Give cousins 30 mil per and draft a QB in the first

[Charlie Brown]

9 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Anyone opposed to signing Cousins as our franchise QB hasn't watched him play enough. 

Anyone fighting anything to improve the Jets QB position after the last 5 years hasn't been watching the Jets play games ...  

[Saul Goodman]

9 hours ago, ChuckkieB said:

If the Jets have a chance to draft Rosen or Darnold, I might be inclined to go that route, but if they don't, sign Cousins and draft Saquon Barkley and call it a day.  I might just cry if either of these two scenarios came true. 

Co-sign this 

[Apache 51]

25 minutes ago, varjet said:

As we know from our years of being Jet fans, the Johnsons are not purists-they are entertainers.  The Jets, like the Chiefs, have generally been reluctant to invest 1st round draft picks on QBS, and would rather play in the FA and other markets.  The Chiefs, despite their success this year, have not lately been a team to go deep in the playoffs despite at times the best OL or secondary in the NFL.  I think they have tried to change that under a GM, who they fired, who hopefully will one day be the Jets GM.

Hopefully the Jets really did not offer Mike Glennon real money.  But in any event, I find it hard to believe that the Jets will not throw a ton of money at Cousins.  It is the best way to fill the stadium with Jet and not other fans.  Any QB will be some risk-look at Bortles or Tannehill.  To me the issue is not what to pay him per year-it is how many years we are on the hook.  Depending on where we are picking, I would say few (if picking high) or more (if picking lower).  First round QBs are under contract for five years, so 2 years of Cousins would not be bad.  

But knowing Snyder, he is thinking he needs to get something from Cousins.  No team should be stupid enough to pay him top dollar and give up high draft picks.  You pay a high draft pick or money for a player, not both.

The 49ers are not out of this race-Garopollo's contract is up-they would need to extend him or franchise him.  I can't say I completely buy what the 49ers did.

But the Jets would have to be bold to make a Cousins deal happen.  Don't know whether they can do it.  I do think it makes some sense if they can use it as an opportunity to find a QB later on that can replace him.  

The stadium is sold except for the upper deck because they couldn't be sold. Bottom 2/3 was PSl'ed for 30 years, or sold out. Niner's took a calculated risk of which I agree with they know as much as us, roll the dice, nothing to lose. Jets don't have to be bold to go for Cousins they have to know what they are doing and they and only they know the inner workings etc.of the team something, we all sure don't. Its been apparent to some of us by what they have and haven't done that they are not into creating a SB caliber team, GM's, coaches etc.

[CanadaSteve]

11 hours ago, Warfish said:

I liked Cousins alot coming out of school, as a mid-round pick.

I like Cousins alot less as a 30+ million a year, 5+ year contract, type player.

He is simply not that good.

30 million buys alot of talent.

Draft a QB, use the 30 mil to surround him with talent and O-line help.

I don't like where this is going either War, but the problem is, there doesn't seem to be a lot of talent in the areas we need, coming up in FA.

[adb280z]

11 hours ago, nico002 said:

We have more cap that we know what to do with. There are not enough quality FA for us to spend even 2/3 of it.

if we are ok paying bum ass Wilkerson 18 mil, cousins is easily worth it.

guy is a top 5 QB and has 3-6 years of production left.

QB issue solved for present and future.

Top 5?

[Paradis]

13 hours ago, nico002 said:

We have more cap that we know what to do with. There are not enough quality FA for us to spend even 2/3 of it.

if we are ok paying bum ass Wilkerson 18 mil, cousins is easily worth it.

guy is a top 5 QB and has 3-6 years of production left.

QB issue solved for present and future.

this whole thread is pointless. 

No way, in a million zillion years would cousins chose to come HERE, unless we promised not draft a QB in the first. You best believe that would be part of the conversation in any negotiations. Guaranteed. 

end thread\

[BurnleyJet]

4 hours ago, Paradis said:

this whole thread is pointless. 

No way, in a million zillion years would cousins chose to come HERE, unless we promised not draft a QB in the first. You best believe that would be part of the conversation in any negotiations. Guaranteed. 

end thread\

Yes, if he comes our draft picks will be LT, Running back, Center.

[Larz]

What is cousin's playoff record? 

[SenorGato]

17 hours ago, Warfish said:

I liked Cousins alot coming out of school, as a mid-round pick.

I like Cousins alot less as a 30+ million a year, 5+ year contract, type player.

He is simply not that good.

30 million buys a lot of talent.

Draft a QB, use the 30 mil to surround him with talent and O-line help.

How much? What positions? The truth is that it really does not buy much unless maybe a couple mid tier  tops starters counts as a lot. 

[CrazyCarl40]

1 hour ago, BurnleyJet said:

Yes, if he comes our draft picks will be LT, Running back, Center.

I think you mean CB, DT, and LB. big Macccc!

[Sperm Edwards]

The way Maccagnan has handled the roster is only marginally dumber than paying Cousins $30m/year.

Nobody is paying that. He’s a legitimate starter, but age and physical ceiling say he’s far closer to Alex Smith than Derek Carr, and that’s what you have to be to get that kind of money.

His absolute ceiling, for a desperate team that’s convinced they can’t find a QB in a QB-rich draft, is about $22-23m. 

I can’t think of any team or GM dumb enough to guarantee him $90m for the next 3 years unless the league and NFLPA announce in February that they’ve reached terms on a new CBA and the 2018 salary cap ceiling is immediately climbing to $275m

$30m/year for Cousins, lol. 

[nico002]

Cousins is better than Carr and will be so for the next 3 years (at least)

this isn’t baseball, the nfl does not guarantee contracts. 

Pay him 30 per and cut him if he declines.

its not our money, it’s woody Johnson’s.

we aren’t spending our cap.

you guys are 

a) underrating cousins ability

b ) over rating his loyalty to dc, remember, they refused to pay him for two years in a row now 

[Jetsfan80]

Threads like these are why the Jets are terrible. 

[SAR I]

Someone please tell me why we want this guy so badly when he sucks so badly with the Washington Redskins.

I don't get it.

SAR I

[Kleckineau]

10 minutes ago, nico002 said:

Cousins is better than Carr and will be so for the next 3 years (at least)

this isn’t baseball, the nfl does not guarantee contracts. 

Pay him 30 per and cut him if he declines.

its not our money, it’s woody Johnson’s.

we aren’t spending our cap.

you guys are 

a) underrating cousins ability

b ) over rating his loyalty to dc, remember, they refused to pay him for two years in a row now 

He would get a ton of guaranteed money up front.

[Jetster]

18 minutes ago, nico002 said:

Cousins is better than Carr and will be so for the next 3 years (at least)

this isn’t baseball, the nfl does not guarantee contracts. 

Pay him 30 per and cut him if he declines.

its not our money, it’s woody Johnson’s.

we aren’t spending our cap.

you guys are 

a) underrating cousins ability

b ) over rating his loyalty to dc, remember, they refused to pay him for two years in a row now 

Rodney Harrison said this about Derek Carr. "Carr is way overrated, he's playing behind a very good Oline & his play is up and down".

[nico002]

15 minutes ago, Kleckineau said:

He would get a ton of guaranteed money up front.

Ok, so? We have the cap room to acommodate that and fill every other need.

 

[Jetster]

19 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Someone please tell me why we want this guy so badly when he sucks so badly with the Washington Redskins.

I don't get it.

SAR I

Do you watch the Redskins play? I'm shocked that so many Jet fans say this about Cousins. I saw him go toe to toe with an Eagles team on the road trying to do everything in his power to carry his team. He's not getting 30 million, but he should get Carr money, right now he's BETTER than Derek Carr. I'd love to see him in this offense with Morton & Bates, McCown couldn't hold Cousins jock strap. I like to imagine McCown playing under the pressure Cousins was in that game vs the Eagles after he lost Williams his LT than Scherff, and they already were missing another lineman. He had a gimpy Reed, 3 of his 5 lineman out, the Eagles were rolling blitzes at him all night & he still made some plays & fought right to the end even though they lost. That game is 40-0 if you swap out Cousins for McCown!

[jetspenguin]

18 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Anyone opposed to signing Cousins as our franchise QB hasn't watched him play enough. 

The key to that sentence is signing him to "huge coin"..I'd be ok to signing him but NOT to some ridiculous contract. He is head and shoulders above what we have but I doubt he is a superbowl winning QB....23 mil? that seems reasonable...30 mil? HARD PASS!!

[JustInFudge]

The strategy seems redundant, no?  Why would you need to spend a 1st round pick on a QB the same year you're dumping 30 million into Cousins?

 

[jetspenguin]

18 hours ago, BrickTamland said:

The Kerley suspension is a great thing. Maybe our coach will allow Mrs. Stewart and Hansen on the field a bit more. We can find out whether we have 3 (or even 4) playable WR next year. (Kearse and Anderson look good going forward)

Kerley is a QB?

[Sperm Edwards]

40 minutes ago, nico002 said:

Cousins is better than Carr and will be so for the next 3 years (at least)

this isn’t baseball, the nfl does not guarantee contracts. 

Pay him 30 per and cut him if he declines.

its not our money, it’s woody Johnson’s.

we aren’t spending our cap.

you guys are 

a) underrating cousins ability

b ) over rating his loyalty to dc, remember, they refused to pay him for two years in a row now 

There is no cutting him if he declines. That’s the point, not some nonsense about saving Woody Johnson any money.

[SAR I]

30 minutes ago, Jetster said:

Do you watch the Redskins play? I'm shocked that so many Jet fans say this about Cousins. I saw him go toe to toe with an Eagles team on the road trying to do everything in his power to carry his team. He's not getting 30 million, but he should get Carr money, right now he's BETTER than Derek Carr. I'd love to see him in this offense with Morton & Bates, McCown couldn't hold Cousins jock strap. I like to imagine McCown playing under the pressure Cousins was in that game vs the Eagles after he lost Williams his LT than Scherff, and they already were missing another lineman. He had a gimpy Reed, 3 of his 5 lineman out, the Eagles were rolling blitzes at him all night & he still made some plays & fought right to the end even though they lost. That game is 40-0 if you swap out Cousins for McCown!

No, I don't pay much attention to the Redskins.  But the guy is a 5 year veteran and hasn't even eked out a .500 record.  Ryan Fitzpatrick in his one fluke year put up more impressive numbers than Kirk Cousins did at any time in Washington and people ran Fitz out of town on a rail.

He's a slow burner and it just doesn't happen like that anymore, does it?  Guy bouncing around for 5 years, jumps teams, and becomes a great one?  Feels like a low percentage play to me.  I'd rather trade up to the top of the draft and take one of the 3 kids coming out in April.  Dak Prescott, Deshaun Watson, Carson Wentz, Derek Carr, Russell Wilson.....these guys explode onto the scene in their first 25 games. 

SAR I

[Jetster]

12 minutes ago, SAR I said:

No, I don't pay much attention to the Redskins.  But the guy is a 5 year veteran and hasn't even eked out a .500 record.  Ryan Fitzpatrick in his one fluke year put up more impressive numbers than Kirk Cousins did at any time in Washington and people ran Fitz out of town on a rail.

He's a slow burner and it just doesn't happen like that anymore, does it?  Guy bouncing around for 5 years, jumps teams, and becomes a great one?  Feels like a low percentage play to me.  I'd rather trade up to the top of the draft and take one of the 3 kids coming out in April.  Dak Prescott, Deshaun Watson, Carson Wentz, Derek Carr, Russell Wilson.....these guys explode onto the scene in their first 25 games. 

SAR I

I'm not averse to that thought if we dump Bowles. I get a kick out of our geniuses here though who have already decided that there is no QB available in the 2018 draft worth a sh*t. I would at least like to see Hackenberg play a few snaps under Morton & Bates and the 1st string offense so we can finally cut bait & stop wasting time before drafting another QB. We just disagree on Cousins. I've seen a lot of him and would love to have him here in this offense. I happen to think Gruden sucks as a head coach there in Washington. Just because he's Johns brother doesn't make him worthy of being an NFL head coach. Reminds me of David Shula.

[Sperm Edwards]

Lost in this, to some, is he’s getting $90m in that situation, not $30m. He’s not sigining anywhere with just 1 year guaranteed. 3 years guaranteed is what a starting QB in his prime is getting if somone’s ponying up elite money for him. Maybe - maybe - you can get away with merely $75-80m guaranteed in that scenario, but if his agent sees you’re willing to spend $90m, then greater than 2 years of it’s getting guaranteed for skill, and even more is typically guaranteed for injury.

There is a salary cap, and there doesn’t cease to be one because we enter the offseason so far under it. You’ll see how fast some of it goes, and $30m on one player is $30m the team doesn’t have to spend on other players. It also means outside of blind luck in hitting paydirt in the mid-later rounds, there’s to be no drafting of another QB for at least 2 more years (legitimately an argument for paying Cousins if Macc is retained, but that’s beside the point). And even into those mid-rounds, the team will stay away from QBs because it’ll need cheaper talent around Cousins if he’s eating up $30m/year for 3 years.

You simply don’t pay $30m for a QB when nobody else is going to pay 80% of that, if anyone even ends up paying that much. Especially not when we’re looking at a top 5-ish pick, with a QB top-heavy draft a month after FA, where (despite the added risk of his success) you can get a QB for 1/5 (or if we trade down from #5 or trade up from #35-40, just 1/10) that amount for the next 4 years. Plus a significant discount on a 5th year team option after that if taken anywhere in round 1.

[Warfish]

46 minutes ago, SAR I said:

No, I don't pay much attention to the Redskins.  But the guy is a 5 year veteran and hasn't even eked out a .500 record.  Ryan Fitzpatrick in his one fluke year put up more impressive numbers than Kirk Cousins did at any time in Washington and people ran Fitz out of town on a rail.

He's a slow burner and it just doesn't happen like that anymore, does it?  Guy bouncing around for 5 years, jumps teams, and becomes a great one?  Feels like a low percentage play to me.  I'd rather trade up to the top of the draft and take one of the 3 kids coming out in April.  Dak Prescott, Deshaun Watson, Carson Wentz, Derek Carr, Russell Wilson.....these guys explode onto the scene in their first 25 games. 

SAR I

Emotionally, I want to (and think we might just) select Baker Mayfield, the most productive QB in college football today.

He has many of the same things that made me like Watson, he wins, he produces, and he faces similar "metrics" criticisms, in Mayfields case his height and the rankings of the Defenses he plays against.

I free admit tho, I've never watched him play, I'm not a minor league football fan and only start to care when it comes close to draft time.  Now, at 3-5 with many losses looming, it's getting closer to draft time IMO, so I'm planning on watching Mayfield play on Saturday vs. another top ranked team, and see if he's real or not.

I do not believe the Jets will pick #1 or #2 overall, so if presumable Darnold and Rosen are the two "big elite names" I don't see us getting either (and I flat out don't want Darnold, at all, he's all hype, hope and projection, no substance, like most USC QB's of recent vintage).

So we'll see.  I always prefer drafting QB's to trading for veteran castoff QB's, not matter how hyped.  End of teh day, if Cousins is available, he was castoff by Washington, unwanted.  It's rare that kind of pickup wins titles, and while draft picks are risky as well, they're far FAR less expensive in both short and long term financials.

[Sperm Edwards]

So...

• Top 5 pick (maybe even top 3)?
• QB-heavy draft, both at the top and in its depth (draft equivalent of length and girth)?

Cool. Let’s pick that time to guarantee a few years at $30m/year to a 30 year-old QB who, while a good QB, isn’t in that ultra-special tier, never was, and never will be.

Know what? I don’t blame the fans asking for this, even as I find fault with their request. They’re good fans. They know it isn’t smart, but they’ve been beaten down over time and it’s an instant fix/turnaround without the slower growth (not to mention, total bust risk) that comes with most draft picks.

So I don’t blame them. I blame the franchise that did this to them. Waterboarding is more humane.

[Kleckineau]

1 hour ago, nico002 said:

Ok, so? We have the cap room to acommodate that and fill every other need.

 

You stated "this isn’t baseball, the nfl does not guarantee contracts."

I pointed out there is guaranteed money for guys like Cousins and lots of it.

BTW I wouldnt mind if the Jets make a run for this guy.

They need to make a bold move whether through the draft or F/A because Metlife is becoming a festering cesspool of visiting teams fans from sold PSL tix. I went 2X this year and I am not going back till next season. They need to start putting out a better product very soon

 

[BrickTamland]

21 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Emotionally, I want to (and think we might just) select Baker Mayfield, the most productive QB in college football today.

He has many of the same things that made me like Watson, he wins, he produces, and he faces similar "metrics" criticisms, in Mayfields case his height and the rankings of the Defenses he plays against.

I free admit tho, I've never watched him play, I'm not a minor league football fan and only start to care when it comes close to draft time.  Now, at 3-5 with many losses looming, it's getting closer to draft time IMO, so I'm planning on watching Mayfield play on Saturday vs. another top ranked team, and see if he's real or not.

I do not believe the Jets will pick #1 or #2 overall, so if presumable Darnold and Rosen are the two "big elite names" I don't see us getting either (and I flat out don't want Darnold, at all, he's all hype, hope and projection, no substance, like most USC QB's of recent vintage).

So we'll see.  I always prefer drafting QB's to trading for veteran castoff QB's, not matter how hyped.  End of teh day, if Cousins is available, he was castoff by Washington, unwanted.  It's rare that kind of pickup wins titles, and while draft picks are risky as well, they're far FAR less expensive in both short and long term financials.

I get what you're going for here. And I would agree if I thought Kirk was only a decent QB. However, I think he is a top 10 or better QB. More than capable of winning a SB. So I am on board with the idea of giving him ~25mil per year.

I like rookie QBs too, typically. Cheap, unexplored potential...but I think that signing Kirk is a rare opportunity to completely avoid the risk inherent in a rookie QB.

The thing that would make me really happy would be getting Kirk plus getting Barkley at pick 5 or so, and that may be possible without trading any picks.

We are not paying anyone right now. Wilkerson is our biggest contract. His hit is 20 mil next year. He may be gone. The next contract is Beachum with a 9.5m cap hit. Skrine is next at 6. He absolutely should be gone.

Someone is going to pay Bell what, 15 mil per season over the next 4 years or so? For a RB. We can pay a fraction of that for our RB whether we get Barkley or someone like Royce Freeman later in the draft. Not to mention we should be able to get starting quality pass-rusher and an OL in the draft. More guys we wont have to pay for a while.

Its ok to pay for a QB. 25mil for a good QB will be a good deal in 3 years. IF he isn't living up to his paycheck then we can draft/pay another guy. But at least then we will have (hopefully) picked up legit young players with our early picks in the 2017 draft, instead of using our 1st (and maybe more) on the QB.

jmo

[kevinc855]

21 hours ago, Warfish said:

I liked Cousins alot coming out of school, as a mid-round pick.

I like Cousins alot less as a 30+ million a year, 5+ year contract, type player.

He is simply not that good.

30 million buys alot of talent.

Draft a QB, use the 30 mil to surround him with talent and O-line help.

So bet on a unproven college kid over a proven nfl winner. Sounds rational 

[RESNewYork]

46 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Emotionally, I want to (and think we might just) select Baker Mayfield, the most productive QB in college football today.

He has many of the same things that made me like Watson, he wins, he produces, and he faces similar "metrics" criticisms, in Mayfields case his height and the rankings of the Defenses he plays against.

I free admit tho, I've never watched him play, I'm not a minor league football fan and only start to care when it comes close to draft time.  Now, at 3-5 with many losses looming, it's getting closer to draft time IMO, so I'm planning on watching Mayfield play on Saturday vs. another top ranked team, and see if he's real or not.

I do not believe the Jets will pick #1 or #2 overall, so if presumable Darnold and Rosen are the two "big elite names" I don't see us getting either (and I flat out don't want Darnold, at all, he's all hype, hope and projection, no substance, like most USC QB's of recent vintage).

So we'll see.  I always prefer drafting QB's to trading for veteran castoff QB's, not matter how hyped.  End of teh day, if Cousins is available, he was castoff by Washington, unwanted.  It's rare that kind of pickup wins titles, and while draft picks are risky as well, they're far FAR less expensive in both short and long term financials.

How about Lamar Jackson's production?

He leads the nation in total offense with 426.3 yards per game, which is more yards than 110 teams in FBS. That is unreal production.

[kelly]

19 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

If we sign Cousins, the move is to draft an OL or Saquon Barkley with our first round pick. With Cousins/Barkley/Enunwa/Anderson/ASJ/Kearse/Stewart/Hansen this offense will be top 10 for game 1 of next season. 

Obviously, if neither an elite OL or Barkley are available you go edge rusher. Not a fan of going DB again. The CBs don't need to be elite if you have Adams/Mayes. 

[kelly]

21 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Cousins isn't going to command $30m/year from us or from anyone.

[Nick Blitz]

28 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

So bet on a unproven college kid over a proven nfl winner. Sounds rational 

A proven NFL winner? 

Been to the Playoffs twice, lost the first game twice.

[Jetster]

37 minutes ago, RESNewYork said:

How about Lamar Jackson's production?

He leads the nation in total offense with 426.3 yards per game, which is more yards than 110 teams in FBS. That is unreal production.

If we drafted Lamar Jackson & he's 25% better than Tyrod Taylor, considering Tyrod Taylor is 25% better than Josh McCown, that's a 50% increase in QB talent then we have right now. I would consider that a win-win for the NY Jets.