy is the same either way, and this is just about saving time.

[Bungaman]

On 8/2/2024 at 4:15 PM, TuscanyTile2 said:

For a long time I've wondered how inaccurate the refs' spotting of the ball was.  There's obviously no way to tell and I highly doubt tech can even figure it out (though I'm sure it can help).  I wonder how many games have been decided by these types of decisions.  One bad spot can be the difference between a 1st down vs a punt, for example.  Football has to be the most difficult sport (by far!) to ref.

I can't understand why NFL game balls couldn't have small sensors manufactured into the two noses, with an array of detectors on, in, above and along the field to help spot the ball, which I think is the more critical issue.

[Bungaman]

On 8/2/2024 at 9:31 PM, THE BARON said:

I don't know what made me remember this, but why not... Along similar lines with technology and football.  Years ago I had an odd dream when I fell asleep watching a football game.  It was some sort of football game of the future.  The players were wearing full body armor including a full helmet.  It was totally enclosed.  There were also invisible mines on the field that could be strategically activated by the coaches.  They could pick one mine per play.   They would not kill or injure the players, but the mines would blow them into the air about ten feet.  Caused fumbles and so on.  When there was a ball carrier or WR running free with the ball, the db's had a club they could deploy from their armor suit to bring down the ball carrier.  Wild dream.  Imagine Breece getting blown 10 feet into the air or Sauce and DJ bashing a ball carrier with high tech clubs ???

I want what you ingested during the game. Seems like it beats melatonin ...

[Better2bgreenthanblue]

2 hours ago, Bungaman said:

I can't understand why NFL game balls couldn't have small sensors manufactured into the two noses, with an array of detectors on, in, above and along the field to help spot the ball, which I think is the more critical issue.

I can't wait until the next generations Tom Brady comes along. You thought deflategate was bad...

[THE BARON]

7 hours ago, Bungaman said:

I want what you ingested during the game. Seems like it beats melatonin ...

Just my wild imagination, I suppose.  The players all had nano armor.  They could hit each other with high tech clubs and get blown into the air by mines, but no way they could get injured in any way.  Injury was no longer part of the game. 

[Larz]

 

[jeremy2020]

On 8/2/2024 at 5:23 AM, static14 said:

I can only see this adding fodder for the "it's all scripted" folks.

Those people don't need fodder.

[OilfieldJet]

On 8/2/2024 at 1:31 PM, THE BARON said:

I don't know what made me remember this, but why not... Along similar lines with technology and football.  Years ago I had an odd dream when I fell asleep watching a football game.  It was some sort of football game of the future.  The players were wearing full body armor including a full helmet.  It was totally enclosed.  There were also invisible mines on the field that could be strategically activated by the coaches.  They could pick one mine per play.   They would not kill or injure the players, but the mines would blow them into the air about ten feet.  Caused fumbles and so on.  When there was a ball carrier or WR running free with the ball, the db's had a club they could deploy from their armor suit to bring down the ball carrier.  Wild dream.  Imagine Breece getting blown 10 feet into the air or Sauce and DJ bashing a ball carrier with high tech clubs ???

Mescaline?

[THE BARON]

11 minutes ago, OilfieldJet said:

Mescaline?

high on life... 

[Larz]

Oops 

[ARodJetsFan]

I really didn't give this thread much attention when it was posted.

The tech for determining where the ball is in relation to the first down marker to essentially do away with the chain gang, was interesting.

However, you still have the problem of relying on the officials to spot the ball correctly - this is the part of the game where I wish they could get some kind of technology to take over.

If I had a dollar for every time I've seen a bad spot.

[Smashmouth]

On 8/2/2024 at 3:31 AM, Sperm Edwards said:

The chains are a part of the show, with the added visual suspense to “did he make it?” At the same time, the officials suck but it’d not only save time doing the chains thing.

It doesn’t sound like this helps them spot the ball, but more immediate feedback if it’s a first down or not after it’s spotted. 

If they had something to help them spot the ball that would be great. The issue should not be whether they could save a prescious minute or 2 and claim they saved time the issue should be was the ball placed right in the first place.  Implementing a GPS system with sensors at each point of the football showing position when a player is " considered down" or "down by contact" would be cool.  Instead of a chain gang, you have one ref stand at the firsrt down marker and he ingages the system when the player is whistled down. Then the system tells you exactly where to put the ball .