SenorGato Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Is that even a topic this offseason? He seems like the odd man out on the DL, and I'd think a premium position guy like him on a rookie deal would be worth a 1st+. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peebag Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 If someone was willing to give up a #1 pick, I'd do it in a heartbeat. But that's a pipe dream. (get it?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted January 29, 2016 Author Share Posted January 29, 2016 He started doing crack? The Seahawks seem like a great match. They took Frank Clark last year in the draft showing zero ****s about taking on an extremely talented a$$hole, and could use a new, cheap star on their defense as FAs start coming up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 He started doing crack? Opium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurnleyJet Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 They don't want to seem to resign Mo. I think Mo's traded. Sheldons still cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuscanyTile2 Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Keep in mind "Refrigerator Richardson" is one of our best running backs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetscrazey Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 I hope to see Richardson here long-term. Despite his slip ups off the field, he has a rare motor that you can't coach. He was the odd man out this year, but won't be next year because I don't see us retaining both Mo and Snacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 his future is still cloudy. the NFL has a really poor track record with suspensions as far as being able to predict them he is easily the worst long term investment the jets could make, I have to think other teams feel the same way I bet they let him play out his rookie deal then see what happens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoot-Face Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 If someone was willing to give up a #1 pick, I'd do it in a heartbeat. But that's a pipe dream. (get it?) He started doing crack? Opium. You're both wrong. Shelly is beating people with metal pipes now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoot-Face Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 I hope to see Richardson here long-term. Despite his slip ups off the field, he has a rare motor that you can't coach. He was the odd man out this year, but won't be next year because I don't see us retaining both Mo and Snacks. Ditto on the motor. The guy never gives up on a play. Will chase you down from ten yards away. He certainly has a propensity to run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl40 Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Selling low on a cheap player is not the way championship teams are built. If Wilk had already been resigned, this could be a valid discussion but it's not. The Jets need him. They're losing either Wilk or Snacks, they'll need him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neckdemon Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Selling low on a cheap player is not the way championship teams are built. If Wilk had already been resigned, this could be a valid discussion but it's not. The Jets need him. They're losing either Wilk or Snacks, they'll need him. gotta keep snacks. wilkerson is a luxury for this team. you cant put that much money into a defensive line that will still be very good without him. williams falling to us sealed wilks fate. we don't have a replacement for snacks......we do have one for wilk though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted January 30, 2016 Author Share Posted January 30, 2016 I see it the other way around - Harrison is luxury while Wilkerson is the DL's most important player. His ability to generate a pass rush from anywhere on the DL, including NT and without being a dick about it at that, is massive. He's terrific against the run as well, a skill set closer to a luxury in today's game. If you're looking to stop an offense built for the 40s, then keep Harrison and secure a stout run defense. If you want a modern defense geared toward slowing down passing games, then you take Wilkerson. It's OK to take whatever small hit the run defense takes to keep the significantly better player against the pass. Carl - The price suggested in the OP is not a low price, but do see your point on losing one of the two DL THO. What kind of comp pick would the Jete be looking at if/when they lost Richardson in FA next year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patriot Killa Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 I see it the other way around - Harrison is luxury while Wilkerson is the DL's most important player. His ability to generate a pass rush from anywhere on the DL, including NT and without being a dick about it at that, is massive. He's terrific against the run as well, a skill set closer to a luxury in today's game. If you're looking to stop an offense built for the 40s, then keep Harrison and secure a stout run defense. If you want a modern defense geared toward slowing down passing games, then you take Wilkerson. It's OK to take whatever small hit the run defense takes to keep the significantly better player against the pass. Carl - The price suggested in the OP is not a low price, but do see your point on losing one of the two DL THO. What kind of comp pick would the Jete be looking at if/when they lost Richardson in FA next year? 3rd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raideraholic Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Is that even a topic this offseason? He seems like the odd man out on the DL, and I'd think a premium position guy like him on a rookie deal would be worth a 1st+. What exactly does trading Sheldon Richardson do for the Jets salary cap. I can't see how the Jets can keep both Damon Harrison , and Muhammad Wilkerson. ( too much money that going to effect other areas of the team. i think after 2016 season might be the better time to trade Sheldon Richardson ( let him prove he can stay out of trouble). Right now due to his drug suspension( failed four drug test) his trade value isn't going to be as high. Heck who knows he might grow up , and the Jets might be glad they didn't act too hastily . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raideraholic Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 I see it the other way around - Harrison is luxury while Wilkerson is the DL's most important player. His ability to generate a pass rush from anywhere on the DL, including NT and without being a dick about it at that, is massive. He's terrific against the run as well, a skill set closer to a luxury in today's game. If you're looking to stop an offense built for the 40s, then keep Harrison and secure a stout run defense. If you want a modern defense geared toward slowing down passing games, then you take Wilkerson. It's OK to take whatever small hit the run defense takes to keep the significantly better player against the pass. Carl - The price suggested in the OP is not a low price, but do see your point on losing one of the two DL THO. What kind of comp pick would the Jete be looking at if/when they lost Richardson in FA next year? First thing is the Jets would take the fifth year option with Sheldon Richardson.( so he wouldn't be a Free agent after next season. Again doesn't do anything for the Jets to trade Sheldon Richardson this year. They are going to need him to replace Snacks or Muhammad Wilkerson. Btw if they didn't take the fifth year option with Richardson and the Jets lost him in free agency. They could be looking at a third rounder or nothing.( the Jets sign Someone big next season in Fa, could offset Sheldon Richardson lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted January 30, 2016 Author Share Posted January 30, 2016 I thought there were more stipulations on that 5th year option, but nope. G'damn the NFL player's union sucks a dick.It does appear that trading Richardson is less obvious a route than I thought. Keeping Wilkerson/Richardson/Williams together through 2018 would be pretty monstrous and ideal. There would be some shades of trading Abraham there that are probably best left avoided altogether. Bird in the hand kind of situation...Got it. So basically what we should take out of this is that the Jets should extend Wilkerson over Harrison. Thanks guys! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Island Leprechaun Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 I thought there were more stipulations on that 5th year option, but nope. G'damn the NFL player's union sucks a dick.It does appear that trading Richardson is less obvious a route than I thought. Keeping Wilkerson/Richardson/Williams together through 2018 would be pretty monstrous and ideal. There would be some shades of trading Abraham there that are probably best left avoided altogether. Bird in the hand kind of situation...Got it. So basically what we should take out of this is that the Jets should extend Wilkerson over Harrison. Thanks guys! What is the relative cap saving for each scenario, let's say over the next two years? Just don't know the numbers. Then I would ask what the marginal value of Wilk over Richardson is in those scenarios vs. the redistribution of Wilk's differential to fill another need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Apart from Watt's $100 mil deal($16m per) Cam Jordan, Cam Heyward and Corey Liuget all signed their 2nd contracts in 2015 at an annual rate of $10 - $11mil/yr for 5 yrs. Callais Campbell will be on his last yr. that pays him about the same. I love Mo and would love to see him remain a Jet.... but if he's looking for Watt money, he's "Tagged and Traded" If he's be willing to take $12mil per with $18 mil SB and some incentives to bring the contract to $60mil then I keep him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Looking at Watts' contract the last 3 yrs. are worth $40 mil. He can be cut with ZERO dead money. So basically it's a 4/$60mil deal Mo cannot expect Watt money but probably a little more than Cam Jordan. Hopefully this gets done. DE JJ Watt signed a six year, $100 million contract extension with the Houston Texans on September 2, 2014. Watt had two years remaining on his contract, meaning the new deal will run through the 2021 season. Details of the contract are currently based on a report by John McClain of the Houston Chronicle. Upon signing the contract Watt received a $10 million signing bonus and guaranteed salaries in 2014 and 2015 to bring his total of fully guaranteed salary to $20.876 million. If he is on the roster on the 5th day of the 2015 League year he wil receive a $10 million roster bonus and will have his 2016 and 2017 base salaries become fully guaranteed in 2016. Watt converted the roster bonus to a signing bonus in 2015 to create $8 million in cap space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted January 30, 2016 Author Share Posted January 30, 2016 # of times JJ Watt makes $16 million a year under his extension: Once That comes in the final year of his deal and is non-garaunteed. Soooooo....the fear mongering over Wilkerson getting that kind of deal is a little much. He is a better player than Jordan, Heyward, and Campbell - all got more than $16 million in garauntees. If you want to lowball your stars for eternity, good luck getting something going as far as building a championship caliber squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Apart from Watt's $100 mil deal($16m per) Cam Jordan, Cam Heyward and Corey Liuget all signed their 2nd contracts in 2015 at an annual rate of $10 - $11mil/yr for 5 yrs. Callais Campbell will be on his last yr. that pays him about the same. I love Mo and would love to see him remain a Jet.... but if he's looking for Watt money, he's "Tagged and Traded" If he's be willing to take $12mil per with $18 mil SB and some incentives to bring the contract to $60mil then I keep him. You really think Mo, his agent or the players association would be happy with a deal where incentives brings his deal up to $60 mil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 You really think Mo, his agent or the players association would be happy with a deal where incentives brings his deal up to $60 mil? I misspoke. What I meant to write was that the overall value was $60 mil but could go higher if certain performance clauses were reached.... just like Cam Jordan and Cam Heyward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 I misspoke. What I meant to write was that the overall value was $60 mil but could go higher if certain performance clauses were reached.... just like Cam Jordan and Cam Heyward. Much better, lol. Even at that though, what are giving him, 5 years? He's got to sign for 5 minimum? 12 per, that's not close to overpaying him, right? What do you want to do, 10 per and incentives? That's 50-60 right there Haven't even put in a signing bonus yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Much better, lol. Even at that though, what are giving him, 5 years? He's got to sign for 5 minimum? 12 per, that's not close to overpaying him, right? What do you want to do, 10 per and incentives? That's 50-60 right there Haven't even put in a signing bonus yet. The SB is included in his $20 mil guaranteed salary ($2 mil more that Cameron) I really think MacDaddy works out a LT deal with Mo, lets Snacks walk and gain a 4th rd. Comp and a 5th for Ivory and goes into FA with about $20 mil after the Cro, Cumberland and Breno releases and D'Brick "re-work" Brings back Powell and drafts a RB to go along with Zack Stacy as the depth guy. Some speed off the edge and an OL in FA and we're ready for the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted January 30, 2016 Author Share Posted January 30, 2016 Boooooo releasing Breno and effectively extending D'Brick. That just outright hurts the team this year and next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 The SB is included in his $20 mil guaranteed salary ($2 mil more that Cameron) I really think MacDaddy works out a LT deal with Mo, lets Snacks walk and gain a 4th rd. Comp and a 5th for Ivory and goes into FA with about $20 mil after the Cro, Cumberland and Breno releases and D'Brick "re-work" Brings back Powell and drafts a RB to go along with Zack Stacy as the depth guy. Some speed off the edge and an OL in FA and we're ready for the draft. 60 you're proposing a 60 million deal, 20 of which is signing bonus? Which means his 5 year contract is 40 million? 8 million per? Don't think that happens. He's a 12 mil per player plus a 20 mil SB player. Minimum. Don't know what he would be willing to take to stay here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snell41 Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Is that even a topic this offseason? He seems like the odd man out on the DL, and I'd think a premium position guy like him on a rookie deal would be worth a 1st+. How exactly is Sheldon odd man out? He's the most versatile DL we have by far. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Boooooo releasing Breno and effectively extending D'Brick. That just outright hurts the team this year and next. You draft Stanley in rd. 1 and you can release D'Brick..... or go Coleman in Rd. 2 to take over for Breno. Brick counts $14 mil to the cap EACH of the next 2 years. He won't make that kind of money elsewhere. I think we may be able to cut and resign him on a 2 yr. deal which works for both sides. He'll want to retire a Jet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 60 you're proposing a 60 million deal, 20 of which is signing bonus? Which means his 5 year contract is 40 million? 8 million per? Don't think that happens. He's a 12 mil per player plus a 20 mil SB player. Minimum. Don't know what he would be willing to take to stay here. I said $20 mil GUARANTEED!.... not as a SB. Figure a $10 mil SB which makes him a $10 mil/yr player similar to Can Jordan and Cam Heyward Watt was somewhere around $30 mil guaranteed. We can play the #'s so Mo appears to be getting a Watt type deal but actually getting as the 2 names below. Cam Jordan Total Value: $55,000,000 (avg. $11,000,000/year; $22,969,000 fully guaranteed) 3rd highest of 70 34DE contracts Cam Heyward Total Value: $52,281,000 (avg. $10,456,200/year; $16,000,000 fully guaranteed) 4th highest of 70 34DE contracts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Richardson is arguably the team's best player. He's been subject to a minimum of three drug tests a month since his suspension, and has obviously remained clean. A naturally brash guy, he seemed genuinely humbled by his run in with the law. And again, no new incidents on that front, either. I hope they're not even considering trading him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Island Leprechaun Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Richardson is arguably the team's best player. He's been subject to a minimum of three drug tests a month since his suspension, and has obviously remained clean. A naturally brash guy, he seemed genuinely humbled by his run in with the law. And again, no new incidents on that front, either. I hope they're not even considering trading him. I'm personally not seeing the enormous marginal value of Wilkerson over Richardson. You could pick up a very very good FA with the difference in their total price tags.I think that does more for the team overall than giving Wilkerson the big contract. The Jets are in the very lucky position of having this kind of problem. Most teams would be fighting over either on of these guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 I said $20 mil GUARANTEED!.... not as a SB. Figure a $10 mil SB which makes him a $10 mil/yr player similar to Can Jordan and Cam Heyward Watt was somewhere around $30 mil guaranteed. We can play the #'s so Mo appears to be getting a Watt type deal but actually getting as the 2 names below. Cam Jordan Total Value: $55,000,000 (avg. $11,000,000/year; $22,969,000 fully guaranteed) 3rd highest of 70 34DE contracts Cam Heyward Total Value: $52,281,000 (avg. $10,456,200/year; $16,000,000 fully guaranteed) 4th highest of 70 34DE contracts Hes not signing with only a 10 mil signing bonus. Dont think either, especially Heyward, are comparable to Mo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Hes not signing with only a 10 mil signing bonus. Dont think either, especially Heyward, are comparable to Mo. Cameron and Heyward received a $16 mil and $12 mil SB. Listen, why don't you come up with a conytract offer you think Mo would take and fair to the Jets. Easy to criticize..... put some effort into this debate. And I think Cameron is defenitely comparable to Mo with less talent around him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage69 Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 I said $20 mil GUARANTEED!.... not as a SB. Figure a $10 mil SB which makes him a $10 mil/yr player similar to Can Jordan and Cam Heyward Watt was somewhere around $30 mil guaranteed. We can play the #'s so Mo appears to be getting a Watt type deal but actually getting as the 2 names below. Cam Jordan Total Value: $55,000,000 (avg. $11,000,000/year; $22,969,000 fully guaranteed) 3rd highest of 70 34DE contracts Cam Heyward Total Value: $52,281,000 (avg. $10,456,200/year; $16,000,000 fully guaranteed) 4th highest of 70 34DE contracts Watt has 20.8 guaranteed.. http://overthecap.com/position/3-4-defensive-end/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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