****OFFICIAL JETS V EAGLES MINSHOWDOWN THREAD****

[Mogglez]

15 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Herein lies the problem: Saleh should be looking for his QB of the future and White—all of 26 years old—has shown, at least, some promise, but he’s not going to be given a chance to compete because Wilson was the second overall pick. Clearly, the team likes White, they responded to him, and they looked like a legitimate offense until they ran into a pissed off Bills team, after which Saleh buried him. Maybe Mike White would end up sucking ass long-term, but not giving him a chance to compete is chickensh*t.

They see him in practice 6 out of the 7 days of the week, when they’re not playing other teams on Sunday.  He didn’t have a particularly great camp or pre-season either.  The Cincinnati game was more likely than not an anomaly.  Yes, draft position plays into it, but why wouldn’t it?  Mike played in three games starts and turned the ball over almost as much as Zach, despite having time to sit on the bench and develop for multiple years.  One good game doesn’t erase a bad camp, pre-season, practices, and the Bills game.  Broncos/Tebow fans did the same thing with him after he lit up the Steelers in the playoffs. If White consistently played and practiced like the guy who lit up the Bengals, he wouldn’t have been benched for Flacco, I can promise you that.

[Jetsfan80]

18 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Disagree - I Would take the two extra wins over the difference in point differential between the two teams

i also wouldn’t really characterize today as a “blowout loss” 

 

 

 

I wouldn’t, and not just for the improved draft position.  

And it’s not just about body of work to this point, it’s what I expect going forward.  This won’t be the last win for Detroit this year, whereas I could easily see us losing our final 5.  They’re set up to finish strong while we head in the wrong direction.

The Lions are the better, more competitive team overall.  Spouting on about a win over the lousy Texans and 2 other victories that seem like a long time ago doesn’t change that.

[CSNY]

12 minutes ago, Jolot said:

Bryce Hall said something similar apparently, that they did not prepare for Minshew . 

Please spare me that BS. They haven’t Stopped a screen pass this season no matter who was the QB. This defense has been atrocious for the past 8 weeks last week not withstanding. Don’t blame it on not knowing or preparing for Minshew makes the team look weak. Just man up dammit 

[T0mShane]

1 minute ago, Mogglez said:

If White consistently played and practiced like the guy who lit up the Bengals, he wouldn’t have been benched for Flacco

If this is the case—that playing time was strictly merit-based— then Flacco would be starting over Zach Wilson. 

[RevisIsland610]

56 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

I can't remember a time when the Jets were this helpless on defense. I challenge anyone to find a game where the Jets allowed the Eagles (or any team) to score on every SINGLE drive. 

This is the worst Jet defense I have ever seen and could be quite possibly the worst defense the NFL has ever seen. The really sad thing is we have a former DC who is now the HC. 

[Jolot]

1 minute ago, CSNY said:

Please spare me that BS. They haven’t Stopped a screen pass this season no matter who was the QB. This defense has been atrocious for the past 8 weeks last week not withstanding. Don’t blame it on not knowing or preparing for Minshew makes the team look weak. Just man up dammit 

Not preparing for Minshew is a shot at Saleh not Minshew ..try and keep up . 

[Grandy]

Wilson didn't have a great game, but the bottom line is that he improved in many areas. That's what I care the most about. More consistency is essential down the line, but the building blocks are there.

 

[Jetsfan80]

10 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

We only got 2 receptions and 15 yards (but one TD) out of the TE position today. If you’re going to go with a short to medium pass offense which most teams are using you need more production from tight ends. 

Says a lot about White that he could throw for 400+ and win without a TE then, eh?  ?

[Mogglez]

Just now, T0mShane said:

If this is the case—that playing time was strictly merit-based— then Flacco would be starting over Zach Wilson. 

I admitted that draft position played into it though.  Who are you more likely to give a chance to develop when the stats are almost even?  The guy who is 26, bounced around the league, has mediocre physical traits, didn’t look good all summer or in practice, or the 21 year old kid with a far better arm and physical talent, who you are heavily invested in, and out plays the other in practice? 

[Barton]

The defense lost the game today. Wilson wasnt great but he was better than last week. 

[jgb]

9 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I wouldn’t, and not just for the improved draft position.  

And it’s not just about body of work to this point, it’s what I expect going forward.  This won’t be the last win for Detroit this year, whereas I could easily see us losing our final 5.  They’re set up to finish strong while we head in the wrong direction.

The Lions are the better, more competitive team overall.  Spouting on about a win over the lousy Texans and 2 other victories that seem like a long time ago doesn’t change that.

Minshew plays well against us -- "Jets D sucks. No credit for you!"

Wilson plays uhhh... well enough to no lose (?) against Houston -- "?"

[K_O_Brien]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

If this is the case—that playing time was strictly merit-based— then Flacco would be starting over Zach Wilson. 

Playing time is merit-based when you're picking between vets. You have years worth of tape to evaluate one over the other. 

When you're looking to develop your rookie, they generally start. Even if they end looking like Trevor Lawrence does, today. 

[FidelioJet]

5 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

If this is the case—that playing time was strictly merit-based— then Flacco would be starting over Zach Wilson. 

It's very strange that you watched that game and came away thinking Mike White should be playing.

Zach play very well today - massive progress from what we've seen....Impressive performance.

Yes, he missed two or three throws, but OMG, the deep bias you have is no longer disputable.

ZW was not the reason this team lost today and not even close to it.

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

I admitted that draft position played into it though.  Who are you more likely to give a chance to develop when the stats are almost even?  The guy who is 26, bounced around the league, has mediocre physical traits, didn’t look good all summer or in practice, or the 21 year old kid with a far better arm and physical talent, who you are heavily invested in, and out plays the other in practice? 

I’d use one to push the other and see who shakes out. I wouldn’t use the 52 other guys on the roster as a multi-year incubator for one kid from Utah who may or may not be a good QB some day. 

[jgb]

Just now, FidelioJet said:

It's very strange that you watched that game and came away thinking Mike White should be playing.

Zach play very well today - massive progress from what we've seen....Impressive performance.

Yes, he missed two or three throws, but OMG, the deep bias you have is no longer disputable.

ZW was not the reason this team lost today and not even close to it.

While I greatly respect and acknowledge the position of my friend, the gentleman from Bridgeport, I do disagree with Tom. Zach needs every possible rep from here on out. Every. Single. One. I do not care even if it is true that Flacco, or White, or running the wishbone with Coleman as QB gives us the best chance to win. Zach needs the reps and we need to assess him with as much data as possible.

Sink or swim.

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Yes, he missed two or three throws

Come on, man.

[Jetsfan80]

6 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

I admitted that draft position played into it though.  Who are you more likely to give a chance to develop when the stats are almost even?  The guy who is 26, bounced around the league, has mediocre physical traits, didn’t look good all summer or in practice, or the 21 year old kid with a far better arm and physical talent, who you are heavily invested in, and out plays the other in practice? 

“Almost even”, lol.

And none of the above still explains why Flacco got the start over White.

White is 10 years younger and might be on the roster next year.  Starting Flacco made no sense. 

[Mogglez]

1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

I’d use one to push the other and see who shakes out. I wouldn’t use the 52 other guys on the roster as a multi-year incubator for one kid from Utah who may or may not be a good QB some day. 

Mike had a chance to climb the depth chart.  He struggled putting away James Morgan.

[jgb]

3 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I’d use one to push the other and see who shakes out. I wouldn’t use the 52 other guys on the roster as a multi-year incubator for one kid from Utah who may or may not be a good QB some day. 

The die is cast for this season. The best I believe we can reasonably hope for is that JD is rousted long enough by a bout of sleep apnea during the FA period to bring in a Trubisky or Tyrod or trade for a dude like Minshew to provide said push in camp next off season and to be that hot breath on Zach's neck in the beginning of the season.

[T0mShane]

Just now, jgb said:

While I greatly respect and acknowledge the position of my friend, the gentleman from Bridgeport, I do disagree with Tom. Zach needs every possible rep from here on out. Every. Single. One. I do not care even if it is true that Flacco, or White, or running the wishbone with Coleman as QB gives us the best chance to win. Zach needs the reps and we need to assess him with as much data as possible.

Sink or swim.

At this point, they don’t have a choice and, at the very least, Zach finally tread water today. My issue is with fans who feel like giving Mike White a chance to compete with Wilson for reps is ludicrous because something something. 

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Mike had a chance to climb the depth chart.  He struggled putting away James Morgan.

Zach Wilson was consecrated as the starting quarterback of the 2021 New York Jets at his freaking pro day, homie.

[maury77]

1 hour ago, Spoot-Face said:

Robert Saleh wants to kill a man, and I'm all for it.

[Mogglez]

6 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

“Almost even”, lol.

And none of the above still explains why Flacco got the start over White.

5 TDS & 8 INTs in 3 games played

4 TDs 9 INTs in 5 3/4 games played.

”LoL”

Flacco got the start because Mike White was a** and couldn’t stay healthy.  Like I said before, if you reeeeeeally care about anomaly performances this much, Fitzpatrick should be available after this year.  Why settle for the guy who gave us the “best game in 20+ years” when we can get the guy who gave us the best single season in 20+ years.
 

[FidelioJet]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Come on, man.

I can honestly say...the ball to Moore just before the INT...back to back bad throws no doubt.

I think one more high one somewhere...and that 4th down at the end of the game...but otherwise a solid performance. 

I know you watch the NFL - you also know guys miss receivers - high, low, wide etc...Zach also had at least 3 balls dropped on him today.

If you can't watch a game like that and acknowledge this was massive progress from what we saw earlier in the year and recognize it was his 7th NFL and this year we were looking to see continue to get better and he has.  

Of course he wasn't perfect - but it's clearly getting better.  Why is that so hard to accept?

[Mogglez]

Just now, T0mShane said:

Zach Wilson was consecrated as the starting quarterback of the 2021 New York Jets at his freaking pro day, homie.

Homie, that still doesn’t change the fact that he looked better than any of the guys we had in camp or the fact that James Morgan was outplaying White in the summer.

[jgb]

1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

Zach Wilson was consecrated as the starting quarterback of the 2021 New York Jets at his freaking pro day, homie.

Yep. Plus the Jets needed a 3rd camp arm in any case and the fact that White -- a journeyman -- beat out a dude that JD invested a 4th in a year ago said a lot. He won the hand against a stacked deck.

[Bugg]

1 hour ago, GreenFish said:

Zach has played poorly because of inconsistent accuracy and not being able to see the field well. Today he seemed to process the game better (improvement). His accuracy in the 2nd half left a lot to be desired. Improvement but he won't silence his doubters until he strings 2 or 3 games of good QB play. Today was just ok.

However, we lost this game because of our poor defense. The Refs spotted the Eagles 6 points which didn't help. The running game was the best part of our team today with the passing game being second. Everything about our defense sucked. Our special teams mostly sucked except for Berrios.

Zero points scored in the 2nd half; that's on the QB, no matter how bad the defense was.

[Jets723]

13 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

It's very strange that you watched that game and came away thinking Mike White should be playing.

Zach play very well today - massive progress from what we've seen....Impressive performance.

Yes, he missed two or three throws, but OMG, the deep bias you have is no longer disputable.

ZW was not the reason this team lost today and not even close to it.

Agreed.  He had one bad pick but other than that I was happy with what I saw.  Yes he needs to stop throwing lasers for short passes but I loved seeing his chemistry  with Moore.  Moore and Davis also had two big drops that would have been big plays 

[Bugg]

14 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

It's very strange that you watched that game and came away thinking Mike White should be playing.

Zach play very well today - massive progress from what we've seen....Impressive performance.

Yes, he missed two or three throws, but OMG, the deep bias you have is no longer disputable.

ZW was not the reason this team lost today and not even close to it.

Are you kidding? Were you watching another game? 

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, Bugg said:

Zero points scored in the 2nd half; that's on the QB, no matter how bad the defense was.

And meanwhile on the other side, Minshew stepped on our throats in the 2nd half.

Wilson was excused for not doing the same to the Texans because reasons.

[T0mShane]

10 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Homie, that still doesn’t change the fact that he looked better than any of the guys we had in camp or the fact that James Morgan was outplaying White in the summer.

Yeah, I’d imagine the kid gifted all the first team reps might look better than the dude getting the third team reps, and given the way Zach and the offense looked early in the season, I doubt he looked all that great this summer anyway. And given the way the players reacted to White during and after the Bengals game, I’m guessing they didn’t hold his rough summer against him too much. 

[maury77]

1 hour ago, BallinPB said:

3rd best player?  What are you smoking?

I'm not sure, but it sounds like it is better than the stuff I get at the dispensary. 

[T0mShane]

9 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I can honestly say...the ball to Moore just before the INT...back to back bad throws no doubt.

I think one more high one somewhere...and that 4th down at the end of the game...but otherwise a solid performance. 

I know you watch the NFL - you also know guys miss receivers - high, low, wide etc...Zach also had at least 3 balls dropped on him today.

If you can't watch a game like that and acknowledge this was massive progress from what we saw earlier in the year and recognize it was his 7th NFL and this year we were looking to see continue to get better and he has.  

Of course he wasn't perfect - but it's clearly getting better.  Why is that so hard to accept?

1. I acknowledge it was progress. He was a decent looking prospect today.

2. I also acknowledge that most of his passes require the players to contort their bodies into unnatural positions to catch them, which is concerning, and explains some of the drops.

[Vader]

8 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Zach Wilson was consecrated as the starting quarterback of the 2021 New York Jets at his freaking pro day, homie.

Where apparently he only threw impossible bombs and skipped over the normal pass accuracy 101 session. I mean if JD actually knew ZW can’t complete regular passes 0-10 yards maybe he’d have NOT drafted this player 

[Jetsfan80]

3 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Yeah, I’d imagine the kid gifted all the first team reps might look better than the dude getting the third team reps, and given the way Zach and the offense looks early in the season, I doubt he looked all that goo this summer anyway. And given the way the players reacted to White during and after the Bengals game, I’m guessing they didn’t hold his rough summer against him too much. 

And I’m quite sure they’re willing to excuse his performance in the Bills game, too.  

Being able to command a huddle is important in this league.  Kirk Cousins, a long-standing veteran, still doesn’t really have it in Minnesota, and that showed on the field today. 

But I guess Wilson and his teammates going to Islanders’ games means a lot on that front…