Zach represented by Bosa's team and JD won't budge..

[Defense Wins Championships]

1 minute ago, Biggs said:

A natural born leader should walk in naked to a negotiation with a billion dollar corporation bend over and let their corporate attorneys write the contract in his annal cavity turn around sign it and lead the men on the field to SB glory.

Nothing says great leader like negiotating with corporations unrepresented by lawyers and agents.  

• 18 other NFL rookies have signed their ROOKIE contract under Joe Douglas since last year. Only Zach Wilson hasn't. 

• Every NFL Rookie all 257 of them have signed their ROOKIE contracts this year outside of only two. And Zach Wilson is one of them. 

No. He's not a team leader. If he was he'd be out there with his teammates right now. 

All will be forgiven once be finally shows up late to training camp but right now I'm disappointed in him. 257/259 are in training camp right now but Zach Wilson isn't. 

Can't wait for his next contract negotiations. Boy is he going to be fun. 

[Larz]

Where is ankle socks today? 
 

I bet this is why parcells hated star. QBs lol

[Jet Nut]

26 minutes ago, Biggs said:

FYI you called me argumentative in another thread.  It was a joke.  It obviously went over your head.  Chill out.  I don't have a personal beef with you, don't make it one it's not necessary.

Kind of hard to tell you were joking.  If you were then I got it wrong and apologize.  I certainly dont have a beef with you, this is supposed to be fun, not a drudgery 

[MichaelScott]

2 hours ago, Warfish said:

Why isn't it on Zach?

Why does the one demanding special treatment not bear any of the responsibility for showing up?

Is it your view that every NFL team needs to give in to every players demands whenever a contract is being arranged, to ensure they all show up on time?  And that the players making demands places no responsabillity on them for not showing up?

I'd also ask what evidence you have that the Johnsons are playing any role in this?  They said specifically, JD is in charge.  You don't believe that now?  Or is belief in that conditional on the convenience of believing it?

Was it the Jets/Johnsons/GM's fault every time Revis held out too?  Or was any of it on Revis?

This very much feels like a "blame the guy we already hate, never blame the player we already invested in loving unconditionally" as opposed to a logical and consistent opinion of responsibility for an impasse.

Good take. 

Imo, and I'll be the first to admit that this might not be a fair take, I put the blame on JD over Wilson's agents because this is just such petty and inconsequential BS compared to the importance of getting your new "FQB" to camp with the rest of his team. 

Zach's agent is doing his job, which is fighting for the best deal for his player. JDs job is to do what's best for this team. Right now JDs job should be to do what needs to be done to get his QB to camp. This isn't Adams demanding a contract that will have long term ramifications for the team. These are comparatively minor and inconsequential aspects of a contract that are holding up our rookie QB getting to camp because JD needs to always take a hard line approach with his principals. I also agree that I don't nessesarily think this is a Johnsons thing. They seem to have given JD full latitude to this point, I can't see how they now decide to stick their nose in to cause a nightmare like their 2nd overall pick not being at camp.

Obviously this is just my interpretation of these events. Like everyone else, I don't know anything about what's happening behind the scenes. I can also admit that maybe my take on this isn't fair but I'm pissed this kid isn't in camp and it's just how I feel at the moment. 

[Biggs]

1 minute ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

• 18 other NFL rookies have signed their ROOKIE contract under Joe Douglas since last year. Only Zach Wilson hasn't. 

• Every NFL Rookie all 257 of them have signed their ROOKIE contracts this year outside of only two. And Zach Wilson is one of them. 

No. He's not a team leader. If he was he'd be out there with his teammates right now. 

All will be forgiven once be finally shows up late to training camp but right now I'm disappointed in him. 257/259 are in training camp right now but Zach Wilson isn't. 

Can't wait for his next contract negotiations. Boy is he going to be fun. 

We went 2 and 14.  Zach isn't everyone else.  

[MichaelScott]

1 hour ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

Exactly. I wanted to stay out of this thread but I'm so frustrated I can't resist. 

Trevor Lawrence went to two National Championship games and had 3 playoff appearances during his 3 years and also won a National Championship. 

I love Wilson too but Jets fans believing he "deserves" the same contract "Trevor Lawrence" is getting is absolutely freaking clueless. 

Because Zach Wilson > Trevor Lawrence 

[Mogglez]

42 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

“Sorry” but that’s not how negotiations, players unions, and precedents work.

None of Trevor’s college achievements got him that contract.  His draft slot did.  Next years first overall pick will probably get something mirroring it.  That’s why agents and players fight so hard for this.  As a union, they want to set a precedent for the guys that come after them as well.

The Jets caved on the offset language issue in Sam Darnold’s deal, the 3rd overall pick.  Wilson’s agent is probably telling Douglas “you guys didn’t put it in Sam’s contract, you sure as sh*t aren’t going to put that in the 2nd overall pick’s contract.” and, quite frankly, that is a perfectly fair argument.  Douglas is probably countering with “yeah, and Sam didn’t work out and I didn’t negotiate that contract” which, while true, doesn’t matter one iota because, unfortunately for Douglas, there is a precedent.  The guy one pick above him getting the same treatment hurts the Jets in their negotiations as well.

Oh wow, would you look at that?

[Biggs]

3 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Kind of hard to tell you were joking.  If you were then I got it wrong and apologize.  I certainly dont have a beef with you, this is supposed to be fun, not a drudgery 

Thanks for the nice response.  Appreciated and lets move on...

[TokyoJetsFan]

This was in the presser thread, but seems a pretty confident thing to say.  If they were far apart I'm sure he would have went the no comment route.  JMO.

 

[jetblue95]

always fun to read fans over-react about the business dealings of others, as if they wouldn't try and get the best deal for themselves if the situation were reversed.

in the end, zach will sign, and unless he stages some really loooooong holdout, it won't matter one iota on whether he turns into a FQB or not.  but for these precious days during the summer, when nothing else is happening, it's always fun to get the pitchforks out and go after zach or JD or the johnsons, or some combo thereof.  

a professional athlete in a contract negotiation with a team - OMG, it's the end of the world!!!!!!

[MichaelScott]

5 hours ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

Don't you dare blame "JD" for this because this is 100% Zach Wilson's fault. 

Joe Douglas has signed all 18 rookies dating back to last year. 

Zach Wilson is being an absolute prick with the help of his agent and is the opposite of a team leader.

I blame JD I blame JD I blame JD 

There, I did it again. And will most likely do it a bunch more.

I'm sorry but you don't get to tell everyone here what they can and can't  "dare" to think or say. You do it in every fu*king thread. It's beyond disrespectful and you need to stop with it. 

[choon328]

1 hour ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

Sorry but Wilson doesn't "deserve" Trevor Lawrence's contract. 

A.) He never won a National Championship.

B.) He never made the National Championship Game 2x.

C.) He never made 3 playoff appearances. 

D.) He wasn't drafted #1 overall. 

What's next? 

He's going to "demand" Patrick Mahomes and Tom Brady $$$$ during his next contract negotiations without ever winning a SB? 

 

Absolutely none of  the points you were trying to make matter in negotiation besides the # he was picked. TL was #1, he was #2. TL's contract set a precedent, that's how Rookie negotiations work.

[The Crusher]

2 hours ago, Warfish said:

I think you nailed it.  If this is "on" anyone, it's the Player's Agent.

But I will disagree with you slightly, I hire an agent to act as an extension of MY priorities.

I lay out to my Agent what results I want, if possible, and what results I simply must have.  

The agent can advise me, "hey, you should want this too", or "hey, this is important for this reason too".

But the Agent should not be driving the agenda, the Player should.

If being here for Day 1 was the priority of the player, he'd be here.  

Clearly, the player has other priorities.  That's not a judgement, it's just a logical conclusion based on him not being here.  He values something in his contract more than he values being here for Day 1.

Which, if it gets settled quickly, is fine.  Missing Day 1 is not a huge deal, very little actually happens on Day 1 in most teams camps.

If we're still here in a few days, then we have a problem.

I understand that and agree. At the same time it may be the agent pointing to the business long term goal they are trying to achieve and just telling the little fella to be patient, "all the big boys do it!"

[The Crusher]

2 hours ago, Stark said:

^^^^

 

Masterclass

 

#IYKYK #tehmafia

WEll played you son of a.......

[Jet Nut]

 

[MichaelScott]

Also fwiw, the mass replies to every promo tweet from Woodys account are from fans screaming to get Zach into camp. I cannot see this mess happening because Woody wants to delay giving him bonuses from his, relatively, small contract. This has turned into a PR nightmare and if its still going on when they hit the practice field tomorrow, it will literally be the only story anyone is talking about. Woody doesn't want this. 

[choon328]

15 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Oh wow, would you look at that?

This reminds me of the post some smart guy made back 3 pages ago, oh that was me. 

The truth is the Johnsons do not have enough cash flow as owners to make moves like this or big Signing bonuses. Everybody wants to credit JD for the low Signing bonuses he hands out to FA's but the truth is his hands are tied when it comes to signing bonuses. When you agree to pay a signing bonus you immediately have to liquid cash set aside to pay it. If you don't have that then you can't offer it. 

[MichaelScott]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

 

 I sure hope that means some good news is coming...

God knows JD has really screwed this up to this point. Zach is the best rookie QB in the league and needs to be on the practice field

[Defense Wins Championships]

3 minutes ago, MichaelScott said:

I blame JD I blame JD I blame JD 

There, I did it again. And will most likely do it a bunch more. 

Cool. Keep blaming him because he's the one who has is in position with A+ available salary cap space come 2022 and A+ draft capital with...

two 1st round picks.

two 2nd round picks. 

one 3rd round pick. 

two 4th round picks. 

two 5th round picks. 

three 6th round picks. 

He's also the only who's completely turned over Idzik/Maccagnan's crap roster throughout only two offseasons of roster purging. 

I'm so thankful I'm not the type of fan who turns on our GM over a spoiled rotten kid Rookie. 

Our O-Line was neglected for 13 years throughout the draft until JD arrived and our WR room was ignored for 23 years before JD throughout the draft. 

Disgusting. 

[The Crusher]

1 hour ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

I disagree. 

A natural born leader doesn't let an agent force him to miss time with his teammates. 

JD has signed all other 18 drafted rookies since last year and all 18 had agents too. 

This is all on Zach Wilson and nothing to do with his agent or JD. 

If he really wanted to be a leader for his teammates he'd fire his agent and be at camp already.

No matter how natural a leader is born, if he's smart he lets the professional guide the business aspect. All his team mates under stand that because they are all in the same situation. 

None of them were 2nd overall QB selections. We would have noticed if they were, because the same thing would likely have happened. Remember the agent has a history of this, as he did with Bosa. 

No it has very little to do with Zach Wilson other then being the second overall QB selected and choosing the agent he did. Again his agent has done this before, but yeah, nothing to do with him. I agree nothing to do with Joe Douglas, all on Woody and the agent in my opinion.

If he fired his agent and took a crap offer to just get into camp a day or so early his teammates would think he's an absolute idiot. They know it's a business and they know they all got a limited time to get paid in the NFL. My guess they would respect the kid more for getting his, just like they want their. This isn't an office softball team they play for fun, its their life and career. 

[freestater]

2 minutes ago, MichaelScott said:

 I sure hope that means some good news is coming...

God knows JD has really screwed this up to this point. Zach is the best rookie QB in the league and needs to be on the practice field

I'll say it again, Saleh said that we're not going the vet QB route because it would take away precious reps from Zach. Are those reps not precious any longer? Joe Douglas doesn't think getting a rookie QB (who has to face the greatest defensive mind the game has ever seen, twice in his rookie campaign) all the reps he can is important? This is JD's 2021 Ryan Kalil moment. 

[choon328]

2 hours ago, slats said:

I doubt Zach would want a contract with the majority of the compensation coming in the form of roster bonuses. That wording suggests that the Jags could get out of most of the contract if they cut him before his first roster bonus was due. It’s obviously unlikely, but that’s a lot better for the team than offset language could ever be. 

2/3 of Wilson's money will come from the signing bonus alone. The other $10 million left will be spread out over the 4 years. The roster bonus is about the player getting the money on the 3rd day of the league year instead of it being spread out throughout the season. Lawrence's Dead cap hits are:

Before 2022: $21 million

Before 2023: $14 million

Before 2024: $7 million

No cap relief at all for releasing him. The Signing bonus is what makes it very hard to release him. 

[Jet Nut]

5 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

No matter how natural a leader is born, if he's smart he lets the professional guide the business aspect. All his team mates under stand that because they are all in the same situation. 

None of them were 2nd overall QB selections. We would have noticed if they were, because the same thing would likely have happened. Remember the agent has a history of this, as he did with Bosa. 

No it has very little to do with Zach Wilson other then being the second overall QB selected and choosing the agent he did. Again his agent has done this before, but yeah, nothing to do with him. I agree nothing to do with Joe Douglas, all on Woody and the agent in my opinion.

If he fired his agent and took a crap offer to just get into camp a day or so early his teammates would think he's an absolute idiot. They know it's a business and they know they all got a limited time to get paid in the NFL. My guess they would respect the kid more for getting his, just like they want their. This isn't an office softball team they play for fun, its their life and career. 

His mistake is not realizing that every single player knows they’re independent contractors and each of them handle their business the way they want to/need to.  No one disparages another player for getting his deal.  Has nothing to do with leadership or lack of leadership.  

[Jet Nut]

9 minutes ago, freestater said:

I'll say it again, Saleh said that we're not going the vet QB route because it would take away precious reps from Zach. Are those reps not precious any longer? Joe Douglas doesn't think getting a rookie QB (who has to face the greatest defensive mind the game has ever seen, twice in his rookie campaign) all the reps he can is important? This is JD's 2021 Ryan Kalil moment. 

Wait @Defense Wins Championships lectured me, swore up and down providing lame proof that Belichick isn’t anything more than an average defensive coach.  
 

[Lupz27]

39 minutes ago, MichaelScott said:

Good take. 

Imo, and I'll be the first to admit that this might not be a fair take, I put the blame on JD over Wilson's agents because this is just such petty and inconsequential BS compared to the importance of getting your new "FQB" to camp with the rest of his team. 

Zach's agent is doing his job, which is fighting for the best deal for his player. JDs job is to do what's best for this team. Right now JDs job should be to do what needs to be done to get his QB to camp. This isn't Adams demanding a contract that will have long term ramifications for the team. These are comparatively minor and inconsequential aspects of a contract that are holding up our rookie QB getting to camp because JD needs to always take a hard line approach with his principals. I also agree that I don't nessesarily think this is a Johnsons thing. They seem to have given JD full latitude to this point, I can't see how they now decide to stick their nose in to cause a nightmare like their 2nd overall pick not being at camp.

Obviously this is just my interpretation of these events. Like everyone else, I don't know anything about what's happening behind the scenes. I can also admit that maybe my take on this isn't fair but I'm pissed this kid isn't in camp and it's just how I feel at the moment. 

To me since this is the 2nd highly drafted QB that will hold out on the Jets under 2 different GM’s tells me the Johnson’s may not be in on the calls but they probably are pushing the terms set by them.

[Defense Wins Championships]

2 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

His mistake is not realizing that every single player knows they’re independent contractors and each of them handle their business the way they want to/need to.  No one disparages another player for getting his deal.  Has nothing to do with leadership or lack of leadership.  

Stop it.

You're the same person who had over 100+ posts crying over Darrelle Revis holding out as an "independent contractor". 

[Lupz27]

36 minutes ago, TokyoJetsFan said:

This was in the presser thread, but seems a pretty confident thing to say.  If they were far apart I'm sure he would have went the no comment route.  JMO.

 

Or maybe Saleh is just always positive ??‍♂️ 

[Lupz27]

26 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

I understand that and agree. At the same time it may be the agent pointing to the business long term goal they are trying to achieve and just telling the little fella to be patient, "all the big boys do it!"

This is what happened to Darnold he wanted to sign and told his agents get me in there day 1 they set their own agenda, but won.

[PS17]

2 hours ago, Pac said:

If pretty boy gets too cute with this he could get Wally Pipp'ed.

Your shtick is tired as ****. 

[Jet Nut]

4 minutes ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

Stop it.

You're the same person who had over 100+ posts crying over Darrelle Revis holding out as an "independent contractor". 

100 posts crying, did you count them?
One more time, holding out to renegotiate a contract is 1000% different.  

But keep bringing it up as if it’s the same
  

[MichaelScott]

22 minutes ago, choon328 said:

This reminds me of the post some smart guy made back 3 pages ago, oh that was me. 

The truth is the Johnsons do not have enough cash flow as owners to make moves like this or big Signing bonuses. Everybody wants to credit JD for the low Signing bonuses he hands out to FA's but the truth is his hands are tied when it comes to signing bonuses. When you agree to pay a signing bonus you immediately have to liquid cash set aside to pay it. If you don't have that then you can't offer it. 

I could be 10000% completely wrong but I could have sworn I read somewhere that guaranteed bonus like that go into some kind of escrow account/system. Meaning the owner still essentially "writes the check" for the full bonus immediately, even if it isn't dispersed to the player or apply towards the cap until a later date. 

[GangGreened]

Jets getting ripped by the media on this, what else is new

just get it done, ****ing Christ. 

 

[Bungaman]

27 minutes ago, choon328 said:

This reminds me of the post some smart guy made back 3 pages ago, oh that was me. 

The truth is the Johnsons do not have enough cash flow as owners to make moves like this or big Signing bonuses. Everybody wants to credit JD for the low Signing bonuses he hands out to FA's but the truth is his hands are tied when it comes to signing bonuses. When you agree to pay a signing bonus you immediately have to liquid cash set aside to pay it. If you don't have that then you can't offer it. 

Do you really believe they don't have the cash flow? If the Bengals have the cash flow, you can believe the Johnsons have it. It's a VERY rich man's club.

[PS17]

39 minutes ago, jetblue95 said:

always fun to read fans over-react about the business dealings of others, as if they wouldn't try and get the best deal for themselves if the situation were reversed.

in the end, zach will sign, and unless he stages some really loooooong holdout, it won't matter one iota on whether he turns into a FQB or not.  but for these precious days during the summer, when nothing else is happening, it's always fun to get the pitchforks out and go after zach or JD or the johnsons, or some combo thereof.  

a professional athlete in a contract negotiation with a team - OMG, it's the end of the world!!!!!!

Agreed. He’ll be in camp by Friday and no one will remember this. But it’s July and there’s been next to nothing to talk about so it’s blown out of proportion. That said the Johnsons suck.

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, Pac said:

If pretty boy gets too cute with this he could get Wally Pipp'ed.

You mean get replaced by a better QB?

What it’s called is Sam Darnold’ed