sec101row23 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 After watching the game on Monday night, and really the entire NFL for the last couple years, one thing has become clear and that’s the old lockdown corner is dead. Really, the value of corner backs has been diminished as well, at least what are perceived to be the elite ones. While every other position in the NFL has seen their top contracts grow over the years, the corner back position has actually seen a decrease. Remember Revis making an average salary of $16 million per year in 2013? The top guy now is Josh Norman at $15 million, Trumain Johnson is second at $14.5. The value of having one elite CB is very little now. The old adage that they take away one half of the field was a fallacy to begin with, but now has proven to be completely false. You are better off with 3-4 average corners who can be swapped out and moved around than having the “lockdown” guy with below average supporting cast. You are better off dumping the resources into pass rushers, and spread around the money between all your corners. If you can’t get to the QB you can’t play defense anymore, it’s very simple. I’m not saying you ignore the CB position, but the value of having and paying an elite one has been greatly diminished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nico002 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 the lockdown corner is not dead- its just the rarest of rare players that literally comes around once every 10 years. There have been like 3 lock down corners in my lifetime. Many corners are marketed as "lockdown" but they just arent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, sec101row23 said: After watching the game on Monday night, and really the entire NFL for the last couple years, one thing has become clear and that’s the old lockdown corner is dead. Really, the value of corner backs has been diminished as well, at least what are perceived to be the elite ones. While every other position in the NFL has seen their top contracts grow over the years, the corner back position has actually seen a decrease. Remember Revis making an average salary of $16 million per year in 2013? The top guy now is Josh Norman at $15 million, Trumain Johnson is second at $14.5. The value of having one elite CB is very little now. The old adage that they take away one half of the field was a fallacy to begin with, but now has proven to be completely false. You are better off with 3-4 average corners who can be swapped out and moved around than having the “lockdown” guy with below average supporting cast. You are better off dumping the resources into pass rushers, and spread around the money between all your corners. If you can’t get to the QB you can’t play defense anymore, it’s very simple. I’m not saying you ignore the CB position, but the value of having and paying an elite one has been greatly diminished. The problem with this theory is that the guys you are counting on as average are what used to be the "lockdown" guys. Are you willing to roll with 4 Buster Skrine's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gas2No99 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Marcus Peters isn't the next lockdown CB? The DBs have NO leeway in coverage. They are literally playing with their hands tied behind their backs because of the rule changes. THAT"S WHY YOU NEED TO RUN THE BALL AND POUND THE GROUND vs. opposing defenses. It's the ONLY WAY to win in today's Modern NFL!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nico002 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 1 minute ago, Gas2No99 said: Marcus Peters isn't the next lockdown CB? The DBs have NO leeway in coverage. They are literally playing with their hands tied behind their backs because of the rule changes. THAT"S WHY YOU NEED TO RUN THE BALL AND POUND THE GROUND vs. opposing defenses. It's the ONLY WAY to win in today's Modern NFL!!!!!! what rule change? Revis played under the same rules... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustiniak Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said: The problem with this theory is that the guys you are counting on as average are what used to be the "lockdown" guys. Are you willing to roll with 4 Buster Skrine's? you can roll with them if you have a pass rush. guys like adams are useless unless they can impact the passing game at the LOS. either you have a potent pass rush and average dbs or you better be scoring 30ppg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai Jet Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 10 minutes ago, sec101row23 said: After watching the game on Monday night, and really the entire NFL for the last couple years, one thing has become clear and that’s the old lockdown corner is dead. Really, the value of corner backs has been diminished as well, at least what are perceived to be the elite ones. While every other position in the NFL has seen their top contracts grow over the years, the corner back position has actually seen a decrease. Remember Revis making an average salary of $16 million per year in 2013? The top guy now is Josh Norman at $15 million, Trumain Johnson is second at $14.5. The value of having one elite CB is very little now. The old adage that they take away one half of the field was a fallacy to begin with, but now has proven to be completely false. You are better off with 3-4 average corners who can be swapped out and moved around than having the “lockdown” guy with below average supporting cast. You are better off dumping the resources into pass rushers, and spread around the money between all your corners. If you can’t get to the QB you can’t play defense anymore, it’s very simple. I’m not saying you ignore the CB position, but the value of having and paying an elite one has been greatly diminished. Not a bad thread.... for a Clemson guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gas2No99 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, nico002 said: the lockdown corner is not dead- its just the rarest of rare players that literally comes around once every 10 years. There have been like 3 lock down corners in my lifetime. Many corners are marketed as "lockdown" but they just arent In MY lifetime: Rod Woodson Deion Sanders Darryl Green Champ Bailey Ty Law Ronde Barber Charles Woodson Darelle Revis Patrick Peterson Richard Sherman They are NOT that RARE. The rules of the game has made them obsolete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgivs21 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 1 minute ago, nico002 said: what rule change? Revis played under the same rules... Not necessarily a rule change, but how the current rules are being enforced. Look how many ticky tac fouls were called on Monday night. But then you go to the Pitt v Jags game & you see the Jags defense not being called for many of those same fouls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gas2No99 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, The Crusher said: Yeah, but who WON that game?!?!?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sec101row23 Posted November 21, 2018 Author Share Posted November 21, 2018 1 minute ago, Augustiniak said: you can roll with them if you have a pass rush. guys like adams are useless unless they can impact the passing game at the LOS. either you have a potent pass rush and average dbs or you better be scoring 30ppg. Exactly. Put the money into pass rushers because you can have the highest paid corners and it won’t make a difference if the QB has all day to throw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sec101row23 Posted November 21, 2018 Author Share Posted November 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, Thai Jet said: Not a bad thread.... for a Clemson guy. Lol...thanks. Looking forward to our annual game in January. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustiniak Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, sec101row23 said: Exactly. Put the money into pass rushers because you can have the highest paid corners and it won’t make a difference if the QB has all day to throw. which is why the jets will be taking a DE at #3 or 4 where they pick, b/c there are no impact offensive players and mccagnan will not trade back. i also think he'll know this heading into FA and that will put more pressure to get impact offensive players since the top of the first round sucks for them. i'd rather have bosa than a cb though. i do think we'll wind up with bell, mccags will be desperate to save his job and he'll offer the most money. they could do worse than giving darnold a weapon like him in the run/pass games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UntouchableCrew Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Since 2009 the Jets have been investing tons of assets in the secondary while neglecting pass rush while smart organizations pretty much did the opposite. It is what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 53 minutes ago, nico002 said: the lockdown corner is not dead- its just the rarest of rare players that literally comes around once every 10 years. There have been like 3 lock down corners in my lifetime. Many corners are marketed as "lockdown" but they just arent Trumaine J. is a Turnstile Corner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gas2No99 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Just now, jack48 said: Trumaine J. is a Turnstile Corner That sounds like a street term for some downtown prostitute in Chelsea. LOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 1 hour ago, sec101row23 said: Exactly. Put the money into pass rushers because you can have the highest paid corners and it won’t make a difference if the QB has all day to throw. Plus, most coaches are smart enough to figure out teams that blitz heavily. Playing lots of man-to-man and blitzing doesn't work too well either anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage69 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 1 hour ago, sec101row23 said: Exactly. Put the money into pass rushers because you can have the highest paid corners and it won’t make a difference if the QB has all day to throw. The rule changes made back in 1978 changed the game.. In those days the D linemen could head slap the O line man on the snap not to mention the NFL changed the blocking rules for offensive linemen back in 1978. Prior to that year, a offensive lineman could only block with his arms folded in toward his body, and his hands closed. Any wonder why Decon Jones said he always had 20 plus sacks a year?? Of course that wasn't a stat until 1982.. Plus different D players could hit a w/r running his route down the field there was no 5 yd rule.. And that's just a few rule changes.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYJ37/12 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 I've stated this in the past: the only positions that matter in the "new" NFL are in order of importance; QB, Oline, WR, pass rusher. That's it. All other positions are irrelevant. Arena football at its finest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 19 minutes ago, NYJ37/12 said: I've stated this is the past: the only positions that matter in the "new" NFL are in order of importance; QB, Oline, WR, pass rusher. That's it. All other positions are irrelevant. Arena football at its finest. Our present gm agrees with you on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupz27 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 5 hours ago, sec101row23 said: After watching the game on Monday night, and really the entire NFL for the last couple years, one thing has become clear and that’s the old lockdown corner is dead. Really, the value of corner backs has been diminished as well, at least what are perceived to be the elite ones. While every other position in the NFL has seen their top contracts grow over the years, the corner back position has actually seen a decrease. Remember Revis making an average salary of $16 million per year in 2013? The top guy now is Josh Norman at $15 million, Trumain Johnson is second at $14.5. The value of having one elite CB is very little now. The old adage that they take away one half of the field was a fallacy to begin with, but now has proven to be completely false. You are better off with 3-4 average corners who can be swapped out and moved around than having the “lockdown” guy with below average supporting cast. You are better off dumping the resources into pass rushers, and spread around the money between all your corners. If you can’t get to the QB you can’t play defense anymore, it’s very simple. I’m not saying you ignore the CB position, but the value of having and paying an elite one has been greatly diminished. Haven’t you heard in the box Safties are the new Lockdown CB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetscrazey Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Revis 2009-2012 was true lockdown. We have some great corners today (Sherman, Ramsey, Peters) but nobody is true lockdown because the offenses have just become more advanced as well as the rule changes. Having 1 elite corner can put you over the top when you have a stacked offense (like the Rams) but you can't build around that kind of player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckkieB Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Consistently good pash rushers have way more value than CB's in the current NFL. The only way to derail a QB running a throw first offensive game plan is to get in his face quickly and make him rush his reads/throws. For the Jets in 2019, a capable OL and WR's are way more important than any other position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRJETS Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 6 hours ago, sec101row23 said: Exactly. Put the money into pass rushers because you can have the highest paid corners and it won’t make a difference if the QB has all day to throw. So you are telling me Truman Johnson ain’t that bad cause he has to deal with Bowles and Rodger scheme giving QB all day. Oh ok thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Lockdown corners go hand in hand with a good pass rush. A great pass rush can turn a good corner into a great corner. No pass rush no lockdown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe W. Namath Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Any defensive position is itrelevant. Stack your offense and plug and play defensive players. The Cheifs have THE worst defense in nfl history and they are one of the favorites to win the super bowl. If Mac takes a defensive player at the top of the draft he should be fired on the spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadienJetsFan Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 7 hours ago, nico002 said: the lockdown corner is not dead- its just the rarest of rare players that literally comes around once every 10 years. There have been like 3 lock down corners in my lifetime. Many corners are marketed as "lockdown" but they just arent Like Trumaine Johnson? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section314 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 21 minutes ago, Smashmouth said: Lockdown corners go hand in hand with a good pass rush. A great pass rush can turn a good corner into a great corner. No pass rush no lockdown So true. I remember fondly the good old days of the Sack Exchange, when people actually thought that Bobby Jackson and Donald Dykes were good corners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuscanyTile2 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Cornerback? As in "player on the defensive side of the ball"? Why would anyone need to discuss that side of the ball in 2018? Defense might as well not even exist anymore in "The League Formerly Known As The NFL". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sec101row23 Posted November 21, 2018 Author Share Posted November 21, 2018 59 minutes ago, DRJETS said: So you are telling me Truman Johnson ain’t that bad cause he has to deal with Bowles and Rodger scheme giving QB all day. Oh ok thanks. That’s not even close to what I was saying. You have clearly missed the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsplayer21 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 7 hours ago, sec101row23 said: After watching the game on Monday night, and really the entire NFL for the last couple years, one thing has become clear and that’s the old lockdown corner is dead. Really, the value of corner backs has been diminished as well, at least what are perceived to be the elite ones. While every other position in the NFL has seen their top contracts grow over the years, the corner back position has actually seen a decrease. Remember Revis making an average salary of $16 million per year in 2013? The top guy now is Josh Norman at $15 million, Trumain Johnson is second at $14.5. The value of having one elite CB is very little now. The old adage that they take away one half of the field was a fallacy to begin with, but now has proven to be completely false. You are better off with 3-4 average corners who can be swapped out and moved around than having the “lockdown” guy with below average supporting cast. You are better off dumping the resources into pass rushers, and spread around the money between all your corners. If you can’t get to the QB you can’t play defense anymore, it’s very simple. I’m not saying you ignore the CB position, but the value of having and paying an elite one has been greatly diminished. And the value of a solid Oline is a lot more important for many reasons.. what does Mac do ? Ignore the OL and patch it with crap, while using premium draft picks and using premium $$ on secondary.. Every good team has adapted, mac is way behind as usual.. Bye bye mac, despite all that coffee, guy is still super sleepy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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