Patriot Killa Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Watched Hard Knocks: 2010 Jets today and it got me reminiscing over those two glory years..found this article from way back in 09'. I was a little surprised by the comparison. https://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/01/20/comparing-2009-jets-with-2000-ravens/ Comparing 2009 Jets With 2000 Ravens BY LUIS DELOUREIRO JANUARY 20, 2010 6:00 AMJanuary 20, 2010 6:00 am Luis DeLoureiro is building a better passer rating, among other statistical pursuits, at NFLStatAnalysis.net. He also contributes at classactsports.com. Recent history suggests that it’s possible to win the Super Bowl with mediocre quarterback play if you have an exceptional (not good….not great…..exceptional) defense. In terms of both yards and points, the 2009 Jets had the league’s No. 1 defense. They were particularly strong against the pass, giving up under 2,500 yards and only 8 TDs through the air. This is no small feat for a team that finished 2008 16th in yards allowed and 18th in points allowed. More surprising was their improvement against the pass – where they ranked 29th in yards allowed in 2008. As we all know by now, that defense has led Rex Ryan’s team all the way to the A.F.C. championship game against the Indianapolis Colts. This got me to thinking. We know how good this defense is when compared to the other 2009 teams. But how good are they when compared with other top defenses of the past decade? I decided to compare the 2009 Jets to the ultimate defensive benchmark of the last 10 years – the 2000 Baltimore Ravens. I wasn’t expecting a fair fight. I came away somewhat surprised by what I found. Below are some key statistics comparing the Jets with the 2000 Ravens. The table includes both the actual metric and rank when compared to all defenses between 2000 and 2009 (out of 315). Keep in mind that offenses – particularly passing offenses – have changed significantly since 2000. I’ll try to address that a bit further down in the post. Defensive Metrics 2000 Ravens 2009 Jets Value Rank Since 2000 Value Rank Since 2000 Points 165 1 236 12 Total Yards 4,037 3 3,967 4 Total Yards Per Play 4.3 7 4.2 5 Passing Yards 2,997 54 2,459 3 Passing Yards Per Att. 5.7 33 4.9 3 Rushing Yards 970 1 1,578 72 Rushing Yards Per Att 2.7 1 3.8 63 • The Ravens and Jets were very close – ranked 3rd and 4th in the decade – in terms of total yards allowed. The 2008 Steelers and the 2000 Titans were the top two in this metric. (That’s right, the Ravens did not finish number one in 2000 in total yards allowed). • The 2000 Ravens had a clear edge in points allowed. However, the Jets’ No. 12 ranking is a bit deceiving. The data includes all scores – not just those given up by the defense. The Jets actually gave up seven TDs on kick, fumble and interception returns – compared with four for the 2000 Ravens. While the Ravens would still prevail in points yielded – 137 points 187 – the Jets would probably climb into the top five for the decade. The two teams differed in their areas of strength. • The 2000 Ravens had the decade’s top rushing defense – giving up under 1,000 yards for the entire season. The 2006 Minnesota Vikings were the only other defense to give up under 1,000 yards on the ground. • The Ravens allowed only 2.7 yards per rush attempt and five touchdown runs. • Meanwhile, the 2009 Jets’ defense finished 3rd in the decade in total passing yards (2,459) and passing yards per attempt (4.91). They allowed only eight passing touchdowns. The 2006 Raiders and the 2000 Titans gave up fewer passing yards. The 2002 Bucs and the 2008 Steelers gave up fewer yards per attempt. This analysis would indicate – not surprisingly – that the 2000 Ravens were the superior defense. However, the raw gap between the two was smaller than would have been expected. Further, when considering the league-wide increases in production via the passing game – 10 quarterbacks surpassed 4,000 yards passing in 2009 – the Jets’ performance against the pass merits further attention. Adjusting for Offensive Trends The 2000 Ravens’ dominance in the running game requires no further review — raw figures tell the story. However, as superb as the Jets’ pass defense appears looking only at the 2009 raw numbers, the results become even more impressive when you consider that league-wide passing numbers have been on the upswing for a few years. To account for the changing offensive trends, I have created a separate calculation that looks at each team’s performance in key statistics against the league’s average in that metric for the given year. For example, the Jets yielded 2,459 passing yards in 2009. The average 16-game passing total in 2009 for all 32 teams was 3,495. The Jets gave up 30% fewer yards than the league average. Below are the averages in several key metrics in 2000 and 2009. Metrics are per game — unless otherwise indicated. Year Total Yds Total Pts Passing Yds Passing Y/A Rushing Yds Rushing Y/A 2000 319.4 20.7 206.9 6.3 112.6 4.1 2009 335.1 22.0 218.5 6.6 116.7 4.2 Difference 15.7 1.4 11.6 0.3 4.1 0.2 In terms of raw passing yards yielded, the 2009 Jets were the third-best pass defense of the decade. However, when you adjust for the league average, the Jets actually had the stingiest defense in terms of yards allowed – yielding 30% fewer yards than the league average. (See the table below) Rank Year Team Passing Yds Avg for Year Diff. From Avg 1 2009 New York Jets 2459 3,495 -30% 2 2000 Tennessee Titans 2423 3,310 -27% 3 2006 Oakland Raiders 2413 3,277 -26% 4 2008 Pittsburgh Steelers 2511 3,381 -26% 5 2002 Tampa Bay Buccaneers 2490 3,350 -26% When adjusting for offenses, the Jets move into second place in the decade for yards per pass attempt. Rank Year Team Y/A Avg for Year Diff. From Avg 1 2008 Pittsburgh Steelers 4.71 6.58 -28% 2 2009 New York Jets 4.91 6.58 -25% 3 2002 Tampa Bay Buccaneers 4.88 6.18 -21% 4 2007 Pittsburgh Steelers 5.27 6.45 -18% 5 2004 Buffalo Bills 5.40 6.58 -18% If you look at the two tables above, you’ll notice that the teams listed were, with a couple of exceptions, very successful. The 2008 Steelers and the 2002 Buccaneers each won the Super Bowl. The 2000 Titans were edged out of the Super Bowl by the Baltimore Ravens, after beating the Ravens in the old A.F.C. Central. The exceptions on the list are the 2004 Bills, who narrowly missed the playoffs, and the 2006 Raiders, who faced only 410 attempts for the entire year. (This was perhaps because they fell behind early and opposing teams were running out the clock). Getting Hot at the Right Time Since a Week 11 loss to the New England Patriots – the last game in a 1-6 stretch when the Jets conceded over 22 points per game – the Jets have given up just over nine points per game and under 150 yards passing per game. And, in the aerial assault that is the 2009 N.F.L., the ability to stop the pass can come in handy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed4 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 If our defense played against their defense...there would be no snap, no QB, and no WRs. ...and, Buster Skrine would still get flagged for holding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patriot Killa Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 17 minutes ago, Greenseed4 said: If our defense played against their defense...there would be no snap, no QB, and no WRs. ...and, Buster Skrine would still get flagged for holding. 10 yard penalty all the way from Chattanooga University 2 years into the future. Boy, that must of been one hell of hold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoBowles Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 absolutely no comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Less than 2500 yards and 8 TDs passing? That's crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HessStation Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Kris Jenkins was the most dominant player I've ever seen play per extremely short window. But truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patriot Killa Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 4 minutes ago, NoBowles said: absolutely no comparison. Jet hater.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoBowles Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Just now, Patriot Killa said: Jet hater.? No, I bleed Green, I am just a realist. I watched both teams, absolutely no comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patriot Killa Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 minute ago, HessStation said: Kris Jenkins was the most dominant player I've ever seen play per extremely short window. But truth. Right! Really sucks he kept getting injured. Vocal leader too. Big presence on the field and in the locker room.. we were stout. A younger David Harris, Bart Scott, Revis(prime), Shaun Ellis, Jenkins, Leonard was no slouch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patriot Killa Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 2 minutes ago, NoBowles said: No, I bleed Green, I am just a realist. I watched both teams, absolutely no comparison. Nah man, I was honestly joking. I know you are a fan. I respect your opinion but I do believe there is very much a comparison to be made. I witnessed greatness that year man. Unique greatness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 The Rex years aka the good old days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoBowles Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Just now, JiF said: The Rex years aka the good old days More like a good couple of days, followed by utter crap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patriot Killa Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 3 minutes ago, JiF said: The Rex years aka the good old days At least the first two out of six. Then we kept blowing coverage 24/7 and getting raped on runs up the middle...i still have no explanation how or why. Oh yeah..Kyle Wilson, Coples, etc. boy for Tanny to draft so good in 2007-2008...he really screwed up after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 minute ago, NoBowles said: More like a good couple of days, followed by utter crap Best years of being a Jets fan in my life... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoBowles Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 minute ago, JiF said: Best years of being a Jets fan in my life... 98 was much better than either of the two good Rex years, and after the two good years, were the worst 4 years of Jets football I experienced, much worse than the Kotite era even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patriot Killa Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 8 minutes ago, NoBowles said: 98 was much better than either of the two good Rex years, and after the two good years, were the worst 4 years of Jets football I experienced, much worse than the Kotite era even. Im 21.. was born in 96' so really the only successful seasons I lived through actually knowing what I was watching was 09 and 10' ..sad but I was the proudest I have ever been of them. Jets defeating the Patriots in that division round after getting blown out 43-3 6 weeks prior...man that cemented it as my favorite game ever...favorite season ever as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 6 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said: Im 21.. was born in 96' so really the only successful seasons I lived through actually knowing what I was watching was 09 and 10' ..sad but I was the proudest I have ever been of them. Jets defeating the Patriots in that division round after getting blown out 43-3 6 weeks prior...man that cemented it as my favorite game ever...favorite season ever as well. So.... you are enjoying a TRUE jet fan experience. You look back 7 years for a good memory. Get used to it....?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patriot Killa Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 7 minutes ago, southparkcpa said: So.... you are enjoying a TRUE jet fan experience. You look back 7 years for a good memory. Get used to it....?? Unfortunately when I get extremely interested in a ball club, hobby, music artist, etc..I go back and dig deep into everything that has ever happened since the existence of said 'interest'..lol. I may have not lived through the pain but i know the pain all too well.? Whenever me and friends get into an argument about football..the FIRST line that comes up EVERY time is "when's the last time the Jets won the super bowl" .. all I have to come back with is "Super bowl 3 was the most important Super Bowl to date." ??♂️??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 11 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said: but i know the pain all too well.? Boyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoBowles Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 48 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said: Im 21.. was born in 96' so really the only successful seasons I lived through actually knowing what I was watching was 09 and 10' ..sad but I was the proudest I have ever been of them. Jets defeating the Patriots in that division round after getting blown out 43-3 6 weeks prior...man that cemented it as my favorite game ever...favorite season ever as well. I have sperm older than you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRy56 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 The jets are better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saul Goodman Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Darelle Revis, and to a much lesser extent, Antonio Cromartie, made that defense what it was Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detectivekimble Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 2 hours ago, Saul Goodman said: Darelle Revis, and to a much lesser extent, Antonio Cromartie, made that defense what it was Cromartie wasn't on the team in 2009. Jenkins was also out most of the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetscrazey Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 It's not even a contest, 2000 Ravens D was better and it's only rivaled by the 1985 Bears, 2002 Bucs, and the 2013 Seahawks. 2009 Jets D was a great unit, but not legendary like the above ones. It lacked the supporting cast in the secondary alongside Revis to be truly great. The 2000 Ravens were very unique because they played mostly base defense, no exotic blitzes. Their front 4 was just so good that they occupied every blocker and disrupted, leaving the back 7 free to make plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kleckineau Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 9 hours ago, Patriot Killa said: When adjusting for offenses, the Jets move into second place in the decade for yards per pass attempt. Rank Year Team Y/A Avg for Year Diff. From Avg 1 2008 Pittsburgh Steelers 4.71 6.58 -28% 2 2009 New York Jets 4.91 6.58 -25% 3 2002 Tampa Bay Buccaneers 4.88 6.18 -21% 4 2007 Pittsburgh Steelers 5.27 6.45 -18% 5 2004 Buffalo Bills 5.40 6.58 -18% How about adjusting for really important games or crucial 3rd downs? I think Baltimore excelled and our Jets..........well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFJF Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 6 hours ago, Saul Goodman said: Darelle Revis, and to a much lesser extent, Antonio Cromartie, made that defense what it was It was Revis and a bunch of nobodies in 2009 Lito Sheppard/Drew Coleman/Donald Strickland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe W. Namath Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 That ravens D was all time great. Our D that year was good. Theres no comparision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 The 09 jets d was effective. The 00 Ravens d was scary. They won the Superbowl on reputation alone.kerry Collins ? his pants facing that d. Jets d never got to that level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike135 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 What would it take to bring Rex back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sourceworx Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 11 hours ago, HessStation said: Kris Jenkins was the most dominant player I've ever seen play per extremely short window. But truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoBowles Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 hour ago, Mike135 said: What would it take to bring Rex back? Only Jets fans want to eat back their old rotten puke, lets get a Geno back while we are at it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rex-n-effect Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 2 minutes ago, NoBowles said: Only Jets fans want to eat back their old rotten puke, lets get a Geno back while we are at it.... Maybe this time a Geno/Tebow tag team could get it done... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 our 2009 and 2010 Ds were good but vastly overrated, The 2000 ravens D dominated and led a team to a SB, the 2009 Jets had a 17-6 lead against the greatest choking QB of our time and gave up 30 pts which could have been much more had they not eased up. The Ravens lost 4 games in 2000, in the 4 losses the D allowed a TOTAL of 45 points(11.3 PPG) and they didn't blew a single 4th qtr lead to lose a game. The 2009 Jets lost 7 games, in those 4 losses they allowed 124 pts(17.7 PPG) and blew 3 4th qtr leads. In the playoffs the 2000 Ravens allowed 16 points in 4 games(4 PPG) In the playoffs the 2009 Jets allowed 58 pts in 3 games(19.3 PPG) and blew a double digit lead. Please don't ever compare the 2 defenses again, I don't care what some silly out of context stat shows. they weren't comparable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage69 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 15 hours ago, HessStation said: Kris Jenkins was the most dominant player I've ever seen play per extremely short window. But truth. Except he only played 7 games in 2 years for the 09-10 team. But yes he was hell when he was well.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoBowles Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 26 minutes ago, nyjunc said: our 2009 and 2010 Ds were good but vastly overrated, The 2000 ravens D dominated and led a team to a SB, the 2009 Jets had a 17-6 lead against the greatest choking QB of our time and gave up 30 pts which could have been much more had they not eased up. The Ravens lost 4 games in 2000, in the 4 losses the D allowed a TOTAL of 45 points(11.3 PPG) and they didn't blew a single 4th qtr lead to lose a game. The 2009 Jets lost 7 games, in those 4 losses they allowed 124 pts(17.7 PPG) and blew 3 4th qtr leads. In the playoffs the 2000 Ravens allowed 16 points in 4 games(4 PPG) In the playoffs the 2009 Jets allowed 58 pts in 3 games(19.3 PPG) and blew a double digit lead. Please don't ever compare the 2 defenses again, I don't care what some silly out of context stat shows. they weren't comparable. Completely agree. It's kind of staggering how you understand this, acknowledging Rex has nothing to do with offense, yet still think he was a good coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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