If Smith goes down and Olu looks good

[bonkertons]

What happens?  Everyone seems to be operating under the assumption that Smith WILL miss time, it's just a matter of when.  I think Olu will have to look pretty damn good for this to even be a debate, but it's certainly a possibility.  This is what you'd call a "good problem" I'm sure but what do you do?  Do you bench Olu again?  Bench Smith?  Move Olu to LG?  

 

Considering Olu is the guy going forward, I think you have to stick with him as long as he's playing well and you're winning games.  Smith makes less money the less he pays from what I understand, so there would be incentive to not play him if you don't have to.  Curious to see what the consensus around here would be.  

 

...tis the boring part of the offseason....

[varjet]

The Olu pick will look very smart if he plays 6+ games for Smith.  
 

It sounded like Olu was getting beat by UDFA Eric Watts in OTAs. 

[ACourseinMiracles]

Provided Smith is playing to his hall of fame credentials when not injured he's going back in. Olu gets his shot next year. The motivation to short change a players earnings is just strange. For clarity, the assumption is the rookie will NOT be outperforming the HOFer. 

[Alka]

30 minutes ago, varjet said:

It sounded like Olu was getting beat by UDFA Eric Watts in OTAs. 

That's what you have preseason for.  That's what you have camp for.  This is Olu's education, and anyone looking into him getting beat in May after he just got drafted in April doesn't mean anything.

I think it says more about Eric Watts, and maybe, just maybe, he might be a diamond in the rough.  In any case, the Jets aren't yet picking out a regular season slot for Eric Watts, because he beat out Olu in May on a play.

[Warfish]

Best player playing the best plays.

Now, then, and always.

[Rich Thornburgh]

37 minutes ago, varjet said:

The Olu pick will look very smart if he plays 6+ games for Smith.  
 

It sounded like Olu was getting beat by UDFA Eric Watts in OTAs. 

It’s still a good pick even if Fashuanu doesn’t play this year. Smith and Moses are both old and we eventually need a successor plus draft picks don’t have to pan out immediately overnight remember the people who know everything calling QW worse than Gholston his rookie year?

[bonkertons]

2 minutes ago, Rich Thornburgh said:

It’s still a good pick even if Fashuanu doesn’t play this year. Smith and Moses are both old and we eventually need a successor plus draft picks don’t have to pan out immediately overnight remember the people who know everything calling QW worse than Gholston his rookie year?

Those were good times.  Honestly I think Quinnen is the reason why you haven't seen a full blown meltdown over McDonald yet(some have, but very few).  We're learning.  This is good.

[Rich Thornburgh]

Just now, bonkertons said:

Those were good times.  Honestly I think Quinnen is the reason why you haven't seen a full blown meltdown over McDonald yet(some have, but very few).  We're learning.  This is good.

QW’s tape at Alabama was off the charts though 

[PepPep]

The answer is obvious. You play Olu if he looks THAT good. He would have to be pretty much dominant (or Smith would have to have dropped his quality of play pre-injury). Not only does this make sense from a financial standpoint but you are giving more reps to your rookie future LT. 

I don't think you try to move Olu to G. 

Yes, this is a great problem to have. Because if Moses goes down once Smith is benched, Olu can slide to the right side and Smith can be next man up on the left side. 

OT is not the problem. The problem will be if Tippman goes down and we are relying on Wes Schweitzer to start at C and the interior of our O-line starts to fall apart.  

[Mo Lew]

The one thing that Saleh knows is D linemen.  I think McDonald is going to have a hell of a season and our trouble will be who plays, JJ, Hassan, or Donny. 

 

 

[Adoni Beast]

If Smith doesn’t get hurt at all this season and Olu goes on to have a 10+ year starting career here, then this is a great draft pick.

Olu’s production or lack thereof this season will need be the measuring stick for whether this was a good draft pick or not….his career will indicate that.

He plays the second most important position on the field, if he’s good for 10+ years, Year 1 don’t mean sh*t.

[THE BARON]

History guaranteed Fashanu will be in the starting lineup before the season is out.  Tyron is not going to play every game. never does.  

I wanted Brock Bowers, but I'm glad I wasn't the GM this time around.

Not having Fashanu on the roster would have been begging for disaster. 

[Joe W. Namath]

Less than 0% chance that Olu is leaping Tyrone Smith on the depth chart if smith is healthy.  This is just silly.

Ill even go out on a limb and say if tyrone plays well and wants to play 1 more year, the jets will sign him and Olu will be a backup again in 2025.

When you get LT right you dont mess w it.

 

[Sperm Edwards]

2 hours ago, Adoni Beast said:

If Smith doesn’t get hurt at all this season and Olu goes on to have a 10+ year starting career here, then this is a great draft pick.

Olu’s production or lack thereof this season will need be the measuring stick for whether this was a good draft pick or not….his career will indicate that.

He plays the second most important position on the field, if he’s good for 10+ years, Year 1 don’t mean sh*t.

LT is not the 2nd-most important position on the field, just given that there are four other offensive linemen. 

While there's a minimum level of competence we all like to see - and which the Jets have mostly lacked for some time now - the difference between adequate and great isn't nearly as big of a difference at LT as it is at other positions. Like there's a Mendoza line and below it you've probably got problems but way above it doesn't transform an offense the way it will at, say, WR. 

• Swap Kelce for Trent Williams & I've got major doubts KC wins the Super Bowl this past year (and maybe at least one other). 
• Dallas was 5-2 with Chuma Edoga at LT and averaged over 27 ppg. Take away CeeDee Lamb (in favor of his Edoga WR equivalent) but put Tyron Smith back on the field those games and it's hard to argue they're not a visibly worse team. 
• Career backup Kendall Lamm started most of the season for Miami, over which time they averaged almost 32 ppg.
• Pittsburgh won 10 games not only with no QB but also with no LT. Give them the best LT in the league but take away TJ Watt and tell me their team is better. 

It's not automatically the 2nd most important position on the field. It's up there, no doubt, but a great playmaker trumps a great LT (exceptions allowing for that LT being the only adequate lineman on the team, like when KC lost Fisher in the AFCCG). I would say a merely adequate LT trumps an equivalently adequate WR, though. The Jets have had such a bad run of injuries & one LT draft pick in particular, that it makes the position seem more magnified. The problem is they had a hole on their OL and that would show if the hole was anywhere. 

The reason it's smart to take a LT early isn't because it's the 2nd most important position on the field so much as it's one where it's not so automatically easy to find a good/consistent long-term starter in free agency or later in the draft, and if you can get hold of one still in his prime with lots of good/great years left in him he's way expensive or will cost premium draft pick(s) for the privilege of paying major money to him. 

[Adoni Beast]

37 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

LT is not the 2nd-most important position on the field, just given that there are four other offensive linemen. 

LT vs playmaker is debatable as to which is more important on an annual basis.

But playmakers have a much shorter shelf life than LTs at being dominant at their position. So, the value in finding a LT could last 10+ years of elite play vs. let’s say a 5-6 year window for a WR.

[LockeJET]

The real question is what if Smith has an absolutely healthy and monster year? Are you going right to Olu next year at LT or are you re-signing Smith?

[Doggin94it]

6 hours ago, bonkertons said:

What happens?  Everyone seems to be operating under the assumption that Smith WILL miss time, it's just a matter of when.  I think Olu will have to look pretty damn good for this to even be a debate, but it's certainly a possibility.  This is what you'd call a "good problem" I'm sure but what do you do?  Do you bench Olu again?  Bench Smith?  Move Olu to LG?  

 

Considering Olu is the guy going forward, I think you have to stick with him as long as he's playing well and you're winning games.  Smith makes less money the less he pays from what I understand, so there would be incentive to not play him if you don't have to.  Curious to see what the consensus around here would be.  

 

...tis the boring part of the offseason....

If Smith is playing up to his usual level, Moses is as well, and Olu comes in after a Smith injury and looks like a stud, then when Smith gets back ... Olu returns to the bench. Smith is a 1st ballot HOFer; Olu "looking good" as a rookie isn't going to be at that level. So when Smith is fully healthy, he'll reclaim the starting job. What Olu looking good would do is let you not rush Smith back before he's fully healed, which is huge, and also give you confidence not to resign Smith next offseason. 

[Sperm Edwards]

6 minutes ago, Adoni Beast said:

LT vs playmaker is debatable as to which is more important on an annual basis.

But playmakers have a much shorter shelf life than LTs at being dominant at their position. So, the value in finding a LT could last 10+ years of elite play vs. let’s say a 5-6 year window for a WR.

There's no purely objective right or wrong, but subjectively I don't agree with that take either. 

Provided we're talking about a serious impact position in either case (i.e. not a safety, center, etc.) I'd take a great player for 5-6 years - or an "elite among the elite" for 3-4 years - every time over a mostly-good, sometimes-great player for 10 years. The idea of getting 10+ years of elite play at LT is pretty f'ing uncommon anyway. There are like 5 guys in the league like that at any given time. The Jets had probably one such LT in franchise history, and it was 50+ years ago when Winston Hill entered the league while JFK was president. 

So putting aside the idea of expecting 10+ years of elite play as pretty far-fetched, I'd take 5-6 years of elite WR play every time anyway. You can win without an elite LT (KC is putting on a clinic in doing so), but you need at least one elite playmaker. That's aside from the reality that there are a lot more WRs great for 5-6 years than LTs great for 10+ years. 

[Claymation]

46 minutes ago, LockeJET said:

The real question is what if Smith has an absolutely healthy and monster year? Are you going right to Olu next year at LT or are you re-signing Smith?

I would resign Smith...if Rodgers is back and Smith wants to come back. 

[Rich Thornburgh]

1 hour ago, LockeJET said:

The real question is what if Smith has an absolutely healthy and monster year? Are you going right to Olu next year at LT or are you re-signing Smith?

You move on to Fashuanu

[AFJF]

2 hours ago, LockeJET said:

The real question is what if Smith has an absolutely healthy and monster year? Are you going right to Olu next year at LT or are you re-signing Smith?

You move on to Olu because you really don't have a choice with all of the big pay days they have coming up.

[Doggin94it]

2 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

There's no purely objective right or wrong, but subjectively I don't agree with that take either. 

Provided we're talking about a serious impact position in either case (i.e. not a safety, center, etc.) I'd take a great player for 5-6 years - or an "elite among the elite" for 3-4 years - every time over a mostly-good, sometimes-great player for 10 years. The idea of getting 10+ years of elite play at LT is pretty f'ing uncommon anyway. There are like 5 guys in the league like that at any given time. The Jets had probably one such LT in franchise history, and it was 50+ years ago when Winston Hill entered the league while JFK was president. 

So putting aside the idea of expecting 10+ years of elite play as pretty far-fetched, I'd take 5-6 years of elite WR play every time anyway. You can win without an elite LT (KC is putting on a clinic in doing so), but you need at least one elite playmaker. That's aside from the reality that there are a lot more WRs great for 5-6 years than LTs great for 10+ years. 

Brick was a consistent top 5-10 LT in the league

[ElBarrioJets]

Depends on how Tyron looks before his hypothetical injury. 

Does he still look like a Hall of Famer? Then it's an obvious choice, put him back in there when he's healthy. Olu still got some much-needed reps. 

If he's lost a step and goes down? Then the Olu era begins. 

[jetsons]

If Smith goes down and Olu looks good

Then Olu plays until otherwise. 

[bitonti]

The Jets start with 3 games in 10 days 

My guess is Tyron starts mnf at SFO, olu starts week 2 at ten and Tyron week 3 vs NEP 

It's going to be that type of management all year long 

[rangerous]

i think it depends on when olu comes in.  if smith is an early season scratch for a couple of games i still think he needs to come back in if healthy.  smith seems to be one of those money players who turn it on late season and for the playoffs.    if smith is out late season then maybe olu stays in for the same reasons.  smith going out late in the season could indicate something pretty serious.

[bonkertons]

15 hours ago, AFJF said:

You move on to Olu because you really don't have a choice with all of the big pay days they have coming up.

This, tbh.  We're going to have to buckle down with the homegrown guys those next two years('25 and '26).  I think this year is obviously all about winning with this Rodgers window, but it also has to be about finding out what you have in certain guys(our young LBs behind Mosley; which young CB could potentially step into DJ Reed's role;  Olu - although after investing the 11th overall, he's going to be the guy in 2025 no matter what; who can we rely on behind Breece as a legit RB2; can Brownlee or Gipson be a core piece of this WR room going forward;  can Ruckert be more than just a good blocking TE, and perhaps be capable of developing into that #1 role).

 

It's going to be fun seeing how all of these play out.

[Sperm Edwards]

17 hours ago, Doggin94it said:

Brick was a consistent top 5-10 LT in the league

We just aren't going to agree - which is fine - that Brick was elite for 10 years (if you think otherwise), and that was the point I was making. 

Also someone like Brick further shows how difficult it is to find a 10 year elite starter at such a premium position. He was a can't miss prospect who didn't miss and was further a singular model of player health, and even he wasn't elite for 10 years (let alone 10+ years). He was only in the league 10 years and he certainly wasn't elite all 10 of them; probably closer to 4-5 of them, but was plenty adequate in most of the rest (but his play showed it was time by the end, even if he was still an every-down participant). 

I'm totally behind the Olu pick, I might add, though it's admittedly position-based support than prospect-based, as I've never seen him play a game (let alone many games).

[extmenace]

On 5/28/2024 at 10:03 AM, bonkertons said:

What happens?  Everyone seems to be operating under the assumption that Smith WILL miss time, it's just a matter of when.  I think Olu will have to look pretty damn good for this to even be a debate, but it's certainly a possibility.  This is what you'd call a "good problem" I'm sure but what do you do?  Do you bench Olu again?  Bench Smith?  Move Olu to LG?  

 

Considering Olu is the guy going forward, I think you have to stick with him as long as he's playing well and you're winning games.  Smith makes less money the less he pays from what I understand, so there would be incentive to not play him if you don't have to.  Curious to see what the consensus around here would be.  

 

...tis the boring part of the offseason....

Assuming only smith goes down is optimistic. This line is a mix of aging vets and injury prone younger guys along the line. How they configure the line is anyone’s guess depending who goes down and when, but I wouldn’t be surprised if we see him taking some snaps on the other side if the injury bug pops up but smith is healthy.

in your scenario though, if smith looks elite prior to the injury, you go back to him. This staff is playing for their jobs. No reason to get cute, you put the potential hall of famer right back into the line up.

[bonkertons]

13 hours ago, extmenace said:

Assuming only smith goes down is optimistic. This line is a mix of aging vets and injury prone younger guys along the line. How they configure the line is anyone’s guess depending who goes down and when, but I wouldn’t be surprised if we see him taking some snaps on the other side if the injury bug pops up but smith is healthy.

in your scenario though, if smith looks elite prior to the injury, you go back to him. This staff is playing for their jobs. No reason to get cute, you put the potential hall of famer right back into the line up.

Fair, but Smith and AVT are the only guys who have consistently missed time.  Moses missed a few games last year but other than that he's been a safe bet to stay on the field.  Even with AVT, part of the expectation is that having him just focus on RG will help prevent some of the injury concerns.

 

...but yeah, chances are someone else will go down.  It's just the nature of the league, regardless of how injury prone your OL happens to be.  

[LAD_Brooklyn]

Bring Smith back as a RT and keep Olu at LT. 

[Rich Thornburgh]

I think it’s time to sign Bakhtiari for depth

[UntouchableCrew]

On 5/28/2024 at 10:43 AM, Alka said:

That's what you have preseason for.  That's what you have camp for.  This is Olu's education, and anyone looking into him getting beat in May after he just got drafted in April doesn't mean anything.

I think it says more about Eric Watts, and maybe, just maybe, he might be a diamond in the rough.  In any case, the Jets aren't yet picking out a regular season slot for Eric Watts, because he beat out Olu in May on a play.

Honestly what does it even mean when guys are getting beat with no pads on?

[Alka]

20 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Honestly what does it even mean when guys are getting beat with no pads on?

Exactly!  Plus, Olu might be getting taught to do something different with his feet, or how he comes off the snap, and is attempting to learn something new.  It's not like the coaching staff says: "We will not teach you anything new.  Just go out and do exactly what you did in college?"  

What is camp for in May?  The guy just came out of college.  He didn't give up a sack in 3 entire years.  All of a sudden, an undrafted guy beats Olu out with no pads in May in camp, and people getting nervous.  

When Olu is playing in the preseason games, and guys are beating Olu time and time again, then we can start getting nervous.  

[Plen T]

When*