Let's talk about Garrett Wilson

[Scott Dierking]

I am sure this has been talked about in other threads, but I have no patience to go through some of the clutter to find it, but why exactly has Wilson regressed as a receiver?

How is it possible that Wilson looked infinitely better with Zach Wilson as a QB? It makes no sense at all.

He seems to be in a wrong spot, not reading what the defense is allowing him to do and finding himself clustered with other receivers  in his vicinity. That and there appears (I know, a dangerous thing to judge from a screen) a mopey attitude. 

I know there is a Hackett problem there, but something definitely seems off. 

[JetPotato]

Garrett Wilson fumbling should shock no one. He's always held the ball carelessly and has fumbled more times in the past as a result.

Being shut down by an elite corner also should not shock anyone.

[Scott Dierking]

1 minute ago, JetPotato said:

Garrett Wilson fumbling should shock no one. He's always held the ball carelessly and has fumbled more times in the past as a result.

Being shut down by an elite corner also should not shock anyone.

Explain the three prior games then.

[Barry McCockinner]

Just a guess but Rodgers wants his WRs to be precise in their routes and where they end up. GW is supposedly more of a creative route runner. He may be getting less targets due to his creativity whereas Zach Wilson is all about that street ball.

[BreeceHallofFame]

Wasn’t GW the go to target all of camp? What the hell happened?

[Biggs]

He’s learned to hate Rodgers almost as much as the Packers GM.

[jetspenguin]

he is doing way too much of this

[yanks9596]

I think we are starting to see that GW was great at bailing out terrible quarterbacks with his “off schedule” play at the receiver position.  He seems not to be a very precise route runner.  I’ve been extremely disappointing in his feet, and his overall situational awareness.  Physically, he’s too skinny.  Has absolutely no functional strength.  Also, he’s not particularly fast.  Hands are often backwards which always drives me crazy.  Santonio Holmes had the same issue.  I think he’s probably more of a low end #1 or perhaps an excellent #2 WR in this league.  

[green&white]

11 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

Explain the three prior games then.

He's gone up against some top corners in every game.  A real #1 receiver wins some of those matchups though.  I think the reality is, he's been overrated to this point.  I think he can be an outstanding #2, but i just don't think he's got the size or the hands to be an elite 1.  I hope I'm wrong.

[HighPitch]

ok so a bad start. it doesnt mean that this is how it will always be

[jetswin]

Surtain looked like Neon Deon yesterday against him.  I have no answers for anything else 

[Warfish]

43 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

I am sure this has been talked about in other threads, but I have no patience to go through some of the clutter to find it, but why exactly has Wilson regressed as a receiver?

He hasn't.

43 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

How is it possible that Wilson looked infinitely better with Zach Wilson as a QB? It makes no sense at all.

He didn't.

43 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

He seems to be in a wrong spot, not reading what the defense is allowing him to do and finding himself clustered with other receivers  in his vicinity.

Or the QB is throwing it to the wrong place because they're not on the same page or Wilson doesn't know what "Rodgers expects" on a given blown-up play (which seems like most drop-backs for Rodgers in 2024 so far).

43 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

That and there appears (I know, a dangerous thing to judge from a screen) a mopey attitude.

Where did you get your remote-psychology-evaluation degree?  And those great "see-thru-a helmet" glasses.

43 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

I know there is a Hackett problem there, but something definitely seems off. 

Wilson & Hall didn't suddenly fall off a cliff of talent and ability.

When you look at Wilson's numbers so far, he's on pace to meet almost all his normal production other than gross yards:

He averages 157 targets, he's projecting to 144 this year.  We have other receivers now our QB likes, it's not the Wilson-only show.

He averages 89 receptions.  He projecting to 85 this year.  A projected drop-off of only 4.

His drop-off is in yards primarily:  He's averaged 1,072 yards, but is projecting to only 811 as of now. 

Again, may be how he's being used, may be the routes we're calling, seems Rodgers and Hackett like Wilson on those short crossing routes which just aren't getting Wilson as many yards or opportunities for YAC.  Wilson's average catch was 8 yards+ deep, now it's down to barely past 5 yards deep with Rodgers.  Wilson averaged about 355 total YAC his first two years, now he's projecting to 310, again a possible effect of this shorter routes/passing game for Wilson under Rodgers/Hackett.

At this point, I'm not selling on Wilson just because our Offense as a whole has been woefully under-productive for it's talent.  Hall too looks like he's lost everything in this 2024 Offense, and I just don't buy that two elite talents suddenly suck.     

------------------------

So ask what the other variable are from the last few years to now.

Like a QB who prefers his boyfriend, Quitter Lazard.  And throws to the TE's alot more.  And the RB's alot as well.  

And an O-Co who has consistently misused Hall vs. Allen and may be misusing Wilson as well.

And an O-Co who may be the most predictable and least effective in the NFL.

And a WR group where Mike Williams is also a legit target.

And an O-Co who keep calling (or Rodgers keeps choosing) to throw to Gipson, who doesn't belong on an NFL field as a WR.

Wilson is likely fine.  So is Hall.  

The Offense (still) isn't, the scheme isn't, the play-calling isn't, same old Jets, same old Jets Offense.  Combine with Rodgers getting alot of other receivers more involved, and here we are.

 

 

[The Crusher]

25 minutes ago, HighPitch said:

ok so a bad start. it doesnt mean that this is how it will always be

Thank you Optimistic Prime.

[kmnj]

Anyone that watches football knows Patrick would shut him down

teans also double him because our other wrs are trash 

lasty GW is very good but not elite and not top ten 

[Warfish]

P.S. Rodgers looks more mopey and disgruntled than anyone else on the Jets.  Why is THAT not part of the issue, but Wilson's frustrations are?

No bias here. right?  Rodgers couldn't possibly be part of the problem so far to some minds.

How do we have TWO threads whining about Wilson, and none complaining about Rodgers boyfriend Hackett and his horrific play-calling and offense? 

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

Hackett. 

This offense doesn’t manufacture or do anything to open up things for specific players. Hackett has done it maybe once or twice for Hall. 

Are we even using M Williams other than streak down the sideline and out jump his guy? 

They love the wr screen that breaks the first tackle and we’re not using the rookie known as the yac king.

This isn’t hard to understand what’s wrong. 

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

1 minute ago, Warfish said:

P.S. Rodgers looks more mopey and disgruntled than anyone else on the Jets.  Why is THAT not part of the issue, but Wilson's frustrations are?

No bias here. right?  Rodgers couldn't possibly be part of the problem so far to some minds.

It’s not an issue. And neither is Wilson’s. They’re pissed things aren’t going well. As they should be. All of them. 

[Matt39]

This was their 4th game together and they play for a franchise who doesn’t expect practice to lead to better communication etc. everything stems from the culture here. 

[Bronx]

Our trading chips are piling up: Sauce, Hall and Wilson.  Get it done Turk'ey. 

[JiFtheOracle]

Clearly him and Rodgers are not gelling like we thought but I also think he’s not adjusting to getting extra attention.  It’s like he’s not finding the soft spots between him the safety over top and he’s just making boneheaded mistakes.  I wonder if he’s pressing a bit putting too much pressure on himself to perform.  Like even his TD catch last week.  Didn’t celebrate with the team, he ran to the sideline like pissed off at something.   He’s off for sure.

[jamesr]

Not sure where the whole "mopey" attitude thing has come from. After the penultimate drive - where Rodgers and Wilson clearly weren't on the same page on route options / expectations - they were shown on the sidelines talking it through; not arguing, not throwing attitude at each other, but working it out like two teammates who want to get better.

[JiFtheOracle]

Clearly him and Rodgers are not gelling like we thought but I also think he’s not adjusting to getting extra attention.  It’s like he’s not finding the soft spots between him the safety over top and he’s just making boneheaded mistakes.  I wonder if he’s pressing a bit putting too much pressure on himself to perform.  Like even his TD catch last week.  Didn’t celebrate with the team, he ran to the sideline like pissed off at something.   He’s off for sure.

[Green Ghost]

1 hour ago, Scott Dierking said:

I am sure this has been talked about in other threads, but I have no patience to go through some of the clutter to find it, but why exactly has Wilson regressed as a receiver?

How is it possible that Wilson looked infinitely better with Zach Wilson as a QB? It makes no sense at all.

He seems to be in a wrong spot, not reading what the defense is allowing him to do and finding himself clustered with other receivers  in his vicinity. That and there appears (I know, a dangerous thing to judge from a screen) a mopey attitude. 

I know there is a Hackett problem there, but something definitely seems off. 

Patrick Surtain is on line 1.

[Biggs]

50 minutes ago, yanks9596 said:

I think we are starting to see that GW was great at bailing out terrible quarterbacks with his “off schedule” play at the receiver position.  He seems not to be a very precise route runner.  I’ve been extremely disappointing in his feet, and his overall situational awareness.  Physically, he’s too skinny.  Has absolutely no functional strength.  Also, he’s not particularly fast.  Hands are often backwards which always drives me crazy.  Santonio Holmes had the same issue.  I think he’s probably more of a low end #1 or perhaps an excellent #2 WR in this league.  

4.38 40 at the combine.  Seems pretty fast.  

[Green Ghost]

IMO Wilson would be better served playing the slot, but on this roster we need him to play like a WR1.

That said, he’s the least of the NYJ problems.

[extmenace]

My buddy and I were actually talking about this, this morning.

Without getting in to too much detail, my theory is that Wilson hasn’t been in an offense yet, both in the pros and in college, where the ball could be coming sooner than where the play is designed for him to make the catch.

In college, you get open, the ball comes to you. Zach had no ability to make anticipation throws. Rodgers is likely the first qb he’s played with that has ability to throw his player open and he hasn’t quite adjusted to playing the position like this. Running routes where the ball could come to him at any point in his route. Everyone is saying that Wilson isn’t on the same page as Rodgers, and that is 100% correct. Rodgers is making advanced throws in live time while Wilson is running his routes and expecting the ball where the designed play tells him he should be looking for the ball. With Rodgers, he’s going to have to learn how to run his routes while also looking for the ball sooner or expect to find the ball in different spots that he may need to adjust too. Wilson is learning really quickly that if he wants to be an elite WR, he’s going to have to learn how to make adjustments while he’s running his routes.

[JetsMan57]

I did not watch it but supposedly on the Giants' Hard Knocks show this year Joe Douglas called the Giants when they were on the clock about a trade up to the #6 pick? I can only imagine that was to draft Nabers

Perhaps the Jets view Wilson as a good 1B rather than an elite 1A.

 

[MR.GANGGREEN28]

Small sample size, growing pains, adjusting to higher expectations, teams are gameplanning to shut him down, offense figuring out its identity. 

Lot of moving parts but he's going to be fine and ball out.

[BreeceHallofFame]

5 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

IMO Wilson would be better served playing the slot, but on this roster we need him to play like a WR1.

That said, he’s the least of the NYJ problems.

“We”

[playtowinthegame]

1 hour ago, JetPotato said:

Garrett Wilson fumbling should shock no one. He's always held the ball carelessly and has fumbled more times in the past as a result.

Being shut down by an elite corner also should not shock anyone.

Slouch

[peekskill68]

8 minutes ago, extmenace said:

My buddy and I were actually talking about this, this morning.

Without getting in to too much detail, my theory is that Wilson hasn’t been in an offense yet, both in the pros and in college, where the ball could be coming sooner than where the play is designed for him to make the catch.

In college, you get open, the ball comes to you. Zach had no ability to make anticipation throws. Rodgers is likely the first qb he’s played with that has ability to throw his player open and he hasn’t quite adjusted to playing the position like this. Running routes where the ball could come to him at any point in his route. Everyone is saying that Wilson isn’t on the same page as Rodgers, and that is 100% correct. Rodgers is making advanced throws in live time while Wilson is running his routes and expecting the ball where the designed play tells him he should be looking for the ball. With Rodgers, he’s going to have to learn how to run his routes while also looking for the ball sooner or expect to find the ball in different spots that he may need to adjust too. Wilson is learning really quickly that if he wants to be an elite WR, he’s going to have to learn how to make adjustments while he’s running his routes.

Are you saying that Lazard is doing this?  Conklin? Trying to understand why Lazard, Conklin and Rodgers seem to be on the same page while Wilson is not.

I'm sort of in the camp with others that Wilson is simply not up to the challenge yet of routinely beating top NFL CBs....

[extmenace]

1 minute ago, peekskill68 said:

Are you saying that Lazard is doing this?  Conklin? Trying to understand why Lazard, Conklin and Rodgers seem to be on the same page while Wilson is not.

I'm sort of in the camp with others that Wilson is simply not up to the challenge yet of routinely beating top NFL CBs....

Lazard is 100% doing this. Conklin is making most of his catches when the play is breaking down and is being hit off script.

[BornJetsFan1983]

1 hour ago, Scott Dierking said:

I am sure this has been talked about in other threads, but I have no patience to go through some of the clutter to find it, but why exactly has Wilson regressed as a receiver?

How is it possible that Wilson looked infinitely better with Zach Wilson as a QB? It makes no sense at all.

He seems to be in a wrong spot, not reading what the defense is allowing him to do and finding himself clustered with other receivers  in his vicinity. That and there appears (I know, a dangerous thing to judge from a screen) a mopey attitude. 

I know there is a Hackett problem there, but something definitely seems off. 

bro game on the line and we they dial up a long shot to gibson....wilson is not the focal point of the offense at all, they are not calling his number unless it is to be killed in the middle of the field. the play designs give him zero chance to be open in 2.4 seconds or whenever rodgers and throwing. Its just poor play design and poor playcalling. 

WIlson is great, so is hall. so is rodgers for that matter. Hackett is the common denominator and we just to a rookie qb wiht liek 50 yards all game. 

You dont blame a kicker for missing a last minute field goal, you blame the offense that couldnt score more than 10 points. And that happens when you call a game so poorley as Nathaniel Hackett. 

At some point are we going to hold anyone responsible for anything?

[Icer]

Kinda feel like some of the young guns read all the press clippings about how good they are, and forgot they still have alot to prove.

[Dunnie]

It's not hard to see what's wrong guys ... The team is poorly coached ... The penalties are glaring proof. It's lackadaisical attention to detail. Stuff that Rice was obsessed with... When the QB knows exactly what his WR will do .. yards and points flow easily. When you have poor route running and bad timing added to stupid ass penalties. You get this.

The answer is to fire Hackett, Saleh or Both.

Simple... Hackett failed in Denver and we scooped him up ... Saleh has failed as a HC and it being let slide till the end of the year.

Players have to be held to account and learn discipline. Will McDonald lined up with his hand in the dirt behind the opponents line of scrimmage (TWICE) is a benchable offense.

It's time for this organization to leave behind its participation trophy mentality.

GW is probably a WR2. He doesn't have the presence or physicality of the prototypical WR1.

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