Russini and Rosenblatt: 2023 Jets a dysfunctional mess; Saleh paranoid, Hackett lazy, Zach a tittybaby

[bitonti]

1 hour ago, slimjasi said:

Again - this makes no sense. Try and think about what you are saying. 

When Andy Reid was first hired by the Philadelphia Eagles in 1999 - no one knew what he was going to turn into. I'll guarantee you that he wasn't a a particularly highly paid coach at the time. That didn't prevent him from turning into a great coach. When you hire a first time coach, you are hiring an unknown and hoping that he develops into an Andy Reid or Bill Belichick. You aren't paying the guy like a top coach before he proves he's a top coach. 

Your car analogy doesn't work. 

 

We're getting off the beaten path here, but Andy Reid is, was, and always will be an offensive coach - he made his reputation on the offensive side of the ball in Green Bay. Saleh is, was, and always will be a defensive coach. 

Andy Reid relies on HC quality Coordinators like Steve Spagnuolo to run the defense, and Reid works on the offense. Reid is also the GM who picked Mahomes, so this is a false analogy on that level. 

Saleh is like Spags, Vic Fangio, or Todd Bowles. He's an excellent DC a marginal HC, but compared to what he is paid the Jets are not losing on that deal. You pay Saleh to make an elite defense he makes an elite defense. Belly is an example of this writ large. 

Where it all falls apart is instead of HC quality OC (which is very hard to find as most leave to become real HCs), what Saleh has is Hackett, possibly the dumbest coach in the entire league, Rodgers, who is washed, and Wilson who is just terrible by every metric.

After this is over Saleh will be like Vic Fangio (his paranoia is justified) and be this borderline HC really good DC for hire for the rest of his career. Saleh can coach Andy Reid's defense and get a ring doing it. Bowles can coach D on a Tom Brady-led offense and get a ring doing it. Saleh almost got a ring with SFO.

Joe Douglas, meanwhile, might not work in the NFL again. He can't scout QB. He can't scout OL. What exactly are you hiring Joe Douglas to do? Make the worst draft pick in franchise history followed by the worst trade in franchise history? 

TL;DR Robert Saleh is a C+ or B- HC, Joe Douglas is an F GM, Hackett/Rodgers/Wilson is an F offensive "braintrust" etc.

Saleh does what they pay him to do. All the hopes and dreams in the world will never make Saleh into an offensive genius, and that wasn't the expectation when they hired him.    
 

[Mogglez]

1 hour ago, Larz said:

I mean who doesn’t want to be a tittybaby at the end of the day? 😂

@T0mShane

Gonna have my fiancé call me this from now on.  Thanks @T0mShane!!

”If the shoe fits!” right guys?

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

6 hours ago, GreenFish said:

The main issue is pretty obvious…Woody.

The owner being influenced by fans on Twitter and then confronting staff is crazy. How can an organization function like that? That shows a lack of trust. I’d be paranoid as hell if I was Saleh and JD. What a sh*t show.

SELL WOODY SELL

[Warfish]

Just now, SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN said:

SELL WOODY SELL

[peekskill68]

3 minutes ago, NYJCAP2 said:

Personally, I don’t think he was enabled to, by Woody.

I say this because Woody had already paid a boat load of guaranteed cash to Wilson and a Brinks truck on Rodgers. Why would he want them to spend another $4-8M of his money on a true back up, if their plan was so good that he ate it up?

That’s why they signed Siemian on basically the vet minimum after the fact.

The report that came out after the injury was Woody didn’t want to trade for another QB was because they’ve spent too much money on Rodgers and Wilson already.

We'll have to agree to disagree on Woody.  While I am a believer he tinkers and is too hands on, and I am a believer he has poor football instincts, I am not a believer he doesn't want to spend money.  I believe JD is being coated with teflon here.  He was fine spending $8 million of Woody's money on a washed Dalvin Cook as "insurance" for Breece Hall, but spent nothing on insurance for Rodgers.   

[slimjasi]

1 minute ago, bitonti said:

we're getting off the beaten path here, but Andy Reid is, was, and always will be an offensive coach - he made his reputation on the offensive side of the ball in Green Bay. Saleh is was and always will be a defensive coach 
 

Sure, but he's still responsible for how the defense and special teams perform because he's the head coach

3 minutes ago, bitonti said:

 

Saleh is like Spags, Vic Fangio or Todd Bowles. He's an excellent DC a marginal HC, but compared to what he is paid the Jets are not losing on that deal. You pay Saleh to make an elite defense he makes an elite defense.Where it all fa
 

NO idea what bolded means. Andy Reid was once a lowly paid fist time head coach, too. According to the article posted in this thread, Saleh makes more money than Matt LaFleur, Kevin Stefanski, and Mike McCarthy. 

And no, we pay Saleh to run the entire team. He's not a defensive coordinator, he's a head coach. Yes, he's a bad head coach, but that doesn't make your argument any more coherent. 

6 minutes ago, bitonti said:

After this is over Saleh will be like Vic Fangio and be this borderline HC really good DC for hire for the rest of his career. Saleh can coach Andy Reid's defense and get a ring doing it. Bowles can coach D on a Tom Brady led offense and get a ring doing it. Saleh almost got a ring with SFO

Ok

8 minutes ago, bitonti said:

TL;DR Robert Saleh is a C+ or B- HC, Joe Douglas is an F GM, Hackett/Rodgers/Wilson is an F offensive "braintrust" etc.
 

To date, Saleh is one of the worst head coaches in the NFL. 

9 minutes ago, bitonti said:

Saleh does what they pay him to do. All the hopes and dreams in the world will never make Saleh into an offensive genius and that wasn't the expectation when they hired him    
 

Incorrect. Saleh is paid to run the entire team, not merely field a good defense. The fact that he is incapable of putting together a good staff and fielding a functional offense is part of the reason why he's been a bad head coach (to date). 

 

[varjet]

• I agree that JD is trajecting toward an F GM.  I think he was fooling people in Baltimore but was exposed by the smart guys in Philadelphia.   He is going to have a tough time getting hired again. 
• Rex Hogan, working the other lifers at 1JD, were not doing much either.  JD and Rex were the guys responsible for the thoughtless draft picks.  Yes, they appeared switched on at the top of the 2021 draft, but do did the magazines.
• Saleh will have a long NFL career.  From what we hear, Saleh wanted to keep Darnold.  Saleh had a plan with MLF, Knapp and Benton.  It was not a bad plan.  Knapp died, he was given Wilson, and it all feel apart. It sounded like MLF and Hogan liked Wilson.  Bye.
• But If I am Woody, I am rebooting with Mike Vrabel, right now.  

[NYJCAP2]

10 minutes ago, peekskill68 said:

We'll have to agree to disagree on Woody.  While I am a believer he tinkers and is too hands on, and I am a believer he has poor football instincts, I am not a believer he doesn't want to spend money.  I believe JD is being coated with teflon here.  He was fine spending $8 million of Woody's money on a washed Dalvin Cook as "insurance" for Breece Hall, but spent nothing on insurance for Rodgers.   

We disagree on this one.

I’ve always been a little naive and on the fence whether they could win with Woody.

But now I know… they won’t.

[bitonti]

4 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Sure, but he's still responsible for how the defense and special teams perform because he's the head coach

Incorrect. Saleh is paid to run the entire team, not merely field a good defense. The fact that he is incapable of putting together a good staff and fielding a functional offense is part of the reason why he's been a bad head coach (to date). 

the owner makes the team draft Zach Wilson cause he's a friend of the family. 

the owner makes the team hire Nathaniel Hackett so the team can push in on Aaron Rodgers

I get what you're saying about total team but how much responsibility does Saleh really have for the offense in these specific scenarios? 

if rumors are to be believed Saleh wanted to keep Darnold and draft Sewell 

he doesn't have the power to overrule meddling Owner and dumb ass GM 

 

[56mehl56]

6 hours ago, oatmeal said:

*Reporter reports news*

Jets fans:

”She’s angry at the jets” 

No dude she’s just doing her job 

And plus we are living in the age of Aquarius = all frauds will be exposed 

You can choose to believe everything you read or are told by the media its a free country at least for now. 

[Untouchable]

[cat999]

2 hours ago, Matt39 said:

Questions that still need answering- 

what did Joe Douglas do?

why was Wilson on the team?

I wish my golf swing was half as consistent as you

[Bugg]

Morons. Where things went sideways. Sign any of the 4, this was a playoff team.Not a division winner, not a Super Bowl team, but among 7 AFC playoff teams. The doubling down on Wilson was a joke. 

"When Rodgers went down, the Jets reached out to some veteran quarterbacks — like Chad Henne, Carson Wentz and Colt McCoy — but decided instead to roll with Wilson until (or if) Rodgers returned. Joe Flacco, who was with the Jets for parts of three seasons from 2020-22, was available, but key decision-makers inside the building didn’t think Flacco would be an upgrade, according to league sources. Flacco signed with the Browns in late November and is a finalist for Comeback Player of the Year after leading Cleveland to the playoffs." 

 

2nd thought; the one thing Robert Wood Johnson Roman Numerals HATES is being show to be  ridiculous. Kind of rash thing that led Mangini and Mike McCagnan geting fired. Saleh may not survive this. Because Johnson can't afford to look ridiculous.

 

 

 

[kevinc855]

The Athletic is damming, it makes the Jets a laughing stock again, worst of all, even if only half is true it shows poor leadership and discipline from Saleh who should not be trusted another year.

Then of course there is the results on the field....18 wins in 3 seasons.

Woody felt pressured to retain Saleh due to Rodgers, NOW he has the reason and opportunity to dump him and hire Vrabel. Act withn the next week, strike while it looks like dysfunction is burning the Jets down. It will force Rodgers hand to not protest to much and roll with the program. 

Get on it Woody. 

[PS17]

2 hours ago, Adoni Beast said:

Has anyone taken anything new or groundbreaking away from this obviously exaggerated article?

• Saleh is immature and in over his head
• Hackett isn't a good OC without Rodgers
• Saleh hates Zach Wilson
• The defense gets burned out by the offense sucking
• The Jets hitched their wagon to Rodgers
• The season was over the second Rodgers got hurt
• Woody Johnson cares about media headlines good or bad too much

This entire article is an exaggeration of what we have all been saying all year.

At least this is gaining some national attention. This bumbling, fraud regime could use more public heat and shame. I’m all for it. 

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

Eh kinda looks even worse if Woody makes a move based on article from The Athletic. 

But yeah, I get it, we’re angry. 

[Barry McCockinner]

3 minutes ago, PS17 said:

At least this is gaining some national attention. This bumbling, fraud regime could use more public heat and shame. I’m all for it. 

if you aint got no haters you aint popping

[56mehl56]

5 hours ago, Matt39 said:

Still not getting to the point of why Zach Wilson was allowed anywhere near the field this year. He had no business being the backup. Or where he went after he was “concussed.” Wilson ghosts reporters on baggy day and then resurfaces in Bora Bora a month later. None of these leaks matter until we get to the bottom of the Zach Wilson nonsense. 

Dude , let it go Zach Wilson will be gone he can't hurt you anymore . 

[nj meadowlands]

Keep dreaming brother

[bitonti]

No one's getting fired because Aaron doesn't want anyone to be fired and he's the king of the Jets for however long it takes them to get out from under his toxic contract 

 

[PS17]

Just now, Barry McCockinner said:

if you aint got no haters you aint popping

Imagine actually saying this. Holy sh*t Bob

mumble mumble receipts mumble mumble eagle and crow mumble mumble zach is improving 

[jetsons]

Your 1st sentence is 100% off … the SOJ ARE 100% To Blame, not an article in a publication.

[southparkcpa]

5 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

The Athletic is damming, it makes the Jets a laughing stock again, worst of all, even if only half is true it shows poor leadership and discipline from Saleh who should not be trusted another year.

Then of course there is the results on the field....18 wins in 3 seasons.

Woody felt pressured to retain Saleh due to Rodgers, NOW he has the reason and opportunity to dump him and hire Vrabel. Act withn the next week, strike while it looks like dysfunction is burning the Jets down. It will force Rodgers hand to not protest to much and roll with the program. 

Get on it Woody. 

Never look for Woody to hire the right person.  It hasn't happened yet in his entire ownership.

Not 1 hire, can we say as fans, was a solid hire. Not 1.

[Rob Moore]

Yes that’s the ticket!

Publicly endorse your regime and announce all of them coming back.

Then a hit piece gets published by 2 reporters with axes to grind.

Immediately fire all the people you publicly endorsed and said you believed in.

This is the blueprint that all well run stable organizations follow! 

[JustInFudge]

[Larz]

So the article about woody reacting to the media is an opportunity to…..react to the media?

[rangerous]

if the athletic article is to be believed, woody needs to stop meddling in the day to day football affairs of the team.  yes saleh needs to be held way more accountable than he has been.  he's proving to have a pretty thin skin but when the coaches need to ask woody's permission to bench players, it's a little much.

[slimjasi]

22 minutes ago, bitonti said:

the owner makes the team draft Zach Wilson cause he's a friend of the family. 

 

 

speculation. Zach Wilson was the consensus #2 QB in that draft by a pretty wide margin. 

 

22 minutes ago, bitonti said:

 

the owner makes the team hire Nathaniel Hackett so the team can push in on Aaron Rodgers

 

eh, Saleh seemed pretty high on Hackett (probably because he really wanted Rodgers). 

speculation 

 

22 minutes ago, bitonti said:

the owner makes the team draft Zach Wilson cause he's a friend of the family. 

the owner makes the team hire Nathaniel Hackett so the team can push in on Aaron Rodgers

I get what you're saying about total team but how much responsibility does Saleh really have for the offense in these specific scenarios? 

 

A lot. He's the head coach. You can argue that he has some reasonable excuses for why his offenses have been so bad, but you can't absolve him of responsibility 

 

22 minutes ago, bitonti said:

if rumors are to be believed Saleh wanted to keep Darnold and draft Sewell 

he doesn't have the power to overrule meddling Owner and dumb ass GM 

 

I've never seen anything about Saleh wanting to draft Sewell - I'd be curious if you have a source for that. 

I DO remember that Saleh and Douglas preferred to keep Darnold (and most likely trade down) early on in the draft process, before they saw Zach throw in shorts at his pro day and fell in love. 

 

[Barry McCockinner]

 

[Guilhermezmc]

I do like Vrabel a little more than Saleh but he's no Belichick or Shanahan like people are making him to be, if we're going to blow this thing up like that why not bring the best gameday coach of all time? You're looking for a SB run who are you most confident that can get you there BB, Vrabel or Saleh?

[slimjasi]

Edit: wrong thread 

[Matt39]

17 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

Dude , let it go Zach Wilson will be gone he can't hurt you anymore . 

Football guy seems to think he’s going to be back 

[Barry McCockinner]

10 minutes ago, Guilhermezmc said:

I do like Vrabel a little more than Saleh but he's no Belichick or Shanahan like people are making him to be, if we're going to blow this thing up like that why not bring the best gameday coach of all time? You're looking for a SB run who are you most confident that can get you there BB, Vrabel or Saleh?

What makes you think Belichick wants anything to do with the Jets?

[Bugg]

2 hours ago, bitonti said:

 He's not 32nd but he's bottom third easy. 

It's not a rule that the Jets have to hire first time Hcs though 

It's a preference 

Twisted way that both Douglas and Saleh are under contract and to be retained  for this coming season. And Johnson doesn't like paying coaches and GMs who aren't here any more. Defeats the purpose of getting the help from the bargain bin if you're paying fired coaches and GMs. 

[nj meadowlands]

3 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Football guy seems to think he’s going to be back 

oh well in that case