Fitz ain't comin back

[Sperm Edwards]

23 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

First of all double Fitz's salary last year was chump change for an NFL starter off of a good season. He was getting backup money last year. When Brick retired he said the movie Concussion was a factor. So he passed on a pay cut because he thought it wasn't worth it even though by most standards millions of bucks, a lot of money. Fitz might feel the same way. It's not worth it under a certain dollar figure that he set not the press or the fans. 

What??? Ferguson said flat-out that learning about CTE concerns/risks through the movie was not a factor in his retirement. The extra money wasn't there and he wasn't the player he was, and even he knew his play slipped. 

[Rangers9]

12 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

What??? Ferguson said flat-out that learning about CTE concerns/risks through the movie was not a factor in his retirement. The extra money wasn't there and he wasn't the player he was, and even he knew his play slipped. 

What I read was that the movie affected and influenced him and when the Jets offered him a substantial cut he weighed the factors and decided at that price it wasn't worth it. 

[Sperm Edwards]

3 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

What I read was that the movie affected and influenced him and when the Jets offered him a substantial cut he weighed the factors and decided at that price it wasn't worth it. 

Well you read that from people who want to believe what they want to believe, facts be damned, because here's what Ferguson had to say on the matter:

“I think learning about that was very groundbreaking for me,” Ferguson said. “But I don’t attribute that discovery to why I’m [retiring]. I really feel that when I came [into] this league I wanted to be the best that I could be. I wanted to go against the best and defend [against] the best. And when I can no longer do that, I wanted to kind of step away and be happy with the things that I accomplished.”

[Smashmouth]

8 hours ago, Freemanm said:

I agree with the article - Forget Fitz. The Jets have a tougher schedule, lost a pillar LT, a thousand yard rusher and one of the league's best run stuffers. Even if Fitz does return, does anyone think the Jets will be one game better next season than this past season, especially with the NFC West and AFC North looming on the schedule? That being the case, it's time to rebuild. Let's either move up and draft Lynch, or (and I actually think this is a viable option) see what Geno can do with actual receivers at his disposal. 

 

we now have a Better LT a better RB group and we will still stop the run so what's your point ? How in the hell do you call Brick a Pillar the guy was never in the discussion of the top LT's in the game but for maybe 1 season.

[j4jets]

6 hours ago, Powpow said:

No he may not be better than Sanchez BUT he is a better game manager and that's all Elway would expect or ask of him. 

No he's not

[BrickTamland]

44 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Yes but he's going to be paid much less than he would if he signed now

I don't know if that's true.

If/when QB1 goes down on a team with playoff hopes, you don't think Fitz would ask for 7-8Mil to "save" their season? 

Its all speculative of course and i

would think that Fitz would rather get paid now than make that gamble.

Regardless, I think that Fitz's potential options are: 

A. Get his 9-10mil from jets if they raise their offer a bit.

B. Cave and sign for 7-8 mil with jets/Denver.

C. Remain unsigned until a team is forced by injury (July/August) to get a quality back-up type for somewhere between 4-6 mil.

Maybe that third option is what is allowing him to turn down Jets' current offer, and continue waiting for a bit more.

The thing that makes this even more interesting is how the draft will affect it. Maybe jets take lynch, or a later round guy, who knows. However, I do believe that this class lacks the start-right-now qbs that past classes have offered. Perhaps that gives Fitz added security.

 

 

[New York Mick]

7 hours ago, Patriot Killa said:

I really hope we some how end up with Goff if we are looking for a rookie.

Goff is going to the Rams. If the Jets give away next years first plus to get a division two QB they're ******* retarded. 

[Jolot]

7 hours ago, SayNoToDMC said:

I don't even care anymore about Fitz. Sign that bag of sh*t Hoyer, our team isn't winning it all this this year anyway. 

This is my feeling as well, just end this already , Hoyer,Mcnown, Fitz.....it doesn't matter, we're screwed this year with any of them .

[Augustiniak]

3 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

Goff is going to the Rams. If the Jets give away next years first plus to get a division two QB they're ******* retarded. 

i think wentz falls.  i think the eagles talking him up is a nice smokescreen and the guy they really want is elliot.  i think the eagles fear the cowboys want elliot too.  

i think wentz makes it to SF, and then SF trades back, maybe with the jets, or even the bears or saints.  

[Rangers9]

25 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Well you read that from people who want to believe what they want to believe, facts be damned, because here's what Ferguson had to say on the matter:

“I think learning about that was very groundbreaking for me,” Ferguson said. “But I don’t attribute that discovery to why I’m [retiring]. I really feel that when I came [into] this league I wanted to be the best that I could be. I wanted to go against the best and defend [against] the best. And when I can no longer do that, I wanted to kind of step away and be happy with the things that I accomplished.”

Looks like you're right. But didn't he also say somewhere else that he would have played if no pay cut. 

[Jolot]

Stay at 20, draft the best available NON D Tackle available , draft a QB somewhere in rounds 3-6 ( cuz you should do that every year )  and continue the endless search for a franchise QB next offseason, I don't see how that's not the best plan at this point .

[Sperm Edwards]

Just now, Rangers9 said:

Looks like you're right. But didn't he also say somewhere else that he would have played if no pay cut. 

I don't recall, but I believe it whether he explicitly said it or not. The fact is he didn't retire until the Jets came to him with a choice of a 50% pay reduction or getting cut. Then within a few days of that "offer" he suddenly retires. Not hard to connect the dots there. 

[Sperm Edwards]

13 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

Goff is going to the Rams. If the Jets give away next years first plus to get a division two QB they're ******* retarded. 

If they pay Fitzpatrick anywhere near $18M/year on even a 2-year deal it doesn't speak well of their collective intelligence either.

Likeliness aside, one of those to choices could lead to superbowl glory in time. The other absolutely will not, and will further rob maybe-could-be's of 1st team reps and playing time because of a veteran's higher perceived floor.

[slats]

7 hours ago, Powpow said:

Elway is smarter than most GM's since he's played the game and the position.  I really don't think he's resigned to letting Sanchez be his starter.  Fitz would be a much better game manager for Denver than Sanchez.  Elway, like Fitz, is waiting to see what happens with Kap, who I believe eventually will sign with the Broncos.  Once that transpires, Fitz will be like the prodigal son and welcomed back with open arms.  As you said, he's the best fit for this team and this team is the best fit for him.  We all, like Mac, just have to be patient for a few more weeks and then it will all unfold. Finally.  

I don't think Denver has any real interest in Fitzpatrick. He just doesn't have the arm to play in Denver in the winter. He might beat Sanchez in a competition in the summer, maybe, but he'd finish the season on the bench. The Jets are the only team in the league showing serious interest in Fitz. And if they do something dramatic like trade up in the first round round for a QB, there may be no teams showing interest in him. 

[Augustiniak]

11 minutes ago, slats said:

I don't think Denver has any real interest in Fitzpatrick. He just doesn't have the arm to play in Denver in the winter. He might beat Sanchez in a competition in the summer, maybe, but he'd finish the season on the bench. The Jets are the only team in the league showing serious interest in Fitz. And if they do something dramatic like trade up in the first round round for a QB, there may be no teams showing interest in him. 

if elway wanted fitz he'd be a bronco.  he clearly didn't want to pay osweiler that money so why would he pay fitz close to that?  

fitz has no market, he's lost the poker game unless he remains unsigned and someone gets hurt in training camp.

i believe that even if the jets had considerably more cap room they still would not have signed fitz yet, b/c mccags is in the market for a young qb and it's possible this qb may start this year, depending on who it is.  it was always logical to wait until after the draft to sign fitz b/c there was always a good chance no other team was going to sign him, especially at his asking price and also b/c he's much better in gailey's system.  

i'll say it again, mccags was in houston for years where they had talent but couldn't win with hoyer or schaub, 2 journeymen similar to fitz.  he does not want to replicate that team model here and if you believe all the rumors/reports, he's intent on getting a qb early this draft.  

[nyjets782]

2 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Kap's money was guaranteed either way for injury. They couldn't cut him. This has been discussed many times.

And Fitz has plenty of money. He can play his hand however he wants. He should hold out for the most money. It's a violent game. 

Try to get the most money yes but with each passing day it becomes obvious that no one is going to match the Jets offer let alone pay him what he is asking.  If the strategy is to get the most money, just watch what happens to his market if/when the Jets draft a QB and/or sign Hoyer.  He won't be able to approach even $7M if the Jets are out of the running. 

That's just looking at it from the financial side.  From the football and career side, his position makes even less sense.  This was his last shot to start in a setting he could be successful in and he is throwing it away.  I don't fault him for wanting the most money possible, I just find his stance in the face of a market that is anything but in his favor to be more and more bizarre each day.

[Integrity28]

3 hours ago, Kleckineau said:

"Game manager"

What a bullsh!t fan made term.

Is there any GM HC or OC out there that actually says lets go get ourselves a game manager?

It's right up there with "rebuilding year". 100% agreed.

[New York Mick]

32 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

If they pay Fitzpatrick anywhere near $18M/year on even a 2-year deal it doesn't speak well of their collective intelligence either.

Likeliness aside, one of those to choices could lead to superbowl glory in time. The other absolutely will not, and will further rob maybe-could-be's of 1st team reps and playing time because of a veteran's higher perceived floor.

Signing Ftiz for that much is almost as stupid as trading away a sh*t ton of picks for a D2 QB. 

 I don't think either is a good option.  Trade down or stay put and pick up one of the other quarterbacks. Sign Ftiz or Hoyer depending on the better contract and let the rookie sit for a while. 

[Big Blocker]

18 minutes ago, nyjets782 said:

Try to get the most money yes but with each passing day it becomes obvious that no one is going to match the Jets offer let alone pay him what he is asking.  If the strategy is to get the most money, just watch what happens to his market if/when the Jets draft a QB and/or sign Hoyer.  He won't be able to approach even $7M if the Jets are out of the running. 

That's just looking at it from the financial side.  From the football and career side, his position makes even less sense.  This was his last shot to start in a setting he could be successful in and he is throwing it away.  I don't fault him for wanting the most money possible, I just find his stance in the face of a market that is anything but in his favor to be more and more bizarre each day.

Regarding your second point, I tend to agree with you if I was in his shoes, but despite him being a smart guy, how he looks at this could both be different and, well, wrong.  But we can't rule out that he's seeing it differently.

The bigger point is I still think Denver is in play for Fitzpatrick.  Look at it this way - if I want to defend the approach that the Jets are using here, I would tend to focus on the perceived benefits of taking a wait and see attitude, holding my cards close, see if anyone else overplays their hand, blah blah blah.  But especially if htat take has merit, how is it essentially different than what Elway seems to be doing?  He watched as SF has not been able to deal Kaep at presumably a higher price than Elway might prefer to pay.  He's signed his backup who if forced to he could start.  In that regard he's in a better position than Macc, who apparently has no one to start right now.

The key question remains, of course, whether the Broncos want Fitzpatrick and at what price.  It's not hard to guess that Fitz's agent is asking for some inflated number from them just as he is from the Jets.  So if I'm Elway I watch to see if either side makes movement between the Jets and Fitz. 

In other words I am far from clear that anyone can reasonably conclude the Broncos have no interest in Fitzpatrick.  And just as the Jets seem to be saying, even if Kaep goes nowhere, and the Jets bring back Fitzpatrick without Denver reaching a deal with him, they can always sign Hoyer.  Some here think that Hoyer might be an acceptable result for the Jets. Maybe Elway sees Hoyer as the extent of his downside taking his approach to date.  And that is an acceptable risk for him.

[Beerfish]

Start of training camp:

Starter: Ryan Fitzpatrick

Backup: Newly drafted Qb if we pick one in the 1st round or Petty

3rd string: Petty if we draft a QB lower in the draft.

Geno cut.

[FidelioJet]

Just now, Beerfish said:

Start of training camp:

Starter: Ryan Fitzpatrick

Backup: Newly drafted Qb if we pick one in the 1st round or Petty

3rd string: Petty if we draft a QB lower in the draft.

Geno cut.

I completely agree that Fitz is the starter.  There's little doubt in my mind that he eventually ends up on the Jets.

But from just about everything that's been said and done, the Jets seem to have little faith in Petty.  And Geno comes cheap...I can't see them cutting Geno and I can't see Petty being ahead of him on the depth chart.

[Beerfish]

Just now, FidelioJet said:

I completely agree that Fitz is the starter.  There's little doubt in my mind that he eventually ends up on the Jets.

But from just about everything that's been said and done, the Jets seem to have little faith in Petty.  And Geno comes cheap...I can't see them cutting Geno and I can't see Petty being ahead of him on the depth chart.

This regime is the anti rex regime, their coach and front office doesn't lavish praise on players, especially new ones so I take the whole they don't like petty with a grain of salt, they drafted him and they are letting him develop, he was a 4th rounder after all.  A new draft pick will be as cheap if not cheaper than Geno.  We will find out sooner or later I guess.

[CanadaSteve]

The other option nobody has mentioned here is Fitzpatrick may not care.

Given his background, he is a SMART dude.  He has lots of kids.  I am sure he has been wise with his money.  He may very well be thinking that if he IS going to come back, it is for money.  If he doesn't, he retires and goes and lives his life financial secure with more years that his body does not have to take a pounding. 

VERY possible this is the reason he is playing hardball with his contract demands.

[BowlesMovement]

1 minute ago, CanadaSteve said:

The other option nobody has mentioned here is Fitzpatrick may not care.

Given his background, he is a SMART dude.  He has lots of kids.  I am sure he has been wise with his money.  He may very well be thinking that if he IS going to come back, it is for money.  If he doesn't, he retires and goes and lives his life financial secure with more years that his body does not have to take a pounding. 

VERY possible this is the reason he is playing hardball with his contract demands.

This is what I think too. The guy has had a few good contracts, and just may not be willing to take the time away from his family, and subject himself to NFL life for anything less than his number. And if that is the case, I wish him well, and respect that. I also don't think the Jets can pay him his number, if they can get him at their number, awesome, love to have him back, but if not, best of luck

[JiFtheOracle]

Agreed.  They're going to sign Hoyer on the cheap and he'll be the NY Jets starting QB.

Lots of QB's out there who can miss the playoffs.  Hoyer actually made it last year. 

[Sarge4Tide]

Hoyer / Petty  / (Lynch, Cook, or Hackenberg) sounds okay to me

 

[Big Blocker]

58 minutes ago, BowlesMovement said:

This is what I think too. The guy has had a few good contracts, and just may not be willing to take the time away from his family, and subject himself to NFL life for anything less than his number. And if that is the case, I wish him well, and respect that. I also don't think the Jets can pay him his number, if they can get him at their number, awesome, love to have him back, but if not, best of luck

It's entirely possible Fitzpatrick is really considering retirement.  Or it may be a posture implied here as a matter of leverage.  Or some combination of both.

I am not sure how much it matters.  If he only has the desire to play another season or two if he's effectively overpaid by market standards, then the Jets should probably just move on and say enjoy your retirement.  I agree.

[Maxman]

1 minute ago, Big Blocker said:

It's entirely possible Fitzpatrick is really considering retirement.  Or it may be a posture implied here as a matter of leverage.  Or some combination of both.

I am not sure how much it matters.  If he only has the desire to play another season or two if he's effectively overpaid by market standards, then the Jets should probably just move on and say enjoy your retirement.  I agree.

He could certainly retire but he stands to make a lot of money even with the Jets low ball (in his mind offer) he can make another 20 million before he retires. That is hard to pass up.

[peebag]

4 hours ago, PatsFanTX said:

Why would you, or any fan, give a 1,000 sh*ts about what happens to Fitz?

He either signs with the Jets or he doesn't.

What is there to care about?

Your current posting abilities are fantastic.

[nyjets782]

1 hour ago, Big Blocker said:

Regarding your second point, I tend to agree with you if I was in his shoes, but despite him being a smart guy, how he looks at this could both be different and, well, wrong.  But we can't rule out that he's seeing it differently.

The bigger point is I still think Denver is in play for Fitzpatrick.  Look at it this way - if I want to defend the approach that the Jets are using here, I would tend to focus on the perceived benefits of taking a wait and see attitude, holding my cards close, see if anyone else overplays their hand, blah blah blah.  But especially if htat take has merit, how is it essentially different than what Elway seems to be doing?  He watched as SF has not been able to deal Kaep at presumably a higher price than Elway might prefer to pay.  He's signed his backup who if forced to he could start.  In that regard he's in a better position than Macc, who apparently has no one to start right now.

The key question remains, of course, whether the Broncos want Fitzpatrick and at what price.  It's not hard to guess that Fitz's agent is asking for some inflated number from them just as he is from the Jets.  So if I'm Elway I watch to see if either side makes movement between the Jets and Fitz. 

In other words I am far from clear that anyone can reasonably conclude the Broncos have no interest in Fitzpatrick.  And just as the Jets seem to be saying, even if Kaep goes nowhere, and the Jets bring back Fitzpatrick without Denver reaching a deal with him, they can always sign Hoyer.  Some here think that Hoyer might be an acceptable result for the Jets. Maybe Elway sees Hoyer as the extent of his downside taking his approach to date.  And that is an acceptable risk for him.

The only thing Fitz could possibly be holding onto is interest from Denver, but no matter what happens with Kaep, they are not paying Fitz anywhere close to $16M.  Once/if the Jets move on, Denver could offer Fitz $5M and he'd have to take it.

I think Denver could have interest in Fitz but they are smart enough not to be dragged into a bidding war for a journeyman and Mac is taking the same approach.  If I was advising Fitz, it would have been to sign before the draft because again, if the Jets draft a guy or if Denver drafts a guy, that further weakens his already weak position. 

 

[Warfish]

We're not drafting a day 1 starting QB this year.  I'm almost willing to guarantee that fact.

 

Fitz, or Hoyer, or Geno will be starting for us in 2016, and the draft will not spell the end of Jets attempts to sign veteran QB's like Fitz and/or Hoyer.

[Rangers9]

1 minute ago, Warfish said:

We're not drafting a day 1 starting QB this year.  I'm almost willing to guarantee that fact.

 

Fitz, or Hoyer, or Geno will be starting for us in 2016, and the draft will not spell the end of Jets attempts to sign veteran QB's like Fitz and/or Hoyer.

I'm hoping you're right and all of these rumors are just a crock but now I'm starting to think it's possible. 

[nyjets782]

3 minutes ago, Warfish said:

We're not drafting a day 1 starting QB this year.  I'm almost willing to guarantee that fact.

 

Fitz, or Hoyer, or Geno will be starting for us in 2016, and the draft will not spell the end of Jets attempts to sign veteran QB's like Fitz and/or Hoyer.

I agree 100%.  Even if we had the top pick, I wouldn't want the guy to start Day 1.  I just don't think it helps Fitz at all if the Jets and Denver add another QB in the draft.

[Raideraholic]

29 minutes ago, Maxman said:

He could certainly retire but he stands to make a lot of money even with the Jets low ball (in his mind offer) he can make another 20 million before he retires. That is hard to pass up.

Jmo I think Fitzpatrick rather wait to see if any Qb gets hurt in the preseason  , than take the Jets low ball offer( in his mind) .     I don't think neither side( Jets or Fitzpatrick ) are going to change their positions. ( both have a different idea of Fitzpatrick worth)

It's probably in the best interest of both parties to go in different directions at this point.

[Mainejet]

13 hours ago, David Harris said:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000653687/article/fitzpatrick-jets-likely-wont-get-deal-done-before-draft

Negotiations are now stopped until after the NFL draft. The same NFL draft that Mike Mccaggan just tried to jump to the number one overal pick so he could draft a quarterback. Mike has interviewed and brought in every single viable quarterback in this draft.  This guy is locked in.

Fitzy- you have just about blown it. Your probable one last opportunity to start in the NFL will disappear in about 10 ten days when the NYJ use a high pick to obtain a QB.  Maybe we jump up for Goff and he starts day one but even if we take a developmental prospect I think it's the end for Ryan here.  Macc is a realist, with a tough schedule and a tight cap, with an alright QB who wants to get paid like a good one.  Mac has two young quarterbacks on the roster that he wants to look at plus there will be a new rookie. After this draft their will be 3 young cheap QB's in the room and Fitz will be a year older.  

If I were his agent I'd tell him to take the one offer on the table asap, but now it may already be too late.

Regardless of whether Mac drafts a QB, I still believe he'll resign Fitz. I do agree this is getting rather tedious with negotiations not working for so long. But at the end of the day, the Jets do not have anyone that is ready to start. They need Fitz. Petty needs more time. Geno got his chance and he sucks. That only leaves Fitz.