All-time worst Jets draft pick?

[Sperm Edwards]

4 hours ago, Pointdexter said:

Ya, I think Drob angers me so much because we traded up to get him. Paid a hefty price. As if he was going to be some kind of savior or franchise difference maker?

Just a colossal mistake. At least Ghost only costed us one 1st rounder.

Depends on how one looks at it. This isn't a defense of trading up for Robertson, of course. Thing is, we could have traded down from #6 in '08 the same way we traded up to #4 in '03.

With the post-combine hype on Gholston still very much alive, there were 6 supposed "blue chip" prospects in that draft and the other 5 had come off the board. What we held had real trade value. Even after Gholston went off the board, with the (perceived) dropoff being significant after him, NE was still able to trade down from #7.

In that sense, plus given the ~$20m guaranteed he got under the old CBA, an unusable bust at #6 overall cost more than one 1st rounder. 

[AFJF]

13 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I think I hate the Gholston pick more because it happened under Mangini's watch, and Mangini was no dummy. He had to know Gholston was a flake.

He should've listened to Rex

[AFJF]

It's Gholston and it's not even close.  Dude was drafted to get to the QB and didn't do it one single time.  Not once.

[Jets1214]

5 hours ago, nycdan said:

My worst: 

Mike Nugent in the 2nd round

And just to make it a little bit worse, you may remember we traded down from 26 to the 2nd round with the Raiders for Doug F-ing Jolley.  Well here's what you may not remember.  OAK then traded from 26 up to 23 by tossing in a few later round picks.  I do not remember who they took at 23, but the next pick...Aaron Rodgers.  So...with great hindsight, we took Mike Nugent and Doug Jolley and some random late round guy over Aaron Rodgers. 

 

Few more honorable mentions:

Mike Haight in the 1st round (albeit it was perhaps the sh*ttiest draft class ever)

Dave Cadigan in the 1st round (if you really needed a Guard, Randall McDaniel went later)

If you recall, they drafted Cadigan to play LT.  We were dying for a LT and I wanted Gruber from Wisconsin but TB grabbed him at 4...and we took Cadigan at 8 to play LT.  So it was a double screw up...he was a "pumped up by steroids" player to begin with and then landed up at OG.

Haight was just idiotic.  Guy had a 4th round grade on him and also was drafted as a LT prospect...only to be moved to OG and never distinguish himself there either.  Our 2nd rounder that year, Doug Williams out of Texas A&M, was a borderline 1st round pick at RT...he didn't even make it our of training camp.  

[TuscanyTile2]

Maybe we need a "player x over player y" thread.  As in "which was worse - taking Kyle Brady over Sapp, O'Brien over Marino, etc"

[TuscanyTile2]

16 hours ago, JetFaninMI said:

Johnny "Lam" Jones

Blair Thomas

Jones ran track at University of Texas. He also joined the football team, where Coach Fred Akers nicknamed him "Lam" because he was from Lampasas to differentiate him from teammate Johnny "Ham" Jones, who was from Hamlin, Texas.

[nycdan]

On ‎4‎/‎2‎/‎2017 at 8:36 AM, Jets1214 said:

If you recall, they drafted Cadigan to play LT.  We were dying for a LT and I wanted Gruber from Wisconsin but TB grabbed him at 4...and we took Cadigan at 8 to play LT.  So it was a double screw up...he was a "pumped up by steroids" player to begin with and then landed up at OG.

Haight was just idiotic.  Guy had a 4th round grade on him and also was drafted as a LT prospect...only to be moved to OG and never distinguish himself there either.  Our 2nd rounder that year, Doug Williams out of Texas A&M, was a borderline 1st round pick at RT...he didn't even make it our of training camp.  

 

What I do recall is that was the midst of a run of vomit-inducing bad drafting.  Our first picks in each draft from 1986-1990:

Mike Haight, Roger Vick, Dave Cadigan, Jeff Lageman, Blair Thomas, followed by Browning Nagle in then 2nd (no 1st rounder)

 

Those clips of fans booing at the draft in NYC were well deserved.

[rangerous]

On 4/1/2017 at 5:10 PM, UnitedWhofans said:

I can't say Gholston because the Jets were trapped into picking him. They kind of had no choice.

This has to be a player that there was a reasonable alternative to pick

I thInk Kyle Brady is the worst Jets pick of all time. Major alternative was availible, plus it was way more publicized. 

Gholston doesn't really get mentioned among the all time greats essentially because that years first round was utter crap.

they weren't trapped.  they may have not been able to get out of the 5 spot but they could have drafted just about anyone taken after 5 with that pick and would've been ahead of the game.  gholston was just an epic bust.  people pick blair thomas or lam jones or dwayne johnson, etc but at least those guys did get into games and play pretty well at points.  gholston did absolutely nothing except take up a roster spot. and you're right about the other choices in gholston's draft year.  not much but still better.

[rangerous]

19 hours ago, nycdan said:

 

What I do recall is that was the mist of a run of vomit-inducing bad drafting.  Our first picks in each draft from 1986-1990:

Mike Haight, Roger Vick, Dave Cadigan, Jeff Lageman, Blair Thomas, followed by Browning Nagle in then 2nd (no 1st rounder)

 

Those clips of fans booing at the draft in NYC were well deserved.

give lageman some credit.  he played well for the jets and then jax.  he was overdrafted.  the other guys were complete waste products.

[rangerous]

On 4/2/2017 at 5:30 AM, Sperm Edwards said:

Depends on how one looks at it. This isn't a defense of trading up for Robertson, of course. Thing is, we could have traded down from #6 in '08 the same way we traded up to #4 in '03.

With the post-combine hype on Gholston still very much alive, there were 6 supposed "blue chip" prospects in that draft and the other 5 had come off the board. What we held had real trade value. Even after Gholston went off the board, with the (perceived) dropoff being significant after him, NE was still able to trade down from #7.

In that sense, plus given the ~$20m guaranteed he got under the old CBA, an unusable bust at #6 overall cost more than one 1st rounder. 

they at least got some playing time from robertson.  he was overdrafted, given his bad knees. gholston was just a complete bust.  he did absolutely nothing in 4 seasons.

[nycdan]

3 minutes ago, rangerous said:

they weren't trapped.  they may have not been able to get out of the 5 spot but they could have drafted just about anyone taken after 5 with that pick and would've been ahead of the game.  gholston was just an epic bust.  people pick blair thomas or lam jones or dwayne johnson, etc but at least those guys did get into games and play pretty well at points.  gholston did absolutely nothing except take up a roster spot. and you're right about the other choices in gholston's draft year.  not much but still better.

He was taken in the 6th spot in a draft where the consensus was there were 6 top-tier players.  The other 5 went before us so there really was no viable choice to make.  And looking back without hindsight, it was the reasonable pick.  Sure, there were some good players taken afterwards, and the pick turned out to be awful, but the Jets weren't necessarily wrong to take him there.  Sometimes guys look great in college and the combine and just suck in the pros.  The outcome was worse than picks like Haight or Cadigan, but those picks were worse in my opinion "at that time".

[Scott Dierking]

Lam Jones cost the Jets TWO first round picks.

[nycdan]

6 minutes ago, rangerous said:

give lageman some credit.  he played well for the jets and then jax.  he was overdrafted.  the other guys were complete waste products.

Fair enough.  And there wasn't much better to choose from at that point either.  But one productive player in five consecutive 1st round picks still has to stand as one of the worse stretches in any team's history.  Maybe Detroit, Cleveland or Oakland can put up something comparable but it was a dark time...

[Kleckineau]

Macc still has a chance to leave NY having made one of the worst 1st round picks for the NYJ if he takes Trubisky or Mahomes.

[rangerous]

Just now, nycdan said:

He was taken in the 6th spot in a draft where the consensus was there were 6 top-tier players.  The other 5 went before us so there really was no viable choice to make.  And looking back without hindsight, it was the reasonable pick.  Sure, there were some good players taken afterwards, and the pick turned out to be awful, but the Jets weren't necessarily wrong to take him there.  Sometimes guys look great in college and the combine and just suck in the pros.  The outcome was worse than picks like Haight or Cadigan, but those picks were worse in my opinion "at that time".

i get your point but there must have been a team or two that also liked gholston.  they could've traded up with the jets.  it didn't happen so maybe there were teams who knew what gholston truly was.  it's hard to tell what goes through the minds of some of these gm's.

[New York Mick]

Thomas and VG. I wouldn't put Robertson in the top ten. He at least played average. 

[FlagmanL11]

Hackenberg. Living in the present.  Quite the list of 1st and 2nd rd busts.  Keeping it in the 2010's. we have Hill, Ducasse, Hackenberg, Millner, Devin Smith all 100% non contributors. 

[Sperm Edwards]

1 hour ago, rangerous said:

they at least got some playing time from robertson.  he was overdrafted, given his bad knees. gholston was just a complete bust.  he did absolutely nothing in 4 seasons.

No doubt. Robertson was a bust for a 4th overall pick, and it was only made worse with the knowledge that (1) we traded up before the draft had even started -- before we knew the guy we wanted would even be there; and (2) we traded the #13 overall plus #22 overall plus another 4th rounder -- all in the current draft, not like this year's #1 and next year's #1, which would have less value today. BFD perhaps, but there were so many really good players taken that year that it magnified the error. Then to cap it all off, the crazy money awarded to a 4th overall pick back then was that of a veteran pro bowl FA in his prime. 

But to your point, there are relative busts (like Robertson), and then there are total - if not historically bad - busts. While a sore point with Jets fans, Robertson isn't even noteworthy in NFL draft lore. Gholston was historically bad.

[CanadaSteve]

Joe Namath....He set the bar too high right out of the gate, one that has been impossible to climb above in over 40 years.

 

 

[Jetsplayer21]

Dee Milner 

[kmnj]

ken obrien-fans me included cheered for marino-

Kyle Brady-we screamed our heads off at the dtac for sapp but....

Blair Thomas-still awaiting his arrival-we need to be patient as our gm has a plan

Gholston - still awaiting his arrival-we need to be patient as our gm has a plan

 

 

[Scott Dierking]

33 minutes ago, kmnj said:

ken obrien-fans me included cheered for marino-

Kyle Brady-we screamed our heads off at the dtac for sapp but....

Blair Thomas-still awaiting his arrival-we need to be patient as our gm has a plan

Gholston - still awaiting his arrival-we need to be patient as our gm has a plan

 

 

Thomas did have 2,000 yards as a Jet, and a 4.2 ypc average. 

That said, he did not fulfill potential. PSU overused him (as they did many backs at that time), and Thomas was tentative to the line.

[UnitedWhofans]

2 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

No doubt. Robertson was a bust for a 4th overall pick, and it was only made worse with the knowledge that (1) we traded up before the draft had even started -- before we knew the guy we wanted would even be there; and (2) we traded the #13 overall plus #22 overall plus another 4th rounder -- all in the current draft, not like this year's #1 and next year's #1, which would have less value today. BFD perhaps, but there were so many really good players taken that year that it magnified the error. Then to cap it all off, the crazy money awarded to a 4th overall pick back then was that of a veteran pro bowl FA in his prime. 

But to your point, there are relative busts (like Robertson), and then there are total - if not historically bad - busts. While a sore point with Jets fans, Robertson isn't even noteworthy in NFL draft lore. Gholston was historically bad.

But you have to admit, Sperm, that Gholston doesn't really get mentioned amongst the greatest busts in NFL history. He's kind of like an "Oh yeah" type of guy.

And I honestly believe that to be the case because the quality of that first round was bad.

[UnitedWhofans]

3 hours ago, rangerous said:

they weren't trapped.  they may have not been able to get out of the 5 spot but they could have drafted just about anyone taken after 5 with that pick and would've been ahead of the game.  gholston was just an epic bust.  people pick blair thomas or lam jones or dwayne johnson, etc but at least those guys did get into games and play pretty well at points.  gholston did absolutely nothing except take up a roster spot. and you're right about the other choices in gholston's draft year.  not much but still better.

WHo could they have drafted, looking at the draft, that would have been cheered at the time?

[jack48]

I gotta say Gholston.  He did nothing.  And he was what, a 6?

[JustInFudge]

I'll only do 1st rounders.

From a pure, bust stand point?  It's Gholston no questions asked. Dee Milliner being a close 2nd.  

From a WTF are you thinking, you took the wrong guy and everyone knows it other than the stupid Jets perspective?  This list is strong even though some of the players had decent careers:

Bryan Thomas > Ed Reed - especially considering the Jets needed a S and had J.Abe and Ellis already on the roster.

Kyle Brady > Warren Sapp - I mean, WTF?

Kenny O > Dan Marino - and I loved me some Kenny O.

Blair Thomas > Cortez Kennedy and Junior Seau, 2 HOF'ers selected directly after Blair.  And I mean, WTF, you drafted a dude named Bliar to play Football?

Quinton Coples > Chandler Jones - I wanted Coples fwiw.

Calvin Pryor > like 10 players.  

And both of last years 1st and 2nd could look really stupid in a few years.  

[jmat321]

Gholston, runners up Kyle Wilson and Rob Moore in the supplemental.

 

[Sperm Edwards]

36 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

But you have to admit, Sperm, that Gholston doesn't really get mentioned amongst the greatest busts in NFL history. He's kind of like an "Oh yeah" type of guy.

And I honestly believe that to be the case because the quality of that first round was bad.

I do not admit it. When loosely discussed, it's just that so many just mention QBs or those who made headlines more than the quiet Gholston.

He was one of the biggest busts in modern NFL history. It wasn't even because he was a troublemaker in the locker room, got himself thrown in jail, or had a drug problem. He just sucked that badly.

 

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/03/01/vernon-gholston-an-unprecedented-nfl-draft-bust/

The news this week that the Jets will cut defensive end Vernon Gholston has given us a couple of opportunities to examine just what a monumental draft bust Gholston was.

In fact, Gholston, taken sixth overall in 2008, may have been the biggest bust of any defensive end ever selected in the NFL draft.

According to Michael Salfino of the Wall Street Journal, Gholston is the only defensive end drafted in the top 10 to fail to record a single sack since the NFL started counting sacks in 1982.

Prior to Gholston, the least productive Top 10 defensive end the NFL had seen was Reggie Rogers, who was taken seventh overall by the Lions in 1987. Rogers recorded two sacks in two seasons before the Lions cut him after he killed three people while driving drunk.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2442694-the-worst-picks-in-nfl-draft-history#slide8 (granted it's bleacherreport, but the author went back 30+ yrs and had Gholston in his top 10)

You could make a strong case that Vernon Gholston has been the most famous bust in the recent history of the draft.

Or is that infamous?

The sixth overall selection by the New York Jets in 2008, the former Ohio State Buckeye failed to terrorize NFL quarterbacks like he did college offenses. He played in a total of 45 games for head coaches Eric Mangini and Rex Ryan and recorded zero sacks.

Released by the club after three seasons, Gholston latched on with the Chicago Bears in 2011 and attempted to impress another defensive-oriented head coach in Lovie Smith. But the disappointing defender failed to make the team, and after brief dalliances with a couple more squads, thus ended an NFL career that accumulated more question marks than tackles.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/photos/biggest-draft-busts-ever

6. Vernon Gholston - New York Jets

Vernon Gholston came out of The Ohio State University as a feared pass rusher. The Jets selected him sixth overall in 2008 NFL Draft, yet Gholston never recorded a sack while in the league.

http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/gallery/biggest-nfl-draft-busts-in-history-ryan-leaf-andre-ware-jamarcus-russell-joey-harrington-040715

Vernon Gholston (No. 6 overall, Jets, 2008)

Gholston was the epitome of a player who ascended at the NFL Scouting Combine and fell flat on his face in the NFL. Teams were impressed with his measurables, his speed, his reps, you name it, but none of it ever translated to the football field. He had 21.5 sacks while at Ohio State, fifth-most in school history. In three seasons with the Jets, he had none. He only started five games, period. He tried to latch on with the Bears, Rams and Redskins, but to no avail.

 

http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/gallery/nfl-draft-busts-football-worst-picks-022411

Vernon Gholston, DE, Jets

Gholston was drafted sixth overall in the 2008 NFL Draft, and lasted with the club for four seasons. He was a workout warrior, who flashed at the combine and even repped 225 pounds 37 times. All the measurrables aside, Gholston couldn’t make an impact on the field and never recorded a sack with the Jets.

 

http://www.nfl.com/photoessays/09000d5d828717ce

4. Vernon Gholston, 2008, sixth overall

The Jets tried to get Gholston to play good football. Gholston himself reached out to Hall of Famer Lawrence Taylor to improve. No effect, as in, he never recorded a single sack. That's like bringing Iceman in to help you fly, and you can't even get the engine turned over. The sixth overall pick in the 2008 draft who had a reputation as a "workout warrior" never even breached the hallowed ground of 30 career tackles.

https://www.si.com/nfl/photos/2014/05/08/biggest-draft-busts-modern-era

Vernon Gholston, DE — 2008 1st round (6th overall)

In his last two seasons at Ohio State, Gholston averaged just over 11 sacks a season. A step up to the NFL didn't really suit him, though: he failed to record a single sack for the Jets, becoming the only defensive end drafted in the top 10 to do so since the league began counting them in 1982.

 

http://www.espn.com/blog/statsinfo/post/_/id/108850/top-10-nfl-draft-busts-of-the-last-10-years

2008: Vernon Gholston, No. 6 pick by New York Jets

In three seasons with the Jets, Gholston started five games. He recorded a total of 25 tackles and did not have a sack. Over those three seasons, 638 players recorded at least one sack. Among the 665 defensive players to take at least 500 snaps over that span, four players had fewer tackles than Gholston, and they each played in 20 or fewer games, whereas Gholston played in 45. Gholston was released by the Jets before the 2011 season and has not played since.

http://www.thenfldraftinsider.com/biggest-nfl-busts-since-2000/

Vernon Gholston, 1.6 in 2008, taken by New York Jets: Vernon Gholston is the only player to make the list who was drafted outside of the top 5, but he had the least productive career of anyone. Gholston was an EDGE prospect out of Ohio State, who lasted just three seasons in the league. Despite playing 14 or more games in each season, he only recorded 5 career starts, and made almost no impact when he played. His final career stats? 3 seasons, 45 games played, 5 starts, 16 solo tackles, 18 assisted tackles, 0 sacks. He was cut after his third season and never made another team despite chances with Chicago and St. Louis in the following years.

---------------

And there's a lot more than that. Plenty of people have him on their all-time biggest busts list despite him being taken outside the top 5, not being a QB, never getting arrested or causing any trouble, or even saying one word that anyone can recall.

[Fantasy Island]

Mark Sanchez.  He didn't have a credible OC.  He didn't have a HC that gave two craps about the offense.  He was more interested in being a celebrity than winning.  We made the AFC title game twice despite him.

[UnitedWhofans]

19 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I do not admit it. When loosely discussed, it's just that so many just mention QBs or those who made headlines more than the quiet Gholston.

He was one of the biggest busts in modern NFL history. It wasn't even because he was a troublemaker in the locker room, got himself thrown in jail, or had a drug problem. He just sucked that badly.

And there's a lot more than that. Plenty of people have him on their all-time biggest busts list despite him being taken outside the top 5, not being a QB, never getting arrested or causing any trouble, or even saying one word that anyone can recall.

Which is what I was implying. General conversation.

Which is why I went with Brady. Because that is more recognizable to the general public than Gholston. That clip of them picking him and booing fans is THE image of Jets at the draft experience.

Gholston was a complete bust to be sure, but I put him behind Brady because fans were not booing the Gholston pick at the time. And there seems to be no HOF that the Jets snubbed for Gholston. IN terms of just plain production, Gholston is the worst. But being an all time NFL draft bust, to me, should include more than that.

[kelly]

 

[kelly]

1 hour ago, jack48 said:

I gotta say Gholston.  He did nothing.  And he was what, a 6?

 

[rangerous]

1 hour ago, UnitedWhofans said:

WHo could they have drafted, looking at the draft, that would have been cheered at the time?

i don't know.  my point is that there must have been signs that gholston wasn't the player they thought they were drafting.  you are right that there were slim pickings in the first round. they could've gone with flacco, or aqib talib, or ryan clady, or rodgers-cromartie, or mckelvin, or even mayo.  they would've overpaid for any of those guys but most have had pretty good careers and even achieved all star status.

[hokiejetfan92]

Tim Tebow

[Sperm Edwards]

57 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Which is what I was implying. General conversation.

Which is why I went with Brady. Because that is more recognizable to the general public than Gholston. That clip of them picking him and booing fans is THE image of Jets at the draft experience.

Gholston was a complete bust to be sure, but I put him behind Brady because fans were not booing the Gholston pick at the time. And there seems to be no HOF that the Jets snubbed for Gholston. IN terms of just plain production, Gholston is the worst. But being an all time NFL draft bust, to me, should include more than that.

Meh. That's just because of that video montage that espn or nfl.com put together. Don't kid yourself, also, that it's probably mostly Jets fans that have watched that over & over; no one else cares.

Brady was nowhere near the bust Gholston was. The team even used the Transition tag on him when his rookie contract was over. Had Jacksonville not bid so much for him, he'd have been a Jet for a while longer, and was a legit NFL starter into his mid-30s. Even if it was "only" as a blocker, he was at least elite at something on the field. Gholston was elite at nothing, from the moment he was drafted.