Corey Davis Signed expecting Darnold to be QB1

[prime21]

 

[jetspenguin]

5 hours ago, genot said:

After he signed, i posted a message to all the Darnold detractors. "Ask Corey Davis who the QB will be". If someone can pull that up, that would be cool. Everybody in the league knows that Sam has strong skills. Almost everybody who's coached or played the game knows how hamstrung he's been. On the field. And on the sidelines. 

that must be the reason for all those strong trade offers for sammy boy

[SAR I]

2 minutes ago, jetspenguin said:

that must be the reason for all those strong trade offers for sammy boy

Sam and Zach battle it out all summer.  

Jets either validate that Gase was Sam's problem and he's a stud or Zach is the future.

Someone else's starter gets hurt.

The loser of the battle gets traded for the haul we would have gotten for either Sam or Zach before the draft.

Jets get cake and eat it too.

SAR I

 

[genot]

3 minutes ago, jetspenguin said:

that must be the reason for all those strong trade offers for sammy boy

Are you being sarcastic. Teams have called. What they've offered. Who knows. What Douglas is asking for . Who knows. I don't know. You don't know. 

[fullblast]

Sigh. All we had to do was complete the tank but noOooOOoOoo.

[Embrace the Suck]

"Sam? Nah, they told me they wanted to trade back, take my man Lance, and then move Sam to the Lions" - Yup, that's exactly the response I expected.

[Matt39]

59 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Sam and Zach battle it out all summer.  

 

There is a 0.0 percent chance these guys are on the roster together. Once you realize the Jets are not totally operating from a strictly winning football games mindset, things make more sense.

[JetsFanatic]

1 hour ago, SAR I said:

Sam and Zach battle it out all summer.  

Jets either validate that Gase was Sam's problem and he's a stud or Zach is the future.

Someone else's starter gets hurt.

The loser of the battle gets traded for the haul we would have gotten for either Sam or Zach before the draft.

Jets get cake and eat it too.

SAR I

 

Ridiculous, you don't use the #2 spot in the draft for a player that may not see the field. You either trade the pick for a haul or take the QB. If you build around Sam and he still sucks you will have multiple ones next season from the trade of the 2nd pick this season to address the QB position. 

[Matt39]

41 minutes ago, JetsFanatic said:

Ridiculous, you don't use the #2 spot in the draft for a player that may not see the field. You either trade the pick for a haul or take the QB. If you build around Sam and he still sucks you will have multiple ones next season from the trade of the 2nd pick this season to address the QB position. 

Sam will still suck. That is a given. If the Jets think Wilson, Fields, Jones and Lance are all busts then you move heaven and earth to move out of the pick. Doomsday scenario is staying at 2 and picking an offensive lineman. One year after taking an offensive lineman. While fielding the worst roster in football. 

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

7 hours ago, usanyj said:

Interesting...

[SAR I]

1 hour ago, Matt39 said:

There is a 0.0 percent chance these guys are on the roster together. Once you realize the Jets are not totally operating from a strictly winning football games mindset, things make more sense.

Sadly, I've realized this from the first hour of free agency (crickets) until now (crickets).

If other teams are offering us a bag of pucks for Darnold, why not keep him?  What if Gase was the devil and he flourishes under a Shanahan system run by a very young and relatable LaFleur?  That could make him worth more in September than he is now and there is always a team that loses their QB and is desperate at that time.  Similarly, a nice insurance policy if Wilson or Fields busts.

The only thing separating the Jets and success is the QB.  Enough putting all our eggs in one basket.  Let's go full Richard Todd Matt Robinson already.

SAR I

[SAR I]

54 minutes ago, JetsFanatic said:

Ridiculous, you don't use the #2 spot in the draft for a player that may not see the field. You either trade the pick for a haul or take the QB. If you build around Sam and he still sucks you will have multiple ones next season from the trade of the 2nd pick this season to address the QB position. 

And what if Zach Wilson and Justin Fields both light up the league?  What if one is in Miami and the other in New England because we passed on them?

We need a QB, period.  All this other stuff can take care of itself with Joe Douglas' 10 year patience plan.  He can f--- up this whole year, miss on every FA and every draft pick, its all good if he just nails the quarterback already.   We've been waiting 50 years for New Namath.  Give Darnold a shot in a non-Gase offense, give one of the NCAA studs a shot to unseat him. 

SAR I

[clayton163v]

7 hours ago, y2k8 said:

I will 100 percent support whatever JD decides to do at QB this year.  I'm choosing to just trust him to build the team the way he wants.

But that said, I'm rooting for Sam to stay just to see the apoplectic reaction of the usual suspects on this board. If the Jets can't entertain me, I know that decision at least will.

I wonder what the Zach Wilson tribe will say if we do take him and he is a total bust or gets knocked out in the season opener like Chad.  They will probably blame it on Sam.

[slimjasi]

1 minute ago, SAR I said:

Sadly, I've realized this from the first hour of free agency (crickets) until now (crickets).

If other teams are offering us a bag of pucks for Darnold, why not keep him?  What if Gase was the devil and he flourishes under a Shanahan system run by a very young and relatable LaFleur?  That could make him worth more in September than he is now and there is always a team that loses their QB and is desperate at that time.  Similarly, a nice insurance policy if Wilson or Fields busts.

The only thing separating the Jets and success is the QB.  Enough putting all our eggs in one basket.  Let's go full Richard Todd Matt Robinson already.

SAR I

I totally get the logic, I just think teams are hesitant to go this route and that it's not going to happen

[clayton163v]

7 hours ago, oatmeal said:

Corey Davis is a JAG that was surrounded by studs, we still don’t have WR1 idk wtf you’re talking about ?‍♂️

Wow, the tribe of Zach Wilson is angry.

[Integrity28]

3 hours ago, Lith said:

I know you are just sharing your insights from what you are hearing, but I usre hope this is not the way the Jets are thinking about the QB position.  Evaluate the QBs.  Sam, Wilson, Fields and others.  If you like Sam, keep him and build around him.  If you like Wilson/Fields draft him and build around him.

The flaw in the logic to this approach is you are letting others make your QB decision for you.  If others like Sam enough to give you a great offer, then you take a QB in the draft.  If other GMs don't think Sam has much value in a trade and don't make a good offer, then you keep him as your starter and pass on guys in the drafty.  Seems like a bizarre approach to me.  The QB decision should determine the best course of action in trade market, not the other way around.

Just my two cents, for whatever that is worth.

Makes it seem like there’s zero confidence in their ability to evaluate.

This probably explains the FA signings the past 2 years. ?

[SAR I]

6 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

I totally get the logic, I just think teams are hesitant to go this route and that it's not going to happen

If that's the case, then why isn't Darnold gone?  Surely Joe Douglas isn't playing a game of chicken with an interested team, making them sweat it out until the draft.  All the logical openings are filled, no?  He's not going to New England or Miami, it doesn't look like we'd go near Deshaun Watson so the Texans are out, and we can't deal with SF because that would let Garroppolo go to Belichick.

We'd better hope we take a QB at #2 and have Darnold on the roster.  Otherwise, we're rolling only with Darnold.  And then Fields and Wilson may wind up in Miami and New England.

SAR I

[Matt39]

15 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Sadly, I've realized this from the first hour of free agency (crickets) until now (crickets).

If other teams are offering us a bag of pucks for Darnold, why not keep him?  What if Gase was the devil and he flourishes under a Shanahan system run by a very young and relatable LaFleur?  That could make him worth more in September than he is now and there is always a team that loses their QB and is desperate at that time.  Similarly, a nice insurance policy if Wilson or Fields busts.

The only thing separating the Jets and success is the QB.  Enough putting all our eggs in one basket.  Let's go full Richard Todd Matt Robinson already.

SAR I

The Johnsons will never allow an actual quarterback competition.

[SAR I]

5 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

The Johnsons will never allow an actual quarterback competition.

I would hope that with all their conviction in Joe Douglas and Robert Saleh, they will do whatever their football men tell them to do.

SAR I

[slimjasi]

16 minutes ago, SAR I said:

If that's the case, then why isn't Darnold gone?  Surely Joe Douglas isn't playing a game of chicken with an interested team, making them sweat it out until the draft.  All the logical openings are filled, no?  He's not going to New England or Miami, it doesn't look like we'd go near Deshaun Watson so the Texans are out, and we can't deal with SF because that would let Garroppolo go to Belichick.

We'd better hope we take a QB at #2 and have Darnold on the roster.  Otherwise, we're rolling only with Darnold.  And then Fields and Wilson may wind up in Miami and New England.

SAR I

I don't think a final decision has been made. 

I think Sam still has a shot at being the 2021 opening day starter. 

[CanadienJetsFan]

22 minutes ago, SAR I said:

If that's the case, then why isn't Darnold gone?  Surely Joe Douglas isn't playing a game of chicken with an interested team, making them sweat it out until the draft.  All the logical openings are filled, no?  He's not going to New England or Miami, it doesn't look like we'd go near Deshaun Watson so the Texans are out, and we can't deal with SF because that would let Garroppolo go to Belichick.

We'd better hope we take a QB at #2 and have Darnold on the roster.  Otherwise, we're rolling only with Darnold.  And then Fields and Wilson may wind up in Miami and New England.

SAR I

IF Zach “wows” them on pro day, and after a thorough background check to make sure he’s got no Skeltons in his closet, only then will JD pull the trigger and trade Sam.
No one needs a QB controversy, the NewYork media will feed off of that like the bunch of hungry dogs that they are.

Just because teams called JD to kick the tires doesn’t mean that any of them offered him anything concrete anyway. A market value must first be established and let’s face it Sam worth isn’t that high. Think of it, a young and ascending team like Washington actually chose to go with Fitzmagic’s consistently ( and the bunch of mail-in games that he’s known for) rather than risk the inconsistency that is Sam.

expect a solid late 2nd or early 3rd for Sam. That’s about what he’s worth.

 

[football guy]

3 hours ago, Big_Slick said:

And you can make that prediction based on his one good season against crap level talent while ignoring his shoulder surgeries?

I'm using a very easy to understand example how the Jets can believe Zach Wilson has higher upside yet still stick with Darnold. Don't look too much into the comparisons. 

[clayton163v]

Just now, slimjasi said:

I don't think a final decision has been made. 

I think Sam still has a shot at being the 2021 opening day starter. 

I agree.  From where I stand the Jets will not take anyone other than Sewell if forced to pick at #2.  He is the clear choice imo. 

They will trade down if offered enough compensation.  Who they then choose depends on who is available.  If we move to #4 and take Chase, Pitts or Sewell (if the league has gone mad if the latter), they I could see the Jets pick a QB at 23.  I honestly believe that one of the four will be there when we pick.   In which case, Sam might be traded or we would have a QB competition. 

For those who read the presence of only two QBs on our roster as a sign of choosing Wilson, I retort that you are advocating that the Jets will go into the season with Wilson, Morgan and veteran at the minimum.  I find that very strange thinking.  If we were locked into Wilson, we would have a legitimate veteran QB on the roster to hold the fort until Wilson is ready.  Unless you think it is a good idea to just throw him to the wolves.  In which case, you are no longer listening to reason.

Either way, I believe that what we do will depend on our options when the pick is on the clock.  Joe Douglas will do what is best for the long haul to get maximum value. 

 

 

[slimjasi]

Just now, clayton163v said:

I agree.  From where I stand the Jets will not take anyone other than Sewell if forced to pick at #2.  He is the clear choice imo. 

They will trade down if offered enough compensation.  Who they then choose depends on who is available.  If we move to #4 and take Chase, Pitts or Sewell (if the league has gone mad if the latter), they I could see the Jets pick a QB at 23.  I honestly believe that one of the four will be there when we pick.   In which case, Sam might be traded or we would have a QB competition. 

For those who read the presence of only two QBs on our roster as a sign of choosing Wilson, I retort that you are advocating that the Jets will go into the season with Wilson, Morgan and veteran at the minimum.  I find that very strange thinking.  If we were locked into Wilson, we would have a legitimate veteran QB on the roster to hold the fort until Wilson is ready.  Unless you think it is a good idea to just throw him to the wolves.  In which case, you are no longer listening to reason.

Either way, I believe that what we do will depend on our options when the pick is on the clock.  Joe Douglas will do what is best for the long haul to get maximum value. 

 

 

Taking Sewell at 2 is nuts. You either take the QB you like or you trade down. 

[GaryM]

3 hours ago, jetspenguin said:

that must be the reason for all those strong trade offers for sammy boy

what trade offers have been given, please enlighten us.

[genot]

9 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Taking Sewell at 2 is nuts. You either take the QB you like or you trade down. 

I think if the Jet's can't trade down, we'll draft Pitts. I know some will go crazy on that one. If there's one generational prospect in the draft. It's Pitts.

[slimjasi]

Just now, genot said:

I think if the Jet's can't trade down, we'll draft Pitts. I know some will go crazy on that one. If there's one generational prospect in the draft. It's Pitts.

Better than taking a tackle for sure, but if we aren't taking a QB, I'd much rather trade down. Heck, if we trade down with Atlanta, we could still get Pitts. 

[football guy]

3 hours ago, Lith said:

I know you are just sharing your insights from what you are hearing, but I usre hope this is not the way the Jets are thinking about the QB position.  Evaluate the QBs.  Sam, Wilson, Fields and others.  If you like Sam, keep him and build around him.  If you like Wilson/Fields draft him and build around him.

The flaw in the logic to this approach is you are letting others make your QB decision for you.  If others like Sam enough to give you a great offer, then you take a QB in the draft.  If other GMs don't think Sam has much value in a trade and don't make a good offer, then you keep him as your starter and pass on guys in the drafty.  Seems like a bizarre approach to me.  The QB decision should determine the best course of action in trade market, not the other way around.

Just my two cents, for whatever that is worth.

The point is that you can like multiple players, and you can like certain things about a prospect - including his upside - better than your incumbent, but still have reasons for keeping the incumbent. The Jets really like Sam. In fact, they love him; they think he has what it takes to be a great QB and at the very least can be a starter you can win with. I don't know how much they love Zach Wilson yet, but I'm sure they will love his upside and financial benefit. They could ultimately determine that Wilson is better in a vacuum (I'm not sure), but it does not necessarily mean they'll take him. 

At the end of the day, it's simple: 

• QB Sam Darnold + value for #2 pick; vs. 
• QB #2 pick + value for Sam Darnold 

If a team meets the price of #2, they'll probably take the deal. If not, they'll probably trade Sam. 

Dan Orlovsky is a Sam Darnold-truther and has said a lot of wild things, but I think he has got this one right: 

 

[SAR I]

31 minutes ago, CanadienJetsFan said:

IF Zach “wows” them on pro day, and after a thorough background check to make sure he’s got no Skeltons in his closet, only then will JD pull the trigger and trade Sam.
No one needs a QB controversy, the NewYork media will feed off of that like the bunch of hungry dogs that they are.

Just because teams called JD to kick the tires doesn’t mean that any of them offered him anything concrete anyway. A market value must first be established and let’s face it Sam worth isn’t that high. Think of it, a young and ascending team like Washington actually chose to go with Fitzmagic’s consistently ( and the bunch of mail-in games that he’s known for) rather than risk the inconsistency that is Sam.

expect a solid late 2nd or early 3rd for Sam. That’s about what he’s worth.

 

Now that Joe Flacco is gone, Sam Darnold (or Zach or Justin) seem like logical backups.

All signs point to Darnold and a youngster.  

SAR I

[Augustiniak]

8 minutes ago, football guy said:

The point is that you can like multiple players, and you can like certain things about a prospect - including his upside - better than your incumbent, but still have reasons for keeping the incumbent. The Jets really like Sam. In fact, they love him; they think he has what it takes to be a great QB and at the very least can be a starter you can win with. I don't know how much they love Zach Wilson yet, but I'm sure they will love his upside and financial benefit. They could ultimately determine that Wilson is better in a vacuum (I'm not sure), but it does not necessarily mean they'll take him. 

At the end of the day, it's simple: 

• QB Sam Darnold + value for #2 pick; vs. 
• QB #2 pick + value for Sam Darnold 

If a team meets the price of #2, they'll probably take the deal. If not, they'll probably trade Sam. 

Dan Orlovsky is a Sam Darnold-truther and has said a lot of wild things, but I think he has got this one right: 

 

I understand what you’re saying but this isn’t a straightforward math equation.  At some point if the potential trade scenarios are fairly close, someone in the organization is going to have to decide which qb they want to work with, whether darnold can truly be salvaged and if they want to deal with paying darnold next season if he does even ok.  This decision isn’t as simple as putting two packages on a balance scale and seeing which one weighs more.  There’s personalities involved here as well.

[genot]

13 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Better than taking a tackle for sure, but if we aren't taking a QB, I'd much rather trade down. Heck, if we trade down with Atlanta, we could still get Pitts. 

Yea. If we can trade down, that's what we'll do. Atlanta might be as far as we can go, if we want Pitt's.i Can't think of anyone else in the top 8, who makes more sense than Pitts. Waddle?????

[slimjasi]

1 minute ago, genot said:

Yea. If we can trade down, that's what we'll do. Atlanta might be as far as we can go, if we want Pitt's.i Can't think of anyone else in the top 8, who makes more sense than Pitts. Waddle?????

I'd love any of the three big WRs -  Waddle, Chase, or Smith

[jetophile]

8 hours ago, Paradis said:

 

Who makes really gay rich Texans! Biblical Bible Belt Fail on God's part, I know.

[doitny]

3 hours ago, SAR I said:

Sam and Zach battle it out all summer.  

Jets either validate that Gase was Sam's problem and he's a stud or Zach is the future.

Someone else's starter gets hurt.

The loser of the battle gets traded for the haul we would have gotten for either Sam or Zach before the draft.

Jets get cake and eat it too.

SAR I

 

serious?

you think if Zach loses to Sam we can get back 2OA value for him? no way. you know what you get back? maybe what Arizona got for Rosen. a 2nd rd pick. 

and if Sam loses his value will go down even more than it is now. 

its a lose, lose for us to keep both.

you guys have got to stop with the Sam/Zach QB duel. there is no way we win.

remember that Trubinsky is a backup.  if my starter goes down i rather trade for him than Sam or Zach.

[BroadwayRay]

3 hours ago, prime21 said:

 

So using the Orlovsky player evaluation theorem, we also have to wonder what version of Darnold we would get in 2021: the 2018 version, the 2019 version or the 2020 version  

Oh wait, all those versions suck. 

Seriously though, it’s hilarious how Wilson critics will completely ignore the injuries he had to deal with in 2019 yet go on endlessly about how Darnold was victimized by poor coaching and poor teammates.