Eli Manning to Retire on Friday

[Biggs]

If you make the argument that Eli shouldn't go in Namath should be removed.  The two runs he had were absolutely great. When you play great on the big stage and win a SB that's the absolute zenith of NFL football.  That's the goal of every player before the season starts.

He had two incredible runs where he lifted his game against the best.  HOF player.

[nyjunc]

7 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

His best games those seasons were not the Super Bowls. He was phenomenal in two road NFC championship games.

I have been on the fence with whether or not Eli is a Hall of Fame quarterback but I am now in the Yes category.  He played a long time, put up some big numbers, and shined brightly during the most clutch situations. Winning one Super Bowl is something that we all hope we get to see our Jets do at some point. Eli won 2 and was the MVP of both games. He delivered when the chips were down and belongs in the Hall of Fame.  Only two quarterbacks have more Super Bowl MVP awards, Joe Montana and Tom Brady. 

In the GB championship game the D forced a TO to set them up for the game winning FG.  In the SF championship game he led his O to 10 points total in the second half and OT, both scoring drives began deep in SF territory including the game winning drive.

 

His best game by far (and the only high scoring game he led) was at GB in the 2011 divisional round.

[nyjunc]

1 minute ago, Biggs said:

If you make the argument that Eli shouldn't go in Namath should be removed. 

Many people know I think Joe is overrated but Here's the difference btw the two.  Joe was actually great for a while, Eli never was great and Joe meant so much towards the growth of the popularity of pro football.  

Joe led the league in multiple major categories (completions, yards, TDs), Eli never led any besides leading in interceptions 3 times.  Joe was on all pro teams in 5 seasons, Eli never made a single all pro team.  Joe was a 2 time AFL player of the year and was first team all decade.

 

Again, I feel Joe's career was overrated mainly due to durability but he belongs in the hall while Eli does not.

[Ohio State NY Jets fan]

I wonder if Garret talked about starting him... 

It will be interesting if Eli takes a front office job, figure Peyton is hiring head coaches so why not...

my guess is he disappears and enjoys the quiet life...

[Biggs]

21 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

Many people know I think Joe is overrated but Here's the difference btw the two.  Joe was actually great for a while, Eli never was great and Joe meant so much towards the growth of the popularity of pro football.  

Joe led the league in multiple major categories (completions, yards, TDs), Eli never led any besides leading in interceptions 3 times.  Joe was on all pro teams in 5 seasons, Eli never made a single all pro team.  Joe was a 2 time AFL player of the year and was first team all decade.

 

Again, I feel Joe's career was overrated mainly due to durability but he belongs in the hall while Eli does not.

He was great but in an 10 team league he was arguably the 4th best QB in that league.  He was a great talent, he was an iconic figure.  He deserves to be in the HOF based on two things, the contract he signed and the guarantee.   In 1968 there were 4 teams with winning records in the AFL.  In the Jets division there were no teams with a winning record except the Jets.  

Joe's playoff stats read like a backup QB.  Eli went on two 3 game runs where he actually lifted his game above everyone.  He outplayed Rodgers and he outplayed Brady twice.  

In the SF game he was beaten like a drum.  He took hit after hit and never turned the ball over.  When the Giants got in position he put them right in the end zone.  He played really well against a great D.  They didn't get to him and when they made a mistake game over.  That happens to be how you play the position.  Situations matter.

Joe was great to watch.  Beautiful passer and unbelievably exciting.  He belongs in the HOF but he never was great on a comparative level against his peers with one exception.  Even though he turned the ball over and didn't complete a lot of passes, he drove the ball down the field on a ridiculously small completion percentage.  

Eli wasn't great on a comparative level either.  He just happen to do it twice in 3 game runs against his peers when it mattered the most. 

Joe on the eye test was absolutely incredible.  On the stat page not a HOF player.  Eli won the hardware.  It counts big.  Back when Joe won nobody really thought the Jets wouldn't win a SB ever again.  Winning SB is really hard.  

[Matt39]

41 minutes ago, Biggs said:

If you make the argument that Eli shouldn't go in Namath should be removed.  The two runs he had were absolutely great. When you play great on the big stage and win a SB that's the absolute zenith of NFL football.  That's the goal of every player before the season starts.

He had two incredible runs where he lifted his game against the best.  HOF player.

Aikman is in. Eli gets in. Moon is also in.

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

I'll let all the Eli fans on this board enjoy the moment.  I have the rest of time to show why he doesn't belong in the Hall.

Right up until he gets in the first year his name comes up if circumstances are right

[Biggs]

5 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Aikman is in. Eli gets in. Moon is also in.

That's the other side of this.  The HOF has been watered down to the Hall of very good.  There are plenty of less than great players who are in the HOF.  Eli had an amazing career.  There have been a handful of teams that have won lots of SB.  Most teams sniff it once or twice in 25 years.  Winning two SB is a huge achievement.

I was lucky.  When I was a young teenager the Mets, Jets and Knicks all won Championships.  I thought that was normal.  I'm 65 now and I know that's not normal.  It's extremely rare and should be cherished.

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, The Crusher said:

Thank you. 

 

Kraken are on the loose? 

[nyjunc]

28 minutes ago, Biggs said:

He was great but in an 10 team league he was arguably the 4th best QB in that league.  He was a great talent, he was an iconic figure.  He deserves to be in the HOF based on two things, the contract he signed and the guarantee.   In 1968 there were 4 teams with winning records in the AFL.  In the Jets division there were no teams with a winning record except the Jets.  

Joe's playoff stats read like a backup QB.  Eli went on two 3 game runs where he actually lifted his game above everyone.  He outplayed Rodgers and he outplayed Brady twice.  

In the SF game he was beaten like a drum.  He took hit after hit and never turned the ball over.  When the Giants got in position he put them right in the end zone.  He played really well against a great D.  They didn't get to him and when they made a mistake game over.  That happens to be how you play the position.  Situations matter.

Joe was great to watch.  Beautiful passer and unbelievably exciting.  He belongs in the HOF but he never was great on a comparative level against his peers with one exception.  Even though he turned the ball over and didn't complete a lot of passes, he drove the ball down the field on a ridiculously small completion percentage.  

Eli wasn't great on a comparative level either.  He just happen to do it twice in 3 game runs against his peers when it mattered the most. 

Joe on the eye test was absolutely incredible.  On the stat page not a HOF player.  Eli won the hardware.  It counts big.  Back when Joe won nobody really thought the Jets wouldn't win a SB ever again.  Winning SB is really hard.  

In that SF game he was fortunate not to turn it over, two times he threw the ball up for grabs where SF DBs collided breaking up would be INTs.  On the same field a week earlier that same D allowed 32 points.

I also think Joe made it as much for his impact of the game as his play on the field.  Eli doesn't have that to add to his resume.

[nyjunc]

15 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Aikman is in. Eli gets in. Moon is also in.

Aikman made an all pro team, aikman led the league in comp %, aikman led a dynasty.

 

Moon led in completions, yards and TDs, was an offensive player of the year and 3x all pro.

 

Eli wasn't anywhere near as good as those two.

[nyjunc]

13 minutes ago, Biggs said:

That's the other side of this.  The HOF has been watered down to the Hall of very good.  There are plenty of less than great players who are in the HOF.  Eli had an amazing career.  There have been a handful of teams that have won lots of SB.  Most teams sniff it once or twice in 25 years.  Winning two SB is a huge achievement.

I was lucky.  When I was a young teenager the Mets, Jets and Knicks all won Championships.  I thought that was normal.  I'm 65 now and I know that's not normal.  It's extremely rare and should be cherished.

He's a modern day Jim Plunkett, if Jim isn't in Eli shouldn't be in (and neither deserve to be in)

[nyjunc]

14 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Right up until he gets in the first year his name comes up if circumstances are right

There is a better chance we win the next 5 super bowls than Eli getting in his first chance.  If he ever gets in (a big if) it will be way down the road.  Just look at the guys that needed the centennial class to get in and look at the ones who didn't make it, all have a much better case than Eli as all were at least great for a period of time, Eli was never great.

[Apache 51]

On 1/23/2020 at 9:16 AM, nyjunc said:

Aikman made an all pro team, aikman led the league in comp %, aikman led a dynasty.

 

Moon led in completions, yards and TDs, was an offensive player of the year and 3x all pro.

 

Eli wasn't anywhere near as good as those two.

True. However, he is going in, 7-11 vs. the Eagles btw?

[Matt39]

8 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

Aikman made an all pro team, aikman led the league in comp %, aikman led a dynasty.

 

Moon led in completions, yards and TDs, was an offensive player of the year and 3x all pro.

 

Eli wasn't anywhere near as good as those two.

Aikman played on an all star team, barely had to throw, and rode the wave. Steve Beurlein would come in and the show continued to roll. He was never an all-pro either. There is a zero percent chance Eli doesn’t get in. 

[Biggs]

12 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

In that SF game he was fortunate not to turn it over, two times he threw the ball up for grabs where SF DBs collided breaking up would be INTs.  On the same field a week earlier that same D allowed 32 points.

I also think Joe made it as much for his impact of the game as his play on the field.  Eli doesn't have that to add to his resume.

He didn't turn it over.  He was pounded constantly and never put the ball on the turf.  Good fortune and bad fortune impact every big close game in the NFL.  Guys drop INT's, guys on the O fight off defenders for the ball, balls are tipped.  It's an amazingly stupid argument even for you.

How are you Junc.  Long time.  Happy New year!

[southparkcpa]

1 hour ago, Biggs said:

If you make the argument that Eli shouldn't go in Namath should be removed.  The two runs he had were absolutely great. When you play great on the big stage and win a SB that's the absolute zenith of NFL football.  That's the goal of every player before the season starts.

He had two incredible runs where he lifted his game against the best.  HOF player.

Add to that he played in his brothers shadow, won as many SB's as Peyton, Ben,  on teams less talented.  He showed up everyday 100 percent as a pro. Compared to the bullshlt we trotted out as QB's since 2004.  

[section314]

Let's keep this pretty simple. You can rag on Eli for whatever you think is pertinent, but I long for the day when the putrid team we root for holds a press conference to announce the retirement of, and honor the career of, a QB that we drafted that won two Super Bowls, and was MVP in both. 

[Dcat]

I just don't understand the ripping of Eli Manning.  Great career.  I only wish the jets had a franchise QB during the last 20 years to take us to a couple of Championships.  No, instead we get a dog named Sanchez whose sucktitude and bindness on the field screwed us.  So from this Jets fan, at least, congrats to Eli on a terrific career!

[Biggs]

32 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

He's a modern day Jim Plunkett, if Jim isn't in Eli shouldn't be in (and neither deserve to be in)

I would have no problem with Plunkett going into the HOF.  I don't agree he's career was anything like Eli's but he did have two SB runs and that's worthy of consideration.  He was SB MVP only once.  Marcus Allen won it the second time he won as a starting QB.

Plunkett was left for dead, got off the bench and played great.  I have a ton of respect for Plunkett.  Most guys would have washed out after what he was put through. 

 

[32green]

Appreciate his work against the Pats*. 

Tough as nails. 

Love that he arranged to have beer delivered to him after every away game. 

Appreciate that he never changed his demeanor no matter how people sh*t on him or mocked him. 

I know someone who interacts with him and his family (and alot of other famous folks) and they had the highest praise for him and his character..not so much for the other famous folks.

The SB's mean something, however average he could seem at times so...HOF? Yep. 

Congrats. 

 

[Philc1]

People are actually arguing Eli isn’t a hall of famer?

[Philc1]

2 hours ago, Dcat said:

I just don't understand the ripping of Eli Manning.  Great career.  I only wish the jets had a franchise QB during the last 20 years to take us to a couple of Championships.  No, instead we get a dog named Sanchez whose sucktitude and bindness on the field screwed us.  So from this Jets fan, at least, congrats to Eli on a terrific career!

He’s no Baker Mayfield 

[bealeb319]

i.e. at least ONE Super Bowl Win?
Where do I sign?

Hell I'd be happy with a couple playoff appearances.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using JetNation.com mobile app

[southparkcpa]

1 hour ago, Philc1 said:

People are actually arguing Eli isn’t a hall of famer?

I say he is a HOFer.....  but if you google it, many writers etc... say he is borderline.   We''ll know in 5 years or so....

[peekskill68]

These Eli vs. Namath type comparisons grow old.  It keeps going back to the same basic metric: on field statistics.  I think it's generational. People now are wired to think about numbers and statistics because it's easier to grasp.  What Namath did literally changed the product we watch today.  It was historically significant. He's in the HOF as much for that as he is for wagging his finger in Miami that afternoon... 

[nycdan]

Eli will be a hotly debated candidate.  There are solid arguments on both sides.  Either the hall wants to continue its trend of letting in players who were good, played a long time, and had a few defining moments, or they want to tighten things up and really only reward players who dominated for the better part of a decade or more.  Eli was the former, not the latter.  He was never as good as at least 5 guys who played during his entire or most of his career (Brees, Brady, Ben, Rodgers and more recently Wilson).  You could argue he was Rivers with a better team and 2 SB rings to show for it.  Rivers has more yards, more TDs, less INTs and a much higher completion %.  But Manning did come up big in the 2 big games (although not really so much in the 2nd SB) so there's that.  It's just not clear cut to me. 

And it really gets down to the essence of what the HoF is and wants to be.  Does admitting Eli lessen the meaning of the gold jacket for guys like Montana, Elway and even Peyton?  That's a worthy debate.  But I will still always cherish his two wins and so if he does get in, I won't begrudge him.

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

7 hours ago, Biggs said:

If you make the argument that Eli shouldn't go in Namath should be removed.

[Jet_Engine1]

22 hours ago, Warfish said:

(Not caring in any way, good or bad, about the NY Giants is such a wonderful feeling.)

In before Jets Fans get all worked about if he's a HOF'er or not (hint:  He will be.)

Everything about this post is correct and accurate. 

[SAR I]

16 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

His best games those seasons were not the Super Bowls. He was phenomenal in two road NFC championship games.

I have been on the fence with whether or not Eli is a Hall of Fame quarterback but I am now in the Yes category.  He played a long time, put up some big numbers, and shined brightly during the most clutch situations. Winning one Super Bowl is something that we all hope we get to see our Jets do at some point. Eli won 2 and was the MVP of both games. He delivered when the chips were down and belongs in the Hall of Fame.  Only two quarterbacks have more Super Bowl MVP awards, Joe Montana and Tom Brady. 

I agree, and I respect the lad, truly.

But he played during the heyday of the following quarterbacks and Eli isn't even Top 5:

Peyton Manning
Tom Brady
Drew Brees
Brett Favre
Aaron Rodgers
Ben Roethlisberger
Tony Romo
Eli Manning

Do you see all of those QB's going into the Hall Of Fame?  Doesn't the line need to be drawn somewhere?

SAR I

[jetstream23]

1 hour ago, SAR I said:

I agree, and I respect the lad, truly.

But he played during the heyday of the following quarterbacks and Eli isn't even Top 5:

Peyton Manning
Tom Brady
Drew Brees
Brett Favre
Aaron Rodgers
Ben Roethlisberger
Tony Romo
Eli Manning

Do you see all of those QB's going into the Hall Of Fame?  Doesn't the line need to be drawn somewhere?

SAR I

Most of those guys are HOF's.  Romo isn't.

It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Stats.  As much as I dislike the Giants you can't tell the story of the NFL over the past 15 years without having Eli Manning play a pretty important part of it.  It would certainly be an easier argument if Eli won a League MVP or made more Pro Bowls.  I don't think he should get in on the first ballot and maybe he needs to wait awhile, but I think he deserves a bust in the HOF.

This is the list of Super Bowl MVPs who have won it 2 or more times.  There's only 5 men in the history of the NFL.

[Biggs]

3 hours ago, peekskill68 said:

These Eli vs. Namath type comparisons grow old.  It keeps going back to the same basic metric: on field statistics.  I think it's generational. People now are wired to think about numbers and statistics because it's easier to grasp.  What Namath did literally changed the product we watch today.  It was historically significant. He's in the HOF as much for that as he is for wagging his finger in Miami that afternoon... 

Sonny Jurgensen did what Namath was doing in 1961 only better.  People think 4,000 yards wow.  In 1961 Sonny threw for 3723 with 32 TD's and averaged 8.9 yards per attempt.  His Y/C was 15.8.  

Jurgensen and Unitas were the pioneers.  Namath radically changed football marketing and star power. 

Don't get me wrong, I loved him.  Favorite player by a mile.  It's just not true that he was the one who revolutionized the game.  

There was a progression from Otto Graham to Unitas Jurgensen and Namath.  Namath was the face of the AFL.  His signing and actual flamboyant performance accelerated the change.  

Your right field metrics were completely different but Namath wasn't the only QB driving the ball down the field.

Without the SB win I'm not sure Namath sniffs the HOF.  

[slimjasi]

40 minutes ago, Biggs said:

 

Without the SB win I'm not sure Namath sniffs the HOF.  

Tbh, without SB III, I don't see how he comes close

[slimjasi]

10 hours ago, Biggs said:

That's the other side of this.  The HOF has been watered down to the Hall of very good.  There are plenty of less than great players who are in the HOF.  Eli had an amazing career.  There have been a handful of teams that have won lots of SB.  Most teams sniff it once or twice in 25 years.  Winning two SB is a huge achievement.

I was lucky.  When I was a young teenager the Mets, Jets and Knicks all won Championships.  I thought that was normal.  I'm 65 now and I know that's not normal.  It's extremely rare and should be cherished.

This is a good point. 

Even if you are someone (like me) who wants only great/dominant players to get into the HOF, the fact of the matter is that there are plenty of compiler/"good player for a long time" types who have already gotten in. 

 

[Barry McCockinner]