I am so angry. Izdick is a tool.

[ZachEY]

How long do we give Idzik to improve the team? Until he finds a franchise QB and then can REALLY start the process?

 

This is not me having a problem with Idzik, but with this logic.

 

Ignoring his first year and the mess he took over... Just looking at this offseason:

 

QB: We have 2 QBs with starting experience.  It's not crazy to think that year 2 Geno is better than year 1.  Vick is an improvement over Simms, so if Geno isn't better, we have a guy who can play and run an offense.

 

RB: Chris Johnson, Ivory, Powell is an improvement over last year, with CJ adding a home-run threat and pass catching out of the backfield.

 

WR: Decker represents a significant improvement over anything we've had.  Just having Kerley healthy should be an improvement as well.

 

TE: Cumberland is back and hopefully healthy.  Amaro may not be a huge help this season, but definitely represents an improvement at the position going forward.

 

OL: Added a few draft picks, traded Howard for Breno.  Pretty much a push.  First area without clear improvement.  Maybe Dozier will play?

 

DL: Best unit on the team.

 

LB: At worst a push here.  Reports are Davis is taking a big step forward and maybe we can be optimistic about Coples.  Pace should be solid again.  Babin will be a good situational rusher.  Harris will be the same.  

 

CB: Only area you can say may be worse.  But how much.  And, you'd only say that because of the injuries.  Milliner is improving.  Cromartie was a bum last year.  Patterson is scary.  So, we'll see.

 

S: Pryor should represent a major upgrade to the most ignored position for the last decade.

 

And, all of this improvement probably only gets us to a 9-7 team this season.  So, I wouldn't say that I'm looking at the team with Green Colored Glasses at all.

 

Truth is, the comment should be, how long to we give Idzik to put together a championship caliber team.  Because, that's really what you're asking for.  Not improvement.  We've got plenty of that.

[JustInFudge]

I don't know if a team with this QB situation could be a super bowl contender but he could definitely have improved the team drastically more than he did.

Possibly. You never really know what one particular signing is going to do for a team or not, as a Jets fan, you should know that all too well. Crying over things that didnt happen instead of what did is just kind of pointless, no? Especially if you're in agreement nothing he could have done would really improved the Jets chances unless Geno steps up big time.

You're acting like he did nothing because he didnt sign an acceptable corner, in your eyes, and that's simply not true.

[Larz]

just bring in ty law and it's all good

[JetsFanInDenver]

Yes... because that's so obvious on the internet. 

 

Its ok if you did not get it. No one will think any less of you. Enjoy your day.

[Jetsfan80]

An example. They had the most picks in the draft out of any team and didn't trade up once. NOT ONCE. Instead they drafted reach players and guys who won't make the team. They also had the most Cap space in the league going into and exiting free agency. You're telling me they couldn't improve the team more than they have with that extra 30 million?

 

First off, a lot of those picks were the compensatory variety that couldn't be traded.

 

Second, for a team with so many needs that had to add talent everywhere to start building a contender, how the hell does trading up help us?  You rip Tannenbaum for trading up for the wrong players while failing to recognize that every GM fails at this from time to time, including Idzik.  Trading up just to trade up is stupid.  You're just as likely to find some players that help you by using all your picks as you are trading up for a specific player you covet. 

[ZachEY]

just bring in ty law and it's all good

 

dammit larz... I'd been holding onto that one, waiting for the perfect moment...

[Jetsfan80]

You are out of your mind if you think Idzik has tamed the beast. He has done a better job at keeping him in check than Tannenbaum did, but insanity is only treatable, not curable; and I'm operating under the notion that it's only a matter of time before Woody slathers himself up in peanut butter and demands that Idzik trade for Courtney Brown.

 

This is the most disturbing thing I've read all offseason.

[Bleedin Green]

If he doesn't, then he's being cheap. Because that's how he operates, or because he's being commanded to by the cheapest owner in the history of professional sports.

 

I just think it's hilarious that, in the past, the repeated complaint was that we were stupidly building a defense around CBs, at the behest of Ryan, the king dope, and how no one smart does such a thing. That we just need to draft guys up front that can bring pressure, and then any CB can stick with his receiver for 2-3 seconds. Because that's what the GIants had when they beat the Patriots in the SB the first time around, because the game today doesn't let you touch the receivers anymore, blah blah blah, therefore it's a waste to dump so much in resources at corner. How no matter how good the #1 and/or the #2 is, a team can always line up 3-4 wide and even two elite guys can't cover 4 receivers. 

 

We all read this here, month after month, for years.

 

Now we're strong up front - or we seem so to me, anyway - and presently have some less than sure things at CB, and it's a f*cking unparalleled disaster resulting from the blind leading the blind.

 

What makes it all even better is that during that time, we heard a non-stop sh*t-fit being thrown about the amount of money the Jets were paying for a #2 CB.  People carried on about how absolutely no NFL teams pay that kind of money for a second CB, and many not even that much for a first.  Whether people like it or not, Milliner is set this year as the Jets #1 CB and so this offseason the team went looking for a #2 CB.  Now all we get to hear is the same people throwing fits because the Jets didn't do exactly what people sh*t all over them for doing for years, by spending excessive amounts of money on that very position.

[Klecko73isGod]

Tannembaum sucked because he signed and drafted the WRONG players, not because he was aggressive. The guy drafted probably one of the top 5 busts in draft history and a bust QB. You do understand that distinction right?

 

Ooh, so you want an aggressive GM who never makes a mistake and always makes brilliant moves. 

 

Is that all?

[Gastineau Lives]

Ignoring his first year and the mess he took over... Just looking at this offseason:

 

QB: We have 2 QBs with starting experience.  It's not crazy to think that year 2 Geno is better than year 1.  Vick is an improvement over Simms, so if Geno isn't better, we have a guy who can play and run an offense.

 

RB: Chris Johnson, Ivory, Powell is an improvement over last year, with CJ adding a home-run threat and pass catching out of the backfield.

 

WR: Decker represents a significant improvement over anything we've had.  Just having Kerley healthy should be an improvement as well.

 

TE: Cumberland is back and hopefully healthy.  Amaro may not be a huge help this season, but definitely represents an improvement at the position going forward.

 

OL: Added a few draft picks, traded Howard for Breno.  Pretty much a push.  First area without clear improvement.  Maybe Dozier will play?

 

DL: Best unit on the team.

 

LB: At worst a push here.  Reports are Davis is taking a big step forward and maybe we can be optimistic about Coples.  Pace should be solid again.  Babin will be a good situational rusher.  Harris will be the same.  

 

CB: Only area you can say may be worse.  But how much.  And, you'd only say that because of the injuries.  Milliner is improving.  Cromartie was a bum last year.  Patterson is scary.  So, we'll see.

 

S: Pryor should represent a major upgrade to the most ignored position for the last decade.

 

And, all of this improvement probably only gets us to a 9-7 team this season.  So, I wouldn't say that I'm looking at the team with Green Colored Glasses at all.

 

Truth is, the comment should be, how long to we give Idzik to put together a championship caliber team.  Because, that's really what you're asking for.  Not improvement.  We've got plenty of that.

 

Yeah, improvement was a poor choice of words.

 

For me, I thought the defense could have made a big step forward into the top three in football with the Milliner of the last month of last season and with a solid, if not very good CB on the opposite side. I have to admit I was disappointed with not getting someone better than Patterson, not just health wise but in terms of where he is best suited to play. If you've listened to the show, you would have heard me defending Idzik not going for someone like Brandon Flowers and being patient and developing McDougle. I think the McDougle injury has exacerbated the feelings I had PRE draft. I think I'm more disappointed that the McDougle injury is a bigger deal than it should have been.

[ZachEY]

Ooh, so you want an aggressive GM who never makes a mistake and always makes brilliant moves. 

 

Is that all?

Maybe there's a discount if you bundle with your purchase from the elite QB store?

 

At least we could combine shipping.

[Klecko73isGod]

just bring in ty law and it's all good

 

TY LAW IS COMING AND HE'S BRINGING HELL WITH HIM!!!!

[Klecko73isGod]

Maybe there's a discount if you bundle with your purchase from the elite QB store?

 

At least we could combine shipping.

 

While you're out, you might as well stop by the genius coach shop and pick one of those up as well...

[ZachEY]

Yeah, improvement was a poor choice of words.

 

For me, I thought the defense could have made a big step forward into the top three in football with the Milliner of the last month of last season and with a solid, if not very good CB on the opposite side. I have to admit I was disappointed with not getting someone better than Patterson, not just health wise but in terms of where he is best suited to play. If you've listened to the show, you would have heard me defending Idzik not going for someone like Brandon Flowers and being patient and developing McDougle. I think the McDougle injury has exacerbated the feelings I had PRE draft. I think I'm more disappointed that the McDougle injury is a bigger deal than it should have been.

 

I hear you.  I'd have liked a CB too.  But, my guy was Vontae Davis.  It didn't happen, and he went back to his own team.  I don't blame Idzik for that.  But I also don't blame Idzik for not bringing in a guy that wasn't really right for this team.  The McDougle injury sucks.  But, if your biggest problem is playing next man up with your #2 CB, then honestly, it's not as bad as some are making it out to be.

 

As for being a top 3 D.  We're eternally a good pass-rusher away from that.  Until that happens, I'm not sure Revis would have been the answer either.

[ZachEY]

While you're out, you might as well stop by the genius coach shop and pick one of those up as well...

 

Please.  That place has been out of business after they sold Belichick.  They've had no inventory whatsoever.

[faba]

Lets make it clear if his draft choices do not pan out and  the free agent acquistions are sub par  you get to complain about Idzik. He is not immune if he does not improve this team.

[Sperm Edwards]

How long do we give Idzik to improve the team? Until he finds a franchise QB and then can REALLY start the process?

 

This is not me having a problem with Idzik, but with this logic.

 

To me it's not about bringing in nobody for $$$ until a franchise QB materializes. I think - it's my opinion - that he's not bringing in high-priced FAs at positions with shorter windows of play worthy of those dollars before that happens.

 

For big money, there are 2 types of free agents.

 

1. One year rental from someone, like Revis, who wants to max-out every year. There are few of these, but you get them for 1 year then you have to be the highest bidder again every year, regardless as to whether that player is worth that much to that roster.

 

2. Multi-year deal. Obviously the more common. But I take for granted that often, if not typically, these players are at their best in the first year or two of the contract and then taper after that. And it may just be an age thing. After the rookie contract is over - and maybe a franchise tag for a year after that sometimes, or after playing out an extension with the team that drafted him before the rookie deal expires - the player then hits free agency at age 27-28 (often older). 

 

Well, a common thing to see is the new FA starting out strong (as long as they don't turn to garbage upon getting huge guarantees like Holmes), maybe is just as good or only slightly worse a year later, then that starts to taper off in a hurry. Bart Scott comes to mind. If players like this are routinesly sought out, then the guarantees last longer than the player can live up to the deal as the player's deal is renegotiated to lower the present cap number. By year 3, certainly by year 4, and sometimes even by year 2, you've got a very expensive player with millions left in guarantees, who isn't nearly worth the money anymore. We have this going on now with Ferguson and Mangold. We just got out of it with Scott, Pace, Harris (who's now at least in the reasonable range for this final contract year, though he's still a bit overpaid), and we also just got out of it with a certain QB whose name escapes me at the moment. 

 

Why not build a team this way? By the time you have enough pieces - particularly the key piece at QB - in place, you are locked into super-high contracts for players who aren't worth it anymore. It's ok with players at positions that have longer careers. Offensive linemen, WRs (whose games won't go to mush with a lost half-step), and certainly QBs (in the rare instance that a great one actually hits free agency or is available via a worthy trade) off the top of my head.  But then that next offseason when you want to make that dive to find multiple expensive guys, as well as retain the younger ones you want to keep, then the cap room isn't there anymore.

CBs - and there certainly are exceptions at the position - I would never expect to last 4-5 years. It's also a prime position to show that big money was a mistake already in year 2 (sometimes even year 1). Then by the time Smith (or the next guy) steps up, the team's locked into a player they wish they never signed. So I can understand the idea behind staying away from the position, especially while its stock is trading at an all-time high. Guys who put up one great (or merely very good) season have been getting $6M+/year deals with gobs of guaranteed money. It's poor value unless this is viewed as the final puzzle piece for this upcoming season (or two).

And if it doesn't work out, it IS more difficult for a lower draft pick to bump one down the depth chart, or be afforded enough attention in practice to prove himself worthy. If a $6-8M guy merely isn't so horrid (or injured), he's still getting all or almost all of the first team work. It also often works out this way because, after taking a CB #9 overall (as we did), and then paying big bucks for another in FA, most teams would steer clear of the position for the first few rounds (at least) for the next couple of drafts (maybe more). So it then would become more difficult to find that declining player's replacement until there's actually a vacancy right away. Which then leads to reaching at the position in the draft and/or overpaying a free agent coming off a career year. And around and around we go. Bradway/Tannenbaum did this at the WR position for most of the past decade, which is why they "ignored" the position in the draft.

 

At the same time, there does need to be some balance. It's my opinion that Patterson was the attempt at such (like Vick is at QB). Draft a CB, bring in a bunch more with the physical skills (or combine numbers, anyway) to be successful at the position, and let a low to moderate priced veteran, on a 1 year deal, play if no one else is yet starter-worthy. Or let him start the season and then when someone steps up with some in-game experience subbing in & out, or if/after Patterson gets injured, then someone takes his place as starter after the season's underway. 

 

And the thing is, it was playing out that way ahead of schedule with McDougal looking more than fine for a 3rd round rookie with 2 weeks of TC under his belt (and after missing most of his senior season to boot). Then Patterson looked like crap in the first pre-season game. OK no tragedy yet, because that just means McDougal starts earlier than expected. Except when McDougal gets injured for the season days later, and then Milliner like 5 minutes later is out for the next 3-4 weeks, and Patterson "dinged up" all at the same time, now we've got a crisis.

 

If we picked up someone else in FA for big dollars in March, then there probably would have been no McDougal in the draft. (I don't think this was a pure BAP draft for Idzik like 2013). Also there wouldn't have been Patterson in free agency either. I think they would have gone WR or G/T or some other position in round 3. Maybe we still take a corner with a much later pick (since we had 12).

And then if, instead of McDougal, it was DRC who busted his ACL on the same play in practice, followed by Milliner's injury, we'd have been no better off than we are today. Actually we'd be in worse shape. In other words, we're in such a dire situation at corner today because of the injuries, not purely because of the players themselves.

Please excuse the brevity of this reply.

[Klecko73isGod]

Lets make it clear if his draft choices do not pan out and  the free agent acquistions are sub par  you get to complain about Idzik. He is not immune if he does not improve this team.

 

Let's at least let the team play one game that counts before we start referring to this offseason as a waste of time. 

[Sperm Edwards]

What makes it all even better is that during that time, we heard a non-stop sh*t-fit being thrown about the amount of money the Jets were paying for a #2 CB.  People carried on about how absolutely no NFL teams pay that kind of money for a second CB, and many not even that much for a first.  Whether people like it or not, Milliner is set this year as the Jets #1 CB and so this offseason the team went looking for a #2 CB.  Now all we get to hear is the same people throwing fits because the Jets didn't do exactly what people sh*t all over them for doing for years, by spending excessive amounts of money on that very position.

Um, yeah, that was my point.

Hey, check it out -- I wrote a short story above just now. It's only a few chapters long.

[Larz]

Lets make it clear if his draft choices do not pan out and  the free agent acquistions are sub par  you get to complain about Idzik. He is not immune if he does not improve this team.

 

agree 100%.  even though I strongly approve of his approach, as I understand it, it's a results business and he needs results.  I am willing to see what he does next year with his wad of cash. 

[Larz]

 we're in such a dire situation at corner today because of the injuries, not purely because of the players themselves.

Please excuse the brevity of this reply.

 

no sweat

[peebag]

The Jets (alleged) top three CBs all have injury histories. Milliner, Patterson, and McDougle. The two draftees dropped because of their injuries, and the vet was cheap. I get that he likes that value, but that's a lot of injury history/risk at one (critical) position. Signing one quality/reliable CB this offseason wouldn't've broken the bank. I think that's a legitimate criticism. 

Which "quality" cb would you have taken?

[Integrity28]

Let's at least let the team play one game that counts before we start referring to this offseason as a waste of time. 

 

This.

[unbanmadmike1]

First off, a lot of those picks were the compensatory variety that couldn't be traded.

 

Second, for a team with so many needs that had to add talent everywhere to start building a contender, how the hell does trading up help us?  You rip Tannenbaum for trading up for the wrong players while failing to recognize that every GM fails at this from time to time, including Idzik.  Trading up just to trade up is stupid.  You're just as likely to find some players that help you by using all your picks as you are trading up for a specific player you covet. 

And so far his draft record is ONE PLAYER and a bunch of JAGs. And this year's class doesn't look great. 

[ZachEY]

Starting QB, Starting DT, Starting CB = 1 player and a bunch of JAGs.  Ok.

[Klecko73isGod]

And so far his draft record is ONE PLAYER and a bunch of JAGs. And this year's class doesn't look great. 

 

This year's class doesn't look like anything yet because THEY DON'T PLAY THEIR FIRST GAME FOR ANOTHER 3 AND A HALF WEEKS FOR ****'S SAKE! CALM THE **** DOWN. 

[JustInFudge]

Let's at least let the team play one game that counts before we start referring to this offseason as a waste of time.

No. Stfu. McDougle got hurt and Izdick didn't sign DRC. Seasons over before it began.

[Thor99]

And so far his draft record is ONE PLAYER and a bunch of JAGs. And this year's class doesn't look great.

A proud graduate of The Shane School of Miserable ****s.

[Jetsfan80]

And so far his draft record is ONE PLAYER and a bunch of JAGs. And this year's class doesn't look great. 

 

No.  The 2013 class contains the DROY, a Defensive Rookie of the Month, a starting guard, a QB and two other OL in their 2nd seasons.  And this year's class contained a top safety prospect, a top TE prospect, and a ton of later picks of which no one has any clue how they'll perform.

 

So far the only negative thing to say about Idzik's draft classes as a true negative is that we took a CB with an injury history who happened to tear his ACL.  For everything else the jury is still out.

[Arsis]

My jimmies remain unrustled.

[unbanmadmike1]

agree 100%.  even though I strongly approve of his approach, as I understand it, it's a results business and he needs results.  I am willing to see what he does next year with his wad of cash. 

Kinda like how last year we were supposed to wait till this year to see what he'll do with his wad of cash. 

[dbatesman]

My jimmies remain unrustled.

Tony Stewart is a murderer.

[Arsis]

Tony Stewart is a murderer.

I respectfully disagree.

[Bugg]

I think Idzik was not interested in signing any of the FA corners to multi year contracts. He would probably take a guy willing to go on a 1 year, but he just did not like the fit for the rest of these guys. Well, no FA was looking for 1 year. Those guys will pop up in the next few weeks. wait and see.

Revis" $13 million really is a 1-year deal. Take away the Patterson $3 million and sign Revis INSTEAD and you would still have had  $11 million open based on Costello's statement the current number is $ 21 million rather thaN 30.

 

Would help a whole bunch if defensive genius Rex Ryan developed a pass rush in year 6. 

[BroadwayJets]

HOW DID IDZIK NOT KNOW MILLINER WOULD SPRAIN HIS ANKLE AND MCDOUGLE WOULD TEAR HIS ACL????????????????????????????????????????????