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[Sperm Edwards]

7 minutes ago, JiFields said:

As documented, this regime's handling of the QB situation infuriates me, really my only true gripe.  That said, I was honestly shocked when they put Zach on the shelf.  Like, deactivated status, never in a million years believed they'd go to that extent.  And I'm going to give the benefit of the doubt because I think they've earned it w/ this take but it feels like, someone in that building is finally speaking the truth about the situation. And if they were able to get JD and Saleh to this point w/ Zach, you have to hope that person is showing how this is confirmation despite the loss, that they made the right decision.

 

In addition to outright belief in White, my take on Wilson not suiting up again this week as the QB2?

Last week, ok fine, I can accept he needed to get his head right.

This week?  If White had gotten himself into some bad early trouble, could be either Saleh nor MLF didn't want any pressure (in real time or after the game in hindsight) to pull him for Wilson. With Flacco as the QB2 there'd be no such calls (certainly far fewer), and White would get all game to right the ship no matter what, just like they gave Wilson in those weeks before him. Meanwhile internally they know, with Wilson needing so much work on himself to get out of his terrible muscle-memory - this surely takes more than one midseason week - that they were just not putting him out there yet, even if White regressed terribly.

That's the best I've got . 

[rangerous]

3 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

Disagree.  Neither were good - The throw was the bigger problem than the catch.

much as i agree the throw wasn't that great it was in berrios' hands and he needs to make that catch 10/10. but i also have a beef with the two plays before 4th down.  they tried that fade to wilson in the corner but wilson got jammed at the line.  i'm not sure why they didn't just run again or try some play action.  i almost think they didn't want to score quickly or force minny to burn time outs.

[Dunnie]

Got us to the one yard line with three chances to win. The one play where he had a chance he made it and it was dropped.
You Zach cultists are the f*cking worst.

Totally agree .. wtf was ML thinking .. run the ball four times ... If there is a penalty .. run it another four times. Didn't get that yesterday.

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[Dunnie]

That was a breece hall game

Well said

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[football guy]

28 minutes ago, doitny said:

exactly. its sad that Mike White has to play 1,000 times better than Zach to keep playing. he is the QB in the 2 most total yds games this year. and according to @football guy they plan on Zach starting the next week vs Detroit. if he knows that im sure Mike White does too. imagine the pressure on this kid to have to not only beat Buffalo but have a really good game just to keep playing. 

these next 5 games should be all about making the playoffs now and Mike White gives us the best chance.

I guess I should rephase: the plan was that the soonest Zach could return to the starting lineup would be against Detroit. They wanted him to take at least 2 weeks to focus on the little things, then elevate to backup, then potentially starting. That's not to say Mike White hasn't been given an opportunity to perform at a level that allows him to keep playing with the starters. They never made promises to Zach or Mike, but that is what was discussed internally with the decision makers. Give Zach some time to regain his fundamentals without the pressure of preparing for games, then elevate him to backup, then potentially the starting lineup. So If he's elevated to backup this week, that means he's on track to getting back into the lineup next week if the Buffalo game does not go as well as we hope it does. 

[Dunnie]

much as i agree the throw wasn't that great it was in berrios' hands and he needs to make that catch 10/10. but i also have a beef with the two plays before 4th down.  they tried that fade to wilson in the corner but wilson got jammed at the line.  i'm not sure why they didn't just run again or try some play action.  i almost think they didn't want to score quickly or force minny to burn time outs.

This guy gets it ^

It was a poor throw behind a covered falling receiver .. but it does not excuse Berrios for not catching it .. that would have been a big boy catch ... Both guys didn't get it done .. 50/50 responsible.

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[Dunnie]

I guess I should rephase: the plan was that the soonest Zach could return to the starting lineup would be against Detroit. They wanted him to take at least 2 weeks to focus on the little things, then elevate to backup, then potentially starting. That's not to say Mike White hasn't been given an opportunity to perform at a level that allows him to keep playing with the starters. They never made promises to Zach or Mike, but that is what was discussed internally with the decision makers. Give Zach some time to regain his fundamentals without the pressure of preparing for games, then elevate him to backup, then potentially the starting lineup. So If he's elevated to backup this week, that means he's on track to getting back into the lineup next week if the Buffalo game does not go as well as we hope it does. 

I never heard a timeframe mentioned.

Zach probably should sit until OTAs commence. He really needs the time to collect himself and focus.

He should soundly display superiors skills before he replaced anyone.

Love the thought of climbing his way back up the depth chart. Only way he will learn that he's got to earn the job.

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[football guy]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

So, this is why this loss was so frustrating. Mike White is the underdog who is supplanting a guy who many, many people were invested in. Not winning that game has given space to those people to hammer Mike White—no matter what he does—with petty complaints while tacitly equating them with Zach Wilson’s gross failures. The things @FidelioJet and @football guy are saying about White could be largely true, but if Berrios catches that ball and the Jets win, they’re not making these posts today and instead are screaming their Mike White critiques into a pillow. Losing has given those critiques oxygen. I’m not criticizing those dudes—that’s how the takes game is played, and it points to the larger problem White has—he has to crush guys like Fidelio and football guy, because there are people in charge of his future that are, or were, likewise invested in Zach Wilson. 

I'm rooting for Mike White to play well when he's on the field. In the moment, I'm a Jets fan first. Always will be. I just acknowledge that he is a see-it, throw-it QB who does not have the upside or athletic gifts to make up for the traits he lacks (anticipation, maintaining accuracy through progressions, intermediate-to-deep ball placement), which will prevent him from becoming a long-term answer at QB. That does not mean I do not root for him. 

[Dunnie]

I'm rooting for Mike White to play well when he's on the field. In the moment, I'm a Jets fan first. Always will be. I just acknowledge that he is a see-it, throw-it QB who does not have the upside or athletic gifts to make up for the traits he lacks (anticipation, maintaining accuracy through progressions, intermediate-to-deep ball placement), which will prevent him from becoming a long-term answer at QB. That does not mean I do not root for him. 

Thank you for this .. we are all fans first ... Even if we evaluate the position differently... I agree with your thoughts on White. He might win us a couple. He's likeable. You could do a hell of a lot worse for a backup. I'll leave the door open that maybe we did catch lightning in a bottle ... But he's got to show me first.

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[FidelioJet]

54 minutes ago, rangerous said:

much as i agree the throw wasn't that great it was in berrios' hands and he needs to make that catch 10/10. but i also have a beef with the two plays before 4th down.  they tried that fade to wilson in the corner but wilson got jammed at the line.  i'm not sure why they didn't just run again or try some play action.  i almost think they didn't want to score quickly or force minny to burn time outs.

Yeah, I found MLF playing calling in the red zone troubling yesterday.

inside the one on 2nd down.  Heck QB sneak 3 times would have been fine.

Or the fact that they were running 5 wide - just a strange call to not even have the threat of running form the 1.  seems like you're really giving up a huge advantage there.  Do play action and I suspect someone is wide open.

With all of that said - I had that feeling too that they were trying to make MN. waste TO's too..although it would be incredibly idiotic if that's what they did.  Get the TD and trust your D.  I really hope that's not what happened.

[Dunnie]

3 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Yeah, I found MLF playing calling in the red zone troubling yesterday.

inside the one on 2nd down.  Heck QB sneak 3 times would have been fine.

Or the fact that they were running 5 wide - just a strange call to not even have the threat of running form the 1.  seems like you're really giving up a huge advantage there.  Do play action and I suspect someone is wide open.

With all of that said - I had that feeling too that they were trying to make MN. waste TO's too..although it would be incredibly idiotic if that's what they did.  Get the TD and trust your D.  I really hope that's not what happened.

That is exactly what happened ... MLF got cute and it burned the Jets.

Edited December 5, 2022 by Dunnie

[VJphillyfan]

2 hours ago, doitny said:

OMG im going to punch him. when is his show today? you know he is going to blame Mike White for everything.

Chris Simms upset his future as a NFL GM got wrecked single handed it by Zack Wilson

[Dunnie]

1 minute ago, VJphillyfan said:

Chris Simms upset his future as a NFL GM got wrecked single handed it by Zack Wilson

^^^ What is looks like when 338 of your 339 posts are anti Zach Wilson and nothing else ... That my final answer Alex.

[Warfish]

1 hour ago, football guy said:

I'm rooting for Mike White to play well when he's on the field. In the moment, I'm a Jets fan first. Always will be. I just acknowledge that he is a see-it, throw-it QB who does not have the upside or athletic gifts to make up for the traits he lacks (anticipation, maintaining accuracy through progressions, intermediate-to-deep ball placement), which will prevent him from becoming a long-term answer at QB. 

I was rooting for Zach Wilson to play well when he was on the field.  I'm a Jets Fan first, always will be.  I just acknowledge that Wilson is a guy with limited ability and skills, whose only really here because of his arm strength and the sunk cost fallacy, and who does not have any top-level talent or potential in the areas of field vision, decision making, reading defenses, throw accuracy at any range, touch passing, pocket presence or ability to stand tall in the pocket, which will prevent him from being a long-term answer at QB.  

[Joejet]

4 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

I have no problem with Mike White personally, I didn't listen to post game interviews.  From what I've been told BB took the blame too.  As they both should.  

I'm glad Mike White has accepted his share of the blame - My problem is with the fans on JetNation that are refusing to accept the same thing Mike White has accepted.  And calling me a troll for agreeing with him.

I personally didn’t call you a troll as you provide a lot of quality posts on this board. We just see things somewhat differently on this specific topic. Also, I agree that both players should take a share of the blame and did so.

[doitny]

1 hour ago, football guy said:

I guess I should rephase: the plan was that the soonest Zach could return to the starting lineup would be against Detroit. They wanted him to take at least 2 weeks to focus on the little things, then elevate to backup, then potentially starting. That's not to say Mike White hasn't been given an opportunity to perform at a level that allows him to keep playing with the starters. They never made promises to Zach or Mike, but that is what was discussed internally with the decision makers. Give Zach some time to regain his fundamentals without the pressure of preparing for games, then elevate him to backup, then potentially the starting lineup. So If he's elevated to backup this week, that means he's on track to getting back into the lineup next week if the Buffalo game does not go as well as we hope it does. 

what scares me is that Zach Wilson probably looks like the best QB on the team..... in TC and practice. cause he is wearing a red shirt and has no fear of being hit. but as we have seen he is much different in real games. that being said i can see him playing good in practice and fooling the coaches into starting him again. cause after what we have seen these pass 2 years he is not the best QB on this team right now. no way he could beat out White or Flacco unless what im saying is true. 

that red shirt can make anyone look great. except for those poor guys on Star Trek who always get killed. lol

[Green Ghost]

3 hours ago, GangGreened said:

I can’t believe you guys voted this guy as JN captain. Embarrassing.

Nobody voted, it was one of those back room deal type of things. The fix was in. ?

[Green Ghost]

2 hours ago, doitny said:

exactly. its sad that Mike White has to play 1,000 times better than Zach to keep playing. he is the QB in the 2 most total yds games this year. and according to @football guy they plan on Zach starting the next week vs Detroit. if he knows that im sure Mike White does too. imagine the pressure on this kid to have to not only beat Buffalo but have a really good game just to keep playing. 

these next 5 games should be all about making the playoffs now and Mike White gives us the best chance.

[Green Ghost]

53 minutes ago, doitny said:

what scares me is that Zach Wilson probably looks like the best QB on the team..... in TC and practice. cause he is wearing a red shirt and has no fear of being hit. but as we have seen he is much different in real games. that being said i can see him playing good in practice and fooling the coaches into starting him again. cause after what we have seen these pass 2 years he is not the best QB on this team right now. no way he could beat out White or Flacco unless what im saying is true. 

that red shirt can make anyone look great. except for those poor guys on Star Trek who always get killed. lol

The last sentence here was really funny. ??

[greenwichjetfan]

6 hours ago, Warfish said:

He did, in the postgame.

It’s also very clear you’re not making these observations is an unbiased way. Go back and read your previous posts in re: Zach and drops for example. 

Your takes since MW was named starter have been as lopsided as the refereeing yesterday.
 

He was on these forums literally ignoring the fact that Zach was unable to complete screen passes, but now a ball that hit Berrios in both hands is to be scrutinized and placed on the shoulders of White.

Agreed White could have thrown a better ball, and White also could have hit a wide open Elijah for a first down and potentially TD on the last play of the game, but he battled like hell, and even in the loss played better than all but one of Zach Wilson's 20 starts. And that's why Fido is the way he is. 

[rangerous]

18 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

Yeah, I found MLF playing calling in the red zone troubling yesterday.

inside the one on 2nd down.  Heck QB sneak 3 times would have been fine.

Or the fact that they were running 5 wide - just a strange call to not even have the threat of running form the 1.  seems like you're really giving up a huge advantage there.  Do play action and I suspect someone is wide open.

With all of that said - I had that feeling too that they were trying to make MN. waste TO's too..although it would be incredibly idiotic if that's what they did.  Get the TD and trust your D.  I really hope that's not what happened.

the funny thing is if they kicked a fg the score would've been 27-25.  they stopped minny when they took over at the one andused their time outs.  they had about a minute when they got the ball back.  perhaps they would've been able to move close enough for a fg.  obviously the minny would've changed their play calling if they received the ko at their 25.  it's just funny how it turned out.

[Larz]

33 minutes ago, rangerous said:

the funny thing is if they kicked a fg the score would've been 27-25.  they stopped minny when they took over at the one andused their time outs.  they had about a minute when they got the ball back.  perhaps they would've been able to move close enough for a fg.  obviously the minny would've changed their play calling if they received the ko at their 25.  it's just funny how it turned out.

Yup plus the call to go for it on 4th much sooner.  Saleh gets blame too

[GandWFan]

On 12/4/2022 at 7:42 PM, Supersonic said:

Accuracy = Average at best.  IQ = Average.  Arm strength = Below Average.  Leadership = Above Average.  Passion = Above Average.  Clutchness = Below Average.  Mobility = Far below average.  Not being Zach Wilson = Thank god.

What hurts me is he doesn't have the talent or ability to take the Jets to a Superbowl.  Throwing for 3000+ yards and being good enough to help the team finish above .500?  I could care less.

Accuracy = very accurate.  Hits receivers in stride.  Football IQ = excellent.  Consistently stands in the pocket and quickly goes through reads.  Arm Strength = above average.  Can sling it when needed but also throws with touch.  Clutchness = above average. Brought team back from 20-3 deficit in second half with 2 chances to win at the end.  No quit in him or the team.  Mobility = who cares.  Irrelevant.  Slides and steps up into the pocket.  You know, like a professional QB does.

What hurts you is that you put all your hope in ZW, and he sucks.  But mobile.  Backwards.

[Stark]

1 hour ago, GandWFan said:

Accuracy = very accurate.  Hits receivers in stride.  Football IQ = excellent.  Consistently stands in the pocket and quickly goes through reads.  Arm Strength = above average.  Can sling it when needed but also throws with touch.  Clutchness = above average. Brought team back from 20-3 deficit in second half with 2 chances to win at the end.  No quit in him or the team.  Mobility = who cares.  Irrelevant.  Slides and steps up into the pocket.  You know, like a professional QB does.

What hurts you is that you put all your hope in ZW, and he sucks.  But mobile.  Backwards.

in reality 1 guy plays the position of quarterback much better than the other. The guy that has played a whole 4 total games. so the guy that has played 25% of the games and has 25% of the experience looks better at QB. ummm... yeah lets keep letting that guy play hell even 10 games and then see. 

People want to make excuses for why we need to keep seeing Zach play and that he needs time. Why does a low rd pick with no experience seem to play better? could it be because he just is better. Zach isn't passing against air, or at a pro day. Zach is afraid to stay in the pocket/ While Zach may have a better arm and or make some throws that are "wow" throws he has shown since Day 1 he struggles to do the basics. Like embarrassingly bad throws into the ground or way over his guys heads and has reoccurring mental lapses during games.

 

sorry but anyone that can't see it is just lost. take away the 4th Q in Pittsburgh and he has been very "meh to disappointing" 

 

keep playing White and give him more games, because if this is him learning a whole 4 games in, what could 10 games in look like?

 

is he the answer at qb, I have no idea, but he sure gives me more hope than Zachenberg

 

 

 

[Jets1958]

3 hours ago, rangerous said:

the funny thing is if they kicked a fg the score would've been 27-25.  they stopped minny when they took over at the one andused their time outs.  they had about a minute when they got the ball back.  perhaps they would've been able to move close enough for a fg.  obviously the minny would've changed their play calling if they received the ko at their 25.  it's just funny how it turned out.

Yes, I had the same thought during the game. Easy to second guess RS and I can argue it both ways.  
 

But just think of the discussion on the board if The Jets  did kick and never got the ball back or failed to move into FG range with 30 sec left.

“stupid coach, should have went for it on 4th down- lost the game for the Jets!”

 

[rangerous]

2 hours ago, Jets1958 said:

Yes, I had the same thought during the game. Easy to second guess RS and I can argue it both ways.  
 

But just think of the discussion on the board if The Jets  did kick and never got the ball back or failed to move into FG range with 30 sec left.

“stupid coach, should have went for it on 4th down- lost the game for the Jets!”

 

ain't that the truth.  just like when they take points off the board by going for it inside the 40.  i don't have any issue with them going for a td.  i do think they got too cute when they should've just rammed it home.  maybe there were some time considerations in play.

[Supersonic]

9 hours ago, GandWFan said:

Accuracy = very accurate.  Hits receivers in stride.  Football IQ = excellent.  Consistently stands in the pocket and quickly goes through reads.  Arm Strength = above average.  Can sling it when needed but also throws with touch.  Clutchness = above average. Brought team back from 20-3 deficit in second half with 2 chances to win at the end.  No quit in him or the team.  Mobility = who cares.  Irrelevant.  Slides and steps up into the pocket.  You know, like a professional QB does.

What hurts you is that you put all your hope in ZW, and he sucks.  But mobile.  Backwards.

You think everyone intelligent enough to realize MW is a journeyman QB is a ZW supporter?  Must suck to be you.

[GandWFan]

1 hour ago, Supersonic said:

You think everyone intelligent enough to realize MW is a journeyman QB is a ZW supporter?  Must suck to be you.

If you would have told me that I would have lived the life I have had, I would have told you that you were crazy.  I was an exec with a Fortune 500 company running an international dept.  I traveled all over the world and met all sorts of great people with different cultures.  

Most importantly, I had a very happy home life, and now have 8 grandkids, all of which live within 1/2 hr away.  

I am now retired, enjoying new hobbies.

Oh, and I saw SB3.

So if being me sucks, give me more of sucks.

[GandWFan]

1 hour ago, Supersonic said:

You think everyone intelligent enough to realize MW is a journeyman QB is a ZW supporter?  Must suck to be you.

Btw, not addressing the bulk of my post I see.  Agendas are a tough think to break, even in the face of contradicting facts.

[rex-n-effect]

I love that this guy still shows up every few months pretending to have insider knowledge, proves himself wrong, disappears for months and repeats. 

[Supersonic]

This clique of you little boys is quite funny.  If you only knew how hard people are laughing at you guys outside your little circle.  The need to talk yourself up, and your lame attempts to ridicule other people, says everything anyone needs to know about you guys.  People with character and success don't need to do that.  Don't worry, I don't expect any of you to comprehend what I just said.  

[Integrity28]

NFLN replay on…

Corey Davis handed that INT to Harrison Smith, what a chode.

[Integrity28]

2nd possession:

• Max Mitchell whiffing on the opening run play
• The short passes worked great
• Great 3rd and 1 conversion
• Pass pro pretty awful
• Great deep throw to CD
• Overthrow to Ty Johnson, then Conklin
• 3rd and 10 was the Conklin ball that he popped into the air, catchable ball
• FG

So 2 drives and both ended by CD and Conk volleyball if the football to the defense. Should have been a second INT.

Mike’s play was fine. There were 2 bad throws out of about 10, I think. Our 2 receivers and Max Mitchell killed these drives.

Im not watching any more. The “White was terrible in the first half” crew is just not good at watching football.

[JetsYanks13]

2nd possession:

• Max Mitchell whiffing on the opening run play
• The short passes worked great
• Great 3rd and 1 conversion
• Pass pro pretty awful
• Great deep throw to CD
• Overthrow to Ty Johnson, then Conklin
• 3rd and 10 was the Conklin ball that he popped into the air, catchable ball
• FG

So 2 drives and both ended by CD and Conk volleyball if the football to the defense. Should have been a second INT.
Mike’s play was fine. There were 2 bad throws out of about 10, I think. Our 2 receivers and Max Mitchell killed these drives.
Im not watching any more. The “White was terrible in the first half” crew is just not good at watching football.

So watching half of the first quarter is how you came to the decision, seems like a thorough way to evaluate a player. White was not terrible, but did not have a good 1st half against the Vikings.


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[Integrity28]

1 hour ago, JetsYanks13 said:

So watching half of the first quarter is how you came to the decision, seems like a thorough way to evaluate a player. White was not terrible, but did not have a good 1st half against the Vikings.


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Already watched the whole game. I rewatched the first couple possessions to give you all the benefit if the doubt… turns out you don’t know wtf you are talking about.

If you’d like to burn another 20 replies having me explain why all over again, that’s up to you.