Jets signing Dalvin Cook? 6/9 Update Cook Released

[jetblue95]

11 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

1. He does not have a ton Of mileage

2. he's 27 years old

3. At this stage he knows he not getting 3 at 10

A ton of Mileage is when your over 300 rushes per year and he's not even close to that

Like I said Cook only makes sense for us on the cheap

 

1. only derrick henry has more carries since 2019

https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/most-carries-since-2019#:~:text=Since 2019%2C Derrick Henry has,rush attempts%2C with 1%2C249 carries.

2. he will be 28 next month, before the season starts

3. can't say for sure what he knows, or what he expects to receive.

but we agree, cook only makes sense for us on the cheap.  whether he's willing to play "for cheap" remains to be seen.  my guess he will hold out for the highest price despite agent-talk of wanting to get a ring (and i wouldn't blame him given the relatively short shelf life of nfl RBs)

[slats]

14 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Absolutely an Izzy fan. But like let’s say Ruckert… his snaps are likely going to be very limited.

 

I think what we all have to remember is that we’re a win now team, so our mindset is changed. It’s not play young guys and see what they have. We legit can win every game. So Izzy getting 10 touches bc he’s the future with Hall isn’t a priority. It’s give those 10 touches to whoever helps you win that game that day. 

Apples & screwdrivers 

TEs typically have the steepest learning curve from college to the pros, while RBs historically have the easiest. And Ruckert was hurt! Rookie RBs play, and play a lot, all of the time. This whole discussion is about replacing a rookie’s production. Carter played as a rookie and looked quite a bit better than he did his sophomore year. UDFA Knight got 98 touches last year. If Abanikanda demonstrates that he can play, he’ll play. They wouldn’t be giving him 10 touches because he’s the future. They’d be giving them to him because he’s potentially explosive with the football in his hands right now in the present. Just like other rookie RBs everywhere forever. 

[slats]

14 hours ago, Rich Thornburgh said:

We need an upgrade at backup qb way more than an expensive part-time rb

Yeah, the Jets traded a couple high picks and are paying Aaron Rodgers $100M -a QB who hasn’t missed a start in five years- so they could invest in a marginal improvement at a position that’s unlikely to ever see the field. 

[Bobby816]

15 minutes ago, slats said:

Apples & screwdrivers 

TEs typically have the steepest learning curve from college to the pros, while RBs historically have the easiest. And Ruckert was hurt! Rookie RBs play, and play a lot, all of the time. This whole discussion is about replacing a rookie’s production. Carter played as a rookie and looked quite a bit better than he did his sophomore year. UDFA Knight got 98 touches last year. If Abanikanda demonstrates that he can play, he’ll play. They wouldn’t be giving him 10 touches because he’s the future. They’d be giving them to him because he’s potentially explosive with the football in his hands right now in the present. Just like other rookie RBs everywhere forever. 

Fully agree that TE is a harder transition than RB... but Ruckert was pretty much 4th on the depth chart regardless of being injured (didn't Yeboah get more time than him?). I was more or less just using that as an example, that just playing young guys to see what we have isn't part of our plan anymore. It's to win every game. Not that it isn't always that. But now it's legit that we can.

So playing Carter when we were a bottom 5 team in the league as a rookie, is different than playing Izzy on a team that is all in on the SB.

I for one think Izzy is the 2nd best RB on the team, so not arguing that he should get those touches. I just see it as very unlikely if we have the exact RB room and no one is injured that he's getting #2 RB touches behind Hall. Or that he's taking RB1 duty to ease Hall back in.

 

I think the disconnect might be that maybe you think Hall will be 100% (or close to it) where our #2 RB isn't a "huge" need.

[jetblue95]

2 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

Fully agree that TE is a harder transition than RB... but Ruckert was pretty much 4th on the depth chart regardless of being injured (didn't Yeboah get more time than him?). I was more or less just using that as an example, that just playing young guys to see what we have isn't part of our plan anymore. It's to win every game. Not that it isn't always that. But now it's legit that we can.

So playing Carter when we were a bottom 5 team in the league as a rookie, is different than playing Izzy on a team that is all in on the SB.

I for one think Izzy is the 2nd best RB on the team, so not arguing that he should get those touches. I just see it as very unlikely if we have the exact RB room and no one is injured that he's getting #2 RB touches behind Hall. Or that he's taking RB1 duty to ease Hall back in.

 

I think the disconnect might be that maybe you think Hall will be 100% (or close to it) where our #2 RB isn't a "huge" need.

 

a 7th round rookie RB started for the SB winners

the best RBs will play.  i don't know much about izzy, but if he proves to be better than carter or knight, he will play.  pretty simple imo

[Bobby816]

6 minutes ago, jetblue95 said:

 

a 7th round rookie RB started for the SB winners

the best RBs will play.  i don't know much about izzy, but if he proves to be better than carter or knight, he will play.  pretty simple imo

That means nothing to me. We aren't the Chiefs, so that's not apples to apples.

KC can pretty much careless about defense... so should be not invest anything there, bc they haven't really either?

[slats]

6 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

So playing Carter when we were a bottom 5 team in the league as a rookie, is different than playing Izzy on a team that is all in on the SB.

I for one think Izzy is the 2nd best RB on the team, so not arguing that he should get those touches. I just see it as very unlikely if we have the exact RB room and no one is injured that he's getting #2 RB touches behind Hall. Or that he's taking RB1 duty to ease Hall back in.

 

I think the disconnect might be that maybe you think Hall will be 100% (or close to it) where our #2 RB isn't a "huge" need.

Rookie RBs play on garbage teams and Super Bowl teams. If they can play, they play. It’s not like Carter or Knight have earned some special privileges in their year or two here. It’s the position where “veteran savvy,” is least required. If Abanikanda looks good in practice, we’ll see him on the field. Of the three of them, he’s the most Hall-like. He’s the one with breakaway speed and home run ability. If he earns the coach’s trust, he’ll be out there. 
 
And I do think that Hall will be the starter opening day. I expect very limited -if any- reps in the preseason for him, but come September he’ll be on the field. I don’t where he’s going to be percentage-wise, I could see them limiting his snaps some early, but that’s what makes having another speed back like Abanikanda so useful. They could keep Carter and Knight in their roles from last year, and have Izzy pick up a couple of Breece’s series every week to open the season. 
 
I’m just not interested in Cook. If he did do all those veteran things well, I’d be more interested, but he doesn’t. He drops passes, he fumbles, and he misses blocking assignments. If the team decides they need another RB, I’d prefer a significantly cheaper one who maybe does a couple of those things and also gets a few more yards than his OL gives him here and there. People get focused on names all the time. They’re often not worth it. Cook isn’t. 

[batman10023]

19 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

 

I literally say in that... BUT AT THE RIGHT PRICE!!!

yes i should have made that clear.  sorry for the confusion

[#27TheDominator]

13 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

Fully agree that TE is a harder transition than RB... but Ruckert was pretty much 4th on the depth chart regardless of being injured (didn't Yeboah get more time than him?). I was more or less just using that as an example, that just playing young guys to see what we have isn't part of our plan anymore. It's to win every game. Not that it isn't always that. But now it's legit that we can.

So playing Carter when we were a bottom 5 team in the league as a rookie, is different than playing Izzy on a team that is all in on the SB.

I for one think Izzy is the 2nd best RB on the team, so not arguing that he should get those touches. I just see it as very unlikely if we have the exact RB room and no one is injured that he's getting #2 RB touches behind Hall. Or that he's taking RB1 duty to ease Hall back in.

 

I think the disconnect might be that maybe you think Hall will be 100% (or close to it) where our #2 RB isn't a "huge" need.

I know it was just an example, but Ruckert outsnapped Yeboah on offense 46-26.  It was on special teams where Yeboah got all those snaps.  Ruckert was the #3 TE pretty much all season and on roster, while Yeboah was bounced off and on the practice squad.  Cager is the one that got 10 snaps in the opener, but they let him walk and by mid-season he was getting solid run with the Giants.  

I am a big fan of giving Abanikanda touches.  The superbowl guy says his kid played with Abanikanda (presumably at Lincoln) and things he (Abanikanda, not his kid) can't catch or block.  That all sounds odd to me.  I want to work Hall back slowly and I get fears about a rookie being ready early.  I just don't see any issue in getting 20 carries a week out of guys other than Hall. 

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

16 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Absolutely an Izzy fan. But like let’s say Ruckert… his snaps are likely going to be very limited.

 

I think what we all have to remember is that we’re a win now team, so our mindset is changed. It’s not play young guys and see what they have. We legit can win every game. So Izzy getting 10 touches bc he’s the future with Hall isn’t a priority. It’s give those 10 touches to whoever helps you win that game that day. 

Deleted.

Slats made the point about rookie RBs and TEs better than my original post here.

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

32 minutes ago, slats said:

Rookie RBs play on garbage teams and Super Bowl teams. If they can play, they play. It’s not like Carter or Knight have earned some special privileges in their year or two here. It’s the position where “veteran savvy,” is least required. If Abanikanda looks good in practice, we’ll see him on the field. Of the three of them, he’s the most Hall-like. He’s the one with breakaway speed and home run ability. If he earns the coach’s trust, he’ll be out there. 
 
And I do think that Hall will be the starter opening day. I expect very limited -if any- reps in the preseason for him, but come September he’ll be on the field. I don’t where he’s going to be percentage-wise, I could see them limiting his snaps some early, but that’s what makes having another speed back like Abanikanda so useful. They could keep Carter and Knight in their roles from last year, and have Izzy pick up a couple of Breece’s series every week to open the season. 
 
I’m just not interested in Cook. If he did do all those veteran things well, I’d be more interested, but he doesn’t. He drops passes, he fumbles, and he misses blocking assignments. If the team decides they need another RB, I’d prefer a significantly cheaper one who maybe does a couple of those things and also gets a few more yards than his OL gives him here and there. People get focused on names all the time. They’re often not worth it. Cook isn’t. 

Plus Abanikanda's speed fits the 49ers style running game used by the Jets. Hit the hole, one cut and run.  Cook is just an expensive name.

Notice nobody is posting that the Jets should sign experienced veteran Elliott?  Why not?  Cook is one year behind Elliott on the declining RB scale.  

[Barry McCockinner]

Just now, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

Plus Abanikanda's speed fits the 49ers style running game used by the Jets. Hit the hole, one cut and run.  Cook is just an expensive name.

Notice nobody is posting that the Jets should sign experienced veteran Elliott?  Why not?  Cook is one year behind Elliott on the declining RB scale.  

I have actually seen people wanting us to sign Zeke as if he doesn't look like he's walking in quick sand wearing lead boots.

[Jetsfan80]

17 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

I have actually seen people wanting us to sign Zeke as if he doesn't look like he's walking in quick sand wearing lead boots.

HE IS A NAME I RECOGNIZE

[jetblue95]

1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

That means nothing to me. We aren't the Chiefs, so that's not apples to apples.

KC can pretty much careless about defense... so should be not invest anything there, bc they haven't really either?

 

uh, what???

all i was saying that the SB champs started a rookie RB.  it would take quite a leap to get from there to all teams that play rookie RBs win the super bowl, which seems to be what your comment implied.

RB seems to be perhaps the easiest position for a rookie to transition from college to pros.  plenty of rookie RBs, even low drafted or UDFA, have stepped into a big role day 1/year 1.  i am taking no position on whether izzy can, or cannot, step into a large role.  that remains to be seen.  but it wouldn't be without precedent for a late-round rookie RB to play a major role on a SB team.  it wouldn't be because the coaches "wanted to see what he had".  it would be because he showed that he can play at this level and be a contributor (hypothetically).

[Bobby816]

1 hour ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

Plus Abanikanda's speed fits the 49ers style running game used by the Jets. Hit the hole, one cut and run.  Cook is just an expensive name.

Notice nobody is posting that the Jets should sign experienced veteran Elliott?  Why not?  Cook is one year behind Elliott on the declining RB scale.  

MLF is gone we have Hackett/Rodgers as OC

[BornJetsFan1983]

21 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I didn't even argue they're better than Bam dude, lol.  

Cook sucks for what it would cost.  Hard pass until he comes down on his price significantly.  

And he isn't "consistent".  Far from it.  He had a few chunk plays last year, which is nice, but he also was about 3 yards and a cloud of dust on the overwhelming majority of his carries.  How is that worth ~ $5-6M more than what Bam brings to the table?

why suggest getting them if they not better than what we have? cook is better in current state that everything we have aside from Hall, and I think def worth the cost cause he can score and make plays we other wise could not. I m not sold that any time will meet his demand for more than 8 mill. We saw bam and carter for that matter do nothing when relied upon after a couple games. I think he is worth the money so that we have a plan for hall not coming back as expected or untill he get there, and to give us a dynamic runner that can make plays. Worht every penny.

[BornJetsFan1983]

21 hours ago, jgb said:

It's not the end of the story, it's part of the story. I almost always roll my eyes when "but the cap!" is thrown around here, and yes, I'd rather them overpay for Cook than do nothing in a SB-or-bust year, but I'd much prefer that money go toward a Q extension, front-load a little more of Rodgers' contact to give some relief for 2024, bring in another WR, or even a veteran QB2.

So yeah, I'd prefer Cook to a cap underspend, but there are so, so, so many things I'd prefer the Jets to do with that money.

But yeah, if he'd take $3M, sign him up.

given that choice I ddef agree to Q money over Cook money. or AR over Cook money. But I do not think we are limited to only one or two of these things. I think we can make COok work and I dont mind 8 -10 mill a year. For as you said, a SB year. 

3 m lol never going to happne, as I understand it he has offer for 7m from miami or maybe even vikings. I think he want most money knowing its his last contract. He could play pivotial role year, lvoe to have him. 

I think we need to get him or try to, cause trusting bam and caarter to carry the load until hall gets back if he gets back is too big of a gamble.

[Jet Nut]

On 7/11/2023 at 11:02 AM, slats said:

This is from Rosenblatt at The Athletic regarding Cook’s decline: 

Con: The decline is real

Not to contradict the first point about his production in 2022, but there is evidence Cook is heading in the wrong direction.

First, Cook accomplished what he did in 2022 behind the third-best run-blocking offensive line in the league, per PFF, and the 10th-best passing attack. In 2021, the Vikings were 16th and fourth in those categories, respectively.

In the last two years combined, per TruMedia, Cook ranks 46th (of 57) in successful play rate on rushes and 51st on third-down conversion rate on rushes, among running backs with at least 150 carries. Per Michael Nania, Cook leads all running backs in combined drops, fumbles and allowed pressures since 2019 with 61. Cook lost four fumbles last year, tied for the most among all running backs with Alvin Kamara.

Last year, Cook had the third-highest percentage (23.5) of rushes for zero or negative yards among running backs with at least 100 carries, per TruMedia. Former Jet James Robinson had the worst percentage. Cook also was 38th (of 42) in first-down rate — Carter was 42nd. He’s still capable of making things happen when a play breaks down, but maybe not at the level he used to.

*note: Carter and Robinson were clearly NOT running behind the league’s third best rushing OL, nor did they enjoy a top ten passing attack. 
 

Do you think the Vikes have access this type of info?  

[Jet Nut]

18 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

1. He does not have a ton Of mileage

2. he's 27 years old

3. At this stage he knows he not getting 3 at 10

A ton of Mileage is when your over 300 rushes per year and he's not even close to that

Like I said Cook only makes sense for us on the cheap

1. He absolutely has a ton of miles. 

2. He turns 28 in a couple of weeks.  Old for a RB.  

3. Who knows what he knows

Who gets consistent 300+ Carrie’s in the NFL?  Who made that the cut off.  240-250 is a hell of a lot and what Cook averaged since he was 22.

 

 

[Larz]

How many pages was the Rodgers trade thread ? 50 ?  This is nuts 😂

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, BornJetsFan1983 said:

why suggest getting them if they not better than what we have? cook is better in current state that everything we have aside from Hall, and I think def worth the cost cause he can score and make plays we other wise could not. I m not sold that any time will meet his demand for more than 8 mill. We saw bam and carter for that matter do nothing when relied upon after a couple games. I think he is worth the money so that we have a plan for hall not coming back as expected or untill he get there, and to give us a dynamic runner that can make plays. Worht every penny.

Because we don't need to overpay a RB for what he's done before.  RB is a young man's position and always will be.  Paying $6M+ for 4.4 YPC is madness.  Not at all "worth every penny".  

We just need to add another decent body to the committee to handle things until Breece returns.  Just because some of the RBs I listed aren't guys you've heard of doesn't mean they aren't better than Bam.  RB is a plug-n-play position.  Eno Benjamin would be just fine and arguably not much of a gap would lie between Dalvin and him at this point in their respective careers.

[SouthernJet]

On 6/5/2023 at 1:29 PM, Rhg1084 said:

 

no chance 11 M for 1 year,,

[SouthernJet]

jets waiting for falcons to salary cap cut Coradelle patterson,, can fill RB and WR roles at bargain price,, 1 year signing for the old guy..

[Beerfish]

The jets saw what happened when we lost breece last year, that was the beginning of the end.  Price is for sure the key but i do not see the jets avoiding rbs just becasue of who we currently have.

[SouthernJet]

28 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

The jets saw what happened when we lost breece last year, that was the beginning of the end.  Price is for sure the key but i do not see the jets avoiding rbs just becasue of who we currently have.

ya i pretty sure they bring in someone,, just playing poker right now with cook, hunt, fournette, maybe Zeke and may have eye on Vet RB that will be cut by rebuild teamss who drafted or signed younger options

 

Not endorsing but possible salary cap caualties

atl coradelle patterson 5.5M

ariz John Connor (MAJOR rebuild mode) 9.5M can almost guarantee he is cut or asked to take paycut in new deal,, they are in sweepstakes for next years QB derby and makes no sense to keep 10M old RB

Sea kenneth walker (love drafted rookie)  2M

[BornJetsFan1983]

4 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Because we don't need to overpay a RB for what he's done before.  RB is a young man's position and always will be.  Paying $6M+ for 4.4 YPC is madness.  Not at all "worth every penny".  

We just need to add another decent body to the committee to handle things until Breece returns.  Just because some of the RBs I listed aren't guys you've heard of doesn't mean they aren't better than Bam.  RB is a plug-n-play position.  Eno Benjamin would be just fine and arguably not much of a gap would lie between Dalvin and him at this point in their respective careers.

There is a huge gap between those two and any of the names you gave and d cook. Like grand canyon size gap. Talent wins. And you are right young mans game bit we are talking about a guy extremely talented verse ave nfl back up levels

[Hex]

How has this gone to 34 pages? We have like a billion RBs

[Jetsfan80]

6 minutes ago, Hex said:

How has this gone to 34 pages? We have like a billion RBs

We have 3 healthy RBs.  lol.  And how long have you been following this team, exactly?  We’re 1 injury away from fans wondering why our RBs suck.  

[Hex]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

We have 3 healthy RBs.  lol.  And how long have you been following this team, exactly?  We’re 1 injury away from fans wondering why our RBs suck.  

True, but Dalvin Cook?

Are there seriously no better options?

[playtowinthegame]

10 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

HE IS A NAME I RECOGNIZE

I RECKON ZEKE IS WASHED.

[Jetsfan80]

7 minutes ago, Hex said:

True, but Dalvin Cook?

Are there seriously no better options?

Yes, and I’ve listed them.  

[Smashmouth]

5 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

1. He absolutely has a ton of miles. 

2. He turns 28 in a couple of weeks.  Old for a RB.  

3. Who knows what he knows

Who gets consistent 300+ Carrie’s in the NFL?  Who made that the cut off.  240-250 is a hell of a lot and what Cook averaged since he was 22.

 

 

Jet nut a ton of miles for a RB is when they run for 300 + carries a year Dalvin Cook did that one time. Lots of mileage is a guy like Levon Bell or a guy like Henry or a guy like Peterson who averaged well over 300 carries a year so if you want to go with Cook having a ton of miles on him that's cool but I'm not going there. When you see a 1500 yard back (which is what gets them paid) they are almost always above 300 Carries approaching 350+.

Dalvin Cook has had very small drops in production and Jet Nation spins that into a declining Running back which I get since they don't want the guy here at what he's asking and neither do I. The fact of the matter is every single RB declines from his late 20's on . In the case of Cook he has been pretty damn consistent in his numbers so he didn't break as many tackles yet he is still is averaging 4.5 ypc so what exactly is the point there ? Advanced stats don't always tell the whole story.

[Reasonable Jets Fan]

6 hours ago, Larz said:

How many pages was the Rodgers trade thread ? 50 ?  This is nuts 😂

Rodgers trade was about 450 pages

 

[Hex]

2 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Yes, and I’ve listed them.  

Dang. I'm just gonna believe you, cause I'm too lazy to search this whole freakin thread.

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, Smashmouth said:

Jet nut a ton of miles for a RB is when they run for 300 + carries a year Dalvin Cook did that one time. Lots of mileage is a guy like Levon Bell or a guy like Henry or a guy like Peterson who averaged well over 300 carries a year so if you want to go with Cook having a ton of miles on him that's cool but I'm not going there. When you see a 1500 yard back (which is what gets them paid) they are almost always above 300 Carries approaching 350+.

Dalvin Cook has had very small drops in production and Jet Nation spins that into a declining Running back which I get since they don't want the guy here at what he's asking and neither do I. The fact of the matter is every single RB declines from his late 20's on . In the case of Cook he has been pretty damn consistent in his numbers so he didn't break as many tackles yet he is still is averaging 4.5 ypc so what exactly is the point there ? Advanced stats don't always tell the whole story.

I agree 300 carry’s per would be a lot but it depends on the back.  A CuMar wouldn’t care, AP didn’t care.  Others burn out and Cook exhibits all the traits of a RB who’s in the decline and isn’t anything special anymore.  You can say he’s had a very small drop on production but it’s not other than he got enough Carrie’s to up his totals.  Playing behind one of the leagues best OL’s.  I wonder what M Carter would have done when Hall went down if he had the 3rd best OL blocking for him.  He averaged 4.4 per because of his line, not because he’s the same player.  Unfortunately advanced stats tell the story here