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Gas2No99

Former Jets QB Chad Pennington hopes Todd Bowles gets the chance to turn franchise around

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3 minutes ago, Lil Woody said:

They quit. It was clear as day. Total lack of effort.

I would tend to agree with that as well but Revis and Skrine couldn't cover in man and the secondary looked like a band of misfits with so many blown coverages. The NFL is a passing league and say what you will but a team needs to have an exceptional secondary. When Revis had his Island you seldom saw a pass even go to his side of the field. That's making an impact on an opposing offense.

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10 minutes ago, MaxAF said:

I would tend to agree with that as well but Revis and Skrine couldn't cover in man and the secondary looked like a band of misfits with so many blown coverages. The NFL is a passing league and say what you will but a team needs to have an exceptional secondary. When Revis had his Island you seldom saw a pass even go to his side of the field. That's making an impact on an opposing offense.

That's true about Revis locking down his man, but even during the "Revis island" days it still didn't really stop the better passing attacks from killing us, it just made the opposing teams have to beat us without their top WR threat. Great coaches would have been able to take advantage of that.  But our team still got smoked often enough by the other teams WRs, slot guys, TEs and/or RBs. Remember how bad Lito Sheppard was opposite Revis.  Even when we had Revis Island, the predominant thinking we that had to keep drafting someone or hitting FA to get another great CB to play the #2 opposite him.  Then even when we fixed the #2 spot and got Cromartie and he was playing at the top of his game, then we just got Kyle Wilson-ed by the better teams out there. If Wilson somehow held up or we started deploying other guys like Ellis Lankster or whoever was hot for a stretch, we still lost those close games by RBs taking a pass between Pace and Harris and just destroying us on 3rd downs. We definitely had some great success under Rex with his blitzing schemes and his use of Revis, but it was very short lived and even during those 2 great years we were always just waiting for the other team to adjust to stop the blitzes, and find that mismatch to exploit and once they did, we were usually gutted on the field.  That's the rub on the past 10 years or so, we had a great CB but still always had a hole in our pass defense. And the real problem was almost always the lack of true pass rushing talent. So we watched the opposing QB get to his 3rd reads, and we blamed the issues on coverage.  So rather than closing the time the QB had to throw, we tried to "fix" the coverage issues by working backwards and identifying who got beat and then throwing money or draft picks at that problem, continuing to ignore the real issue.  I agree the NFL is a passing league and you need good CB play across the board. But I would say that a pass rush is more important to defending the passing game than CB play is. .

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11 hours ago, Lil Woody said:

Company line? It's just how intelligent players speak when addressing the media. Maybe Derek Jeter was a phony too then. And even if Chad was a phony....so what?  I'd rather hear players push the company line and act like a professional and be a phony than have some idiot player vocalizing his own stupidity to the media just to keep it 100 and effectively add to the circus atmosphere that our highly unprofessional beat writers look to perpetuate.

So... you dont want the truth?   You want the company line?  Got it.  

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4 hours ago, southparkcpa said:

So... you dont want the truth?   You want the company line?  Got it.  

LOL. Yes, I guess.  The truth? You want the truth? What is this geopolitics?  It's the NFL. I just want to root for a team that I like and that represents itself well and with class and competes hard every game and wins well.  I want to see the game I love be presented as a great sporting event between sportsmen.  I don't want to listen to a bunch of selfish entitled players complaining about their union deals and spouting off at the mouth about getting their money and the hardships they endure and how they are living the big baller lifestyle.  I simply want to be entertained by an entertainment property.  The players are generally unrelatable and sometimes entirely unlikable.  I want to watch my favorite sport played with integrity by guys who love the sport.  I don't need to know about their money issues, what kinds of cars they have, how many hot sluts they bang, or any of that stuff that isn't important to the game itself. 

Some people love to get immersed in their story, who they are, what personal battles they overcome, etc...I just don't care. I'm not interested in a players need to brand himself to get more marketable.  I don't care about that. I only really care about how they play the game. Some guys make it to the highest level in the sport without flash and grandstanding. That's preferable to me.  Jerry Rice and Peyton Manning are some of my favorite players in NFL history, I know next to nothing about their personal lives or what they do for fun in the offseason.  I have read everything I could about their approach to the game, and I followed their careers very closely.  I want to watch guys like that, who put everything into their jobs and reaped the rewards.  I don't give a rats ass if they gambled with Jeter and MJ on the weekends or if they were in the club until 3 am getting their knobs polished by some TMZ all star.  Simple contract for me as a fan - I want to root for you as a player - all I expect is that you work as hard as you can, play every down hard, compete and don't embarrass the franchise with their immaturity and stupidity.  Marvin Harrison might be a gang kingpin based on some of the crazy news reports I heard a while back, but hey, that guy had a great career and was a model citizen in the league when he was playing. He repped his team well and now that he's out of the league, nobody really cares if he's hiding guns in alleyways in Philly or whatever.

So maybe that makes me an old white guy or whatever, which I am.  I'm very happy with that and this is what I want to consume as a fan. If you want to call that the company line, fine. I don't watch the additional content at the end of Game of Thrones to hear some actors talking on how they had difficulty acting out one of the scenes outside with high winds and sun glare.  I don't give a rat's ass. Same is true for the NFL players.  I only care about the quality of the product. Just make a great show and show me some boobs and dragons or great football.

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22 hours ago, Larz said:

There were some things I liked about Pennington, but he is a big phony. Always saying the company line

How is he being phony?  What company line?  Who gave it to him and sent him out to tell their story on NFLN? 

Funny how it goes from his opinion, based on experience with Bowles, to being a phony shill for the Jets when we don't agree with his point of view. 

At least there aren't as many he should STFU posts as we usually get when a player talks

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4 hours ago, southparkcpa said:

So... you dont want the truth?   You want the company line?  Got it.  

And you know it's not the truth as he sees it just how?  You've already given some ridiculous reasons for disliking Chad earlier.  You take a lot of liberty with the truth, should be last one accusing someone of not being truthful

Still want to know how someone who has no affiliation with the Jets was given this company line and what his motivation is to pass it on to the world if he doesn't agree with it.  Please explain that one.  I know it fits the overall negative vibe but really? 

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On 7/15/2017 at 2:55 PM, Larz said:

There were some things I liked about Pennington, but he is a big phony. Always saying the company line

+1

It's nice that there's a national voice who doesn't reflexively mock the Jets and everything they do, but he said all this stuff about Rex (and Sanchez, and Geno, and Fitzpatrick) too.

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19 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

+1

It's nice that there's a national voice who doesn't reflexively mock the Jets and everything they do, but he said all this stuff about Rex (and Sanchez, and Geno, and Fitzpatrick) too.

Don't forget Herm....... 😀

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59 minutes ago, southparkcpa said:

Don't forget Herm....... 😀

In the context of the Jets and the last 20 years or so...Herm wasnt that terrible in hindsight. He figured out a way to surround himself with pretty decent positional coaches(a lot of whom have moved up)...was able to hire Westhoff...and the team was always at the bottom in penalties committed. I dont get the sense that there's anyone on Bowles' staff in line for a promotion. 

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I'll always like Penny. If the guy was durable, I have no doubt he would have brought a SB here. Kid was just an icredible football mind and had all the tools to succeed before his injury. Yeah he didn't have a huge arm, but that was overblown. Once he tore the labrum though, it was over and he was never the same. His "weak" arm became a legitimately weak arm that could no longer make NFL throws.  But the guy had the perfect mental makeup and approach to the game. He was Peyton Manning-esque. I'd love for him to get out of the broadcasting game and into coaching. He'd likely be an incredible coach.  Jets should ask him every year if he'd like to join a staff as a quality control asst and groom him on a fast track to be a QB coach.
That said, I get that Bowles is a highly respected coach in NFL circles. I get that he's in a bad situation. I get all the reasons to keep him.  But I have 2 to get rid of him that trumps all the good. 
1) He lost the team.
2) He has no ability to effect the game from the sidelines. That's a bit of a catch all in saying he can't game plan, cant adjust, can't manage game situations or a clock properly, can't scheme an effective defense to fit the players abilities (stuck in his "system").
He's probably a great guy and an old school coaches coach type of guy.  But he's also toothless and ineffective. 2 things that you can not be taught or developed. You either command respect or you don't. You either are a guy that will do whatever it takes to find a way to make things work for you or you are the type of guys who is willing to just to sit back and become a spectator when you feel things are out of your control. 


So the only 'good' coach we have had was parcels ???


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

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18 hours ago, dbatesman said:

+1

It's nice that there's a national voice who doesn't reflexively mock the Jets and everything they do, but he said all this stuff about Rex (and Sanchez, and Geno, and Fitzpatrick) too.

well Rex and Sanchez helped this team make 2 title game apps.  why is it Jet fans treat rex and Mark like Kotite and bubby Brister?

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19 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

well Rex and Sanchez helped this team make 2 title game apps.  why is it Jet fans treat rex and Mark like Kotite and bubby Brister?

you crack me up man

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29 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

you crack me up man

it's so weird how as a group of fans we judge players and coaches.

-Brett favre sabotages a season for us and he's beloved

-Ken O'Brien never wins a playoff game and he's beloved(Now, when he was playing he was hated)

-Mark Sanchez wins 4 PO games and is hated

-Chad Pennington wins a rare div title and is hated

-Rex wins 4 PO games and is hated

Herm takes us to PO 3 times and is hated.

 

it's odd.  I'm not saying build a statue for any of these guys but can we have some appreciation?

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2 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

it's so weird how as a group of fans we judge players and coaches.

-Brett favre sabotages a season for us and he's beloved

-Ken O'Brien never wins a playoff game and he's beloved(Now, when he was playing he was hated)

-Mark Sanchez wins 4 PO games and is hated

-Chad Pennington wins a rare div title and is hated

-Rex wins 4 PO games and is hated

Herm takes us to PO 3 times and is hated.

 

it's odd.  I'm not saying build a statue for any of these guys but can we have some appreciation?

dude... please.... we have rehashed teh sanchize time and time again.  I am pretty much the closest ally you have in all of Jetdom when it comes to him and we arent even close to agreeing which says alot...

 

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17 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

dude... please.... we have rehashed teh sanchize time and time again.  I am pretty much the closest ally you have in all of Jetdom when it comes to him and we arent even close to agreeing which says alot...

 

so you wouldn't agree he deserves some appreciation?  what exactly do you disagree w/?  (this should be interesting to read your perception).

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Just now, CanadienJetsFan said:

Training camp can't come soon enough. It amazes me just how many players, ex-players, pundits, call them what you will, seem to like Bowles immensely...

Chad does work for the Jets organization, he's not going to blast the HC.

 

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9 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

so you wouldn't agree he deserves some appreciation?  what exactly do you disagree w/?  (this should be interesting to read your perception).

you and I have had this exact discussion many times, not going down that road with you again.  I have been open to discussing who sanchez is at every stop on his career.  there is no reason to have that discussion today or ever again(hopefully).

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3 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

you and I have had this exact discussion many times, not going down that road with you again.  I have been open to discussing who sanchez is at every stop on his career.  there is no reason to have that discussion today or ever again(hopefully).

what does that have to do w/ appreciating winning more PO games w/ him than any other QB in Jets history?

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14 minutes ago, CanadienJetsFan said:

Training camp can't come soon enough. It amazes me just how many players, ex-players, pundits, call them what you will, seem to like Bowles immensely...

These comments are not meaningful. 

Q: What do you think about Bowles and his chances with the Jets?

A: I hope he has a chance to succeed.

Q: What do you about X and his chances with Y?

A: I hope he has a chance to succeed.

It's just an upbeat non-answer. 

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13 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

what does that have to do w/ appreciating winning more PO games w/ him than any other QB in Jets history?

That is your saving grace after all these years and all the chances sanchez has had around the league.  QB friendly coaches, little to no competition at the position.  now all you can do is hang your hat on the point that he was part of a run first team with a good defense that was successful.

 

And i know you remember our convos due to your little disclaimer at the end of your original post about not building him a statue ;) 

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19 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

That is your saving grace after all these years and all the chances sanchez has had around the league.  QB friendly coaches, little to no competition at the position.  now all you can do is hang your hat on the point that he was part of a run first team with a good defense that was successful.

 

And i know you remember our convos due to your little disclaimer at the end of your original post about not building him a statue ;) 

I don't get your point? You are acting like I said he was all pro caliber.  I don't care what he did when he left(though he was damn good in Philly in 2014), I care about what he did here and we don't make those runs w/o him so I appreciate what he did. If we had him in 2015 our playoff drought would be over.

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1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

I don't get your point? You are acting like I said he was all pro caliber.  I don't care what he did when he left(though he was damn good in Philly in 2014), I care about what he did here and we don't make those runs w/o him so I appreciate what he did. If we had him in 2015 our playoff drought would be over.

This is where you overrate Sanchez. You give him to much credit for the 09 and 10 success. Because Mark Sanchez, a very at best average QB on a really strong team made the playoffs in his first two seasons in the NFL does not mean that he would have got the job done with the 2015 Jets.

You're looking at it along the lines of "well he's clutch and has had some big wins for us, so we wouldn't have blown that game in Buffalo with him" when in reality Mark Sanchez has also helped give away games during his career with the Jets, or has just played games poorly where the Jets have gone on to lose. Maybe Mark does beat the Bills the final week in 2015, but maybe he doesn't pick up that clutch first down against the Giants on QB  keeper a few weeks before that to keep the Jets hopes alive in a game they would go on to win.

To make a blanket statement like "If we had him in 2015 our playoff drought would be over" shows how you overrate him. He's not Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Rodgers, etc. He's Mark Sanchez, a very average QB at best, at best....

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32 minutes ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

This is where you overrate Sanchez. You give him to much credit for the 09 and 10 success. Because Mark Sanchez, a very at best average QB on a really strong team made the playoffs in his first two seasons in the NFL does not mean that he would have got the job done with the 2015 Jets.

You're looking at it along the lines of "well he's clutch and has had some big wins for us, so we wouldn't have blown that game in Buffalo with him" when in reality Mark Sanchez has also helped give away games during his career with the Jets, or has just played games poorly where the Jets have gone on to lose. Maybe Mark does beat the Bills the final week in 2015, but maybe he doesn't pick up that clutch first down against the Giants on QB  keeper a few weeks before that to keep the Jets hopes alive in a game they would go on to win.

To make a blanket statement like "If we had him in 2015 our playoff drought would be over" shows how you overrate him. He's not Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Rodgers, etc. He's Mark Sanchez, a very average QB at best, at best....

I give him proper credit unlike most who give him zero.  we were a QB that could make big plays in big spots away from being a playoff team in 2015.  we had all the pieces we had in 2009 and 2010 yet we couldn't get it done against a dead Bills team.

 

Mark has certainly given away games here and there(not as many as you guys like to credit him for) but he's played well in big games more often than he hasn't and he never crapped the bed in a win and in type game like Fitz did.

I truly believe if we had a QB like Mark we make the playoffs in 2015 and can go on a run. he's not Peyton Manning, a guy like Peyton gets you to the POs every year which Mark cannot BUT you can get there w/ Mark and once in he played really well- better than supposed much better QBs.  he didn't hold his team back like Peyton so often did or like a Rivers, etc...

Mark is an average QB that can elevate, I'd rather have that than a big #s guy who comes up small in big spots.

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9 hours ago, Dunnie said:

 


So the only 'good' coach we have had was parcels ???


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

I mean, I guess I liked Mangini as a coach, but he definitely had his warts.  Rex was an amazing DC and a great guy to root for, but he couldn't manage the team at all, knew very little about the offensive game management and let the lockerroom devolve into a total sh*tshow.  Benefit of having a great roster and a ball control offense and attacking defense.  But it disintegrated very quickly. Herm was just a joke as a coach. He could really motivate his guys, a great mentor type, but that's about all.  Players loved Herm and Rex.  That is never a good sign.  Players need to respect their coaches, not want to go out for a beer and a lapdance with them.  Mangini probably was our best "coach" over the post Parcells time frame.  If he had a real GM he reported to and was kept in check instead of being given the keys to the franchise and a puppet GM and total control...who knows?  The guy did everything the right way.  But the poor players didn't like having to be accountable for everything and work harder than they felt they needed to.  If he was put in a situation where he was being managed by an established GM and was given limited control, things may have turned out different. But our special little richie rich owner is forever learning on the job every year for the past 17 years or whatever and still hasn't figured anything out.

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13 hours ago, rex-n-effect said:

These comments are not meaningful. 

Q: What do you think about Bowles and his chances with the Jets?

A: I hope he has a chance to succeed.

Q: What do you about X and his chances with Y?

A: I hope he has a chance to succeed.

It's just an upbeat non-answer. 

Agreed, you can't expect someone like Pennington to come out and blast the current coach. Plus, he's connected to the Jets franchise both currently and in the past.

Still, I haven't heard anyone else  (who are not affiliated with the Jets and are paid to comment and or criticize ) come out and blast Bowles...

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