How good is Tua Tagovaiola?

[Mogglez]

21 minutes ago, RobR said:

I don't agree that he was a fantastic prospect and I'm going too leave his medicals out of this. He played with an NFL offense and was able to hold the ball forever. If you look at his offense he had two WR's go in the first round this year and possibly two more first rounders next year in Waddle and Smith. His RT went in the first round this year and his LT will go in the first next year. Then you add in Najee Harris. It's damn near impossible for a QB to fail under those conditions. Just my differing view on him as as prospect without consideration for his injuries .

I also love the fact the Dolphins drafted him so high. Besides landing Becton and Mims my next favorite move was Miami drafting him.

I respect that thought process.  I'm a Bama guy too, so I have to take my own personal biases out of it, hard as that may be. Tua was the first guy that I personally felt wasn't just "along for the ride" when it came to watching the Bama offense.  That being said, you'd have to be an absolute fool to think that the star studded cast he had didn't make life easier for him and I definitely think it helped.  I think someone here said it, but it should be concerning for pro-Tua guys to see how Jeudy and co. fared without him. 

Ultimately, I think he is a really good prospect, but I don't think he comes close guys like Darnold, Luck, Wentz, etc. when it comes to collegiate-to-pro prospects.  

[RobR]

3 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

I respect that thought process.  I'm a Bama guy too, so I have to take my own personal biases out of it, hard as that may be. Tua was the first guy that I personally felt wasn't just "along for the ride" when it came to watching the Bama offense.  That being said, you'd have to be an absolute fool to think that the star studded cast he had didn't make life easier for him and I definitely think it helped.  I think someone here said it, but it should be concerning for pro-Tua guys to see how Jeudy and co. fared without him. 

Ultimately, I think he is a really good prospect, but I don't think he comes close guys like Darnold, Luck, Wentz, etc. when it comes to collegiate-to-pro prospects.  

I agree 100% on this. Even though Hurts won a ton of games at Bama he was so inferior to Tua it wasn't even close. Another part of my evaluation is his size(short and light) and how he'll be relegated to the pocket in the NFL.....even a giant like Herbert is a better runner.

[14 in Green]

Just now, RobR said:

Just read my post above. You said earlier that Tua would never amount too anything because of his injury and after he gets drafted by a division rival you called his potential "off the charts". He's also going too become the best and most complete QB in our division was what you said. I'm just calling a spade a spade. 

Alright. The "have you ever watched him play" remark got me hot under the collar, but let's move on.

Yes. I said his potential was off the charts. I also said I hope they let him sit this year and hopefully get back to 100%. If he can, and does, yes. The most complete QB in the division.

Yes. I had that injury, and because of that I have a soft spot for the kid, and I'm really rooting hard for him.

 I said before the draft, and you disagreed with me, if I were the Miami GM I'd be afraid to use the #5 pick on Tua because of the hip, and I'd take Herbert. But the Dolphins did take him, which sucks, because whoever took him I was going to root for... and I hate the Dolphins. So... conundrum.

[14 in Green]

Just now, Mogglez said:

I respect that thought process.  I'm a Bama guy too, so I have to take my own personal biases out of it, hard as that may be. Tua was the first guy that I personally felt wasn't just "along for the ride" when it came to watching the Bama offense.  That being said, you'd have to be an absolute fool to think that the star studded cast he had didn't make life easier for him and I definitely think it helped.  I think someone here said it, but it should be concerning for pro-Tua guys to see how Jeudy and co. fared without him. 

Ultimately, I think he is a really good prospect, but I don't think he comes close guys like Darnold, Luck, Wentz, etc. when it comes to collegiate-to-pro prospects.  

Honestly, I don't respect that "thought process" at all. In fact I think it's laughable.

To do so, you'd have to feel the same way about Burrow, Lawrence and any other college QB who played or plays at a school loaded with talent.

How about giving the kid credit for being good enough to be the guy who wins the QB job at a school with that kind of talent instead of doubting him because he did?

[RobR]

8 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

Alright. The "have you ever watched him play" remark got me hot under the collar, but let's move on.

Yes. I said his potential was off the charts. I also said I hope they let him sit this year and hopefully get back to 100%. If he can, and does, yes. The most complete QB in the division.

Yes. I had that injury, and because of that I have a soft spot for the kid, and I'm really rooting hard for him.

 I said before the draft, and you disagreed with me, if I were the Miami GM I'd be afraid to use the #5 pick on Tua because of the hip, and I'd take Herbert. But the Dolphins did take him, which sucks, because whoever took him I was going to root for... and I hate the Dolphins. So... conundrum.

You're lucky I'm beyond lazy to use the search function.

There's a reason why many call you out on this site for being a troll that is not a Jets fan. There's nothing wrong about being critical of Jets moves, although here that is a tough stance, but it's another thing to hate everything they do. You praise the Browns, Giants, and now the Phins and crap on every move the Jets make, even now when some of the most pessimistic fans are celebrating a good draft and decent FA period. Keep on trolling and complaining about your neg reps on the site. Pathetic.

[pdxgreen]

As a Ducks fan... I can tell you one thing.  I am glad that he allowed Herbert to stay on the West Coast where I can watch him every Sunday and not have to see him play for a team I despise.

[14 in Green]

Just now, RobR said:

You're lucky I'm beyond lazy to use the search function.

There's a reason why many call you out on this site for being a troll that is not a Jets fan. There's nothing wrong about being critical of Jets moves, although here that is a tough stance, but it's another thing to hate everything they do. You praise the Browns, Giants, and now the Phins and crap on every move the Jets make, even now when some of the most pessimistic fans are celebrating a good draft and decent FA period. Keep on trolling and complaining about your neg reps on the site. Pathetic.

Actually what is pathetic is you asking "have you ever seen Tua play?" and then trumping that by playing the "troll" card.

I learned a lot about you in the last half hour. None of it good.

[RobR]

6 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

Actually what is pathetic is you asking "have you ever seen Tua play?" and then trumping that by playing the "troll" card.

I learned a lot about you in the last half hour. None of it good.

It didn't take me a half hour. I used to like interacting back and forth but it's obvious why you're here.

[greenwichjetfan]

1 hour ago, 14 in Green said:

Alright. The "have you ever watched him play" remark got me hot under the collar, but let's move on.

Yes. I said his potential was off the charts. I also said I hope they let him sit this year and hopefully get back to 100%. If he can, and does, yes. The most complete QB in the division.

Yes. I had that injury, and because of that I have a soft spot for the kid, and I'm really rooting hard for him.

 I said before the draft, and you disagreed with me, if I were the Miami GM I'd be afraid to use the #5 pick on Tua because of the hip, and I'd take Herbert. But the Dolphins did take him, which sucks, because whoever took him I was going to root for... and I hate the Dolphins. So... conundrum.

^This guys odds for 2021 MVP:

Baker 3/1

Allen 2/1

Tua 1/1

[LionelRichie]

13 hours ago, predator_05 said:

Is he the type of QB that will annoy us for the next decade (like Brady) or is he nothing more than a solid competitor? I don't watch college football, but his stats are pretty damn impressive. Trying to get an idea of his talent level.

I know there's concern over the injuries, but we heard something similar with Drew brees and he turned out OK. Physical conditioning is one of the few traits that can be improved with time and coaching.

Now that he's in our division for the long-term, how worried should we be about Tua?

I could be way off on tua but he seems like a Pennington lite to me.  Soft tosser who benefited from the talent around him.  I’m not an expert but I could have seen him being ok in a dome but he is going to suck in the afc East because he can’t break a pain of glass with his arm.   Maybe I’m missing something but he’s more detmer than young.   Not seeing his game translate to the nfl.  

[Daddy Wang Doodle]

32 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

^This guys odds for 2021 MVP:

Baker 3/1

Allen 2/1

Tua 1/1

+1. Guy is the absolute worst.

Nothing wrong with liking some players and not having an affiliation with a specific team - it's actually what the new generation has seemed to take a liking to. Just don't sit here and claim you're a die hard fan of the Jets while simultaneously sh!tting on them (for generally well-received moves nonetheless) and c*mming over the moves other teams have made.

I've no doubt he used to be a fan of the team, but those days seem long gone.

And just to reiterate, there's nothing wrong with that. Just don't act like it's impossible to understand why people think you're a troll, rather than a fan of the team - when your posts and general sentiment towards the team you 'allegedly' route for say anything but.

[Jet9]

I don't see how he can stay healthy. How often does an injury prone college QB stay healthy as a pro? 

[predator_05]

10 hours ago, artemusclyde said:

 

He's extremely overrated, watch the injury compilation I linked, the guy got hurt sliding, no one touched him, he got hurt sliding. That, along with his injury history, tells you everything you need to know about his durability. Best case, he's Sam Bradford 2.0.

He could be coached out of that though.

Look at kyler murray last year. He played it safe by hanging in the pocket, and never looked to scramble unless he had a lane.

[Mogglez]

4 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

Honestly, I don't respect that "thought process" at all. In fact I think it's laughable.

To do so, you'd have to feel the same way about Burrow, Lawrence and any other college QB who played or plays at a school loaded with talent.

How about giving the kid credit for being good enough to be the guy who wins the QB job at a school with that kind of talent instead of doubting him because he did?

I get what you're saying. I can only speak for myself, but I do have legitimate concerns with Burrow, however, I love him nonetheless.  He had the greatest college season of all time for crying out loud, along with showing skills that translate well to the pro's.  I saw LSUs offense without a Joe Burrow.  It was night and day.  I've seen Bama dominate for decades, even on offense, without Tua.  That, to me, is the big difference.

Lawrence, I believe, is a phenomenal prospect, maybe one of the best ever, who is getting nitpicked because there is just so much good about him.  I'm less concerned when it comes to him.

[predator_05]

19 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

I get what you're saying. I can only speak for myself, but I do have legitimate concerns with Burrow, however, I love him nonetheless.  He had the greatest college season of all time for crying out loud, along with showing skills that translate well to the pro's.  I saw LSUs offense without a Joe Burrow.  It was night and day.  I've seen Bama dominate for decades, even on offense, without Tua.  That, to me, is the big difference.

 

Burrow is coach-proof, IMO. Good under pressure, fearless. Makes all the difference in the NFL. 

His college performance is proof of the upside he has when the rest of the offense plays at his level.

[pdxgreen]

3 hours ago, Daddy Wang Doodle said:

+1. Guy is the absolute worst.

Nothing wrong with liking some players and not having an affiliation with a specific team - it's actually what the new generation has seemed to take a liking to. Just don't sit here and claim you're a die hard fan of the Jets while simultaneously sh!tting on them (for generally well-received moves nonetheless) and c*mming over the moves other teams have made.

I've no doubt he used to be a fan of the team, but those days seem long gone.

And just to reiterate, there's nothing wrong with that. Just don't act like it's impossible to understand why people think you're a troll, rather than a fan of the team - when your posts and general sentiment towards the team you 'allegedly' route for say anything but.

[UntouchableCrew]

Personally I think he's awesome. Good arm, extremely accurate, intuitive, instinctive player. Great athleticism. Just a natural.

That said:

1) It's hard to evaluate a kid at Alabama because those teams are just so stacked. Every running back he's ever handed off to will play in the NFL. HIs blind side protector was a top 10 pick. His two two receivers were both top 15 picks. That team is simply loaded -- so while he was awesome he also had good protection and open receivers. It will be tougher at the NFL level.

2) He's shown a propensity to be injury prone, and considering he's a bit undersized and runs a lot I'm not sure that's going to go away.

That said, he's the best QB the Dolphins have drafted since Marino and I was definitely hoping he didn't end up with them. He's absolutely a threat to be the best QB in the AFC East for the next 10 years.

[southtown24th]

TAG-O-VAI-LOA

[slats]

11 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

Actually what is pathetic is you asking "have you ever seen Tua play?" and then trumping that by playing the "troll" card.

I learned a lot about you in the last half hour. None of it good.

Are you actually pretending that slamming Sam Darnold at every opportunity isn't your primary objective here? No matter the QB being discussed, it's always a chance for you to hit Darnold. You're also a primary participant in any thread where others are getting their shots in on Darnold, upvoting every single post that has the slightest negative thing to say about him. 

C'mon man, this is what you do. It's obvious to everyone. This playing hurt here is more than a little pathetic. 

[BCJet]

10 hours ago, LionelRichie said:

I could be way off on tua but he seems like a Pennington lite to me.  Soft tosser who benefited from the talent around him.  I’m not an expert but I could have seen him being ok in a dome but he is going to suck in the afc East because he can’t break a pain of glass with his arm.   Maybe I’m missing something but he’s more detmer than young.   Not seeing his game translate to the nfl.  

He doest have a weak arm at all, he just didnt really have to zip the ball in college since his guys were usually wide open.

The kid is really talented and has the ability to feel pressure and look off safeties at this point which is very advanced.  I think if he remains healthy he will be a top 10 QB - the issue is that him remaining healthy is not the same as it is for other players who haven't been hurt this much.

[Philc1]

13 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

Tua's potential is off the charts.

If he is given the time to heal, and come back from his hip surgery 100% healthy (I think Miami should sit him at least until late November, I'd sit him the entire year) he will become the best, and most complete QB in the division. 

Might not have the arm strength of Allen (nobody does), but Tua is far more accurate.

Throws the deep ball (and just about everything else) better than Darnold. Probably moves better in and out of the pocket also. When Sam plays a 16 game season, then I'll listen to people here knocking Tua for his injuries. They both have to show they can stay healthy. 

Stidham? Meh. However, if the Pats like him, that scares me.

Right now the best QB in the division is Fitzpatrick. The Dolphins can and should let him mentor Tua for a year. Then unleash the beast.

The Pats also liked Matt Cassell, Ryan Mallet and Brian Hoyer

[Philc1]

28 minutes ago, BCJet said:

He doest have a weak arm at all, he just didnt really have to zip the ball in college since his guys were usually wide open.

The kid is really talented and has the ability to feel pressure and look off safeties at this point which is very advanced.  I think if he remains healthy he will be a top 10 QB - the issue is that him remaining healthy is not the same as it is for other players who haven't been hurt this much.

I love the people who say “Drew Brees had a major injury before going to the saints”

 

well Tua has had multiple major injuries at a younger age

[JohnnyLV]

14 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

I had the same exact injury, Moggs.

It ended my so-so college baseball stint. Bo Jackson and Flacco's TE (can't remember his name) are both 1000x better athletes than I was, had it, and it ended their careers. I honestly don't know of anyone coming back from it.

@johnnysd and I have talked about this a few times, and Im hoping he's right, and that there have been advancements to the point where Tua can come back healthy. I'd love to see it... no kid deserves to have his sports career cut short like that.

Well obviously I have never had the issue just relaying what doctors are saying about it, that his is one there can be complete recovery from. I can guarantee Dolphin fans and NFL fans everywhere will hold their breath the first few times he gets tackled hard. Definitely a risky pick but tons of potential upside.

[Bronx]

On 5/9/2020 at 9:17 AM, BigRy56 said:

He’s a decent prospect but a walking injury 

Thanks for the insight. 

[PepPep]

Sky is the limit for Tua. I remember some analyst compared him to Drew Brees. And I kinda agree. Smooth, quick release. Throws with accuracy and anticipation, cannon for an arm, similar in height and build, etc. etc. Both Tua and Brees are mobile, Tua is the better athlete but both are primarily pocket QBs. for example, even though Tua could get out of trouble like Russell Wilson if he really needed to I def. would not compare him to Russell Wilson. 

Now, comparing rookies to HOF's is pretty darn silly I'll say that right now. Tua hasn't proven anything. However, upside is IMMENSE. 

His floor is pretty high, IMO. Barring injuries I don't think you are getting a raw prospect who could completely bust. At worst he will be a capable starter or backup.

However, his string of injuries are a huge red flag and should scare every coach, GM and fan. That's the rub. Can he stay healthy long enough to stay a legitimate starter. QB is a position that need stability more so than any other. 

[predator_05]

2 hours ago, southtown24th said:

TAG-O-VAI-LOA

 

[YankeeJet22]

14 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

.  because whoever took him I was going to root for... and I hate the Dolphins. So... conundrum.

****n wierdo. 

[Lith]

6 minutes ago, predator_05 said:

 

Thet should do this with his first name.  Tuanigamanuolepola. 

There is a reason he goes by Tua.

[14 in Green]

Lots of ruffled feathers here...  

I'm flattered by all the attention, but I think most people would rather read about Tua. That's who this thread is about, no?

But... Whatever.

[Adoni Beast]

I think hes going to be a stud. Athletic and extremely accurate. He’ll be a thorn in our side for the next 12-15 years.

[Daddy Wang Doodle]

4 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

So according to the story, ESPN is looking "in house" for replacements. Orlovsky would be my choice for analyst if I had to choose from their NFL crew. Play by play? I don't have a clue.

If they were smart though, they'd use people from their NCAA coverage. They do a really nice job pre and post game, and the announcing crews are good also.

Watching the draft coverage, where ABC used those college guys from ESPN, the difference was plain as day. Those guys were head and shoulders above what we saw from both the NFL Network and ESPN's NFL crews

Wrong thread bro. This is the tua one where multiple people ended up attacking your fandom

[Grandy]

Tua is very talented and probably the most accurate QB in the division. However his athleticism is not at the same level as Darnold, and Allen. His ceiling simply isn't as high, but his floor definitely is. He's also more injury prone and has never faced even close to the amount of adversity that they have. Playing with Alabama talent and O-line is a world of difference compared to Miami. We've simply never seen him have to compensate for his team like Darnold has. 

[YankeeJet22]

5 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

So according to the story, ESPN is looking "in house" for replacements. Orlovsky would be my choice for analyst if I had to choose from their NFL crew. Play by play? I don't have a clue.

If they were smart though, they'd use people from their NCAA coverage. They do a really nice job pre and post game, and the announcing crews are good also.

Watching the draft coverage, where ABC used those college guys from ESPN, the difference was plain as day. Those guys were head and shoulders above what we saw from both the NFL Network and ESPN's NFL crews

Wierdo and an idiot.  Wrong thread jek0ff. 

[14 in Green]

Just now, Daddy Wang Doodle said:

Wrong thread bro. This is the tua one where multiple people ended up attacking your fandom

LOL yeah. you're right. I meant to leave that in the Monday Night Football thread, obviously, but I got sidetracked reading all my fan mail here.... 

BTW I was going to quote you earlier this morning. I know you don't care for me, and a lot of my posts, and that's okay. I'm giving you the courtesy of a reply though because unlike the others who chimed in, I find a lot of the stuff you post interesting, and or funny. I enjoy that, even the sarcasm.

It doesn't matter to me if you like me or not. I'm not here to make friends (even though there are quite a few people here I feel that way about.)

It's all about making me want to read what you have to say.

[Icer]

I can't see him staying healthy in the NFL. He wasn't even that fast in college, imagine in the pros. If he doesn't play super careful, he will be out all the time