Prove me wrong

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

The punter ? Lol

Trying to imagine Belichick tolerating Darron Lee or Jamal Adams is giving me tinnitus 

[genot]

5 minutes ago, JetFaninMI said:

See you agree that Sam is a FQB yet you ignore the fact that your boy Macc continues to neglect the one position that directly supports that FQB. WOW.

He traded for a pro bowl left guard, and drafted a tackle who's talented enough to compete with Shell, Beachum, or Winters. He isn't ignoring anything.

[TuscanyTile2]

My gut feeling is we drafted 1 starter (Quinnen) and the rest we'll have to see.  I wouldn't be surprised if this ended up being a 1 player draft for us though (and maybe another backup/special team type).  A lot depends on Polite (who admittedly looks pretty impressive in videos but I'm cautiously optimistic at best because Jets).

[Jets723]

2 minutes ago, JetFaninMI said:

A project to say the least. How many has he drafted since he got the job? How many has he drafted since he drafted SAM? How many has he drafted with a 1st or 2nd round pick? You know since he drafted the FRANCHISE QB? HOW MANY?

I’m not defending Macc.  Like I said before I wish we had those 3 seconds that we traded up for but that’s how life works.  This draft was big on defense so there was no way you could pass up in better impact players like Williams or Allen to reach for a OL.  I really love the Osemele move he will help bigtime

[Kevin L]

26 minutes ago, ECURB said:

Not using your feelings that are running wild on this message board...but rather using FACTS... Prove me wrong.

I only had time to pick the "best" team to compare us against but feel free to look up some others.

 

2015-2018 Drafts

JETS - 28 picks 

Currently still have 18 on the team (64%)

9 are starters (32%)

 

Patriots - 33 picks

Currently still have 14 on the team (42%)

4 are starters (12%)

 

So you say "Mac sucks at drafting" but what are you basing it on? Almost 3/4 of his picks are still kicking and it looks like this year will be no different.

The difference is that the Pats draft solid starters like Michel and Flowers.

We draft guys like Shell and a punter.

[jgb]

2 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

My gut feeling is we drafted 1 starter (Quinnen) and the rest we'll have to see.  I wouldn't be surprised if this ended up being a 1 player draft for us though (and maybe another backup/special team type).  A lot depends on Polite (who admittedly looks pretty impressive in videos but I'm cautiously optimistic at best because Jets).

Macc has a better success record with UDFAs than rounds 2-7. This ain’t over!

[genot]

1 minute ago, Jets723 said:

I’m not defending Macc.  Like I said before I wish we had those 3 seconds that we traded up for but that’s how life works.  This draft was big on defense so there was no way you could pass up in better impact players like Williams or Allen to reach for a OL.  I really love the Osemele move he will help bigtime

Don't be frightened to defend Mac. His failures are greatly exaggerated here. Has he drafted some dogs. Yea. So has every other GM in the league.

[Larz]

Holy triggered trolls lol

[Jets723]

1 minute ago, genot said:

Don't be frightened to defend Mac. His failures are greatly exaggerated here. Has he drafted some dogs. Yea. So has every other GM in the league.

Im definitely not afraid.  I try to be fair as possible.  

[jgb]

2 minutes ago, Jets723 said:

Im definitely not afraid.  I try to be fair as possible.  

You’re no Jets fan. Boo this man!

[Creepy Lurker]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with having a different opinion than the “Mac haters” and making a case that he is good etc. I just think that this particular scenario that you are using doesn’t support that argument well at all. Yes the draft is a crap shoot for all and this illustrates that even the best teams have misses.

Your “point” is completely flawed though because you are a comparing a multiple super bowl winning/appearance team with a VERY deep roster during that time period to a team that had major roster turnover and possibly the lowest level of talent in the entire NFL during that same time period. New England isn’t known for having many superstars but having a very balanced and complete roster full of good system players. It’s harder to make the cut on a team like that than the Jets, especially during this specific time period. 

I’d be curious to see other teams and especially when considering how good/bad they were and how difficult it would have been to make their rosters. This isn’t feasible to do or not worth the effor. Your example though couldn’t be more of an apples to oranges comparison if you tried. That’s not emotion, that’s a fact. 

[Drums]

5 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

My gut feeling is we drafted 1 starter (Quinnen) and the rest we'll have to see.  I wouldn't be surprised if this ended up being a 1 player draft for us though (and maybe another backup/special team type).  A lot depends on Polite (who admittedly looks pretty impressive in videos but I'm cautiously optimistic at best because Jets).

I like the TE we drafted. Given our TE depth chart, I think he has a chance. Given our FB depth chart, I think he has a chance. Wouldn't be surprised if he's in there somewhere on gameday.  

[BROOKLYN JET]

@ECURB you would have more success trying to sell us on PSLs again.

[Jet_Engine1]

36 minutes ago, ECURB said:

Not using your feelings that are running wild on this message board...but rather using FACTS... Prove me wrong.

I only had time to pick the "best" team to compare us against but feel free to look up some others.

 

2015-2018 Drafts

JETS - 28 picks 

Currently still have 18 on the team (64%)

9 are starters (32%)

 

Patriots - 33 picks

Currently still have 14 on the team (42%)

4 are starters (12%)

 

So you say "Mac sucks at drafting" but what are you basing it on? Almost 3/4 of his picks are still kicking and it looks like this year will be no different.

Its hard to make the Patriots team. This team started Darron Lee at LB and Spencer Long, a guy who couldn't effectively execute a  shotgun snap at Center for almost an entire year. 

We just drafted a replacement for a former #6 pick, a replacement for several recent attempts at OLB, a replacement for a former 1st round ILB, and a replacement for several recent attempts at TE.

 

So, there you go. 

[genot]

11 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said:

Mac's record as GM is 24-40 and the team's win total has never increased during his tenure. Mac sucks.  Prove me wrong.

It's about the QB. It always has been. Fitz played well, we won 10 games. Mccown playing like a quality backup, we win 7 games if he didn't get hurt. When Darnold, as a rookie played well we won, or played close enough to win if we had some more talent around him. Texans game. Packers game. There were games last year we could have won, but darnold imploded. Both Dolphin games. The Browns game. It's all about the QB, and how he performs.

[TuscanyTile2]

2 minutes ago, Drums said:

I like the TE we drafted. Given our TE depth chart, I think he has a chance. Given our FB depth chart, I think he has a chance. Wouldn't be surprised if he's in there somewhere on gameday.  

I hope he turns into anything close to what we're hearing about him but I could see him being another one of those over-hyped guys who end up becoming a JAG and an afterthought after 2 years.  

Again, I'm hope I'm wrong.  I'm just pessimistic because we go through this drill every year where we get optimistic after the draft and things don't work out.  I remember how excited people on here were for Devin Smith.  (Not saying that I knew better btw.  I didn't)

[CTM]

Seems like a lot of mac supporters are former penningtologists

[Integrity28]

34 minutes ago, ECURB said:

Not using your feelings that are running wild on this message board...but rather using FACTS... Prove me wrong.

I only had time to pick the "best" team to compare us against but feel free to look up some others.

 

2015-2018 Drafts

JETS - 28 picks 

Currently still have 18 on the team (64%)

9 are starters (32%)

 

Patriots - 33 picks

Currently still have 14 on the team (42%)

4 are starters (12%)

 

So you say "Mac sucks at drafting" but what are you basing it on? Almost 3/4 of his picks are still kicking and it looks like this year will be no different.

What your percentages completely ignore is 1.) the talent level of each roster, and therefore the difficulty to stick in NY versus NE; 2.) the quality of starter they're getting.

IMO this is an irrelevant comparison, because the Pats are a deeply talented team, and therefore use the draft to take LOTS of swings at filling a smaller percentage of roster space - via turnover. While the Jets have been horribly drafted going back to Tannenbaum, and every draft class basically gets 1-2 years of de facto residency on the roster. The Pats cut rookies. The Jets start them. 

We're just in two totally different worlds of organizational development and competency.

[CTM]

20 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Brady is playing 1 on 11 and compensating for a secretly inept coach and GM is my favorite Jets fanboy argument.

Hope we get to find out. All the top QB's regularly win divisions, I dont see a highly talent rich roster in NE

[Jets723]

1 minute ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I hope he turns into anything close to what we're hearing about him but I could see him being another one of those over-hyped guys who end up becoming a JAG and an afterthought after 2 years.  

Again, I'm hope I'm wrong.  I'm just pessimistic because we go through this drill every year where we get optimistic after the draft and things don't work out.  I remember how excited people on here were for Devin Smith.  (Not saying that I knew better btw.  I didn't)

I think the pessimistic mindset is the bigger issues.  Im not saying you have to give every move a A, that would be silly and inaccurate BUT I do think there should be more positivity regarding this team because of the QB and the moves we made this offseason

[jgb]

5 minutes ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Its hard to make the Patriots team. This team started Darron Lee at LB and Spencer Long, a guy who couldn't effectively execute a  shotgun snap at Center for almost an entire year. 

We just drafted a replacement for a former #6 pick, a replacement for several recent attempts at OLB, a replacement for a former 1st round ILB, and a replacement for several recent attempts at TE.

 

So, there you go. 

This. This draft cannot be judged only for the players Macc picked but also why we find ourselves picking the same positions yet again under one GM’s watch.

[CTM]

As to the analysis the fact that one guy has picked top 10 3 times versus the other bottom 4 everytime explains this. The jets second round pick is essentially the same tier as the Pat's first, same for every other round.

[Matt39]

Just now, CTM said:

Hope we get to find out. All the top QB's regularly win divisions, I dont see a talent rich roster in NE

They have the best line in football and have perfected sacrificing raw talent for coachability. 

[jgb]

4 minutes ago, CTM said:

Hope we get to find out. All the top QB's regularly win divisions, I dont see a highly talent rich roster in NE

If Wes Welker or Julian Edelman were Jets, they’d be Jeremy Kerley. Conversely, if Kerley was a Pat he’d be a 90+ catch guy.

[JetFaninMI]

14 minutes ago, genot said:

He traded for a pro bowl left guard, and drafted a tackle who's talented enough to compete with Shell, Beachum, or Winters. He isn't ignoring anything.

Okay. A guy who made the pro bowl in 2016-17 but had a down year last year. Coming off of injuries to his knee and toe.

But Osemele's play slipped last season as he battled knee and toe injuries, missing a total of five games. There were rumors that he'd be shipped out before the trading deadline, but he made it through the season on a poor offensive line. Quarterback Derek Carr was sacked 51 times.

Osemele has two years remaining on his contract, with cap charges of $10.2 million and $11.7 million. None of his remaining salary is guaranteed. The Jets have more than $90 million in cap space.

In recent days, there was speculation that Osemele, who turns 30 on June 24, would be cut. In February, he released video on Twitter that suggested he's determined to have a bounce-back year. He tweeted that 2019 would be devoted to "health and wellness" and he showed himself tipping the scale at 296 pounds.

You then go on to say how he drafted a guy who can compete with the scrubs we have. Why am I not excited? We are talking about Macc's draft performance pal. 30 year old beat up OL and project guys ain't getting it done. NEXT.

[Integrity28]

4 minutes ago, Jets723 said:

I think the pessimistic mindset is the bigger issues.  Im not saying you have to give every move a A, that would be silly and inaccurate BUT I do think there should be more positivity regarding this team because of the QB and the moves we made this offseason

I also need people to unabashedly agree with my world view in order to feel better about myself.

[jgb]

1 minute ago, JetFaninMI said:

Okay. A guy who made the pro bowl in 2016-17 but had a down year last year. Coming off of injuries to his knee and toe.

But Osemele's play slipped last season as he battled knee and toe injuries, missing a total of five games. There were rumors that he'd be shipped out before the trading deadline, but he made it through the season on a poor offensive line. Quarterback Derek Carr was sacked 51 times.

Osemele has two years remaining on his contract, with cap charges of $10.2 million and $11.7 million. None of his remaining salary is guaranteed. The Jets have more than $90 million in cap space.

In recent days, there was speculation that Osemele, who turns 30 on June 24, would be cut. In February, he released video on Twitter that suggested he's determined to have a bounce-back year. He tweeted that 2019 would be devoted to "health and wellness" and he showed himself tipping the scale at 296 pounds.

You then go on to say how he drafted a guy who can compete with the scrubs we have. Why am I not excited? We are talking about Macc's draft performance pal. 30 year old beat up OL and project guys ain't getting it done. NEXT.

Yep and Leo is a “pro bowl DL,” but look how many want to ship him out.

Mommas, don’t let your boys grow up to be Jets players.

[JetFaninMI]

20 minutes ago, Jets723 said:

I’m not defending Macc.  Like I said before I wish we had those 3 seconds that we traded up for but that’s how life works.  This draft was big on defense so there was no way you could pass up in better impact players like Williams or Allen to reach for a OL.  I really love the Osemele move he will help bigtime

I never asked you anything about 2nd round picks or guys he traded for. I asked how many OL he drafted period. Since this is a thread about proving Macc's drafting ability or lack thereof that is the question.

[FidelioJet]

Your not wrong. People are frustrated because of our win-loss record. Can't blame them When you look fairly, at the last 4 years it really comes down to, who was behind center and how did he perform. Franchise QB's don't grow on trees. We have one now. Winning is just around the corner

Yet we still draft DT’s with our first pick?



Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

24:25:31

[CTM]

1 minute ago, Matt39 said:

They have the best line in football and have perfected sacrificing raw talent for coachability. 

Uh huh. Having a great QB helps the line and mitigates talent issues 

The colts go Luck back and went from top 5 pick to divisional round.

[JetFaninMI]

2 minutes ago, jgb said:

Yep and Leo is a “pro bowl DL,” but look how many want to ship him out.

Mommas, don’t let your boys grow up to be Jets players.

So right. LOL. A brutal bunch we Fans can be.

[Jets723]

2 minutes ago, JetFaninMI said:

I never asked you anything about 2nd round picks or guys he traded for. I asked how many OL he drafted period. Since this is a thread about proving Macc's drafting ability or lack thereof that is the question.

I agreed with you about that.  I think Macc should of drafted more olinemen in previous drafts

[Matt39]

2 minutes ago, CTM said:

Uh huh. Having a great QB helps the line and mitigates talent issues 

The colts go Luck back and went from top 5 pick to divisional round.

Brady is the GOAT. 

But the greatest QB does not have the ability to compensate for a bad executive/coach who has total control and go to 7 Super Bowls. Belichick is miles ahead of everyone. More so than Brady is currently at his respective position.

[Drums]

16 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I hope he turns into anything close to what we're hearing about him but I could see him being another one of those over-hyped guys who end up becoming a JAG and an afterthought after 2 years.  

Again, I'm hope I'm wrong.  I'm just pessimistic because we go through this drill every year where we get optimistic after the draft and things don't work out.  I remember how excited people on here were for Devin Smith.  (Not saying that I knew better btw.  I didn't)

I know-- and after a while, less people are optimistic. It's hard to see the same patterns over and over again, denying them at first, but after ten times you have to stop and say, "hey..."

Even though I never heard of this guy, I wanted the Jets to draft a TE that could block (and hopefully catch) to add a little help to our offensive line. What's his name came in as FB last year and helped us out at times but now he's gone. We have Bell now, too, who's going to want that blocker. The TE looks like he punishes people with his blocks-- he's a pretty big dude on the field.  I hope he is fun to watch.  I do like Polite and the LB we added as well-- I think they might contribute at some point. I've accepted Q now I guess who should hopefully be fun to watch.

Still scared about the line though, and the fact that injuries destroyed us at WR last year and we didn't do a whole lot to address that (adding one guy doesn't address that in my opinion), but having Bell should help so... fingers crossed. New coaching seems to help this team and others ignite some fire and win some games. Here's to hoping that helps here too. 

[T0mShane]

Also, I wouldn’t hire Belichick to be my GM, either.