Carlton and Boomer: " Fitz/Jets have an agreement in place

[cant wait]

3 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

No he's kind of saying that Marino wasn't that good because he didn't win a ring. And that his big time stats were meaningless and basically fantasy football. 

I like you Rangers, but we all know not every team with a great QB deserves to win. Jim Kelly too would be a god if he had played here. And AJ I apologize for getting heated but it's incredibly frustrating to think about another year without a QB to believe in. We should have never let Favre walk out the door

[Integrity28]

4 minutes ago, AFJF said:

Yup, I wish they had  a shot at Paxton Lynch but he'll be gone well before 20th.

Dak Prescott?  

Connor Cook?  Jets sent five coaches to his pro day.

Hackenberg?

Ugh...Glennon or Lynch IMO.

If taking a flier on somebody late, I like Sudfeld.

I really like Dak the guy, but I don't have a clue if he can play at this level. Seems like an awesome leader though.

Cook scares me... I see Pennington. I can live with that, but I view Fitz the same way as Pennington, but less of a pussy.

Sudfeld or Hogan late... sure, I guess. 

Paxton Lynch is intriguing. If we trade Mo, we'd better get a QB out of it.

[Rangers9]

1 minute ago, cant wait said:

I like you Rangers, but we all know not every team with a great QB deserves to win. Jim Kelly too would be a god if he had played here. And AJ I apologize for getting heated but it's incredibly frustrating to think about another year without a QB to believe in. We should have never let Favre walk out the door

Favre signed with the Jets only because the Pack wouldn't let him go to Minnesota. After the one year here Tanny agreed to release him so he could go play for the Vikings and be in the same division as GB because he wanted to get them back for wanting to get rid of him to play Aaron Rodgers. 

[CanadaSteve]

3 hours ago, fltflo said:

Sorry guys but if history teaches us anything, most of you loving the resigning of Fitz, won't be feeling the same way by mid season.

The correct move, if the Jets are moving on from Geno was, upgrading the QB position with younger more long term solution. Signing Fitz as our starter is nothing short of a dead end. With this years schedule and the perfect blueprint Rex laid out, we will be luck to win 8 games.

If that is going to be the case, then better to lose 8 with a QB that is going to improve the following year, rather then one who had his peak last season.

That is not to say that this won't happen.  They need to have SOMEONE play QB this year.  Petty is NOT ready, and neither will be the QB they draft this year.  The only other option was trying to trade for Glennon, and I think they would rather draft a new guy and let him sit a year, rather than putting everything on Glennon.

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, AFJF said:

We've had enough QB's who weren't good enough to win the SB. Why would we "sell our souls" for another one?

Wow, hard to say anything other than wow. 

[AFJF]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

Wow, hard to say anything other than wow. 

Again, I prefer SB rings to fantasy stats, but I know that's an old school mentality.

It's no wonder every time I look up at the scoreboard in MetLife it's all "Fanduel" standings.

[Rangers9]

Look I don't want to put Glennon down. Sure he has some potential. But what does he bring to the table. He hasn't won anything. You know like games. So how do the Jets have a better chance to win with him than Fitz. 

[AFJF]

2 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

Look I don't want to put Glennon down. Sure he has some potential. But what does he bring to the table. He hasn't  won anything. You know like games. So how do the Jets have a better chance to win with him than Fitz. 

How many games should he have won in Tampa with that supporting cast?  18?  20?

[Jet Nut]

1 minute ago, AFJF said:

Again, I prefer SB rings to fantasy stats, but I know that's an old school mentality.

It's no wonder every time I look up at the scoreboard in MetLife it's all "Fanduel" standings.

There isn't a person, GM, coach of any kind who would turn Marino down. 

Fitz in 11 seasons hasn't made a playoff appearance.

Marino In year 1 went to a SB.  I'll take my chances with Matino.  On the field or fantasy nonsense.  

[dbatesman]

8 minutes ago, AFJF said:

Again, I prefer SB rings to fantasy stats

Im the exact opposite

[Rangers9]

Look, I was making a joke that some Jets fans wouldn't even appreciate Marino and sadly I was right. I'll go even further. If we had Montana these same fans would say he was nothing and only successful because of Jerry Rice. The same way they give Fitz no credit at all and Marshall all of the credit. Kind of mind boggling wouldn't you say??

[Gastineau Lives]

1 hour ago, AFJF said:

Hey, I'd prefer somebody with a ring over a guy with fantastic fantasy stats, but I'm an old guy...not a fanduel kid concerned with "winning my league".

Those two things are not mutually exclusive. You know who puts up great fantasy stats? Aaron Rodgers. He's terrible and not a winner, I know. You know who else? Tom Brady. Also not so good and not a winner. Cam Newton? PASS. Russel Wilson. Not a winner. Roethlisberger. Can't win, that guy. Drew Brees? What has he won? Alex Smith on the other hand, bad fantasy QB. Peyton Manning with a schoolgirl arm just won the Super Bowl. Brad Johnson too. Trent Dilfer. Just winners, those guys.

Brett Favre put up good fantasy numbers. Steve Young would have been a fantasy beast.

See how this works?

This is a common refrain you hear all the time that has no basis in reality. If a guy throws for 40 tds and 5000 yards, he's a QB you want to have. The only other option is to have a guy that plays with an all time defense and "wins" rings like Mark Sanchez took the Jets to two consecutive AFC championship games. The resurrection of Terry Bradshaw and Len Dawson is another way to go.

My point, Glenn, is that you will find most of the playoff QB's atop the fantasy ranks. Guys like Bridgewater and Alex Smith get there when their teams play lights out defense and run the ball well.

 

[JohnnyLV]

8 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

Look, I was making a joke that some Jets fans wouldn't even appreciate Marino and sadly I was right. I'll go even further. If we had Montana these same fans would say he was nothing and only successful because of Jerry Rice. The same way they give Fitz no credit at all and Marshall all of the credit. Kind of mind boggling wouldn't you say??

No because in Fitz case it is true. He is not a good QB on ANY level except sack avoidance which he is strong at. He is weal armed, wildly inaccurate, careless with his throws, incapable of going through reads, terrible truly terrible past 15 yards, and despite the "harvard" BS really not that great at understanding the game and making reads. So our offense literally consisted of throwing the ball up to Brandon, throwing to a wide open Decker when Marshall was double teamed and quickly dumping off to the RB. It was as simple an offense as could be run in the NFL, and Gailey constructed it beautifully. Coupled with playing the 31st most difficult defenses overall in the league and by far the easiest schedule in the NFL, Fitz went along for the ride and threw 31TDs. But he had 15 interceptions and could have had 30 amd was pretty much horrible in all other aspects. His underthrows on deep passes are actually funny.It is actually mind boggling that anyone can actually watch the JAG play and NOT think that he is immensely average and special or really even good at anything except dumping off quickly against the blitz and making sure he gets those 4 yards on 3rd and 7. Screw Fitz. If he actually comes back he will be god awful and we will waste yet another year.

[jetscrazey]

I'm starting to believe Mo could be traded on draft day in an attempt to move up for a franchise linebacker. That would free up space for a Fitz signing.

Also, cutting D'Brick and re-signing him at a discount (I doubt he'd want to pick up his life and move somewhere else now), or cutting Giacomini and going with Qvale, could allow the Jets to bring on another potential starter at a need position who is still a FA or a post June-1 cut

[Mainejet]

I'm happy for the Jets if this is true. Fitz is the best QB this team can have in the short term. There are no better solutions right now. Fitz is not going to get us to the SB, but he may get us to the playoffs. That's the best we can hope for until we find a franchise QB.

[Nostradamus]

Awesome...we need Fitz.  So he had a bad game in Buffalo...he lit it up all year. Get some o line help and add Forte in the mix and watch out!!

[long suffering jets fan]

I was thinking about this the other day.  No way Mac wasn't prepared for this from the beginning of free agency.  He and Fitz had an agreement that Fitz go out and see what his value is and the Jets will match.

Mac isn't going to leave the QB position to chance, or Geno.

[Villain The Foe]

5 hours ago, AFJF said:

Anyway, as I said earlier, I hope the rumor is true.  Get a veteran mentor like Fitz, then draft a QB early so he has a couple of promising young QB's to bring along.

What does this even mean? 

Get a veteran Mentor like Fitz yet we're not looking to work with Geno, a guy who was mentored by Fitz? The "mentor" statement is bull. You pay a starter to start and win football games. 

 

The "mentor" statement is crap just like Fitz/Marino comparisons. Yeah, Marino never won a SB but I doubt that there was a time where Dolphins fans felt like it was Marino that was holding that team back. Marino never had a fraction of the talent Fitz had last year. 

Also, who the heck has Fitz ever "mentored"? I never seen a guy come up from behind Fitz and do great because of Fitzpatrick mentoring, and Fitz has been on what, 6 different teams? 

Fitzpatrick is a mediocre, overly glorified back up quarterback that shouldnt even be put in the unique position to EVER be compared to a guy that I hated but will always respect in Dan Marino. Marino may not have won any SB's, but he is a champion....he won an AFCCG which makes him an AFC Champion. You must first get to the playoffs in order to even achieve something like that. 

[Smashmouth]

Sign Fitz which is what I said probably happened since day 1 for the 10-12 million range. Free up cap space by restructuring Brick, Mangold, and trading Wilkerson. Draft one of the young QB's, CUT Geno Smith after he looks like he's accomplished nothing during training camp and let Fitz Mentor Petty and the newly drafted QB . If Fitz lights it up and plays well with the new added talent at RB great, if not, then in a year or two one of those young QB's will be primed to step in and make this their team with Fitz taking a back up role as he ends his career and stays on to help the young QB's along. This is the best case scenario for the Jets moving forward and with the current acquisitions its the only scenario that makes any sense at all. 

[Smashmouth]

24 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

What does this even mean? 

Get a veteran Mentor like Fitz yet we're not looking to work with Geno, a guy who was mentored by Fitz? The "mentor" statement is bullsh*t. You pay a starter to start and win football games. 

 

The "mentor" statement people sling around is crap just like Fitz/Marino comparisons. Yeah, Marino never won a SB but I doubt that there was a time where Dolphins fans felt like it was Marino that was holding that team back. Marino never had a fraction of the talent Fitz had last year. 

Also, who the heck has Fitz ever "mentored"? I never seen a guy come up from behind Fitz and do great because of Fitzpatrick mentoring, and Fitz has been on what, 6 different teams? 

Fitzpatrick is a mediocre, overly glorified back up quarterback that shouldnt even be put in the unique position to EVER be compared to a guy that I hated but will always respect in Dan Marino. Marino may not have won any SB's, but he is a champion....he won an AFCCG which makes him an AFC Champion. You must first get to the playoffs in order to even achieve something like that. 

And what exactly is Mike Glennon ? A guy who has done the same nothing you bitch at Fitz for. Yet you sound like you would trade the farm for the guy. Fitz proved he could play well last year maybe the guy just happened to find the right fit and some decent talent to play with in an offense he already knows and was able to lead this team with his knowledge of said offense as a true leader. Hes now got 3 very good pass receiving RB's as an outlet and hopefully a TE  in Amaro who could at least catch the football.

Many people on this forum forget this team learned 2 new systems last year and they will only get better moving forward because that's how things work when you improve in a system over the course of the season and then you add 2 very Important parts to help the QB . Fitz will be a very good QB in this system moving forward lets hope the team does nto let us down as they did last year. We left 3 games on the table with bad ST play and some really untimely drops and fumbles. Fitz may have lost a game or 2 with some bad play but for the most part he willed this team to way more wins than he lost on his own.

if you want to point to the wind in Buffalo then your not objedctively looking at the QB position because no QB in the NFl or in any league plays well against the wind .Most smart teams play conservative into the wind and aggressive with the wind at their backs the Jets just never got it going and all this forum can do is put the blame squarely on Fitz and that is just ridiculous.

[Villain The Foe]

2 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

And what exactly is Mike Glennon ? A guy who has done the same nothing you bitch at Fitz for. Yet you sound like you would trade the farm for the guy. Fitz proved he could play well last year maybe the guy just happened to find the right fit and some decent talent to play with in an offense he already knows and was able to lead this team with his knowledge of said offense as a true leader. Hes now got 3 very good pass receiving RB's as an outlet and hopefully a TE  in Amaro who could at least catch the football.

Many people on this forum forget this team learned 2 new systems last year and they will only get better moving forward because that's how things work when you improve in a system over the course of the season and then you add 2 very Important parts to help the QB . Fitz will be a very good QB in this system moving forward lets hope the team does nto let us down as they did last year. We left 3 games on the table with bad ST play and some really untimely drops and fumbles. Fitz may have lost a game or 2 with some bad play but for the most part he willed this team to way more wins than he lost on his own.

if you want to point to the wind in Buffalo then your not objedctively looking at the QB position because no QB in the NFl or in any league plays well against the wind .Most smart teams play conservative into the wind and aggressive with the wind at their backs the Jets just never got it going and all this forum can do is put the blame squarely on Fitz and that is just ridiculous.

What exactly is Glennon? Well, what exactly is a rookie QB? You pay for talent, youth and upside Smashmouth. Also, a 3rd round pick isnt selling the farm...but let me get back to Fitzpatrick since his career of mediocrity and inability to step up during big moments is actually whats being debated here. 

Fitz is not young, he's was already in what is considered "his best position", so there is no more upside, he's injury prone...having 4 of his 10 seasons cut short due to injury, he's a limited passer that does not threaten with the deep pass (20% completion rate on deep throws, which about 50% of those completions were based on WR's adjusting and making awesome catches. Look at last season with Marshall, Decker or look at the year prior with DeAndre Hopkins). Any pass traveling more than 15 yards is an inaccurate football more often than we would like. We won 10 games. Yeah, we should have won 12 though. 

So let me ask you. What exactly is Fitz? Let me show you.

With Fitzpatrick as Jets QB, when opponents scored 21 or more points the Jets have a 1-6 record. 1-6! This stat right here tells me all I have to know about a Fitzpatrick led offense. And before you say that "21 or more could mean 40 points", 5 of those 7 games were no higher than 24 points, the other 2 games were 30 or more points". This right here shows that if any team scores 3 TD's, a Fitzpatrick led Jets team has an 85% chance of losing the game. Let me reiterate that.  The Jets had an 85% chance of losing the game if Fitzpatrick is quarterbacking and the opponent puts up just 21 points. 

And if you think that this is only relevant to this past season, I'll go down the list for you. 

Fitzpatrick W/L record against opponents who've score 21 or more points (Omitting the Jets Season for later comparison)

2014: 1-4 

2013: 0-6

2012: 0-8

2011: 3-10

2010: 1-7

2009: 0-2

2008: 0-5

2007: N/A

2006: 1-0

2005: 1-2

Total: 7-44 or 84.1% career losing percentage. 

Now, for the sake of not looking like a hater, I will give the "benefit of the doubt" for his first 10 seasons given that many people here have said that he didnt have great talent around him....however last year he had not just the best talent on both sides of the ball that I've seen the Jets field in my almost 25 years of following the Jets (collectively), but he also had Chan Gailey...the OC that basically made Fitzpatrick relevant to some capacity. and what was his percentage? Here you go. 

Jets Total: 1-6 or 85% losing percentage on the season. Fitzpatrick actually did worse than his career average with better talent around him on both sides of the ball. So all those people who we're yelling how Fitz won "more than 6 games" should give that credit directly to the defense, because when 7 teams this season scored 21 points, Fitz IMMEDIATELY became the fitz that was a "max 6 wins" kinda guy, and it didnt matter that he had the #1 WR duo, a 1,000 yard rusher and an offensive line that had Fitz as one of the least sacked QB's in the entire NFL. 

And in his last 4 seasons Fitz has a W/L record of 2-24! He's lost 92% of these games the past 4 seasons. In a passing league? How ridiculous is that, really? And we should pay 7-10 million for this?

I ask you this honestly, can Mike Glennon or Geno Smith for that matter do worst that that? Why pay a man 7-10 million when the Jets defense will have atleast 6-7 teams score more than 21 points? You're literally throwing away your season and the stats, not Villain, but the stats prove that you'll be throwing away your season....AND paying 7 to 10 million to do it.

The signing, if true is stupid. 

 

So, do you blame me for looking at different options? 

So yea, I like Mike Glennon. I like his game and I believe that he has potential which really has no value because it isnt some tangible stat. I understand that potential is only relevant when someone likes your game. HOWEVER, Fitz has very tangible stats given the amount of years/games played and the dude is a mediocre QB and when facing an offense that can score points the Jets have an 85% chance of losing the game. And trust me, Fitz 85% is a reflection of QB in relation of talent on both sides of the ball. People can talk all day about Mike Glennon and his 5 wins in his career, but outside of Vincent Jackson, 4 games with Mike Evans, Gerald McCoy and Lavonte David that Bucs team was absolute garbage. 

 

So to conclude, when you can only win 15% of your games with that amount of talent around you, against that poor of a schedule, in a league that is now a "passing league" which is designed to score points...then I feel like my position is quite valid. 

So please, let me know if losing 85% of those games in this type of league with the amount of talent around him is okay for you, and people like me should be ashamed for looking for potentially better options. 

[Kleckineau]

If they do indeed have an agreement in place, this Macc / Bowles regime is no better than Idzik / Tannenbaum / Ryan.

Standing pat at the QB position with essentially a back up QB is not the way a winning organization operates.

I hope they prove me wrong and make a trade for Glennon or Kaep or make a bold move on or before draft day but I doubt it.

[thebuzzardman]

I  just wanted to add that Jets fans probably wouldn't have appreciated Johnny Unitas either, because of his weird ass flat top.

Just wanted to get some older school players in on the un-appreciation.

 

 

[Villain The Foe]

1 minute ago, thebuzzardman said:

I  just wanted to add that Jets fans probably wouldn't have appreciated Johnny Unitas either, because of his weird ass flat top.

Just wanted to get some older school players in on the un-appreciation.

 

 

From what I hear, The Steelers didnt appreciate Johnny U. lol. 

[Sperm Edwards]

11 hours ago, KRL said:

I tend to believe the report because all of a sudden the agent (Sexton)
has stopped leaking info to the media.  If Fitzpatrick is coming back
I hope he's ready to equal or surpass his performance in 2015.  Because
after all of this contract drama the fans are not going to give him a
"free ride".  With Marshall, Decker, Forte and Powell to throw to there's
no way he should be under 60% completion:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/8664/ryan-fitzpatrick

The fans are going to hold him to a higher standard in 2016 I hope he's
ready for it

Not holding my breath. 

[Long Island Leprechaun]

8 hours ago, AFJF said:

He was a great regular season QB, but was never good enough to win a ring.  If you'd be happy to see the Jets go another 15 years w/o a SB win but a bunch of passing yards...to each his own.

I'd prefer a QB who can win a ring.

We know Marino can win zero and we know Fitz can win zero.  I want better.

Please stop. I'm an "old" guy too. Marino was a GREAT quarterback -- 100% HOF. I can only suspect that you never saw him play to make the ridiculous comments that you're throwing out here. Fitz is an average QB who is in a comfortable system. Putting Fitz and Marino in the same sentence is like putting Barry Sanders and LeGarrette Blount in the same universe. You don't like Fitz -- fair enough. There's plenty to criticize. But this Marino BS is really really stupid.

[section314]

33 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

Please stop. I'm an "old" guy too. Marino was a GREAT quarterback -- 100% HOF. I can only suspect that you never saw him play to make the ridiculous comments that you're throwing out here. Fitz is an average QB who is in a comfortable system. Putting Fitz and Marino in the same sentence is like putting Barry Sanders and LeGarrette Blount in the same universe. You don't like Fitz -- fair enough. There's plenty to criticize. But this Marino BS is really really stupid.

We need to get to this draft already because this board is getting wackier by the day! Thanks for trying to set the record straight. I guess Ted Williams and Ernie Banks were bums too! 

[AFJF]

55 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

Please stop. I'm an "old" guy too. Marino was a GREAT quarterback -- 100% HOF. I can only suspect that you never saw him play to make the ridiculous comments that you're throwing out here. Fitz is an average QB who is in a comfortable system. Putting Fitz and Marino in the same sentence is like putting Barry Sanders and LeGarrette Blount in the same universe. You don't like Fitz -- fair enough. There's plenty to criticize. But this Marino BS is really really stupid.

What exactly did I say in comparing Fitz and Marino that was incorrect?

[thebuzzardman]

I hated Marino as much as any good Jet fan (that damn fake spike...etc) but he's yet another example of a guy who gets judged too harshly based on lack of rings. There are things like circumstance, in terms of which players are around you on the rest of the team; in football what the defense is like, etc. Basketball examples would be Ewing and Barkley, for example. An example of a great team that didn't win the Championship would be the Webber/Peja/Miller etc Kings, where the rest of the West was so good (Spurs, Lakers etc)

 

 

[Villain The Foe]

49 minutes ago, AFJF said:

What exactly did I say in comparing Fitz and Marino that was incorrect?

I can chime on on this one. 

You were quoted as saying that Marino has never won anything. 

He's an AFC Champion my friend. He represented the AFC in the superbowl, in order to do that you must be an AFC champion. I would also assume (not sure) that he's also won some division championships as well. 

Fitz has never been an AFC champion because he's never been to the superbowl. Fitz has never been a division champion because he's never been to the playoffs and if you win your division you are guaranteed a playoff spot. 

 

You know that I dig your style AFJF, but you're wrong here my friend. Comparing the two is just asinine. 

[Mike135]

8 minutes ago, thebuzzardman said:

I hated Marino as much as any good Jet fan (that damn fake spike...etc) but he's yet another example of a guy who gets judged too harshly based on lack of rings. There are things like circumstance, in terms of which players are around you on the rest of the team; in football what the defense is like, etc. Basketball examples would be Ewing and Barkley, for example. An example of a great team that didn't win the Championship would be the Webber/Peja/Miller etc Kings, where the rest of the West was so good (Spurs, Lakers etc)

 

 

Exactly.  Who knows what might have been in 2013 and 2014 with good teams around Geno.

He could easily have a ring or two now.

 

That sort of thinking doesn't work with Fitz though.  He just stinks.  Unless maybe the Jets get a RB who can throw...  then maybe the team could reach the playoffs with Fitz at QB.  Any pass over 20yds (or over 10yds when windy) can be pitched to the RB so he can make the throw.

Can Forte throw?

[Joe Jets fan]

48 minutes ago, AFJF said:

What exactly did I say in comparing Fitz and Marino that was incorrect?

You said you wanted better then Marino, there is not a QB in the league or draft as good as Marino.   So your incorrect. 

 

Did you ever see Marino play?

there is so much more to judging a QB then rings.   

[UnitedWhofans]

People just can't see the forest for the trees. This is not about comparing Fitz and Marino, Glennon or anybody

There is no real solution at QB out there this year, so signing Fitz back is the perfect option.

Honestly people, what's the worst that happens? He sucks and we get a high draft pick for next year to start the search again.

The team is going to start to infuse younger talent. It has already begun. 

I honestly don't see why nobody seems to get this.

Of course if people are worried that we will get 7-9 wins and get a lower draft pick, that means that probably Fitz did a good job

[Rangers9]

9 hours ago, AFJF said:

How many games should he have won in Tampa with that supporting cast?  18?  20?

Look you're killing Fitz and even Marino for not winning either playoff games or SBs. So why so many excuses for Glennon. If he's so good how come he isn't their starter. They keep going to other Qbs. If you're saying why should the Jets accept mediocrity then what about him!

[UnitedWhofans]

This is not about accepting mediocrity. This is reality. IMO, Fitzpatrick is a better option than Kaepernick, and Glennon (at an expensive price).

And if you are just going to bemoan the fact that we are wasting another year, than 31 other NFL teams should feel the same way.

Texans, Jaguars, Vikings, Lions, Panthers, Browns, Eagles, Chargers, Titans, Bengals, Cardinals, Bills

All of these franchises have not won Super Bowls. We have. It doesn't matter how long ago it was. Still counts.