In theory there should be a market for Sheldon Richardson..

[Bugg]

6 minutes ago, sourceworx said:

Great. So we lose by 14 points every game instead of 24. 

We have nothing on offense. A safety is a waste. He can be Ronnie Lott, Ed Reed, and Sean Taylor all wrapped into one. Still a waste.

Agree 100%. You can scheme defense, and supposedly the HC is a really good defensive coach (stifle laughter here). Yes, the defense was rough. But the rules mean that every defense, even the very best, is gonna fail several times each game. And no small part of the defense sucking was a 3 and out offense. Simply this offense is from hunger. I'm cool with a QB, or a RB, or a LT or WR if that guy is gonna start on Day 1. This franchise over the last decade and a half  has spent oodles of draft picks on defense with a minimal change for the better. Really only guy they have drafted that's worth a damn on the D side is Williams. The inability to sustain drives and score points is again going to kill thEm if it isn't addressed ASAP.

[Augustiniak]

2 minutes ago, Bugg said:

Agree 100%. You can scheme defense, and supposedly the HC is a really good defensive coach (stifle laughter here). Yes, the defense was rough. But the rules mean that every defense, even the very best, is gonna fail several times each game. And no small part of the defense sucking was a 3 and out offense. Simply this offense is from hunger. I'm cool with a QB, or a RB, or a LT or WR if that guy is gonna start on Day 1. This franchise over the last decade and a half  has spent oodles of draft picks on defense with a minimal change for the better. Really only guy they have drafted that's worth a damn on the D side is Williams. The inability to sustain drives and score points is again going to kill thEm if it isn't addressed ASAP.

to this end, why do the jets have to have the absolute worst TEs in the league?  why not get a real TE like howard who would also be an asset in the run game.  add real weapons for hack or whomever they get next draft.  

[Raideraholic]

33 minutes ago, AFJF said:

19 teams have $13 million or more in cap space.

15 teams have $16 million or more in cap space.

Again teams need money for draft, and undrafted fa's( top ones go to who gives the most cash).     Also teams like to have five million in reserve- injury insurance if they lose a player.   ( refresh those numbers and you see what I'm talking about). 

Teams can't blow all there cap money without planning for their own future players they want to re-sign,.   Case in points , you think it's going to be cheap for the Cowboys to keep that offense line together.   They can take on s Richardson contract , and think about signing him long term without that having an effect on their ability to keep their offense line together.

Only way a team can have continued success is through the draft- can't keep everyone, and you need some cheap contracts.

 

[AFJF]

7 minutes ago, Raideraholic said:

Again teams need money for draft, and undrafted fa's( top ones go to who gives the most cash).     Also teams like to have five million in reserve- injury insurance if they lose a player.   ( refresh those numbers and you see what I'm talking about). 

Teams can't blow all there cap money without planning for their own future players they want to re-sign,.   Case in points , you think it's going to be cheap for the Cowboys to keep that offense line together.   They can take on s Richardson contract , and think about signing him long term without that having an effect on their ability to keep their offense line together.

Only way a team can have continued success is through the draft- can't keep everyone, and you need some cheap contracts.

 

Oh, they do?  Draft picks get paid as well?  I had no idea.

Is there any way for a team to create cap space by re-working somebody's deal to free up around $3 million?

[AFJF]

9 minutes ago, Raideraholic said:

Again teams need money for draft, and undrafted fa's( top ones go to who gives the most cash).     Also teams like to have five million in reserve- injury insurance if they lose a player.   ( refresh those numbers and you see what I'm talking about). 

Teams can't blow all there cap money without planning for their own future players they want to re-sign,.   Case in points , you think it's going to be cheap for the Cowboys to keep that offense line together.   They can take on s Richardson contract , and think about signing him long term without that having an effect on their ability to keep their offense line together.

Only way a team can have continued success is through the draft- can't keep everyone, and you need some cheap contracts.

 

Okay, 11 teams have $20 million in cap space.  Is that enough to fit Sheldon's $8 million hit?

[RoadFan]

The most this turd will bring is a 4th.

And for those without foresight expecting a 3rd round compensatory pick, you still still take the 4th for the following reasons.

Sheldumb will only draw a 3rd IF the following two things occur;

1) He stays out of trouble for a full year.

2) Some GM is stupid enough to sign him to a large contract.

Hence, the reward is nowhere near the risk...especially for a Jets team that is going nowhere this season, with or without Sheldumb.

[AFJF]

Just now, RoadFan said:

The most this turd will bring is a 4th.

And for those without foresight expecting a 3rd round compensatory pick, you still still take the 4th for the following reasons.

Sheldumb will only draw a 3rd IF the following two things occur;

1) He stays out of trouble for a full year.

2) Some GM is stupid enough to sign him to a large contract.

Hence, the reward is nowhere near the risk...especially for a Jets team that is going nowhere this season, with or without Sheldumb.

What if the Jets sign a few big name free agents with their $70ish million in cap space and that cancels out Sheldon's comp status?  He leaves and they get nada.

[RoadFan]

Just now, AFJF said:

What if the Jets sign a few big name free agents with their $70ish million in cap space and that cancels out Sheldon's comp status?  He leaves and they get nada.

Great point.

[SickJetFan]

45 minutes ago, Raideraholic said:

Kc can't even sign their drafted picks they make this week, and they are going to find 8 plus million , and give up picks for Sheldon Richardson.

Raiders for a one year rental are only giving up a fifth rounder.  The Raiders re-sign him they get a third rounder in 2018.( never see that third rounder as theywill never Give him a longterm deal.

The Jets have to do what's in their best interest- take the best offer they can get.

Any team that needs cap space can find it.  Especially those teams where their window of opportunity for superbowl is closing.  They can restructure, cut, or whatever and they will.  If they have to pay for that an extra year so be it wont matter when their core team is gone anyway.

[AFJF]

5 minutes ago, SickJetFan said:

Any team that needs cap space can find it.  Especially those teams where their window of opportunity for superbowl is closing.  They can restructure, cut, or whatever and they will.  If they have to pay for that an extra year so be it wont matter when their core team is gone anyway.

This

[varjet]

1 hour ago, sourceworx said:

If they take Hooker or Adams, I'm going to be foaming at the mouth. Just what we don't need, another injury-prone DB.

At 6, you take players at premier positions. That's QB, WR, LT, or pass rusher. Maybe a CB or RB if they're truly a special player. Taking a safety there is pissing away a top draft pick. Complete waste. I don't give a f*ck how good they looked in college. It does NOTHING for this team.

I don't think you can rule out certain of these positions as not worthy of 6.  A very high impact risk free TE or S is worthy of 6.

I think Hooker has too many question marks.    Adams or Howard, maybe.  

[thebuzzardman]

1 hour ago, NoBowles said:

Sheldon should throw in a nice bag of weed for his new team to sweeten the deal.

 

 

Is there a points system for that like there is with the # of the draft pick? Like if it's high quality, high THC content from a dispensary, say a medical Vortex or Sour Diesel, the bag has more value to the new club than a good indoor grown White Widow that isn't tested etc? Does it matter if the new club is more a Sativa fan vs Indica, not unlike running a 4-3 or 3-4? 

 

[peebag]

2 hours ago, section314 said:

There's always a market. it's just whether it makes sense.

sure but I blame the rookie salary cap - this dude's looking for a payday and teams can get a player for cheap for what 4-5 years and w/o the off field issues.

[section314]

Just now, peebag said:

sure but I blame the rookie salary cap - this dude's looking for a payday and teams can get a player for cheap for what 4-5 years and w/o the off field issues.

That is exactly my point. There is a market for everything, but you have to be realistic that you may not get anywhere near value for your asset. Unless you get a 3rd, keep him , and either resign him or let him walk. If he walks, worst you get is a 4th, maybe a 3rd. 

[The Crusher]

1 hour ago, NoBowles said:

Sheldon should throw in a nice bag of weed for his new team to sweeten the deal.

 

 

and a "Ho's across America secret decoder ring."

[Raideraholic]

1 hour ago, AFJF said:

Okay, 11 teams have $20 million in cap space.  Is that enough to fit Sheldon's $8 million hit?

Raiders are one of such teams that have that much salary cap.    Do they really?   Right after the draft they will be signing Derek Carr and Gabe Jackson to contract extensions. Those two will eat up most of their cap.   ( r

Again haven't studied all the teams salary situation, and whose coming down the pike for them they might want to re-sign. Just showing that cap space could be misleading.  

[Butterfield]

I think he could be moved as part of a package.  Maybe Jets #6 and Sheldon to the Browns for #12, #33 and a 4th or something.  That would be equivalent of a mid 3rd.

[bitonti]

it's actually a really weak defensive tackle/3-4DE end draft too 

there's only 7 legit DL in my top 100 this year, usually it's like 10 or 12 easy 

 

that being said Sheldon's value is killed by his 2 suspensions. the next one is a year.

He might be worth a 4th at best and at that point in the draft, what Sheldon will bring this year (fighting for FA) could be worth more.  

[rangerous]

3 hours ago, Beerfish said:

I think we all agree that we are not getting super value if we trade him but looking at teams rosters and the draft there should be teams that have interest.  Too bad he has had the suspension issues. 

Teams like Washington and Dallas that figure they are close need help on he dline, some teams are switching  to 3-4 from 4-3's.  This draft has a fair number of edge rushers but it looks much thinner as far as all around Dline goes and 3-4 DE types. 

imo, it isn't a theory.  shelly has shown he can be an impact player it's just a matter of how much a team wants to pay for a one year rental or how much they think they want to sign him to a longer deal.  shelly probably has stars in his eyes and wants wilk money.  any team that signs him should be from missouri.  show me.

[SenorGato]

He's a healthy, prime aged, and above average DT on his rookie deal. Of course there will be a market for him.

[Lil Woody]

If you were an owner and a GM came to you saying, "I want to trade for a DT with 2 suspensions already in the books, immaturity issues, criminal level stupidity, and hasn't produced due to scheme problems, and oh yeah btw he is going to cost us 8 mill against the cap this year and also wants to be paid at the top of the market.", how long would you wait to fire him?  

[Hael]

Jaimie Collins was traded for a late 3rd round pick last year on the last year of a rookie contract.  Now consider this:

His contract was cheaper, he doesn't carry looming suspension issues, he had a superbowl ring,  he doesn't have character/iq issues both on/off the field, and he wasn't coming off a terrible year production wise.  He is also arguably a better player relative to his position (Richardson isn't a top 5 DT in the league)

So you can extrapolate that we would probably net at best a 4th round pick from a Richardson trade. 

Now, that's pretty good.  I'd be thrilled with a 4th.  However I suspect that teams would be very wary to trade for that type of risk, so it might carry all sorts of conditional clauses...

I think the best we can do is to not trade him, rehabilitate his image this year, and hopefully we get a 3rd comp pick the following year if someone is crazy enough to pay him a big contract as a free agent.

[Lil Woody]

5 minutes ago, Hael said:

I think the best we can do is to not trade him, rehabilitate his image this year, and hopefully we get a 3rd comp pick the following year if someone is crazy enough to pay him a big contract as a free agent.

All great points, until I got here.  I get the logic, and it makes a lot of sense if we were competitive and were not logjammed at the position. But we are trying to build for the future here. Who do you want to push aside to help this loser rehabilitate his image and get his stats up to help him get that big 2nd contract?  Do you demote Mo for the year? Do you Take away reps from both Mo and Leo? Do you switch to a 4-3 and play Leo at DE? Do you let our idiot HC keep playing Sheldon at OLB?

And then the other thing to consider. Do you want this malcontent idiot in your lockerroom again? We are trying to go younger and build towards something. What benefit to the bigger picture does this guy serve?

Is all that worth maybe getting a 3rd round comp pick? Or 4th?

I'd say no. But I get the other side of the argument too. I just want to get rid of all the bad investment guys that don't have a place here in the future, or serve any short term  purpose in bridging the gap.

Sheldon, both Safeties, ASJ, Forte...trade or cut them all.  Forte and ASJ I get not cutting because it gives no benefit by doing so, but just drop them way down the depth chart then. Time to clean house. If that means a fire sale on malcontents and only getting a 5th...so be it.  I'm holding out hope that the Cowboys will give us their 3rd or 4th for him though, Hopefully Macc can pull off a bluff with this busted hand.

[jeremy2020]

There is a market...it's just that the market is a 5th round pick

[win4ever]

There is no point in trading him for a 5th round pick.  Who is going to be there in the 5th?  Talented, malcontent idiots that fell because of character concerns?  Or borderline NFL players that won't move the meter one way or another?  It's rare to find good players in the 5th, let alone very good ones.  It does no good to just trade him away.  If he leaves after the year, grab the compensation pick and live with it.  

Let's assume he gets a decent contract, so a end of Round 3 pick.  How is this worse than losing a year of Richardson (whom with an injury to either Williams or Wilkerson becomes integral) and only getting a 5th worth it?  Second, the team is rebuilding and if it has no plans on being good this year, the compensation pick is pretty big.  You want players that you can pick as high as possible instead of just throwing them out to cure the locker room.  

If someone offers a second or something, by all means jump on it.  But there is no reason to just let him as a malcontent, because there are a ton of idiots on every team.  I'd rather risk the suspension than give him away because that's just giving in to the worst case scenario anyway.  

[Bugg]

14 hours ago, Lil Woody said:

If you were an owner and a GM came to you saying, "I want to trade for a DT with 2 suspensions already in the books, immaturity issues, criminal level stupidity, and hasn't produced due to scheme problems, and oh yeah btw he is going to cost us 8 mill against the cap this year and also wants to be paid at the top of the market.", how long would you wait to fire him?  

If you think Jerry Jones' son freaked the eff out when he tried to draft Manziel, how would they react to taking on $8 million of Sheldumb? Jones himself would probably laugh at the Jets. 

[Lil Woody]

4 minutes ago, Bugg said:

If you think Jerry Jones' son freaked the eff out when he tried to draft Manziel, how would they react to taking on $8 million of Sheldumb? Jones himself would probably laugh at the Jets. 

Yeah. But if there is a sucker to be had....Jerruh seems like the best target imo.

[section314]

4 minutes ago, Bugg said:

If you think Jerry Jones' son freaked the eff out when he tried to draft Manziel, how would they react to taking on $8 million of Sheldumb? Jones himself would probably laugh at the Jets. 

They drafted that burnout Gregory. Sheldon is ten times the better player.

[SickJetFan]

10 minutes ago, Bugg said:

If you think Jerry Jones' son freaked the eff out when he tried to draft Manziel, how would they react to taking on $8 million of Sheldumb? Jones himself would probably laugh at the Jets. 

i think if any team tho SR would get them that extra they needed to win superbowl 8 million doesnt mean anything