Justin Fields Pro Day 3/30 (for those still holding on)

[jvill 51]

1 hour ago, legler82 said:

RGIII though I don’t think RGIII was as good a passer.

Good call. Pretty much the same size, RG3 faster but agreed on Fields being the better passer. Really wonder what would have happened with RG3 had Washington not completely mismanaged his injury.

[Mogglez]

6 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

hearing fields is lighting it up....

any truth or twitter being twitter?

Very good workout.

[football guy]

8 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

I've been on here for the past year pointing out all the fallacies that have been thrown out there about Fields , what you are saying is just regurgitating things you are hearing from the so called "experts" and no I'm not talking about your Jets front office insiders.  Clearly we will agree to disagree and I'm not wasting my time breaking it all down again as some will never see what they don't want to see. 

It's not regurgitating sh*t. It's trusting what I see and coupling it with what I know. 

[Paradis]

3 minutes ago, football guy said:

They run a full-on spread right now, and I can't see how this could be anywhere close to accurate. RPO and screens are a staple of the Ohio State offense. Maybe they're chalking them up as play-action, but comes off as very misleading above. 

Ultimately the point is that if Fields were to have any chance at producing in his rookie season, he would need to be used the way the Ravens use Jackson. And it's very possible he would thrive in that, but if you took Jackson and asked him to play in the offense we're looking to implement, he would be a bottom 12 QB at best. It's not meant to be a slight, it's just realistic. 

You’re too low on Fields to take your perspective beyond face value. 

[jetsons]

2 hours ago, Guilhermezmc said:

Where my keep Sam Darnold fam at??

right here... trade down and get a plethora of high draft picks for the next several drafts that would keep the jets in contention for the championship for years to come.

[RogerVick1980]

6 minutes ago, bitonti said:

BYU isn't that weak

they have Wilson, a top 5 QB prospect 

they have a draftable WR and 3 draftable OL despite age

they have a sick defense dominated with recruits from pacific island type places and yes they play cupcakes

when Fields plays Indiana, that defense returned 35 letter winners from the year before. When he plays Penn State, half that defense runs 4.4 and I'm talking about the edge rushers too. He got his rib broken vs Clemson on national tv and won, then went out a week later and gutted it out vs Bama

Wilson's career highlight is the Idaho Potato Bowl 

 

Mahomes didn’t win anything in college.. Tebow and Vince Young won tons of games against great teams..

 

Means nothing 

[Ken Schroy]

32 minutes ago, Paradis said:

Justin is something of the underdog this draft cycle, which for me only makes it throb more.  

Yeah you gotta love those "underdogs" that get drafted in the top 5 of the NFL.

[Jackie Treehorn]

1 minute ago, bitonti said:

sheesh i wish 

it's like a joke from a hundred fifty years ago 

the play was supposed to be quite good, fwiw 

 

https://howlround.com/really-how-was-play-mrs-lincoln

Cool, thanks! Amazing I haven’t seen it before. I always thought watching The Big Lebowski would suffice to get educated enough, obviously not...

[JohnnyLV]

I thought Fields was pretty impressive. It was definitely a Pro Day tailored to try and show the 49ers and Jets that he can work in their offense, borrowing liberally from the Wilson set of passes.

Fields showed good accuracy, velocity and a very good long ball.

But I do not think you can compare the Wilson pro day and Fields pro day. Wilson did it effortlessly. Faster release, more zip (at times) more fluid motion. Fields sort of threw at one speed and you could tell he was really working to do some of the throws.

I do find it interesting that Wilson had "bad weight" and was out of shape, when after watching Jones and Fields today both look more labored than he did.

To my eyes as a pure thrower, Fields is excellent, Wilson is signifcantly better and the tape shows that.

Fields is an elite athlete no doubt. I do find it interesting that Wilson is injury prone (having only one injury from actual game play and it was a hand) but Fields is more durable but got injured in the playoff game. 

But it seems to move people are forgetting a lot of what makes a great QB and that is football smarts, anticipation, awareness, play making ability and maybe most important informational retention.

What we see on both film and in these pro days do not even touch on these elements in the evaluation process.

Fields threw better than Jones today. But Jones is know to be fantastic at diagnosing plays, identifying receivers, knowing the offense, making quick decision, foortball intelligence and retention. Those things separate a NFL QB

Wilson is even better in those areas. People go on and on about how great his retention is, his work ethic, his understaning offenses,. and his anticipation, awareness and playmaking ability on the field.

What do we hear about Fields? For the most part that he is a great athlete.

It works for Lamar so maybe that is what you wanted. Paradis suggested it is what he wanted.

To me it is clear that Wilson is the best overall QB prospect in this draft. I would probably rank Fields 5th because I just do not see him adjusting to the speed and complexity of the NFL game. Does not mean in the right situation he cannot be successful for a few years until impact and wear and tear catch up to him. Wilson could be our QB for 15 years, 

[RogerVick1980]

4 minutes ago, football guy said:

They run a full-on spread right now, and I can't see how this could be anywhere close to accurate. RPO and screens are a staple of the Ohio State offense. Maybe they're chalking them up as play-action, but comes off as very misleading above. 

Ultimately the point is that if Fields were to have any chance at producing in his rookie season, he would need to be used the way the Ravens use Jackson. And it's very possible he would thrive in that, but if you took Jackson and asked him to play in the offense we're looking to implement, he would be a bottom 12 QB at best. It's not meant to be a slight, it's just realistic. 

I don’t disagree..

Not sure how accurate that PFF post is..

PFF is more tied to their predictions then anyone because they claim they have some scientific formula nobody else does to rate these guys lol

They are high on Fields so there gonna do what they can to manipulate it to make  him look good.

[Paradis]

3 minutes ago, Ken Schroy said:

Yeah you gotta love those "underdogs" that get drafted in the top 5 of the NFL.

Thanks, Karen. 

[jetsons]

29 minutes ago, Grandy said:

You just know he's going to have a chip on his shoulder if he falls.

you mean like geno ?

[More Cowbell]

3 minutes ago, RogerVick1980 said:

Mahomes didn’t win anything in college.. Tebow and Vince Young won tons of games against great teams..

 

Means nothing 

Sorry, I can't  take anything seriously  from someone who chose Roger Vick as his Forum Name. 

[Morrissey]

Good day for Fields, but his red flags can’t be measured in a pro day workout. 

[kdels62]

4 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

I thought Fields was pretty impressive. It was definitely a Pro Day tailored to try and show the 49ers and Jets that he can work in their offense, borrowing liberally from the Wilson set of passes.

Fields showed good accuracy, velocity and a very good long ball.

But I do not think you can compare the Wilson pro day and Fields pro day. Wilson did it effortlessly. Faster release, more zip (at times) more fluid motion. Fields sort of threw at one speed and you could tell he was really working to do some of the throws.

I do find it interesting that Wilson had "bad weight" and was out of shape, when after watching Jones and Fields today both look more labored than he did.

To my eyes as a pure thrower, Fields is excellent, Wilson is signifcantly better and the tape shows that.

Fields is an elite athlete no doubt. I do find it interesting that Wilson is injury prone (having only one injury from actual game play and it was a hand) but Fields is more durable but got injured in the playoff game. 

But it seems to move people are forgetting a lot of what makes a great QB and that is football smarts, anticipation, awareness, play making ability and maybe most important informational retention.

What we see on both film and in these pro days do not even touch on these elements in the evaluation process.

Fields threw better than Jones today. But Jones is know to be fantastic at diagnosing plays, identifying receivers, knowing the offense, making quick decision, foortball intelligence and retention. Those things separate a NFL QB

Wilson is even better in those areas. People go on and on about how great his retention is, his work ethic, his understaning offenses,. and his anticipation, awareness and playmaking ability on the field.

What do we hear about Fields? For the most part that he is a great athlete.

It works for Lamar so maybe that is what you wanted. Paradis suggested it is what he wanted.

To me it is clear that Wilson is the best overall QB prospect in this draft. I would probably rank Fields 5th because I just do not see him adjusting to the speed and complexity of the NFL game. Does not mean in the right situation he cannot be successful for a few years until impact and wear and tear catch up to him. Wilson could be our QB for 15 years, 

Fields did his workout before his throwing session including running the 40 twice. He had reason to look a bit tired. I don’t even know if Jones sweat at all but he ran less than Wilson or Fields. 

Fields didn’t borrow from Wilson‘a pro day. They both are coached by John Beck who clearly knows how to script a show. The difference in a John Beck Pro Day and a Jordan Palmer pro day is insane. 

[JetBlue]

2 hours ago, RogerVick1980 said:

Where are all these running Qb’s who’ve won Super Bowls?

Brady just won a SB Lamar can’t come back from multiple scores down when teams know he has to pass yet all I hear is you need an extremely fast QB..

Imo you just need a QB who can move his feet and has pocket awareness to avoid a rush..

I think this running Qb thing is a little overblown..

 

 

I guess he means Mahomes and Russell Wilson of late.  Although Allen and Jackson haven't made to a SB they have both made the playoffs so I don't think it is overblown at all.  It is not about running quarterbacks as it is about mobile quarterbacks versus drop back passers.  

[Jetsfan4life90]

50 minutes ago, ToonforPrez said:

Yea i have a 12 year old girl and a 4 year old Boy i'm done haha. I have the best of both world's and happy. 

I want a mix, so if the first two I had were a boy and girl, then I'd probably be content with 2. My girl doesn't really want more than 2 lol. 

[Lurker89]

16 minutes ago, Jackie Treehorn said:

Enlighten a foreigner: is this some sort of an American expression I’ve never come across before or did you just make it up? 

 

12 minutes ago, bitonti said:

sheesh i wish 

it's like a joke from a hundred fifty years ago 

the play was supposed to be quite good, fwiw 

 

https://howlround.com/really-how-was-play-mrs-lincoln

Without forcing you to read a full article, yes it's an expression for missing the point while downplaying someone's complaint or misfortune. ?

[RogerVick1980]

3 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Sorry, I can't  take anything seriously  from someone who chose Roger Vick as his Forum Name. 

Well I’ll try my best over  time  to prove my worth  to more cowbell with my posts.

 

[genot]

4 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Sorry, I can't  take anything seriously  from someone who chose Roger Vick as his Forum Name. 

Sorry. Just had too.

[bitonti]

10 minutes ago, RogerVick1980 said:

Mahomes didn’t win anything in college.. Tebow and Vince Young won tons of games against great teams..

 

Means nothing 

Vince Young won rookie of the year in the NFL

if I told you the Jets would draft a QB at 2 and he'd be rookie of the year, you'd take that outcome, sight unseen. We all would 

 

[HawkeyeJet]

28 minutes ago, football guy said:

Then walk me through a tape study and explain why. Otherwise I can care less what you have to say. Sorry if I sound arrogant but Fields is the most overrated prospect in this draft class. He's an enticing raw talent, but there's nothing about his college game that tells me he will succeed in the NFL unless teams put in years of work to develop him in a way Ohio State didn't and implement a specific offense driven on RPO in order to ease his reads, progression, and decision-making. 

Man, you are a something. 

[JetsFan459]

46 minutes ago, football guy said:

Wilson > Lawrence > Lance > Fields > Jones for me. 

I understand why the 49ers view Jones highly, but I personally don't get drafting him at #3. Yes, there are Joe Burrow comparisons to his game, but I wouldn't say they are apples-to-apples comparisons; he's like Joe Burrow, but didn't show the level of tight-window anticipation or pocket management that Joe did even if their skill sets are similar.

My perspective is that if you're so hellbent on finding a QB that can execute the offense in a way you want them to, take Lance or Fields and coach them up for a year. Lance already has a head start on the nuances of the position from a pro's perspective just needs to work on consistency, whereas Fields has the talent but needs to learn the nuances of the position, NFL offense, and reading defenses. The argument for those guys is Mahomes: he wouldn't have been able to run Reid's offense year 1, but he learned a lot in year one and at the same time gave Reid more reason to be creative with his scheme, play-design, and play-calling once he got a first hand look how Mahomes' evolved through his first full year. Lance and Fields don't have Mahomes' processor, but similarly could leave Shanahan feeling more willing to incorporate more deep-passing and designed runs in his offense after getting a feel for these guys and their development after a full season.  

I think Jones will be a good NFL QB in the right scheme, just as I think all of these guys can be good NFL QBs if they land in the right situation, but from a pure upside perspective I have them rated as I do above. If you need a QB to start right away I can see why your argument would be for Jones, but absent that why not take Lance or Fields and give him the year to learn?

I agree with you, I think Wilson is the best in the class. I've been wondering if the Jets have Wilson rated higher than Lawrence. I'd bet that Douglas would draft Lawrence if we had the number one pick

[RogerVick1980]

Just now, bitonti said:

Vince Young won rookie of the year in the NFL

if I told you the Jets would draft a QB at 2 and he'd be rookie of the year, you'd take that outcome, sight unseen. We all would 

 

ROY and then out of the league in a few years?

Holy sh*t I know the bars low but I’ll still  pass 

[Jet Nut]

22 minutes ago, genot said:

Just an opinion. They want Pitts. He'd be long gone at #12.

3 #1s for a TE?

No

[56mehl56]

8 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

Fields did his workout before his throwing session including running the 40 twice. He had reason to look a bit tired. I don’t even know if Jones sweat at all but he ran less than Wilson or Fields. 

Fields didn’t borrow from Wilson‘a pro day. They both are coached by John Beck who clearly knows how to script a show. The difference in a John Beck Pro Day and a Jordan Palmer pro day is insane. 

Thank You . Someone gets it.

[jvill 51]

2 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

Fields threw better than Jones today. But Jones is know to be fantastic at diagnosing plays, identifying receivers, knowing the offense, making quick decision, foortball intelligence and retention. Those things separate a NFL QB

What do we hear about Fields? For the most part that he is a great athlete.

It works for Lamar so maybe that is what you wanted. Paradis suggested it is what he wanted.

This is where people lose me in this whole debate. I’ll try and find the exact stat but Jones had the worst passer rating of any of the top QBs when forced off their first read. The “quick decision making” is largely offensive design.

Fields is first and foremost a passer. In fact I kind of wish he looked to run more. I can’t see how anybody watches the tape and compares his style of play to Lamar Jackson. For people to boil down Justin Fields to “just an athlete” is pure nonsense. His athletic ability is just icing on the cake to his ability as a passer.

[ToonforPrez]

8 minutes ago, Jetsfan4life90 said:

I want a mix, so if the first two I had were a boy and girl, then I'd probably be content with 2. My girl doesn't really want more than 2 lol. 

Better pump out a girl and boy pal i have friends that have pumped out girl after girl and the wife saying yep i'm done lol 

[Jet Nut]

24 minutes ago, Scotty Wooty Doo Doo said:

Dont act like OSU played ALL top 20 teams ,,, they didnt !  Every year they consistently beat some team by scoring 70 points .

Which is the opposite of what I said

[football guy]

18 minutes ago, Paradis said:

You’re too low on Fields to take your perspective beyond face value. 

If we were the Baltimore Ravens, running Greg Roman's offense I'd probably have him as my 2nd or 3rd QB. We're not. If you told me that he may get the luxury of sitting for 2-3 years maybe I'd move him ahead of Lance for the sole reason that I think Fields is a more natural thrower, but it's close.

In Fields, I see an elite athlete with good throwing mechanics (which helps further indicate that he's coachable), high level character/toughness/poise, and an accurate deep ball. I don't see a player who has any sense of feel for pressure or pocket awareness, I don't see a player who sees the whole field or even half of it for that matter (I see someone who can only see the field in thirds), I see someone who is slow to work through progressions and has a slow processor (partially due to his field vision), and I don't see someone who knows how to manipulate the defense with his eyes (has a tendency to lock on a target).

Far more concerning than any of that is the offense he was coached in... he wasn't asked to do ANYTHING most team's QBs needs to do in the NFL to stick on a roster, let alone be a starting QB. Now if I get him on the board and he impresses that would make me feel better about his ability to learn, but I'd still feel he's a year away from actually starting. Although this offense removes pressure from QBs intra-game, it doesn't mean learning the offense and performing the tasks required to make it work is a walk in the park. We're running a complex, pro-style scheme that asks the QB to full digest and recall the playbook, read the defense, call out protections, make quick-and-decisive decisions, and be able to throw on the run whether it be off-platform or not. 

I get it if fans like Fields. I don't dislike him. I just know that if he were to be drafted by the Jets, we would be so disappointed. The very thought of it gives me severe anxiety. 

[Lurker89]

8 minutes ago, RogerVick1980 said:

Well I’ll try my best over  time  to prove my worth  to more cowbell with my posts.

 

No need a trash compactor has better takes than he does.

[Jet Nut]

24 minutes ago, bitonti said:

BYU isn't that weak

they have Wilson, a top 5 QB prospect 

they have a draftable WR and 3 draftable OL despite age

they have a sick defense dominated with recruits from pacific island type places and yes they play cupcakes

when Fields plays Indiana, that defense returned 35 letter winners from the year before. When he plays Penn State, half that defense runs 4.4 and I'm talking about the edge rushers too. He got his rib broken vs Clemson on national tv and won, then went out a week later and gutted it out vs Bama

Wilson's career highlight is the Idaho Potato Bowl 

 

OK, now BYU is a powerhouse.

Because of Wilson.  But then Wilson benefits from their 30 year old OL.  But then....

The level of comp isnt similar.  BYU doesnt dominate their schedule the way OSU does.  

Its not even my argument.  I watch the player, you keep whining about the teams and the competition.   I like Fields but Wilson is the better QB because he processes plays better.  

[football guy]

7 minutes ago, JetsFan459 said:

I agree with you, I think Wilson is the best in the class. I've been wondering if the Jets have Wilson rated higher than Lawrence. I'd bet that Douglas would draft Lawrence if we had the number one pick

We'll know soon enough. I think any team who blinds out coach-speak, group-think, and archaic evaluation methods should see Wilson as the top QB in the draft. Trevor Lawrence is overrated as well, but not to the point where he's not worthy of going top 3. I just don't see him as a generational prospect. 

[Jet Nut]

26 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

A lot of their guys are Redshirt Juniors and Seniors sometimes due to missions the Mormons go on as part of college life. Some of these are a few years older are more mature than the comp they are facing.  

I get that, I know how Mormons are brought up having worked for a company based in Provo and spending a hell of a lot of time in Utah.  A couple of OL that are older doesnt necessarily  mean theyre better though

[Paradis]

I've seen this movie before....

Somehow this guy winds up in the filthy hands of BB and McDaniels in NE - where they turn him into the next Sith Lord... Meanwhile, Zach Wilson predictably Pennington's his shoulder year 2 and we enter into another dark era of Patriots rule, the likes of which many of us will not survive.