2022 NY Jets WRs snap count review

[Bronx]

 

 

[Hex]

Jets need better WRs past Wilson. Getting a better OC might help that room but they need roster improvement anyways.

[FactsOnly]

Absolute dogsh*t offensive scheme

[Beerfish]

I still have hopes for Moore, I can't believe he would drop off from the promise he showed early on.  Mims is done, davis is done, berrios is done though .

[bla bla bla]

Wilson

Moore

Mims

 

I think if you can get Carr then I'd make a play for Lazard or Hopkins

[Hex]

We are starting to need another JD fleecing, we haven't had one in a while now

Go for a WR

[Bronx]

Melijah Moore and Mims wanted out of the team as well. 

[Ghost420]

7 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

Wilson

Moore

Mims

 

I think if you can get Carr then I'd make a play for Lazard or Hopkins

Mims lmao

[JiFtheOracle]

So hard to put anything on this WR core w/ the QB play on this team.  Obviously we know G. Wilson is a dude, but do we really know anything about Moore and Mims playing in this offense?  Davis is a must cut.  Totally unreliable, good for 1 or 2 back breaking gaff's a game and he's a very nice saving for that new QB and/or a new deal for Q. Will.

[Viermoo]

You could Randy Moss, Calvin Johnson and Jerry Rice on this team and their numbers would be trash because of one common factor. Can anyone guess?


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[Dunnie]

Draft another stud ?

[Dunnie]

2 minutes ago, Viermoo said:

You could Randy Moss, Calvin Johnson and Jerry Rice on this team and their numbers would be trash because of one common factor. Can anyone guess?


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

Mike LaFleur ?

[bla bla bla]

23 minutes ago, Ghost420 said:

Mims lmao

What's wrong with Mims as WR 3 or 4 in a contract year

[JetsMetsRangers]

1 hour ago, bla bla bla said:

What's wrong with Mims as WR 3 or 4 in a contract year

Maybe use the kid who is 6'4" in the Red Zone as he highpoints the ball instead of Berrios.......Again misuse of the personal imo.......Not one fade that i can remember down there with Mims but have seen Berrios line up on the outside on occasion.....Makes no sense......

[varjet]

A year ago we thought this WR group was one of the best in the NFL and the backbone of a "win now team."

Who thinks that now, especially considering that Corey Davis' money now needs to pay the QB?  Its another mess that needs to be rebuilt.  

[JTJet]

1 hour ago, bla bla bla said:

What's wrong with Mims as WR 3 or 4 in a contract year

Let. It. Go. 

The Mims thing is dead. 

[GreenFish]

The WR group is fine. Use the draft resources on other units (ie OL and DL). Restructure player contracts to make room for Carr. Then go out and win games.

Corey Davis can be upgraded but if we go FA, it’ll cost us.

[Sperm Edwards]

12 hours ago, Beerfish said:

I still have hopes for Moore, I can't believe he would drop off from the promise he showed early on.  Mims is done, davis is done, berrios is done though .

Agree across the board:

• I might give Mims a 5% chance of being what we'd once hoped rather than 0%, but those are still bad odds. He's cheap so he can at least stick through the end of August to see if he responds to a new offensive staff & QB. I wouldn't rely upon him; more like found money if the light suddenly goes on. 
• Davis is - or should be - gone at his $. The team can't rely upon someone who's so often a question-mark for leaving early or not playing at all. Fine if he was a WR5, but not as 1/3 of the starting trio. Better to have someone with a little less upside but is reliable in his role; who shows up every week instead of foiling a lot of the week's gameplan by leaving in the 1st Q / 1st half, or the season's gameplan by missing most or all of so many games outright. 
• Berrios is just too expensive for what he brings. Douglas should've extended him months earlier when his pricetag was closer to $2MM instead of buying at the player's all-time high. I'd be ok bringing him back, if the new OC feels he fits, but at the $2MM level at which he belongs.

I'm not writing off Moore just because he wasn't very productive with bad QBs throwing behind an oft-shaky OL, and an unready coaching staff from the non-disciplinarian HC overseeing this WR (who seemingly needs the opposite), an OC who had obvious flaws, and a WRC who had no business being a full position coach yet.

He's not the unique type talent that Garrett Wilson clearly is, but that doesn't mean he isn't a starter with playmaking ability. He's still as young as a rookie (he turns just 23 in March ffs); he's talented; he's very cheap; and he's entering year 3 when a lot of famous WRs take a big leap forward (Moore had more yards & TDs as a rookie than Austin, his WRC with the Jets, had in his first 3 1/4 seasons combined). 

[derp]

Moore being literally 80th of 80 WR’s in targets per route run is telling and explains why, in addition to his good rookie year, it’s probably early to give up on him. It’d be encouraging if the new OC has had success with slot receivers.

[bla bla bla]

1 hour ago, JTJet said:

Let. It. Go. 

The Mims thing is dead. 

Wilson, Moore, DHop/Lazard, Mims, UDFA slot, & a gunner - I'm 100% good with this WR room.

[Sperm Edwards]

2 hours ago, derp said:

Moore being literally 80th of 80 WR’s in targets per route run is telling and explains why, in addition to his good rookie year, it’s probably early to give up on him. It’d be encouraging if the new OC has had success with slot receivers.

No doubt. Then again if I was out there running routes, at my age no less, I'd have been 81st out of 81 because - no matter how many routes I ran - I couldn't get open against the league's worst corner. Or if I did it'd be sparse and/or if the corner slipped on wet turf or something.

A more to-the-point person would just offer up the idea that maybe that means he wasn't getting open. 

[derp]

12 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

No doubt. Then again if I was out there running routes, at my age no less, I'd have been 81st out of 81 because - no matter how many routes I ran - I couldn't get open against the league's worst corner. Or if I did it'd be sparse and/or if the corner slipped on wet turf or something.

A more to-the-point person would just offer up the idea that maybe that means he wasn't getting open. 

Which is possible, absolutely, but I think metrics showed he was above average at separating early in the year. And anecdotally he snapped off some nice routes when targeted.

Attitude, loafing, all that stuff is problematic but also he’s a guy you’d want to engage and utilize. Partially on him to be sure, partially OC, partially QB play - and I’m sure everyone has their own breakdown of what’s responsible but it’s clearly multi-factorial.

Ultimately I think a thoughtful discussion could be had regarding what should be done if he becomes productive, but I think he’s probably - like a lot of WR’s - somebody who gets engaged and more productive when he’s utilized and you see things start to multiply a little if they start getting him the ball some. I get not wanting to reward the immaturity and to an extent hopefully he grows up but the low usage becomes a cut off your nose to spite your face thing a little.

[rangerous]

i still think moore has some value and needs to get his head back in the game.  i'm not sure what his beef is because flacco and zwilson both threw to him.  maybe not to the same degree as gwilson but it should have been enough.  he should be a 70 receptions per year type guy. i also thinks this falls on the milfy.  milfy calls the plays and there is a reason why the first option is the first option and the second the second and so on down the line.  the qb's may have been told to throw it to gwilson.  of course gwilson was pretty reliable and it just about made sense to throw it his way no matter the coverage.

but there were other ways to use moore like on reverses where he has the speed to make good things happen.  instead milfy sort of kept him out of the game.

[#27TheDominator]

Just now, rangerous said:

i still think moore has some value and needs to get his head back in the game.  i'm not sure what his beef is because flacco and zwilson both threw to him.  maybe not to the same degree as gwilson but it should have been enough.  he should be a 70 receptions per year type guy. i also thinks this falls on the milfy.  milfy calls the plays and there is a reason why the first option is the first option and the second the second and so on down the line.  the qb's may have been told to throw it to gwilson.  of course gwilson was pretty reliable and it just about made sense to throw it his way no matter the coverage.

but there were other ways to use moore like on reverses where he has the speed to make good things happen.  instead milfy sort of kept him out of the game.

That is false.  Elijah Moore was targeted 65 times.  My unscientific count says that only 23 of those were from Zach Wilson even though Wilson started half the games that Moore played and 4 of his 9 starts.  I am pretty sure LaFleur did not change the playcalling to don't throw to Elijah.  Remember that comes on the heels of 2021 where Moore had a huge uptick in performance when Zach got hurt. 

[Sperm Edwards]

4 hours ago, derp said:

Which is possible, absolutely, but I think metrics showed he was above average at separating early in the year. And anecdotally he snapped off some nice routes when targeted.

Attitude, loafing, all that stuff is problematic but also he’s a guy you’d want to engage and utilize. Partially on him to be sure, partially OC, partially QB play - and I’m sure everyone has their own breakdown of what’s responsible but it’s clearly multi-factorial.

Ultimately I think a thoughtful discussion could be had regarding what should be done if he becomes productive, but I think he’s probably - like a lot of WR’s - somebody who gets engaged and more productive when he’s utilized and you see things start to multiply a little if they start getting him the ball some. I get not wanting to reward the immaturity and to an extent hopefully he grows up but the low usage becomes a cut off your nose to spite your face thing a little.

Yeah I'm on board with your last paragraph. Blah blah blah about rewarding bad - or just immature/selfish - behavior. Goody, so we'll be right to punish one of two WRs on the team who's both worth a damn and also doesn't miss half the season, and lose more games than we win again. But we'll be right -- we'll definitely have that going for us. So we'll lose the right way. 

He doesn't even turn 23 for another couple months ffs. He's got 2 more really cheap years under contract. If they don't want to give him a giant extension, ok fine I can get behind that if they feel the $ will mean choosing between him & GW. So both this year and next year, draft someone else in rounds 3-6 to groom behind him, who won't be needed as a full-time starter until 2025, to play behind our younger duo (assuming nothing from Mims) plus another veteran. Figuring that veteran can be in the Marvin Jones mold (or maybe what he was a year or two ago), just to have a tall starter on the field who doesn't miss half the season, but who isn't needed to take over games or even average 50 ypg on the season. With Moore, GW and continued better production from the TE position, and a couple different RBs who are decent receivers out of the backfield, that really should be ample for a veteran QB who knows how to play the position competently. It also lets the new offensive staff get a good, long look another good look at Moore while not betting the season on relying upon him too heavily nor burying him too deeply by Wilson and another bigger name.

He also may just need to play inside more. He's definitely got wheels: yeah it was only at a pro day, since there was no combine, but even with the time being unofficial no one runs a 4.32 and isn't really fast. The thing is NFL corners are fast, too, and so far Moore doesn't look like he plays at nearly that speed. Like he doesn't seem to have the unique burst, or what seems to be an insignificant, subtle 6th sense move that gets CBs to lean just enough the wrong way to create separation because it seems like the receiver's about to make a not-subtle change in what ends up being the wrong direction; that thing that gives him the effect of being 2-3 more tenths of a second faster than his timed speed.

[TuscanyTile2]

10 hours ago, Bronx said:

Melijah Moore and Mims wanted out of the team as well. 

Brilliant!

[BP]

18 hours ago, FactsOnly said:

Absolute dogsh*t offensive scheme

It was too loud in the room 2021, it needed to be quieted down in 2022. That strategy actually worked. 

[derp]

18 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Yeah I'm on board with your last paragraph. Blah blah blah about rewarding bad - or just immature/selfish - behavior. Goody, so we'll be right to punish one of two WRs on the team who's both worth a damn and also doesn't miss half the season, and lose more games than we win again. But we'll be right -- we'll definitely have that going for us. So we'll lose the right way. 

He doesn't even turn 23 for another couple months ffs. He's got 2 more really cheap years under contract. If they don't want to give him a giant extension, ok fine I can get behind that if they feel the $ will mean choosing between him & GW. So both this year and next year, draft someone else in rounds 3-6 to groom behind him, who won't be needed as a full-time starter until 2025, to play behind our younger duo (assuming nothing from Mims) plus another veteran. Figuring that veteran can be in the Marvin Jones mold (or maybe what he was a year or two ago), just to have a tall starter on the field who doesn't miss half the season, but who isn't needed to take over games or even average 50 ypg on the season. With Moore, GW and continued better production from the TE position, and a couple different RBs who are decent receivers out of the backfield, that really should be ample for a veteran QB who knows how to play the position competently. It also lets the new offensive staff get a good, long look another good look at Moore while not betting the season on relying upon him too heavily nor burying him too deeply by Wilson and another bigger name.

He also may just need to play inside more. He's definitely got wheels: yeah it was only at a pro day, since there was no combine, but even with the time being unofficial no one runs a 4.32 and isn't really fast. The thing is NFL corners are fast, too, and so far Moore doesn't look like he plays at nearly that speed. Like he doesn't seem to have the unique burst, or what seems to be an insignificant, subtle 6th sense move that gets CBs to lean just enough the wrong way to create separation because it seems like the receiver's about to make a not-subtle change in what ends up being the wrong direction; that thing that gives him the effect of being 2-3 more tenths of a second faster than his timed speed.

Yeah I’m with you on overall roster construction.

I do think he’s roughly that fast with the obvious caveat that Pro Day times are a little faster than combine. The thing is he’s short, light, and has short arms so none of his other traits lead the speed to play up in a way that means he has to be a half step faster than the DB because he’s not winning with size or positioning down the field when the DB can make any play on the ball. He’s space fast though, I think the best example is when he beat the DB’s angle on the long TD against Miami last year. This offense just doesn’t create space too often so we don’t get to see it.

[rangerous]

5 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

That is false.  Elijah Moore was targeted 65 times.  My unscientific count says that only 23 of those were from Zach Wilson even though Wilson started half the games that Moore played and 4 of his 9 starts.  I am pretty sure LaFleur did not change the playcalling to don't throw to Elijah.  Remember that comes on the heels of 2021 where Moore had a huge uptick in performance when Zach got hurt. 

Uh, zwilson only played about 9 games and Moore missed a couple of them so 23 out 63 is pretty close to the right percentage.  And if he was thrown to only 63 times then that means he wasn’t being targeted by anyone. I don’t think milfy used him properly. He sure didn’t seem that motivated.

[#27TheDominator]

4 hours ago, rangerous said:

Uh, zwilson only played about 9 games and Moore missed a couple of them so 23 out 63 is pretty close to the right percentage.  And if he was thrown to only 63 times then that means he wasn’t being targeted by anyone. I don’t think milfy used him properly. He sure didn’t seem that motivated.

Check your math.  Moore was averaging 7 targets a game under Flacco.  As I said, Wilson started half the games Moore played and had a bit over 1/3 the targets.

[rangerous]

7 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Check your math.  Moore was averaging 7 targets a game under Flacco.  As I said, Wilson started half the games Moore played and had a bit over 1/3 the targets.

my math is fine.  1/3 is still pretty close to 1/2. and just how many additional targets would moore need to get to 50%?  maybe 5 or 6? and what about those fake end around plays where moore comes in motion behind the qb?  i don't recall a single one.  the whole purpose of moore going in motion is to see how the defense shifts.  if the throws aren't going to moore, why would the defense shift?

[Sonny Werblin]

Moore had some hard lessons this season. I expect a return to his rookie promise next season. Mims will be #4.

The new OC and position coach need to get Moore to run forward after the catch and get Mims to stop body catching. 

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, rangerous said:

my math is fine.  1/3 is still pretty close to 1/2. and just how many additional targets would moore need to get to 50%?  maybe 5 or 6? and what about those fake end around plays where moore comes in motion behind the qb?  i don't recall a single one.  the whole purpose of moore going in motion is to see how the defense shifts.  if the throws aren't going to moore, why would the defense shift?

The kid literally demanded a trade because Wilson wasn't throwing him the ball.  If you want to tell yourself he was, that does not make it so.   It would take another 10 targets to get to 50% and that would be close to 50% of the times Wilson targeted him.  

I have no idea what your point is about the motion.  The defense would shift because they still have to ******* cover the guy.  Schottenheimer used to do it with Tony Richardson and the defense still had to shift one way or the other.  If they moved for Tony Richardson they are going to leave Elijah Moore alone?  You're saying they didn't do that?  There is actually a "doghouse" highlight video of Moore that is just him running around in motion for two weeks.

[32EBoozer]

On 1/17/2023 at 12:40 AM, bla bla bla said:

Wilson

Moore

Mims

 

I think if you can get Carr then I'd make a play for Lazard or Hopkins

Rodgers & Lazard package deal! Two holes with 1 trade and Aaron's go-to guy. Make it happen JD ?

[sackdance]

On 1/17/2023 at 12:26 AM, Beerfish said:

I still have hopes for Moore, I can't believe he would drop off from the promise he showed early on.  Mims is done, davis is done, berrios is done though .

He not only quit before the rest of the team did, he quit when we were peaking.