Jets standing by QB Zach Wilson 'through hell or high water'

[JohnnyLV]

13 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Ehhhh. I think there are warring factions inside the Jets right now, with most wanting to launch Wilson into the sun. Saleh is just a really bad actor who thinks he’s a lot smarter than everyone else in the room, and he ends up looking like a dope in those settings. 

Actually Saleh has been amazingly consistent. Maybe the OC said just let me play White and everything will be fixed. And well that blew up like a wet fart. There is no reason other than bias and selective narrative to think Saleh is not being truthful.

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

Actually Saleh has been amazingly consistent. Maybe the OC said just let me play White and everything will be fixed. And well that blew up like a wet fart. There is no reason other than bias and selective narrative to think Saleh is not being truthful.

It is your belief that Mike LaFleur convinced Robert Saleh to bench Zach Wilson—whom, in your scenario, Saleh likes—during the run-up to the playoffs and, even now after Mike White sucked last week and Zach is still inactive, LaFleur is still forcing Saleh’s hand? 

[oatmeal]

2 hours ago, Skeet Ulrich said:

This isn't WFAN. What do you want them to say, he's a complete turd and they're gonna cut bait as soon as possible?

By their actions you can see what they think about Zach. They benched him for a guy who can't even throw a football for god's sake.

 

 

[Jet_Engine1]

3 hours ago, dbatesman said:

also: lmao. If you handed LaFleur a gun with two bullets and put him in a room with Hitler, Stalin, and Wilson, he would shoot Wilson twice

He would send Stalin in motion, have Hitler run a Jet sweep action, shoot Wilson in the foot and slam him into the wall.

[doitny]

13 minutes ago, shuler82 said:

The only thing that gives me hope it that this organization was saying similar things about Jamal and Sam until they both went away. 

exactly.

and its not just us, i heard all summer from Aaron Boone how Joey Gallo is an important part of the team and does so much more than his 180 BA. 

no coach will ever say a bad thing about anyone on their roster. maybe Parcells did back in the day but now its unheard of.

[pointman]

There is no point in saying he sucks and won't play here again. Either we hold him to develop and see since hes on his rookie deal, or we prime him with nonsensical words blowing up how great he is going to be so we can find a GM like Seattle has to fleece in a trade.

[JohnnyLV]

14 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

It is your belief that Mike LaFleur convinced Robert Saleh to bench Zach Wilson—whom, in your scenario, Saleh likes—during the run-up to the playoffs and, even now after Mike White sucked last week and Zach is still inactive, LaFleur is still forcing Saleh’s hand? 

No I am saying that after the NE performance there was a very long press conference delaying meeting. Something needed to be done about Zach. It is not necessarily the correct assumption that it was Saleh pushing benching Zach. He may have. But he may have thought it was just what he said it was and a Zach saving move. You just cannot assume that Saleh is secretly anti-Zach or that anyone is for that matter. 

[Dax89]

Why is everyone getting their panties in a knot over obvious coachspeak?

[Dcat]

4 hours ago, Bronx said:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35378674/jets-standing-qb-zach-wilson-hell-high-water

FLORHAM PARK, N.J. -- The New York Jets won't give up on quarterback Zach Wilson after only two seasons, according to coach Robert Saleh, who insisted Wednesday the organization will do everything "through hell or high water" to maximize his potential.

This was the Jets' strongest endorsement of Wilson, whose future has been the subject of intense speculation because of two benchings. Saleh said Wilson, who will be a healthy scratch Sunday against the Miami Dolphins, can begin his turnaround with a mental break from football as soon as the season is over.

"Go read a book, go do something, get away from this game, just reset," Saleh said. "I think the greatest gift you can give yourself as a human is to figure out what's important to you. What do you value and how can you stick to those values day in and day out?

"That is the greatest gift you can give yourself, is to discover yourself. I think Zach needs to get away, read a book and figure that out."

Saleh noted that Wilson is only 23 years old, an age when many players still are maturing. This has been a difficult year for the former BYU star, drafted second overall in 2021. He missed the first three games with a knee injury and got benched for the first time when the team was 6-4.

"Zach has all the talent in the world, and we have all the confidence in the world in him," Saleh said. "It's just, like I said, a reset. We're going to grind with him. We are. Through hell or high water, we're going to figure how to get him to where we know he can be."

The Jets (7-9), losers of five straight and mathematically eliminated last Sunday, haven't committed to Wilson as their 2023 starter. His rookie contract runs through 2024; he's due to make a total of $9.3 million (fully guaranteed) over the final two seasons.

The other two quarterbacks on the 53-man roster, Mike White and Joe Flacco, will be free agents. White, who will start the finale against the Dolphins, has displayed some promise in four starts this season (1-3), but the Jets might opt for a more proven commodity in 2023. Chances are, they will acquire a veteran from the off-season market.

"[He needs to] keep working," offensive coordinator Mike LaFleur said. "He's a New York Jet and that's not changing. That's the way my mindset is."

Both the coaches and Wilson himself have acknowledged that his fundamentals have slipped -- specifically, his footwork and balance. The plan after the first benching was to have him focus on his fundamentals, but he returned to action after only three weeks of inactivity due to White's rib injury.

Saleh said it's not a talent issue with Wilson, who sparked a firestorm by refusing to take accountability for a poor performance in a Nov. 20 loss to the New England Patriots -- the precursor to his first benching. An emotional Wilson later apologized to the team.

"We want to make sure we reconnect with Zach and regain his confidence -- regain his confidence in himself and us, and us and him, all of us," he said. "Just to make sure he's back on track, make sure his footwork is right, mechanics right, his mind right. It's not a talent thing for Zach. I believe that. We're going to work our tails off to help him, and we're committed to him."

 

It's rare for a team to move on from a highly drafted quarterback after only two seasons. Since 1998, only two top-10 quarterbacks lasted less than three years with the team that drafted them: Ryan Leaf (San Diego Chargers, No. 2 pick in 1998) and Josh Rosen (Arizona Cardinals, No. 10 pick in 2018).

In two seasons, Wilson has a 15-18 record as a starter, with 15 touchdowns, 18 interceptions, a 55% completion rate and only 4,022 passing yards. His QBR for the two seasons is 35.0, the lowest among 35 qualified passers.

 

On the other hand, it just might be that he'll be traded the moment JD figures he has the best offer. 

[Jet_Engine1]

27 minutes ago, Dax89 said:

Why is everyone getting their panties in a knot over obvious coachspeak?

[T0mShane]

46 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

No I am saying that after the NE performance there was a very long press conference delaying meeting. Something needed to be done about Zach. It is not necessarily the correct assumption that it was Saleh pushing benching Zach. He may have. But he may have thought it was just what he said it was and a Zach saving move. You just cannot assume that Saleh is secretly anti-Zach or that anyone is for that matter. 

Pretty safe to assume that by not only benching, but making him inactive, Saleh isn’t the hugest pro-Zach guy in the building. According to Costello, Mogglez, and football guy, Woody isn’t either. That leaves Douglas and the personnel department as the last holdouts. 

[Darnold Schwarzenegger]

I was all for giving jd and saleh another year but if there plan involves Zach Wilson being a starter next year just clean house now.

[VJphillyfan]

If this organization had a clue they would be moving on from Zach. It was a very stupid qb evaluation 2 years ago.  Yay, he had one good year facing community colleges

[Green Ghost]

2 hours ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

Can only hope you are right about this.

On the bald GM front, does one home run draft outweigh 2 sh-tty ones, pisspoor OL, botched #2 overall pick, and countless FA whiffs?

I’m not as big a fan as a lot of people are, I’ll leave it at that.

[bla bla bla]

Jamal Adams will be a Jet

Sam Darnold will be a Jet

Zach Wilson will be a Jet

[Barry McCockinner]

2 minutes ago, bla bla bla said:

Jamal Adams will be a Jet

Sam Darnold will be a Jet

Zach Wilson will be a Jet

Denzel mims will be a jet.

Elijah Moore will be a jet.

[Green Ghost]

2 hours ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

If only Baker signed here!  

Bye bye 

If you had any reading comprehension skills, you’d have seen where I said I’d still be active on the board, but alas, that doesn’t seem to be the case.

You’re right about Baker though, that would be sweet. Zachy could run the scout team during the week learn from watching Mayfield play on Sundays!

[bla bla bla]

3 hours ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

Can only hope you are right about this.

On the bald GM front, does one home run draft outweigh 2 sh-tty ones, pisspoor OL, botched #2 overall pick, and countless FA whiffs?

I think it's based on context. A good GM will hit 50% of their first round picks, the percentage gets lower as the draft goes on. If we look at the first 2 rounds for Douglas:

Becton - BUST

Mims - Disappointment

Z Wilson - BUST

AVT - Stud

Moore - Talented 

Sauce - Stud

G Wilson - Stud

Johnson II - Talented

Breece - Stud

 

Let's call say Douglas hit on 6 of 9 early picks, that's 67% hit rate - well above average. I'd also argue that Becton was looking like best LT in the NFL potential before the injuries when previously he had none. Mims has been a disappointment compared to expectations, he's a JAG at best right now. Missing on Zach obviously hurts because of the value of that #2 pick, in hindsight you trade down or do not take a QB. I would be upset if we moved on from Douglas, I understand people's frustration but to find players like Quincy, Berrios, JFM, Huff, Echols, MC2, and Herbig are depth pieces we haven't had on this team in decades. I'd also like to point out that we haven't gotten the bad end of a trade from Joe Douglas unless you want to consider the move back for Mims and passing on Claypool.

 

We are about to sign our first player to a 2nd contract since Muhammed Wilkerson, let that sink in (I know Q wasn't a JD pick)

[bla bla bla]

9 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Denzel mims will be a jet.

Elijah Moore will be a jet.

Sam, Jamal, and Zach never publicly requested trades

[slimjasi]

1 hour ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

I can legit hear him saying this in my head  

[Bronx]

9 minutes ago, bla bla bla said:

I think it's based on context. A good GM will hit 50% of their first round picks, the percentage gets lower as the draft goes on. If we look at the first 2 rounds for Douglas:

Becton - BUST

Mims - Disappointment

Z Wilson - BUST

AVT - Stud

Moore - Talented 

Sauce - Stud

G Wilson - Stud

Johnson II - Talented

Breece - Stud

 

Let's call say Douglas hit on 6 of 9 early picks, that's 67% hit rate - well above average. I'd also argue that Becton was looking like best LT in the NFL potential before the injuries when previously he had none. Mims has been a disappointment compared to expectations, he's a JAG at best right now. Missing on Zach obviously hurts because of the value of that #2 pick, in hindsight you trade down or do not take a QB. I would be upset if we moved on from Douglas, I understand people's frustration but to find players like Quincy, Berrios, JFM, Huff, Echols, MC2, and Herbig are depth pieces we haven't had on this team in decades. I'd also like to point out that we haven't gotten the bad end of a trade from Joe Douglas unless you want to consider the move back for Mims and passing on Claypool.

 

We are about to sign our first player to a 2nd contract since Muhammed Wilkerson, let that sink in (I know Q wasn't a JD pick)

That's on the draft side of things. He has bummed on FAs; Kalil, Tomlinson, punters in general, Lawson, JFM'- extension, etc. To his credit, Reed was a steal.

[Dunnie]

Denzel mims will be a jet.
Elijah Moore will be a jet.

Mike White will be a Jet
Mekhi Becton will be a Jet

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Bronx]

1 minute ago, Dunnie said:

Mike White will be a Jet
Mekhi Becton will be a Jet

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

Berrios and that Chic Cristina will be a Jet

[BP]

4 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

Mike White will be a Jet
Mekhi Becton will be a Jet

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

Mekhi will be working out on the beach in a banana hammock in front of Zach while he’s sipping a smoothie and reading a book. 

[bla bla bla]

11 minutes ago, Bronx said:

That's on the draft side of things. He has bummed on FAs; Kalil, Tomlinson, punters in general, Lawson, JFM'- extension, etc. To his credit, Reed was a steal.

Kahlil was a signing after the draft and FA (Douglas wasn't here for), I don't blame JD for that signing really.

Tomlinson had all of us fooled, Pro Bowler to bottom tier scrub, I'm equally as perplexed on that signing

Punters - if this is a downside to a GM I'll gladly take it.

Lawson - He had injury history but never anything to do with his Achilles. 7 sacks after that kind of injury is something I can live with. JD hitting on Huff, JJ, and Clemons lightens this blow IMO

JFM - What didn't you like about the JFM extension? I know it's a popular gripe with people on this forum but I've never fully understood it. We basically gave him $12m for 2022 and can either move on from him or pay him $12m for 2023 (would be 31st in the NFL for Edge Rushers)

[Fantasy Island]

2 hours ago, johnnysd said:

No I am saying that after the NE performance there was a very long press conference delaying meeting. Something needed to be done about Zach. It is not necessarily the correct assumption that it was Saleh pushing benching Zach. He may have. But he may have thought it was just what he said it was and a Zach saving move. You just cannot assume that Saleh is secretly anti-Zach or that anyone is for that matter. 

Everyone with functioning eyes is Anti-Zach.  Unless he is your family or he is seeing your niece.

[Hex]

1 hour ago, bla bla bla said:

Kahlil was a signing after the draft and FA (Douglas wasn't here for), I don't blame JD for that signing really.

Tomlinson had all of us fooled, Pro Bowler to bottom tier scrub, I'm equally as perplexed on that signing

Punters - if this is a downside to a GM I'll gladly take it.

Lawson - He had injury history but never anything to do with his Achilles. 7 sacks after that kind of injury is something I can live with. JD hitting on Huff, JJ, and Clemons lightens this blow IMO

JFM - What didn't you like about the JFM extension? I know it's a popular gripe with people on this forum but I've never fully understood it. We basically gave him $12m for 2022 and can either move on from him or pay him $12m for 2023 (would be 31st in the NFL for Edge Rushers)

Tomlinson's fall has been so perplexing. I don't get why he struggles so much compared to the other OLers.

The TE signings have been pretty sad too, but I don't think there were many people who weren't happy about them.

I also remeber when people talked about how JD couldn't get a kicker for the life of him, but Zurlein has been great. Hopefully the same thing can happen with Punter.

James Robinson was also dissapointing but he was a 1000 yard rusher in his rookie year.

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

3 hours ago, Hex said:

Tomlinson's fall has been so perplexing. I don't get why he struggles so much compared to the other OLers.

The TE signings have been pretty sad too, but I don't think there were many people who weren't happy about them.

I also remeber when people talked about how JD couldn't get a kicker for the life of him, but Zurlein has been great. Hopefully the same thing can happen with Punter.

James Robinson was also dissapointing but he was a 1000 yard rusher in his rookie year.

Guys play to get paid.

Once they get the bag, a lot of guys mail it in.

Look at Mo Wilk.

Something to think about when negotiating Q’s deal.  The contract year “breakout” is always a bit scary.

[jgb]

12 hours ago, bonkertons said:

I mean, this makes sense.  I don't think this means they plan on rolling with him as the #1 to start next year, but why wouldn't they try to salvage their 2nd overall investment?  

Because if you trade him you avoid paying him some money that you can give to another players that help your football team

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

13 hours ago, Bronx said:

In two seasons, Wilson has a 15-18 record as a starter, with 15 touchdowns, 18 interceptions, a 55% completion rate and only 4,022 passing yards. His QBR for the two seasons is 35.0, the lowest among 35 qualified passers.

In what world is Zach Wilson 15-18 as a starter? In what world has Zach Wilson played 33 games?

[Charlie Brown]

11 hours ago, rangerous said:

I’m trying to be nice here. I don’t like the idea of switching coaches without good reason. But even I see the offense just doesn’t look right, at least on a consistent basis. And for two seasons now, players have been getting into the coaches dog house.  Maybe the players deserved it but maybe the coaches don’t know what they’re doing.  I want someone in the jets organization say they’re going to objectively evaluate saleh and his staff.  If it turns out that milf is a problem then he needs to go.

Great points.

This was my concern.  
 

I have NEVER seen on a consistent basis the friction between so many players and the offensive coaches here on a team that is seeking to be a true contender. This is way beyond the Bell —Gase stuff..

Think, MLF even sought to throw shade at Garret Wilson saying early on this year that Wilson didn’t know the entire route tree and implied he wasn’t on the field as a result, but it didn’t stick because the offense was so putrid and Wilson was so good.  Wilson immediately had an impact when he came in and was able to overcome bad coaching!  

MLF’s attitude concerned me and shows ZERO flexibility and impacts everyone including QB development.  Some players can’t overcome bad coaching and then develop bad habits.  Moore has gotten worse with the Jets coaching and lack of plays designed for him.  The Jets have simply HURT Moore and made him less effective.  He runs wildly on the field when he catches the ball because he is so anxious to show he can make the spectacular play as opposed to just turning up the field and run.  Why? Cause the dude isn’t seeing the ball not because of bad QB play alone but because he is not even an offensive option on plays.  

At the end of the day the Jets can’t in effect say we will demote and embarrass everyone including the QB but with the coach we will just work on it. 

[southparkcpa]

15 hours ago, Saul Goodman said:

Saleh looks to be in over his head. These quotes are not helping his cause at all.

And if the team really believes in continuing to build around Zach Wilson, they should all be fired. 

Agreed.  He is in over his head.  I would say as DC he was just average.  Woody hired him for all the wrong reasons. 

 

[rangerous]

1 minute ago, Charlie Brown said:

Great points.

This was my concern.  
 

I have NEVER seen on a consistent basis the friction between so many players and the offensive coaches here on a team that is seeking to be a true contender. This is way beyond the Bell —Gase stuff..

Think, MLF even sought to throw shade at Garret Wilson saying early on this year that Wilson didn’t know the entire route tree and implied he wasn’t on the field as a result, but it didn’t stick because the offense was so putrid and Wilson was so good and that was with Flacco as QB. Result Wilson immediately had an impact when he came in was on the field  in effect he was able to overcome bad coaching!  

MLF’s attitude concerned me and shows ZERO flexibility and impacts everyone including QB development.  Some players can’t overcome bad coaching and then develop bad habits Moore has gotten worse with the Jets coaching and lack of plays designed for him.  The Jets have HURT Moore and made him less effective.    

At the end of the day the Jets can’t in effect say we will demote and embarrass everyone including the QB but with the coach we will just work on it. 

all good points.  as i recall gwilson got in mainly because davis was injured (as usual).  the thing too is there was a period this season when things were working even with zwilson.  i know many say it was because of breece hall and that may be the case but it was also decent oline play and the defense was getting turnovers.

[Dunnie]

4 hours ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

Guys play to get paid.

Once they get the bag, a lot of guys mail it in.

Look at Mo Wilk.

Something to think about when negotiating Q’s deal.  The contract year “breakout” is always a bit scary.

Is there any way to make an incentive laden deal look attractive ?

[Dunnie]

23 minutes ago, southparkcpa said:

Agreed.  He is in over his head.  I would say as DC he was just average.  Woody hired him for all the wrong reasons. 

 

I think the reasoning was sound ... there was prospective hope that he had leadership, motivational and communication skills that were elite and appropriate for the Head Coaching position. 

The problem is ... that does not seem to be the case.  I echo the sentiment from an earlier poster when I say that I am COMPLETELY APPALLED, and shocked to be honest, that Saleh not only doesn't motivate the team ... his sideline demeanor floundering on the sideline as the team struggles is completely unexpected and disgustingly opposite of how a Head Coach should act.   

The Jets Media department should have taken some photos of his disinterested, glum body language on the sideline for his Story Wall at One Jets Drive.

Edited January 5, 2023 by Dunnie