Daniel Jeremiah's Mock 1.0: Fauga over Fashanu

[varjet]

• Every year scout and pundits get enamored with tackles with long arms and quick feet who they believe can dance with Edge rushers.  Many too not turn out to be good football players.
• We have seen guys like Tristan Wirfs and even Panei Sewell get undervalued.  
• Fuaga is a football player.    He will do fine as a T.
• We are riding or dying with AR8, and trying to build a good culture. That involves not having players on the roster who are grossly overpaid or underachieving.  That means, to me:
  • Give AR8 Bakhtiari-Warren and Mitchell are his backup
  • Draft Fuaga for RT-same backups.
  • Draft a RG, put AVT at LG, cut Tomlinson.
  • Offer Mosley and JFM restructures.  
  • Resign Ashtyn.

[Augustiniak]

9 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Former PFF guy Eric Eager has argued for a long time that teams should prioritize run blocking when building out the OL because the indomitable rushing attack is scheme- and conditions-proof and it enhances the play action pass attack. It’s very hard to line up and pass block against today’s defensive schemes and edge talent, so even the best pass blockers are nullified if they can’t run block. Maybe this is why we’re seeing Fashanu “fall” in the more credible mocks? 

Well as we know pass blocking can be significantly aided by a qb who can read a defense and get rid of the ball in a reasonable amount of time 

[derp]

Hopefully Fuaga plays at the Senior Bowl and plays well. If he plays there this is a nice low risk flag plant for DJ. He’ll show off at the Senior Bowl, “move up”, and DJ looks smart or he’ll dip him down a little and nobody notices.

[Beerfish]

24 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Former PFF guy Eric Eager has argued for a long time that teams should prioritize run blocking when building out the OL because the indomitable rushing attack is scheme- and conditions-proof and it enhances the play action pass attack. It’s very hard to line up and pass block against today’s defensive schemes and edge talent, so even the best pass blockers are nullified if they can’t run block. Maybe this is why we’re seeing Fashanu “fall” in the more credible mocks? 

I mean this sounds very jets like.   You are great as long as you are ahead by two tds and can run the ball!  But get behind and you are utterly screwed.  Play action is nice but you need to be able to pass.

In todays game you pass to set up the run, not the other way around old school. imo.

[Bronxville Jets Fan]

Let’s all pray the board falls this way with two defensive players and only one OT going top 9.

[HawkeyeJet]

2 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

 

some are projecting him as a Guard. Taking a G over a LT who can start D1 would really be something.

He also liked Becton over Wirfs(who tons of people also said would be a guard).

The more I read NFL draft stuff over the years, the more I’m convinced that projecting a tackle(especially a 1st round guy) to guard is just these guys way of protecting their reputation.  

[T0mShane]

57 minutes ago, derp said:

Hopefully Fuaga plays at the Senior Bowl and plays well. If he plays there this is a nice low risk flag plant for DJ. He’ll show off at the Senior Bowl, “move up”, and DJ looks smart or he’ll dip him down a little and nobody notices.

iirc DJ has that fun story every year about supposed “risers and fallers” being the result of coaching staffs parachuting in to the personnel meetings after the Super Bowl, putting their fingers on the scale, and leaking to the media who they like and dislike. 

[Waka Flocka Flacco]

I’ll crossbook anything friendzone cosigns. Anybody want to put money on this?

[maury77]

I'm going to watch more tape of Fashanu vs. Fuaga, but based upon what I've seen so far, choosing Fuaga over Fashanu is a mistake. Give me the more explosive athlete who played better competition. 

[derp]

53 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

iirc DJ has that fun story every year about supposed “risers and fallers” being the result of coaching staffs parachuting in to the personnel meetings after the Super Bowl, putting their fingers on the scale, and leaking to the media who they like and dislike. 

Yup that’s why I put “move up” in quotes. Brugler is pretty well connected too though and a good guesser (early on Travon Walker, etc) so I tend to find confluence between those two extra interesting.

8 minutes ago, maury77 said:

I'm going to watch more tape of Fashanu vs. Fuaga, but based upon what I've seen so far, choosing Fuaga over Fashanu is a mistake. Give me the more explosive athlete who played better competition. 

Fashanu is definitely more of a fluid athlete but it’s possible Fuaga is more explosive. He’s got some pop. Feel like Fashanu would be a bigger version of Brick - who is a favorite of mine so that wouldn’t be bad.

[maury77]

 

 

Fuaga seems like the more saavy blocker of the two. He makes a lot of good decisions regarding positioning himself and you don't see a lot of mistakes. On the other hand, he looks stiff and you don't see him frequently bending his knees to pop into his blocks and you see him bend at the waist a few times. I think because of his size and cerebral approach he's going to have a high floor but he just does't seem like a very good athlete IMO and I think he is going to have some leverage issues along as well as issues handling faster defensive ends. 

Fashanu is a little more raw than Fuaga and you see him overset and make an occasional mental error. That being said, he is a proverbial "dancing bear" with his size, lateral agility and the way he can drop and explode up into the defender. 

I suppose it is a matter of personal preference, but I'd take Fashanu over Fuaga and it is not a very difficult decision IMO. 

[maury77]

10 minutes ago, derp said:

Yup that’s why I put “move up” in quotes. Brugler is pretty well connected too though and a good guesser (early on Travon Walker, etc) so I tend to find confluence between those two extra interesting.

Fashanu is definitely more of a fluid athlete but it’s possible Fuaga is more explosive. He’s got some pop. Feel like Fashanu would be a bigger version of Brick - who is a favorite of mine so that wouldn’t be bad.

Fuaga looks explosive when he gets a head of steam going because he is a big guy with a long strider, but IMO the twitchiness and flexibility is mediocre. 

[football guy]

2 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Former PFF guy Eric Eager has argued for a long time that teams should prioritize run blocking when building out the OL because the indomitable rushing attack is scheme- and conditions-proof and it enhances the play action pass attack. It’s very hard to line up and pass block against today’s defensive schemes and edge talent, so even the best pass blockers are nullified if they can’t run block. Maybe this is why we’re seeing Fashanu “fall” in the more credible mocks? 

I think there’s absolutely an argument to be made here, but I would say it’s case-by-case. Some teams who are more pass heavy or operate out of the gun more frequently need to prioritize pass blocking. But if you look at a team like the Lions, they basically followed this method to a tee by prioritizing their run blocking to feature a strong run game and generate explosive plays off play-action. I’m no Hackett/Carter truther by any means, nor would I dare compare their efforts to Ben Johnson’s, but the entire 2023 offense was designed with the intention of being able to run the ball to establish play-action. When you can’t run block, you can’t run the ball. When you can’t run the ball, you can’t establish play-action. It’s really that simple.

I think your right about why some experts may be souring on Fashanu, and it’s probably even deeper than that. Jeremiah noted that he’s a little worried about his tape from 2023 vs. 2022 and noticed that he struggled with balance, tightness, and play strength in 2023. He made a point to say that he speaks to GMs all the time and a bunch of them say they have 3-4 other tackles they like better right now. Will there be a team who has Fashanu rated highest still? Absolutely. Not much different than the 2020 draft. But when you consider what the Jets need most and what they’re lacking most, it doesn’t feel like Fashanu will be the guy they’re after. They want well rounded players who will bring an enforcers mentality and help significantly improve the run game because right now it collapsed 2 years in a row when AVT went down, and the offense they designed won’t work unless they are able to establish the run.

[Jetpain]

Where the Jets and Woody continue to disappoint me is that they invest high draft picks and big contracts in these young O lineman but then hire a bottom of the league offensive line coach to teach and develop them.  Why wouldnt Woody budget more money for this position coach and hire a top 10 O line coach?

[derp]

45 minutes ago, maury77 said:

Fuaga looks explosive when he gets a head of steam going because he is a big guy with a long strider, but IMO the twitchiness and flexibility is mediocre. 

Yeah I think the flexibility is what I associate with fluidity but I personally don’t think of flexibility as a part of explosiveness. Important for sure though. 

[Untouchable]

1 hour ago, maury77 said:

I'm going to watch more tape of Fashanu vs. Fuaga, but based upon what I've seen so far, choosing Fuaga over Fashanu is a mistake. Give me the more explosive athlete who played better competition. 

Plus give me the guy who is a natural LT with an extremely high ceiling over the dude who is a pure RT who many are projecting to RG in the pros.

I’m not just going to pigeonhole the Jets with a 1st round OL for the sake of doing so.

I also have a pretty good feeling that Douglas is going to want to reinforce the OL and find another weapon to compliment Garrett and Breece before the draft even rolls around in the first place.

The Jets had a 2-3 year window from the moment they made the Rodgers trade. They’d be stupid to suddenly become flaccid less than a year into this thing.

You have to go all out, sink or swim.

A dream (yet somewhat realistic) offseason has us solidifying the OL to a respectable level and adding something like a Davante Adams/Brock Bowers combo at the skill positions.

THAT’S how you signal that you’re serious

[JetsRay]

5 hours ago, Beerfish said:

I want the pass blocking tackle.  

Massive and powerful, sorry i want agile.  Becton was massive and powerful and can run block but he gets destroyed pass blocking.

Pass blocking is vastly more important than run blocking for your tackles, both of them.

Fuaga might be a good player but regardless, Douglas has to get this one right.

Not willing to put a tag on who that player should be that "Douglas has to get right?"

But I'm sure you'll be ready to pounce whoever that player is, and then should he fail...

So predictable! 🙄

[Beerfish]

2 hours ago, JetsRay said:

Not willing to put a tag on who that player should be that "Douglas has to get right?"

But I'm sure you'll be ready to pounce whoever that player is, and then should he fail...

So predictable! 🙄

He has to get the oline pick right.

He has utterly failed to build the oline.

I've given Douglas tons of credit for his good picks.

And should he fail?  You better bloody believe I will pounce because the object of the game is to draft well and build a winner.

In your world, Idzik, McCagnan were great gms, just some of the picks did not work out.

[Smashmouth]

5 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

If the argument is what their biggest need is right now, I am on board.  If you are deciding what to do in the draft based solely on that need, I say that is a fine way to have a sh*tty team.  The Giants needed offensive line in 2022.  They took Evan Neal.  Do you think they'd be better off starting some mid to low-tier FA T and drafting Wilson or Olave?  If there is someone sitting there that they like fine, but saying "Take the pass blocking LT!" sounds good until the guy gets to the NFL and can't pass block. 

Its based on how the Jets value the need and what's going to happen in FA that will determine the draft. If we land a WR and Guard in FA I can see the Jets wanting to move up and get the tackle of their choice not who falls. And yes that tackle has to be can't miss in their eyes not just a pick to fill that need. 

Now if the Jets land a LT and a WR in FA it gets interesting do you double down at WR or LT ? Do you trade out for more picks say G RT  ? I can see a double down on WR due to the WR they land may be an aging one , I'm not saying that's my choice but you have to look at every angle and the same goes for an Aging LT. Lots to think about here but  I agree if a guy drops to you in a position of need that does not mean you have to take him if another absolute stud at another position is also there.

[Smashmouth]

25 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

He has to get the oline pick right.

He has utterly failed to build the oline.

I've given Douglas tons of credit for his good picks.

And should he fail?  You better bloody believe I will pounce because the object of the game is to draft well and build a winner.

In your world, Idzik, McCagnan were grea gms, just some of the picks did not work out.

Douglas got dealt a sh*tty hand on the OL yes he took a few chances but the injuries that were sustained over the past 2 years were just ridiculous. What I looked at as mistakes was relying on Duane Brown and Mekai Becton. The season ending injuries too McGovern , And AVT were a big blow then their replacements never seemed healthy Like Mitchel who took a step backwards but he did not look like himself either. So adding that with the fact he lost his QB 4 plays in led to the second mistake of not immediately signing a back up QB other than that extremely important non move JD has built a good football team that can turn it around very quickly if he redeems himself this off season. I hope he learned his lesson. I think he can get this done and learn from it moving forward

[Sammybighead]

Fantastic news. There are at least 3 good tackles. We should end up with one unless we spectacularly F it up, jets style.

[Rangers9]

8 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

Would love this pick!

For those wondering Jeremiah's other Mock Draft 1.0's

21: Zach Wilson & Travis Etienne

22: Kayvon Thibodeaux & Trent McDuffie

23: Broderick Jones

Well if Jeremiah who posts lots of mock drafts predicted Zach at 21 it was a good prediction. Of course Etienne is a lot better.

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

10 hours ago, football guy said:

https://www.nfl.com/news/daniel-jeremiah-2024-nfl-mock-draft-1-0 

I believe Jeremiah is the first "expert" to slate Fuaga over Fashanu in a mock draft. It's going to happen more and more. Fuaga is very much like a Penei Sewell/Tristan Wirfs type prospect who will likely continue to rise up draft boards as the process unfolds. I think the Jets could very well have him rated higher as well because of what Fuaga brings to the table. While Fashanu may have more upside as a blind-side pass protector (think Ronnie Stanley), Fuaga is the type of player who can define your run game and has the kind of "enforcer" mentality this offensive line desperately lacks. 

In all, Jeremiah had 9(!) OL in round 1

 

I wanted Ronnie Stanley for the Jets that year.

So of course that didn’t happen.

IIRC the Tunsil gas mask thing happened and the Ravens pivoted to Ronnie.

[maury77]

Reflecting on Jeremiah's mock a little bit more, it is actually relieving to hear. While I prefer Olu to Fuaga, if other teams prefer Fuaga, it makes it more likely that Olu drops to the Jets. 

[Barton]

Who did Fuaga actually play against in college though? Anyone legit? 

[68JET11]

The real question will be on Draft day once all FA moves have been made, but if either of the big 3 OL, or WR fall at 10 which will be the case it will be interesting to see what GM Rodgers says is the pick.

Personally I go with OL because I think with an offseason and training camp working with Brownlee, and Irwin, Rodgers can and should be able to get in sync with both of them. See as his personal friend Lizard will still be on the team, I'd be taking OL as our 1st pick.

[maury77]

1 hour ago, Barton said:

Who did Fuaga actually play against in college though? Anyone legit? 

He played in the Pac 10, so he played some good pass rushers. There is tape of his game against Latu, the UCLA defensive end expected to go in the first round. 

[TheClashFan]

18 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Former PFF guy Eric Eager has argued for a long time that teams should prioritize run blocking when building out the OL because the indomitable rushing attack is scheme- and conditions-proof and it enhances the play action pass attack. It’s very hard to line up and pass block against today’s defensive schemes and edge talent, so even the best pass blockers are nullified if they can’t run block. Maybe this is why we’re seeing Fashanu “fall” in the more credible mocks? 

IIRC, when D'Brick came out, he was considered (and was in the NFL) as an elite pass protector but a rather so-so run blocker. The Jets later ended up leading the NFL in rushing, again IIRC, with him at LT.  Of course, it helped that the Jets also had a great running back to feature then, but they do now, too.

So, go for pass protecting at LT to protect the QB's blind spot, then maybe emphasize run blocking everywhere else?

 

[varjet]

9 minutes ago, TheClashFan said:

IIRC, when D'Brick came out, he was considered (and was in the NFL) as an elite pass protector but a rather so-so run blocker. The Jets later ended up leading the NFL in rushing, again IIRC, with him at LT.  Of course, it helped that the Jets also had a great running back to feature then, but they do now, too.

So, go for pass protecting at LT to protect the QB's blind spot, then maybe emphasize run blocking everywhere else?

 

We all loved Brick but when he came into the NFL, and started week 1 of his rookie season, he was a skinny 270 lb LT.  He ended up filling out to over 300 pounds and was a very good and dependable LT for over 10 years.  

The Jets can’t draft someone like that, because his rookie year will be 50-100% of the time he needs to protect AR8.

As we all know, it is hard to get impact WRs and Ts in FA.  They both cost money.   I think you are more likely to spend and get at good T than a WR (see Golladay, Lazard, etc.).  So maybe the answer here for JD is to see what he can sign in FA, and then fill in the draft.  That does put BPA out the window, but so be it.  

[football guy]

1 minute ago, TheClashFan said:

IIRC, when D'Brick came out, he was considered (and was in the NFL) as an elite pass protector but a rather so-so run blocker. The Jets later ended up leading the NFL in rushing, again IIRC, with him at LT.  Of course, it helped that the Jets also had a great running back to feature then, but they do now, too.

So, go for pass protecting at LT to protect the QB's blind spot, then maybe emphasize run blocking everywhere else?

 

This is true. But also consider how the Jets built out the rest of their OL… a bunch of ass-kickers. Brick took a few years before he reached his potential, and it really wasn’t until we beefed up the rest of the OL until we got to appreciate him. You can live with having a guy who isn’t a great run blocker if you have 4 other guys who are great at it. Our problem right now is that we have 1 good run blocker under contract in AVT. 

Here’s the debate I think the Jets will have. In Fuaga you have a guy who has the technique, strength, temperament, and tone-setting play style to be a good starting tackle right away, and despite being a clean pass protector his upside is in the run game/outside zone. He’s the type of player you can build your rushing attack around. He has the feet and hand quickness to play tackle, but may be better suited on the right side due to the lack of range that most teams look for in LTs. Very similar cases can be made for JC Latham. In Fashanu your getting a guy who possesses truly elite athletic traits but is more raw. His mechanics and strength profile aren’t there yet. He has the upside to be a Laremy Tunsil/Ronnie Stanley level player, but it’s not going to happen overnight… he very well may struggle for his first couple years as he works to become stronger and more refined.

So if your the Jets, do you grab the higher floor guy who will provide a boost in your run game immediately and operate as a (hopefully) reliable RT as you go for it over the next 1-3 years with Aaron Rodgers, or do you take the player who could take 2+ years before developing into an elite pass protecting LT? 

[JetsRay]

14 hours ago, Beerfish said:

He has to get the oline pick right.

He has utterly failed to build the oline.

I've given Douglas tons of credit for his good picks.

And should he fail?  You better bloody believe I will pounce because the object of the game is to draft well and build a winner.

In your world, Idzik, McCagnan were great gms, just some of the picks did not work out.

He has to get a lot of things right, and the team needs to win.

He has built an OL, but they've been ravaged with injuries. 

And yes, sometimes, players don't work out. Becton became soft after his injuries with a fragile ego, something he didn't display after his rookie year.

Don't pretend to think you know how I think "in my world," because you don't have a clue.

Like anybody else that loves to "pounce" and think they are expert GM's (on Monday morning), I gave you a chance to put those "expert" GM skills to work, and of course you ducked out.  Which I expected!

[peekskill68]

17 hours ago, maury77 said:

 

 

Fuaga seems like the more saavy blocker of the two. He makes a lot of good decisions regarding positioning himself and you don't see a lot of mistakes. On the other hand, he looks stiff and you don't see him frequently bending his knees to pop into his blocks and you see him bend at the waist a few times. I think because of his size and cerebral approach he's going to have a high floor but he just does't seem like a very good athlete IMO and I think he is going to have some leverage issues along as well as issues handling faster defensive ends. 

Fashanu is a little more raw than Fuaga and you see him overset and make an occasional mental error. That being said, he is a proverbial "dancing bear" with his size, lateral agility and the way he can drop and explode up into the defender. 

I suppose it is a matter of personal preference, but I'd take Fashanu over Fuaga and it is not a very difficult decision IMO. 

I'm not a college guy, but didn't Becton's tape paint a similar picture?  Superb athlete raw technique?

[Adoni Beast]

25 minutes ago, football guy said:

This is true. But also consider how the Jets built out the rest of their OL… a bunch of ass-kickers. Brick took a few years before he reached his potential, and it really wasn’t until we beefed up the rest of the OL until we got to appreciate him. You can live with having a guy who isn’t a great run blocker if you have 4 other guys who are great at it. Our problem right now is that we have 1 good run blocker under contract in AVT. 

Here’s the debate I think the Jets will have. In Fuaga you have a guy who has the technique, strength, temperament, and tone-setting play style to be a good starting tackle right away, and despite being a clean pass protector his upside is in the run game/outside zone. He’s the type of player you can build your rushing attack around. He has the feet and hand quickness to play tackle, but may be better suited on the right side due to the lack of range that most teams look for in LTs. Very similar cases can be made for JC Latham. In Fashanu your getting a guy who possesses truly elite athletic traits but is more raw. His mechanics and strength profile aren’t there yet. He has the upside to be a Laremy Tunsil/Ronnie Stanley level player, but it’s not going to happen overnight… he very well may struggle for his first couple years as he works to become stronger and more refined.

So if your the Jets, do you grab the higher floor guy who will provide a boost in your run game immediately and operate as a (hopefully) reliable RT as you go for it over the next 1-3 years with Aaron Rodgers, or do you take the player who could take 2+ years before developing into an elite pass protecting LT? 

I think the more prudent thing (since we are in a 2-3 year win-now window) would be to beef up LT via free agency and take Fuaga (if available) or another tackle and have them make a bigger impact from Day 1 at RT.

[football guy]

6 minutes ago, Adoni Beast said:

I think the more prudent thing (since we are in a 2-3 year win-now window) would be to beef up LT via free agency and take Fuaga (if available) or another tackle and have them make a bigger impact from Day 1 at RT.

I think the Jets will figure the same. A lot of it will come down who they’re able to get in FA, but when you factor in the desire to build their running game behind the right side of the line it seems clear that they’ll want to find a high upside run blocker for the RT spot and a veteran pass protector at LT (think Tyron Smith, David Bakhtiari, Cam Robinson, Charles Leno, DJ Humphries). Despite his poor play down the stretch, there’s always the possibility they bring back Becton cheap as a versatile LT/RT option as well… many personnel executives will convince themselves that Becton is going to only get better if he keeps the weight off now that he’s healthy.

[Adoni Beast]

4 minutes ago, football guy said:

I think the Jets will figure the same. A lot of it will come down who they’re able to get in FA, but when you factor in the desire to build their running game behind the right side of the line it seems clear that they’ll want to find a high upside run blocker for the RT spot and a veteran pass protector at LT (think Tyron Smith, David Bakhtiari, Cam Robinson, Charles Leno, DJ Humphries). Despite his poor play down the stretch, there’s always the possibility they bring back Becton cheap as a versatile LT/RT option as well… many personnel executives will convince themselves that Becton is going to only get better if he keeps the weight off now that he’s healthy.

If they can get Becton on the cheap I’m all for it as long as they also sign some depth.

In the event we draft RT in Round, let’s please cut Lake + move AVT BACK at LG.