Jets\Pats -- Belly Cheated: MERGED

[NIGHT STALKER]

In all seriousness, I think this clown has been using this type of technology for a long time now. It's not something he just decided to do this past Sunday.

The NFL should investigate how long ago this started, not just this past Sunday's fiasco...if he used this type of crap on our lowly, pathetic Jets, don't you think he used it against the better teams in the league?

[raffyD]

Belichick has made every pee-wee footbal player in the world question the term sportsmanship. Thats all that needs to be said, really.

My wife, who has slowly morphed into a good football fan told me last night that she doesn't want to watch football anymore because of this. (she also thinks Brady is BB's lost illegitimate child from some affair and that Brady is in on all of this, yes she is insane but she's my wife so I'm in for life)

I'm scared to think of how this will effect the little kids.

Goodell needs to drop the hammer on this guy and run his a$$ out of football. Levy such a heavy fine and suspension that Kraft will be forced to fire BB. NFL restored to the pre-BB era.

[L.I.MikeBleedsGreen]

Belicheater is a Pimp and a Hustler

He pimps Brady and Hustles the NFL officals

Just sayin' F the Rats

:Nuts:that one is for Chad.. Belifag

[nyjetsjetsjets]

My wife, who has slowly morphed into a good football fan told me last night that she doesn't want to watch football anymore because of this. (she also thinks Brady is BB's lost illegitimate child from some affair and that Brady is in on all of this, yes she is insane but she's my wife so I'm in for life)

I'm scared to think of how this will effect the little kids.

Goodell needs to drop the hammer on this guy and run his a$$ out of football. Levy such a heavy fine and suspension that Kraft will be forced to fire BB. NFL restored to the pre-BB era.

Sadly my girlfriend said the same thing. She doesn't watch all the time anyways, but she said she won't watch any more games, jets, pats or otherwise. I finally got her to actually enjoy watching a game once in a while too.

[BUM-KNEE]

My wife, who has slowly morphed into a good football fan told me last night that she doesn't want to watch football anymore because of this. (she also thinks Brady is BB's lost illegitimate child from some affair and that Brady is in on all of this, yes she is insane but she's my wife so I'm in for life)

I'm scared to think of how this will effect the little kids.

Goodell needs to drop the hammer on this guy and run his a$$ out of football. Levy such a heavy fine and suspension that Kraft will be forced to fire BB. NFL restored to the pre-BB era.

Yes, this is going to effect alot of kids outlook on football, which in itself is a measuring stick for life. I hope the coaches use this as a teaching aid with their teams, and these kids dont lose respect or love of the game because of it. This scandal has the pernicious nature to be devastating if not handled correctly.

[SouthernJet]

from CNNsi..

Part genius, part jerk

Spy-gate raises questions about Belichick's character

Posted: Wednesday September 12, 2007 11:18AM; Updated: Wednesday September 12, 2007 11:18AM

NFL coaches, bless their controlling, obsessive, conniving, secretive little hearts, are not, as a rule, the most well-adjusted individuals you'll ever meet. The season is only one week old and already we've just about had our fill of their self-important personalities -- the way they address the media as if they're describing Operation Desert Storm instead of a third-down screen play, the way they refuse to reveal which mediocre quarterback they've chosen to start the next game as if they were protecting nuclear launch codes. Generally speaking, they're just weird guys, which is why it takes some truly abnormal behavior for an NFL coach to set himself apart from his peers.

That brings us to Bill Belichick. Surely you've heard about the latest apparent indiscretion from Belichick, New England's brilliant but bizarre coach: videotaping and attempting to steal the defensive signals of the opposing team. During the Pats' 38-14 victory over the New York Jets on Sunday, a member of the New England staff had his video camera confiscated by NFL security. The league examined the videotape for evidence of signal stealing, which is expressly against NFL rules.

Reportedly league officials have determined that the Patriots were indeed trying to steal signs, the second time in two years that the team has been suspected of this violation. If found guilty, a fine and/or the revocation of draft choices could be the Pats' punishment. Maybe Belichick, the ruler of all he surveys in Patriot-land, isn't the mastermind of this little bit of espionage. And maybe Tom Brady has trouble getting a date.

Belichick's apologists counter that even if the allegations are true, the New England coach isn't the only head man who goes to such lengths to gain an edge, and that besides, if you're not cheating, you're not trying. (We'd pay good money to avoid having to hear that hackneyed piece of philosophy ever again.) Maybe if this were the first example of odd, rather classless behavior from Belichick, it would be easier to dismiss. But in addition to his three Super Bowl titles, Belichick has a fairly extensive history of behavior that makes observers wonder why a coach of his stature would stoop so low. He may be part genius, but he's also part jerk.

There was his inexplicably negative reaction to his prot

[onemanswarm]

Bill Balled-a-chick named Shenocca, who probably has gigantic, leathery pee-flaps.

[nyjetsjetsjets]

couldn't have happened to a nicer guy!

[jetophile]

Even my podunk paper has Belislob across the back page. 'Jerk' is written with a sharpie across his forehead: 'Hall of Shame': The Biggest Jerks in Sports. Here's their list:

1) Bill Belifraud

2) Barry Bonds

3) Bobby Knight

4) Scott Olsen

5) Terrell Owens

Haha, Little Slob Cheating Hood at #1.

That's Mangini on the right. Check out my mad MS Paint Skills. HAH.

[DMaynard]

Nope. Id be willing to bet a 12 year old WR would say if you cheated to win, it doesnt mean as much.

amen

[madmike1]

Even my podunk paper has Belislob across the back page. 'Jerk' is written with a sharpie across his forehead: 'Hall of Shame': The Biggest Jerks in Sports. Here's their list:

1) Bill Belifraud

2) Barry Bonds

3) Bobby Knight

4) Scott Olsen

5) Terrell Owens

Haha, Little Slob Cheating Hood at #1.

That's Mangini on the right. Check out my mad MS Paint Skills. HAH.

TO is just a clown. He's nowhere near of a scumbag as the others.

[DMaynard]

I have to believe the non patriot fanatical people of Mass are very embarrassed by all of this. Bellichick, never a social butterfly, will be even less liked. I would not be surprised if Ted Kennedy offers to pick him up from the airport and take him on a short cut home.

[raffyD]

Yes, this is going to effect alot of kids outlook on football, which in itself is a measuring stick for life. I hope the coaches use this as a teaching aid with their teams, and these kids dont lose respect or love of the game because of it. This scandal has the pernicious nature to be devastating if not handled correctly.

The only way that can happen is if the commish drops the hammer, if it's just draft picks or a fine then no message can be sent to the kids ever.

[PatriotReign37]

Its going around.

The Krafts are sick after all this and want to wash their hands of Belichick.

[JetCane]

Its going around.

The Krafts are sick after all this and want to wash their hands of Belichick.

I call B.S. unless you have a link

[SoFlaJets]

Its going around.

The Krafts are sick after all this and want to wash their hands of Belichick.

knowing you I'm pretty sure you made it up just to get a rise but truth be told it's the best possible solution for all involved ESPECIALLY Pats fans

[BP]

Its going around.

The Krafts are sick after all this and want to wash their hands of Belichick.

Link?

or this thread goes bye bye

[joebabyny]

Its going around.

The Krafts are sick after all this and want to wash their hands of Belichick.

i don't buy it

[DMaynard]

Yes, Kraft can't believe they got caught. Bellichick promised him they would never get caught.

[SoFlaJets]

Link?

or this thread goes bye bye

hey BP I hear the garbage men outside now-want me to take this crap out with the bag in the kitchen?

[BP]

hey BP I hear the garbage men outside now-want me to take this crap out with the bag in the kitchen?

See, the great thing about JN is that we have an incinerator for threads like these. they don't get moved, they just vanish if a link isn't given.

[SouthernJet]

probably BS,, BUT,, if Kraft had half a brain, this is a great solution,, protect your legacy as a great owner (u have the 3 rings) by firing him now and saying ;why i never had a idea'... he comes off as a moral standing owner,,look what i did.,,,

that way he moves on by hiring cowher of something loike that next year..

[BwanaZulia]

Could Christmas come early?

BZ

[flgreen]

probably BS,, BUT,, if Kraft had half a brain, this is a great solution,, protect your legacy as a great owner (u have the 3 rings) by firing him now and saying ;why i never had a idea'... he comes off as a moral standing owner,,look what i did.,,,

that way he moves on by hiring cowher of something loike that next year..

I forgot about Cower.

If he is willing, thaat would be an excellent idea

[DMaynard]

Bellichick would find work in a microsecond.

The CIA is always looking for good men.

[SoFlaJets]

probably BS,, BUT,, if Kraft had half a brain, this is a great solution,, protect your legacy as a great owner (u have the 3 rings) by firing him now and saying ;why i never had a idea'... he comes off as a moral standing owner,,look what i did.,,,

that way he moves on by hiring cowher of something loike that next year..

that's the thing that Pats fans fail to recognize SJ that it would be in their best interest to NOT have 80 thousand screaming fans chanting cheater cheater pumpkin eater for 3 hours every away game for the rest of Belichick's tenure

[i remember shea]

that way he moves on by hiring cowher of something loike that next year..

SJ...shouldn't that post read:

probably BS,, BUT,, if Kraft had half a brain, this is a great solution,, protect your legacy as a great owner (u have the 3 rings)*** by firing him now and saying ;why i never had a idea'... he comes off as a moral standing owner,,look what i did.,,,

[BornJetsFan1983]

probably BS,, BUT,, if Kraft had half a brain, this is a great solution,, protect your legacy as a great owner (u have the 3 rings) by firing him now and saying ;why i never had a idea'... he comes off as a moral standing owner,,look what i did.,,,

that way he moves on by hiring cowher of something loike that next year..

yeah that would happen lol,

[Bob]

Kraft: Bill, this has been a hell of an embarrassment. What the hell were you thinking?

Mumbles: You like the championships and the sold-out stadium, don't you? Shut the hell up.

Kraft: Ok. Want a raise?

[ECURB]

Kraft: Bill, this has been a hell of an embarrassment. What the hell were you thinking?

Mumbles: You like the championships and the sold-out stadium, don't you? Shut the hell up.

Kraft: Ok. Want a raise?

LOL

POTW back at ya

[Kentucky Jet]

IS BRADY TARNISHED, TOO?

At the risk of inviting another 500 or so e-mails, we need to address a twist to this whole Patriots Act ordeal that we have yet to tackle, but that we have been pondering for the past 36 hours or so.

Do the revelations of stolen defensive signals diminish the reputation and perceived abilities of quarterback Tom Brady?

If the goal of the brazenly overt operations was to help the team know the tactics that an opposing defense would employ on a given play (either on game day or the next time the two teams met), the player squarely in the eye of the storm of information was Brady. And, surely, he knew (or at least suspected) that the intelligence that the offensive coaches had about what a given defense might be doing didn't come from legitimate methods.

So, as an industry source posed the question to us this morning, what did Brady know, and when did he know it?

Unless and until Brady comes clean with a full and frank -- and credible -- explanation about his first-hand experiences, it fairly can be presumed that his legend has been fueled by the advantage derived from the actions for which the Patriots undoubtedly will be punished, as soon as Friday.

How many times has Brady come up with a key play late in a close game? In those occasions, how many times did he know exactly what the defense would be doing?

Part of the effectiveness of a blitz is the element of surprise. And a quarterback's challenge in that situation is to spot the corresponding gap in the coverage, and to get the ball to the receiver who'll likely be wide open in the sliver of time that the quarterback has to unload the ball before landing on his butt.

If the quarterback knows that the blitz is coming before the play is snapped, and if he knows who'll be blitzing, the task of finding that open receiver suddenly becomes a lot easier.

How many times have we seen Brady fire the ball to a wide open receiver an instant after Brady got the snap? How, in those cases, did he know so quickly that the guy would be open?

Though we realize that there are many factors that influence the ability of the team to achieve success on the field, most of which are unrelated to cheating, the added advantage that can come from knowing what the defense is going to do can make a huge difference. Otherwise, the Patriots (and other teams) wouldn't be devoting time and effort and money in order to find out, through legitimate and/or illegitimate means.

As we see it, the fact that the Patriots did what they allegedly/apparently/actually did creates a presumption that a benefit came from it. The fact that Brady has been the quarterback since 2001 creates a presumption that he knew or should have known what was going on. The fact that he took less money to stay in New England suggests that he knew (or feared) that he might not be able to replicate his success in a system that doesn't involve videotaping defensive signals. So unless he comes clean, we think it's fair to believe that, but for the added benefits that came from knowing what the defense was doing via techniques that crossed the line, he might have performed more like a sixth-round draft pick and less like a future Hall of Famer.

Regardless of whether he opts not to disclose what he knew and when he knew it, we think that Brady will be required to achieve a high level of success under another coach, and possibly with another team, before he is regarded as being truly worthy of Canton.

[RSJ]

This probably explains why all those games ended in field goals rather than touchdowns too.

[bitonti]

it was always a great mystery how a guy who couldn't beat out Brian Griese in the Big 10 became the greatest living QB in the NFL. from purely a draft perspective, Tom Brady has been an anomoly since day 1. Even when people bring up names of successful not drafted QBs like Kurt Warner or Jake Delhomme, these guys were mortal and only were considered franchise caliber players for a year or two. Brady has been dominant since he stepped on the field and came out of nowhere to do it - that just doesn't happen.

[RSJ]

it was always a great mystery how a guy who couldn't beat out Brian Griese in the Big 10 became the greatest living QB in the NFL. from purely a draft perspective, Tom Brady has been an anomoly since day 1. Even when people bring up names of successful not drafted QBs like Kurt Warner or Jake Delhomme, these guys were mortal and only were considered franchise caliber players for a year or two. Brady has been dominant since he stepped on the field and came out of nowhere to do it - that just doesn't happen.

I agree 100%.

He is a fraud.

It also explains why you always see Brady make the right throw, and never ever the spectacular throw or the remarkable throw, just the right throw. And there is a big difference.

Furthermore look at who he was throwing too.....other scrubs.

[Kentucky Jet]

In NFL, cheating to gain edge is a tradition

BY BOB GLAUBER | bob.glauber@newsday.com

September 13, 2007

Patriots coach Bill Belichick is at the center of a national controversy after allegedly trying to steal the Jets' defensive signals Sunday at Giants Stadium. But it's hardly the first case of an NFL coach attempting to gain a competitive advantage by breaking rules. Given the long history of football subterfuge, it almost certainly won't be the last.

Whether it's illegally videotaping signals or spying on practices, cheating and defending it have deep roots in the NFL. Belichick just happens to be one of the few who has gotten caught.

"You're talking about coaching at the highest level of competitiveness, and everyone is always looking for an advantage," former Giants coach Jim Fassel said yesterday from Phoenix. "People look at the rules and see if they can figure out a way to get an edge."

Fassel wouldn't directly impugn Belichick, who is accused of having a team employee videotape the Jets' sideline and pick up the defensive signals being sent in. Teams are not prohibited from stealing signs by watching and trying to interpret them; however, the use of audio or video equipment is forbidden.

The taping Sunday did not last long. According to a person with knowledge of the situation, Jets director of security Steve Yarnell noticed it in the first quarter and had the camera confiscated.

The league has yet to rule on a punishment for Belichick, but two people familiar with the investigation told Newsday that the Patriots would likely have one or more draft choices taken away next spring. Belichick is not expected to be suspended, and the Jets will not be awarded a forfeit victory, according to the sources.

Trying to steal information about an opponent goes back decades in the NFL. In the 1970s, Redskins coach George Allen would have the trees around the team's Dickinson (Pa.) College training camp fields inspected for spies from other teams. In the 1960s, Packers coach Vince Lombardi was so convinced that Bears coach George Halas was spying on his practices that Lombardi had his players switch jerseys so it was difficult to see who was getting the ball. Former Jets coach Weeb Ewbank often would send maintenance workers through the corridors at Shea Stadium to make sure there were no unwelcome observers.

"Weeb would have some workers look around if we suspected someone was spying on our practices," former Ewbank assistant Walt Michaels said from his home in Shickshinny, Pa. "He never found anybody."

When Michaels was the Jets' coach, he suspected Raiders owner Al Davis of dirty tricks and instructed players not to discuss any game plan information. "Everybody had suspicions that [Davis] bugged our locker room," Michaels said. "If you have the technology, you could do it."

Former Broncos, Giants and Falcons coach Dan Reeves, a former Cowboys player and assistant, said Dallas coach Tom Landry was so paranoid about Allen spying on practices that he bought out all the hotel rooms next to the Cowboys' practice fields.

Reeves had his own experience stealing signals, albeit legally, after former Broncos assistant Mike Shanahan became coach of the Raiders. Shanahan used the same signals with Oakland as the Broncos used, and Reeves picked up on them during a game and told defensive coordinator Joe Collier.

"Heck, we still didn't stop them," Reeves said from Atlanta. "Finally, Joe just told me, 'Don't tell me the play, just tell me whether it's a run or a pass.' "

Reeves suggested that the league should penalize Belichick not by taking away draft picks, but by cutting off the team's coach-to-quarterback communication system for the rest of the season.

The Patriots might have been victimized last season by a somewhat unscrupulous move by former Dolphins coach Nick Saban, who reportedly bought the audio from Patriots games to listen to quarterback Tom Brady's line calls. By knowing which protection scheme Brady was calling, the Dolphins could easily figure out whether to blitz or put more men into coverage. Miami won, 21-0. The NFL did not further investigate the matter.

"I would love to see evidence of that," Brady said the next day. "They could know exactly what our line calls are, but it doesn't matter." Brady blamed poor execution for the loss.

Teams are extremely protective of information in playbooks or in the weekly scouting reports handed out in the locker room. Players who are released must immediately surrender their playbooks, and anyone losing a playbook is subject to a team fine. But teams often get around that issue by contacting players released by other clubs in an effort to get information. A few days before Sunday's Patriots-Jets game, the Jets brought in former Patriot Reche Caldwell, and the Patriots debriefed former Jet Tim Dwight.

Fassel was so meticulous about keeping all written correspondence in house that he would instruct locker room attendants to look through every locker and garbage can to make sure no play sheets were left behind.

"You couldn't go too far with that," he said. "You have to take precautions."

Fassel's suspicion was rooted partly with what he saw at the college level. While Fassel was an assistant at Weber State, a scouting report used to be left deliberately in the opposing team's hotel, and in a very conspicuous spot.

"We'd make up a phony scouting report and make sure they saw it," he said. "We'd include a script of the first 10 plays, and make sure one of their graduate assistants saw it."

Former Giants kicker Raul Allegre acknowledges that kickers and punters often rubbed down game balls so they would be easier to kick. Sometimes players would take the balls home and put them in dryers to make them travel farther on game day. Rules now prohibit doctoring footballs before games.

Don't expect the trickery to stop. If it's a matter of finding the winning edge, teams will often use every means possible. Even if it's against the rules.

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