How many Day 1 Starters from this offseason?

[JohnnyLV]

I see a lot of people predicting like 5 wins for us and I just do not see it. We are dramatically upgraded at some many positions:

LOCKS (offense): Zach, AVT, E. Moore, Corey Davis, Keelan Cole

Likely (offense): Michael Carter 1 

Possible (offense): Yeboah Tevin Coleman

LOCKS (defense); Lawson, Jarrad Davis, Michael Carter 2

Likely (defense):  Sheldon Rankins, Pinnock, 1 of Sherwood/Nasrildeen

Possible: Echols

Special teams: Hardee

So 6 or 7 new on offense (all upgrades) 5 or 6 on defense (all upgrades)

And someone might still surprise -plus we get some injured players back like Moseley, Mims, Phillips and young players like T. Johnson Adams Guidry, Jackson Berrios etc with more experience

I mean we could start like 60% new players on both sides of the ball. Plus better systems. We are not going to be a bad team. 

[k-met57]

1 hour ago, johnnysd said:

I see a lot of people predicting like 5 wins for us and I just do not see it. We are dramatically upgraded at some many positions:

LOCKS (offense): Zach, AVT, E. Moore, Corey Davis, Keelan Cole

Likely (offense): Michael Carter 1 

Possible (offense): Yeboah Tevin Coleman

LOCKS (defense); Lawson, Jarrad Davis, Michael Carter 2

Likely (defense):  Sheldon Rankins, Pinnock, 1 of Sherwood/Nasrildeen

Possible: Echols

Special teams: Hardee

So 6 or 7 new on offense (all upgrades) 5 or 6 on defense (all upgrades)

And someone might still surprise -plus we get some injured players back like Moseley, Mims, Phillips and young players like T. Johnson Adams Guidry, Jackson Berrios etc with more experience

I mean we could start like 60% new players on both sides of the ball. Plus better systems. We are not going to be a bad team. 

you are massively overrating a majority of the players.

i am not even sure Yeboah makes the team, maybe PS. He isnt a blocker, and the jets will likely keep Herndon as the receiving TE

Carter 2, Pinnock, Sherwood, Nasrildeen will not start either, we'll be lucky if all of these mid/late round picks are contributing anything year 1....hopefully they sure up special teams

The strength of this year over last year is going to the the upgrades at receiver, RB, AVT and the return of Mosley.

The wildcard for me is the draft class from last year, and how much progress the 3rd year guys can make.

If Wilson is a HR, we can go 8-8, if he has the rookie yips we'll be lucky to see 5 wins.

[Jetsfan80]

You said the Jets would be good last year and that you “didn’t understand” why people thought we’d be bad.

Maybe in 2022 they’ll be good.  If Wilson looks like the real deal that’s a distinct possibility.

But 2021 will probably be bad and that’s ok.  Just let them be bad.

[jetstream23]

15 hours ago, johnnysd said:

I see a lot of people predicting like 5 wins for us and I just do not see it. We are dramatically upgraded at some many positions:

LOCKS (offense): Zach, AVT, E. Moore, Corey Davis, Keelan Cole

Likely (offense): Michael Carter 1 

Possible (offense): Yeboah Tevin Coleman

 

Just addressing the offense, I think Moore has a shot but despite Crowder's situation he's still the placeholder in the slot.  Keelan Cole looks good but that WR2 spot will be competitive with Mims.  In short, not sure how you can call those two "locks."

I think Carter and Coleman will share something like 80%+ of the carries at RB.  The "starter" will almost definitely be Coleman.  But that term starter doesn't mean much these days.  Coleman could start.  Carter could get 60% of the touches in a game.

Yeboah looks good.  But not sure about him being TE1.

[AFJF]

8 hours ago, k-met57 said:

you are massively overrating a majority of the players.

i am not even sure Yeboah makes the team, maybe PS. He isnt a blocker, and the jets will likely keep Herndon as the receiving TE

Carter 2, Pinnock, Sherwood, Nasrildeen will not start either, we'll be lucky if all of these mid/late round picks are contributing anything year 1....hopefully they sure up special teams

The strength of this year over last year is going to the the upgrades at receiver, RB, AVT and the return of Mosley.

The wildcard for me is the draft class from last year, and how much progress the 3rd year guys can make.

If Wilson is a HR, we can go 8-8, if he has the rookie yips we'll be lucky to see 5 wins.

Yeboah isn't a great blocker but he's much better than a lot of current NFL TE's who are barely willing to get in the way when a defender is coming at them.

 

[JustInFudge]

These guys suck.  Different does make it better. 

[Long Island Leprechaun]

12 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

These guys suck.  Different does make it better. 

Ergo: different suckers make it better. Hey, Jude.

[DetroitRed]

The most concerning part is the same O line with a rookie 

[Jethead]

I think your point is valid. Big influx of talented youngsters. Good reason to believe the Jets will be overachievers in 2021. I would rather have our roster that Miami or NE.

J-e-t-s,....

[kdels62]

If you catch me being a Jets fan, I’ll tell you 11 wins.

If you catch me as an NFL fan, I’ll tell you between 5-8 wins. 

So much depends on the right outcomes related to Wilson’s play, Becton’s health, Mosley’s return, and DL performance. There’s a lot that has to break right for the team to succeed, a lot less has to break wrong for the team to be bad.

[The Crusher]

1 hour ago, JiFapono said:

These guys suck.  Different does make it better. 

Whatevs, at a minimum they double and possibly triple last years win total. 

[Lith]

Does the term "starter" really mean much in today's NFL.  On offense, the only meaningful starters are QB and OL.  WR, RB, TE are all rotational positions based on matchups. Similar on defense, where you have a handful of guys who play 3 downs, while most guys rotate in and out situationally.

I would expect to see significant amounts of playing time for a lot of the new acquisitions: Davis, Cole, Coleman, Carter, Moore will all get a lot of PT.  Zach and AVT will start.  On defense, Rannkins, Curry, Lawson, Davis, Joyner will be in the regular rotation.  As for the defensive rookies, still a lot of offseason to go before we can draw any conclusions about Nasirildeen, Sherwood, Pinnock, Carter, Echols, Dunn, etc.  Some of these guys wll likely only play on STs as rookies.  Maybe 1 or 2 will break into the regular rotation.

There will be a lot of new faces on the field next year including a rookie QB.  How quickly it will all come together, still way too early to tell.  6-8 wins seems reasonable.

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, JiFapono said:

These guys suck.  Different does make it better. 

And you know they all suck how exactly?  
 

[NYJ1]

12 hours ago, johnnysd said:

I see a lot of people predicting like 5 wins for us and I just do not see it. We are dramatically upgraded at some many positions:

LOCKS (offense): Zach, AVT, E. Moore, Corey Davis, Keelan Cole

Likely (offense): Michael Carter 1 

Possible (offense): Yeboah Tevin Coleman

LOCKS (defense); Lawson, Jarrad Davis, Michael Carter 2

Likely (defense):  Sheldon Rankins, Pinnock, 1 of Sherwood/Nasrildeen

Possible: Echols

Special teams: Hardee

So 6 or 7 new on offense (all upgrades) 5 or 6 on defense (all upgrades)

And someone might still surprise -plus we get some injured players back like Moseley, Mims, Phillips and young players like T. Johnson Adams Guidry, Jackson Berrios etc with more experience

I mean we could start like 60% new players on both sides of the ball. Plus better systems. We are not going to be a bad team. 

I agree with you SD. My feeling is this team should be vastly improved. Joe Douglas has his fingerprints all over this roster now. I'm a little reluctant to point out the Jets insane lack of talent roster wide now? I really don't know how quickly this team will play their best ball but the end product should be much better than the garbage we saw the last 10 or so years. I think the Jets are a 7-10 team this season. 8-9 if they do acquire Moses. I don't know where these predictions of 5-12 come from? I'm not hearing that from anyone that's actually in the know and not just running their mouth.

[The Crusher]

39 minutes ago, Lith said:

Does the term "starter" really mean much in today's NFL.  On offense, the only meaningful starters are QB and OL.  WR, RB, TE are all rotational positions based on matchups. Similar on defense, where you have a handful of guys who play 3 downs, while most guys rotate in and out situationally.

I would expect to see significant amounts of playing time for a lot of the new acquisitions: Davis, Cole, Coleman, Carter, Moore, Cole, will all get a lot of PT.  Zach and AVT will start.  On defense, Rannkins, Curry, Lawson, Davis, Joyner will be in the regular rotation.  As for the defensive rookies, still a lot of offseason to go before we can draw any conclusions about Nasirildeen, Sherwood, Pinnock, Carter, Echols, Dunn, etc.  Some of these guys wll likely only play on STs as rookies.  Maybe 1 or 2 will break into the regular rotation.

There will be a lot of new faces on the field next year including a rookie QB.  How quickly it will all come together, still way too early to tell.  6-8 wins seems reasonable.

Well damn, that was a very good post. Thank you. 

[slats]

The Jets were a two win team last year.
 
This year, they have a rookie head coach, rookie OC, and a rookie QB on the youngest team in the league installing a new system on each side of the ball. That’s why Vegas has them at 6 wins, and that feels about right. 
 
Most of the offseason work was done on offense, where most fans wanted it done. If Davis, AVT, Moore, and, of course, Zach and LaFluer can create a more dynamic offense that actually puts more points on the board, then what you’re gonna see is the defense getting challenged for the first time in years. 
 
On defense, the only work done was desperately needed pass rush help. That front four needs to be both great and deep because everything behind them is a question mark. Ulbrich talks about the secondary getting a baptism by fire and the inference there is that they’re going to get burned. This cover 3 gets spoken about like it’s super easy for CBs, and we don’t need great individual players there as a result. That may be true, but only once everyone understands it and is on the same page with one another. 
 
I’m just hoping to see a team that improves over the course of the season, and a product that’s more entertaining to watch. That’s  what I’m expecting; some higher scoring losses with a stronger second half of the year. 

[slats]

7 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

I think Carter and Coleman will share something like 80%+ of the carries at RB.  The "starter" will almost definitely be Coleman.  But that term starter doesn't mean much these days.  Coleman could start.  Carter could get 60% of the touches in a game.

I expect a true RBBC approach with Coleman being the designated obvious passing down back. I don’t see why a fourth round rookie would automatically jump Johnson and Adams, I think both of those guys could be very successful in this system. I think they’ll go with the hot hand. Be interesting to see what happens with Perine. 

[FidelioJet]

13 hours ago, johnnysd said:

I see a lot of people predicting like 5 wins for us and I just do not see it. We are dramatically upgraded at some many positions:

LOCKS (offense): Zach, AVT, E. Moore, Corey Davis, Keelan Cole

Likely (offense): Michael Carter 1 

Possible (offense): Yeboah Tevin Coleman

LOCKS (defense); Lawson, Jarrad Davis, Michael Carter 2

Likely (defense):  Sheldon Rankins, Pinnock, 1 of Sherwood/Nasrildeen

Possible: Echols

Special teams: Hardee

So 6 or 7 new on offense (all upgrades) 5 or 6 on defense (all upgrades)

And someone might still surprise -plus we get some injured players back like Moseley, Mims, Phillips and young players like T. Johnson Adams Guidry, Jackson Berrios etc with more experience

I mean we could start like 60% new players on both sides of the ball. Plus better systems. We are not going to be a bad team. 

 

this is all true, but the reason you win 5 games if you have a rookie QB.  This team can win 12 games a year from now.  The potential talent is there, but it's just tough to win with Rookie QB's especially when you're counting on the offense to be the better side.

[Jethead]

9 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

 

this is all true, but the reason you win 5 games if you have a rookie QB.  This team can win 12 games a year from now.  The potential talent is there, but it's just tough to win with Rookie QB's especially when you're counting on the offense to be the better side.

As Zach goes, so go the Jets. Andale!

[Jetsfan80]

31 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

 

this is all true, but the reason you win 5 games if you have a rookie QB.  This team can win 12 games a year from now.  The potential talent is there, but it's just tough to win with Rookie QB's especially when you're counting on the offense to be the better side.

Very true.  The offense needs to be excellent this season in order to win a lot of games.

The Jets haven’t generated a pass rush since something like 2005, and now we’re rolling out a scheme that depends on having all 4 guys on the DL doing it. Even with the pass rushing additions this offseason that’s most certainly not going to happen over night.  There’s too many unknowns in the pass rushing department to be able to count on it. 

Hence why I anticipate a 1st round pick going towards a pass rusher in 2022, as well as another acquisition or 2 to help in that area.

[JohnnyLV]

34 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

 

this is all true, but the reason you win 5 games if you have a rookie QB.  This team can win 12 games a year from now.  The potential talent is there, but it's just tough to win with Rookie QB's especially when you're counting on the offense to be the better side.

I think that Zach in his rookie season will be better at QB than Sam at any point in his career. Not all Sam's fault, but not only is Zach a WAY better prospect than Sam, his situation is almost dramatically better than Sam ever had. I also think Zach will make the OL better. I need to look up what I said last year but I really think the rookies will be really good and we are a borderline playoff team 

[FidelioJet]

7 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

I think that Zach in his rookie season will be better at QB than Sam at any point in his career. Not all Sam's fault, but not only is Zach a WAY better prospect than Sam, his situation is almost dramatically better than Sam ever had. I also think Zach will make the OL better. I need to look up what I said last year but I really think the rookies will be really good and we are a borderline playoff team 

I agree.  I think we're going to see an NFL offense for the first time in almost a decade.  Zach is going to impress and the offense will get us excited for the future.

But the team and ZW are going to have to learn how to win - It's going to take a year or two.  I really think this team will look very good but still win 5 or 6 games.  Just my opinion.

[JohnnyLV]

50 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I agree.  I think we're going to see an NFL offense for the first time in almost a decade.  Zach is going to impress and the offense will get us excited for the future.

But the team and ZW are going to have to learn how to win - It's going to take a year or two.  I really think this team will look very good but still win 5 or 6 games.  Just my opinion.

You could be right.  The fan in my last year was saying we would win 10 games but I am not sure I really believed that. I was already super mistrustful of Gase and I still thought Sam would "get it", but he didn't.

I feel really confident this year. The point I was making was how significantly our starters are upgraded, and how much better the systems and coaching are. Pollak was a horrible OL coach we now have on regarded near the very top of the NFL.

I see the team being loose and having fun.  We drafted for need early and they will reap rewards. I still believe Zach is the best college QB I have ever seen. And unlike Sam who sucked really bad at OTAs Zach has shined. And we are giving him 100% of the reps which always drove me nuts when coaches would do a complete BS competition and only really accomplish giving the young guy less reps.

I am always a Jets glass 3/4 full guy but I have much more conviction this year. I am even going to put a few hundred on the Jets making the playoffs and I generally DO NOT gamble. Last bet I placed was on Braylon Edwards to score the first touchdown in our playoff game and won! that was awesome. But I don't gamble as a rule.

[Death2NE]

You could be right.  The fan in my last year was saying we would win 10 games but I am not sure I really believed that. I was already super mistrustful of Gase and I still thought Sam would "get it", but he didn't.
I feel really confident this year. The point I was making was how significantly our starters are upgraded, and how much better the systems and coaching are. Pollak was a horrible OL coach we now have on regarded near the very top of the NFL.
I see the team being loose and having fun.  We drafted for need early and they will reap rewards. I still believe Zach is the best college QB I have ever seen. And unlike Sam who sucked really bad at OTAs Zach has shined. And we are giving him 100% of the reps which always drove me nuts when coaches would do a complete BS competition and only really accomplish giving the young guy less reps.
I am always a Jets glass 3/4 full guy but I have much more conviction this year. I am even going to put a few hundred on the Jets making the playoffs and I generally DO NOT gamble. Last bet I placed was on Braylon Edwards to score the first touchdown in our playoff game and won! that was awesome. But I don't gamble as a rule.

Couldn’t agree more , Jets over 6 wins to me is so likely I think it’s a no-brainer bet … then if Wilson is even average , we get some health luck and Saleh proves to be a good hire a 7 seed isn’t impossible at 5-1 odds (I don’t know how it’s not even more considering we have a 6 game total and are 20-1 to win the division ) and speaking of that , if you with those two bets why not just throw a little on winning the division at 20-1 , a josh Allen injury would probably cut those odds 75% . But Jets over 6 is about as confident as I’ve ever been for a bet .

I don’t think fans are fully appreciate yet how obvious it is that we have a GM who has an actual plan that he sticks too and a team building philosophy that myself and most of you probably agree with . Just the fact that we have at least 3 positional groups in DL , RB, WR where people aren’t going to make the roster but get signed to someone else’s active roster after cuts is such a far cry from the razor thin depth this team had last year . Douglas changed the team hierarchy structure to function like normal instead of backwards like the Jets always seem to be . Just think about the roster as is right now , outside of a number 1 corner and some cb depth (which could already be on roster but I’ll just include it) , what is the GLARING hole on this roster . We could use upgrades at rg, rt, olb, safety next to Maye , maybe another tight end threat to play ahead or along Herndon , those are all positions currently filled by guys who are at least capable and some of them have players drafted by Douglas who maybe step up and fill those but none are glaring weaknesses except a big time corner or olb. The system this offense is going to model doesn’t need a true #1 wr , of course having that player is nice but we have a group that all excel at certain ranges on the field and things that fit the mold of the 49ers style offense . All this in mind and we still have cap space , and just an insane amount of high value picks next draft . If Wilson and Saleh are just capable (I think both are better especially Saleh) this team is going to surprise this season and one more offseason with the resources we have could be playing in serious playoff games in 2022


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[Death2NE]

Couldn’t agree more , Jets over 6 wins to me is so likely I think it’s a no-brainer bet … then if Wilson is even average , we get some health luck and Saleh proves to be a good hire a 7 seed isn’t impossible at 5-1 odds (I don’t know how it’s not even more considering we have a 6 game total and are 20-1 to win the division ) and speaking of that , if you with those two bets why not just throw a little on winning the division at 20-1 , a josh Allen injury would probably cut those odds 75% . But Jets over 6 is about as confident as I’ve ever been for a bet .

I don’t think fans are fully appreciate yet how obvious it is that we have a GM who has an actual plan that he sticks too and a team building philosophy that myself and most of you probably agree with . Just the fact that we have at least 3 positional groups in DL , RB, WR where people aren’t going to make the roster but get signed to someone else’s active roster after cuts is such a far cry from the razor thin depth this team had last year . Douglas changed the team hierarchy structure to function like normal instead of backwards like the Jets always seem to be . Just think about the roster as is right now , outside of a number 1 corner and some cb depth (which could already be on roster but I’ll just include it) , what is the GLARING hole on this roster . We could use upgrades at rg, rt, olb, safety next to Maye , maybe another tight end threat to play ahead or along Herndon , those are all positions currently filled by guys who are at least capable and some of them have players drafted by Douglas who maybe step up and fill those but none are glaring weaknesses except a big time corner or olb. The system this offense is going to model doesn’t need a true #1 wr , of course having that player is nice but we have a group that all excel at certain ranges on the field and things that fit the mold of the 49ers style offense . All this in mind and we still have cap space , and just an insane amount of high value picks next draft . If Wilson and Saleh are just capable (I think both are better especially Saleh) this team is going to surprise this season and one more offseason with the resources we have could be playing in serious playoff games in 2022


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The return of Mosley is being seriously underrated too, the idea that a guy like Mosley is a question mark bc he hasn’t played in two years is just stupid , you don’t forget how to play the game the worst that can be said is he has a little rust to shake off but I’m not even sure that’s something that carries into the start of the regular season . It’s adding a a top 5 player in the league at the position to the LB group ,we already incredibly bolstered the pass rush and have plenty of run stuffers and a stud safety , the other guys just need to not be a complete liability and the d will be solid , if the other guys are more than that the def is going to be top 5-8.

If Dak wasn’t the biggest lock of all time for comeback player of the year mosley at like 50-1 (maybe even more) would have been a nice long shot bet


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[PepPep]

15 hours ago, k-met57 said:

you are massively overrating a majority of the players.

i am not even sure Yeboah makes the team, maybe PS. He isnt a blocker, and the jets will likely keep Herndon as the receiving TE

Carter 2, Pinnock, Sherwood, Nasrildeen will not start either, we'll be lucky if all of these mid/late round picks are contributing anything year 1....hopefully they sure up special teams

The strength of this year over last year is going to the the upgrades at receiver, RB, AVT and the return of Mosley.

The wildcard for me is the draft class from last year, and how much progress the 3rd year guys can make.

If Wilson is a HR, we can go 8-8, if he has the rookie yips we'll be lucky to see 5 wins.

I mean you have a point but you kind of contradict yourself. lol. "The strength of this year over last year is going to the the upgrades at receiver, RB, AVT and the return of Mosley." That right there is a lot. And I think you can add QB to that list. True, we simply don't know if Z.Wilson will be legit or bust HOWEVER, in this system, with the upgraded O-line an receiving corps, you've gotta think he is and upgrade over Darnold's play last year and the year before. You also forgot a huge addition in Lawson. Adding him to this stacked D-line should open up a lot of opportunities to cause havoc in backfield. This is simply a more talented, deeper team. And I think it will be a team that is well coached and wins more games- however we will only find that out once the season gets going. 

To put this team is the best position to win JD needs to swing a trade for Nick Foles and sign Morgan Moses. I don't know if we have the cap for that but it would secure two critical weak spots that really hurt the team if Z.Wilson or Becton get injured. If it meant losing Crowder to clear cap so we can make these two moves happen, so be it.  

[LIJetsFan]

4 hours ago, slats said:

The Jets were a two win team last year.
 
This year, they have a rookie head coach, rookie OC, and a rookie QB on the youngest team in the league installing a new system on each side of the ball. That’s why Vegas has them at 6 wins, and that feels about right. 
 
Most of the offseason work was done on offense, where most fans wanted it done. If Davis, AVT, Moore, and, of course, Zach and LaFluer can create a more dynamic offense that actually puts more points on the board, then what you’re gonna see is the defense getting challenged for the first time in years. 
 
On defense, the only work done was desperately needed pass rush help. That front four needs to be both great and deep because everything behind them is a question mark. Ulbrich talks about the secondary getting a baptism by fire and the inference there is that they’re going to get burned. This cover 3 gets spoken about like it’s super easy for CBs, and we don’t need great individual players there as a result. That may be true, but only once everyone understands it and is on the same page with one another. 
 
I’m just hoping to see a team that improves over the course of the season, and a product that’s more entertaining to watch. That’s  what I’m expecting; some higher scoring losses with a stronger second half of the year. 

lol you guys talk like every other team we play is stacked to the hilt and hasn't anything on the roster wish list.  We'll do fine this year v.s. any number of teams. 

Gase was a HUGE addition by subtraction.  Please keep that in mind when looking at last years team.  

I think we are most definitely a 7+ win team this year based on these two factors alone.  If Zack has a "good" rookie year we'll do even better.    

[Fantasy Island]

18 hours ago, johnnysd said:

I see a lot of people predicting like 5 wins for us and I just do not see it. We are dramatically upgraded at some many positions:

LOCKS (offense): Zach, AVT, E. Moore, Corey Davis, Keelan Cole

Likely (offense): Michael Carter 1 

Possible (offense): Yeboah Tevin Coleman

LOCKS (defense); Lawson, Jarrad Davis, Michael Carter 2

Likely (defense):  Sheldon Rankins, Pinnock, 1 of Sherwood/Nasrildeen

Possible: Echols

Special teams: Hardee

So 6 or 7 new on offense (all upgrades) 5 or 6 on defense (all upgrades)

And someone might still surprise -plus we get some injured players back like Moseley, Mims, Phillips and young players like T. Johnson Adams Guidry, Jackson Berrios etc with more experience

I mean we could start like 60% new players on both sides of the ball. Plus better systems. We are not going to be a bad team. 

That f*** is going to lay out again or get hurt within the first 4 weeks,  Book it!

[JustInFudge]

6 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

And you know they all suck how exactly?  
 

I said so. 

[Snook]

18 hours ago, johnnysd said:

And someone might still surprise -plus we get some injured players back like Moseley, Mims, Phillips and young players like T. Johnson Adams Guidry, Jackson Berrios etc with more experience

For the price of a period you could have just typed in the y.  ?

[JohnnyLV]

42 minutes ago, Snook said:

For the price of a period you could have just typed in the y.  ?

I have this program that lets you type in abbreviations for words or entire sentences. I use it for work for work a lot. Well the stupid thing defaults t...y to thank you and I was too tired to figure out how to disable it.

[JohnnyLV]

Just now, johnnysd said:

I have this program that lets you type in abbreviations for words or entire sentences. I use it for work for work a lot. Well the stupid thing defaults t...y to thank you and I was too tired to figure out how to disable it.

ty----ty ty ty...figured out how to disable it

[clayton163v]

19 hours ago, johnnysd said:

I see a lot of people predicting like 5 wins for us and I just do not see it. We are dramatically upgraded at some many positions:

LOCKS (offense): Zach, AVT, E. Moore, Corey Davis, Keelan Cole

Likely (offense): Michael Carter 1 

Possible (offense): Yeboah Tevin Coleman

LOCKS (defense); Lawson, Jarrad Davis, Michael Carter 2

Likely (defense):  Sheldon Rankins, Pinnock, 1 of Sherwood/Nasrildeen

Possible: Echols

Special teams: Hardee

So 6 or 7 new on offense (all upgrades) 5 or 6 on defense (all upgrades)

And someone might still surprise -plus we get some injured players back like Moseley, Mims, Phillips and young players like T. Johnson Adams Guidry, Jackson Berrios etc with more experience

I mean we could start like 60% new players on both sides of the ball. Plus better systems. We are not going to be a bad team. 

I like your general point that we have upgraded across the roster.  But to extrapolate that into a playoff team is a bit much.  The good side is that we have gotten younger.  No more castoffs from the Colts as a band aid in the secondary and in with a large group of late round picks in the hope of finding a mix of talents to make the Saleh scheme work.  But do not forget your Bill Parcells:  "You will lose a game for every rookie you start."  By your own admission, there will be rookies playing in the regular offense and defense across the entire team.  They are going to make mistakes.

17 hours ago, k-met57 said:

The strength of this year over last year is going to the the upgrades at receiver, RB, AVT and the return of Mosley.

This is so true.  The upgrades at wide receiver are not only obvious but give us more prototype players.  No more playing a slot receiver on the outside.  I like Crowder, but that scared nobody.  Remember your Bill Parcells: "you cannot compromise your prototypes".  At wide receiver, we did and paid the price. 

The wildcard for me is the draft class from last year, and how much progress the 3rd year guys can make.

This is also true.  Mims, Becton and Hall are now key players.  If Zuniga, Davis and Clark can step up it will go a long way towards improving the bottom line.

If Wilson is a HR, we can go 8-8, if he has the rookie yips we'll be lucky to see 5 wins.

This.  Not much else to say. 

 

8 hours ago, AFJF said:

Yeboah isn't a great blocker but he's much better than a lot of current NFL TE's who are barely willing to get in the way when a defender is coming at them.

 

I like Yeboah.  But his value lies in how quickly he can add 10 to 20 lbs of muscle to his angular frame so he can play inline for us.  He is not going to beat out Corey Davis for H-back duty.  His career lies inside and the scouting report said as much.  If he wasn't already 23 and a long strider, he would have been drafted.  I think it unlikely that he can block well enough to dislodge Herndon as a rookie.  But he does have real potential. 

7 hours ago, kdels62 said:

If you catch me being a Jets fan, I’ll tell you 11 wins.

If you catch me as an NFL fan, I’ll tell you between 5-8 wins. 

So much depends on the right outcomes related to Wilson’s play, Becton’s health, Mosley’s return, and DL performance. There’s a lot that has to break right for the team to succeed, a lot less has to break wrong for the team to be bad.

Correct.  I honestly see us as a 5-8 win team given our relatively easy schedule.  A turnaround to a playoff team is so unlikely.  Look at the Chargers and Bengals.  By all accounts they struck gold in Justin Herbert and Joe Barrow but went 7-9 and 4-11.  No playoff teams there and I would be delighted with Wilson equaling Herbert or Barrow's production.

6 hours ago, Lith said:

Does the term "starter" really mean much in today's NFL.  On offense, the only meaningful starters are QB and OL.  WR, RB, TE are all rotational positions based on matchups. Similar on defense, where you have a handful of guys who play 3 downs, while most guys rotate in and out situationally.

I would expect to see significant amounts of playing time for a lot of the new acquisitions: Davis, Cole, Coleman, Carter, Moore will all get a lot of PT.  Zach and AVT will start.  On defense, Rannkins, Curry, Lawson, Davis, Joyner will be in the regular rotation.  As for the defensive rookies, still a lot of offseason to go before we can draw any conclusions about Nasirildeen, Sherwood, Pinnock, Carter, Echols, Dunn, etc.  Some of these guys wll likely only play on STs as rookies.  Maybe 1 or 2 will break into the regular rotation.

There will be a lot of new faces on the field next year including a rookie QB.  How quickly it will all come together, still way too early to tell.  6-8 wins seems reasonable.

I agree with all of this post.  The key point is "how quickly it will all come together".  We are fielding a new guys everywhere.  It was a tear down, not a rebuild.

5 hours ago, slats said:

The Jets were a two win team last year.

Not only that but for the first half of the season, we were not competitive at all.  There were times when the offense line was overwhelmed - particularly inside - as defenses lost all respect for the deep pass and presented eight and nine man fronts. 

This year, they have a rookie head coach, rookie OC, and a rookie QB on the youngest team in the league installing a new system on each side of the ball. That’s why Vegas has them at 6 wins, and that feels about right. 

This is the most important point in this thread.  With new offenses and defenses along with a rookie QB it is going to take time to implement these new systems.  Only the wide zone blocking scheme has continuity.  

 
Most of the offseason work was done on offense, where most fans wanted it done. If Davis, AVT, Moore, and, of course, Zach and LaFluer can create a more dynamic offense that actually puts more points on the board, then what you’re gonna see is the defense getting challenged for the first time in years. 

I am hopeful that we can put more points on the board.  But I would be very satisfied if I could see better production on offense starting with the second half of the year.  I want to see progress.
 
On defense, the only work done was desperately needed pass rush help. That front four needs to be both great and deep because everything behind them is a question mark. Ulbrich talks about the secondary getting a baptism by fire and the inference there is that they’re going to get burned. This cover 3 gets spoken about like it’s super easy for CBs, and we don’t need great individual players there as a result. That may be true, but only once everyone understands it and is on the same page with one another. 
 

Another clean statement.   It is going to take time to get everybody on the same page especially when you consider the sheer youth movement underway in our back seven.  Worse, the matchup zone looks horrible when you get it wrong.

I’m just hoping to see a team that improves over the course of the season, and a product that’s more entertaining to watch. That’s  what I’m expecting; some higher scoring losses with a stronger second half of the year. 

Me too.

 

5 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Very true.  The offense needs to be excellent this season in order to win a lot of games.

The Jets haven’t generated a pass rush since something like 2005, and now we’re rolling out a scheme that depends on having all 4 guys on the DL doing it. Even with the pass rushing additions this offseason that’s most certainly not going to happen over night.  There’s too many unknowns in the pass rushing department to be able to count on it. 

Hence why I anticipate a 1st round pick going towards a pass rusher in 2022, as well as another acquisition or 2 to help in that area.

I too expect our defense to have serious growing pains.  But I am optimistic that we have chosen the right system to implement and it will pay dividends over time.  The NFL is now a true passing league and it only makes sense to feature a true passing defense.  I also have come to admit that it is easier to field a 4-3 defense since the college game generates that type of personnel.  

2 hours ago, Death2NE said:

Couldn’t agree more , Jets over 6 wins to me is so likely I think it’s a no-brainer bet … then if Wilson is even average , we get some health luck and Saleh proves to be a good hire a 7 seed isn’t impossible at 5-1 odds (I don’t know how it’s not even more considering we have a 6 game total and are 20-1 to win the division ) and speaking of that , if you with those two bets why not just throw a little on winning the division at 20-1 , a josh Allen injury would probably cut those odds 75% . But Jets over 6 is about as confident as I’ve ever been for a bet .

Love your handle.  II see us at 5-8 wins given the easy schedule.  But a lot will have to break our way to do much better and so much will depend on the division games.  New England has reloaded, the Fins have completed their tear down and the Bills are solid throughout.  It just seems remote that we can overcome them this season. 

I don’t think fans are fully appreciate yet how obvious it is that we have a GM who has an actual plan that he sticks too and a team building philosophy that myself and most of you probably agree with . Just the fact that we have at least 3 positional groups in DL , RB, WR where people aren’t going to make the roster but get signed to someone else’s active roster after cuts is such a far cry from the razor thin depth this team had last year . Douglas changed the team hierarchy structure to function like normal instead of backwards like the Jets always seem to be . Just think about the roster as is right now , outside of a number 1 corner and some cb depth (which could already be on roster but I’ll just include it) , what is the GLARING hole on this roster . We could use upgrades at rg, rt, olb, safety next to Maye , maybe another tight end threat to play ahead or along Herndon , those are all positions currently filled by guys who are at least capable and some of them have players drafted by Douglas who maybe step up and fill those but none are glaring weaknesses except a big time corner or olb. The system this offense is going to model doesn’t need a true #1 wr , of course having that player is nice but we have a group that all excel at certain ranges on the field and things that fit the mold of the 49ers style offense . All this in mind and we still have cap space , and just an insane amount of high value picks next draft . If Wilson and Saleh are just capable (I think both are better especially Saleh) this team is going to surprise this season and one more offseason with the resources we have could be playing in serious playoff games in 2022

I agree we are much better.  But we were 2-14.  As one poster remarked.  If we improve 300%, then we will go 6-10.

Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

 

I see rookie starters on offense as Wilson, AVT and Carter (RB) with Moore as the gadget/slot guy.  I see Sherwood or Nasirildeen at linebacker/strong safety and MC2 at nickel as rookie starters on defense.  The other rookies will find roles on defense depending on formation.

[k-met57]

10 hours ago, AFJF said:

Yeboah isn't a great blocker but he's much better than a lot of current NFL TE's who are barely willing to get in the way when a defender is coming at them.

 

i dont know if Herndon plays specials, or he this kid does...but i can tell you the jets will not carry both. They like likely carry one of them + Wesco + whoever else can contribute on special teams.

[FidelioJet]

6 hours ago, johnnysd said:

You could be right.  The fan in my last year was saying we would win 10 games but I am not sure I really believed that. I was already super mistrustful of Gase and I still thought Sam would "get it", but he didn't.

I feel really confident this year. The point I was making was how significantly our starters are upgraded, and how much better the systems and coaching are. Pollak was a horrible OL coach we now have on regarded near the very top of the NFL.

I see the team being loose and having fun.  We drafted for need early and they will reap rewards. I still believe Zach is the best college QB I have ever seen. And unlike Sam who sucked really bad at OTAs Zach has shined. And we are giving him 100% of the reps which always drove me nuts when coaches would do a complete BS competition and only really accomplish giving the young guy less reps.

I am always a Jets glass 3/4 full guy but I have much more conviction this year. I am even going to put a few hundred on the Jets making the playoffs and I generally DO NOT gamble. Last bet I placed was on Braylon Edwards to score the first touchdown in our playoff game and won! that was awesome. But I don't gamble as a rule.

I think of myself as a realist.  I had no illusions of what our team was last year and projected that.  
With that said, you are 100% correct. The talent upgrade, particularly on offense, is massive.  
i honestly think this is 12 win team in 2022. But wins will be hard to come by this year.  
i do also agree ZW is an advanced prospect - his learning curve will be shorter. Which is why I think he can be a 12 win QB in year 2.