Kwon Alexander in for a visit with NYJ

[slats]

32 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

This is the last spot on the team where the Jets are lacking competence.  Not spending the extra money for him is a bit of a head scratcher.

 

Kwon Alexander is a soon to be 28 year old ILB who last played a full season back when he was 22. Outside of that single season, he’s never played more than 12 games in a year. I have no problem with JD holding firm on a value for this particular player. I’m sure their pro scouting department has their eyes on potential cuts at LB (as well as at OT). 

[Joe W. Namath]

9 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I suspect when Hamsah Nasirlideen is starting and getting blown away and the team is giving up 150 rushing yards a week - JD will regret saving $2mm in cap space.

No on is saying Kwon is a super star but he is an NFL caliber LB - the Jets are lacking a full complement of starters at that level of player on the current roster.

So that is your prediction?  Without an average nfl linebacker who is oft injured, we are giving up 150 rushing yards a game.  And with him that problem is shored up?

[derp]

The third linebacker doesn’t play much in the modern NFL - this defense is not remotely an exception. If they can’t stop the run it’ll be below even rethinking how they deploy their nickel in reasons why. Certainly DL play and Mosley/Williams will be up there.

[SickJetFan]

3 minutes ago, derp said:

The third linebacker doesn’t play much in the modern NFL - this defense is not remotely an exception. If they can’t stop the run it’ll be below even rethinking how they deploy their nickel in reasons why. Certainly DL play and Mosley/Williams will be up there.

if you go back and watch that Carolina game they had Nas in there on 1st and 2nd downs.  He was getting pushed around a lot but also made a play or too but on one play he was destroyed by a WR block.

[slats]

1 minute ago, derp said:

The third linebacker doesn’t play much in the modern NFL - this defense is not remotely an exception. If they can’t stop the run it’ll be below even rethinking how they deploy their nickel in reasons why. Certainly DL play and Mosley/Williams will be up there.

The plan will be a steady rotation of fresh legs on the DL and Whitehead living in the box. Last year Mosley played 92% of the snaps, Quincy played 74%, and no other LB played more than 18%. Be nice to have a solid depth piece but LB is a much bigger problem on this board than it is in reality. 

[nycdan]

1 minute ago, slats said:

The plan will be a steady rotation of fresh legs on the DL and Whitehead living in the box. Last year Mosley played 92% of the snaps, Quincy played 74%, and no other LB played more than 18%. Be nice to have a solid depth piece but LB is a much bigger problem on this board than it is in reality. 

...along with Becton's weight, Zach's personal life, Denzel's talent, and Saleh's coaching style.  

 

[SickJetFan]

3 minutes ago, slats said:

The plan will be a steady rotation of fresh legs on the DL and Whitehead living in the box. Last year Mosley played 92% of the snaps, Quincy played 74%, and no other LB played more than 18%. Be nice to have a solid depth piece but LB is a much bigger problem on this board than it is in reality. 

I think they went into season with intent to play more 4-3 on early downs but obviously with the percentages they backed off of that.  Interesting to go back and look at the games see when that happen...probably around same time they gave up on Nas experiment?

[rtnelson]

4 minutes ago, slats said:

The plan will be a steady rotation of fresh legs on the DL and Whitehead living in the box. Last year Mosley played 92% of the snaps, Quincy played 74%, and no other LB played more than 18%. Be nice to have a solid depth piece but LB is a much bigger problem on this board than it is in reality. 

I like Mosley, but I don't think he is the answer beyond this season at LB.  I like Quincy, but we are still hoping that he can take that "next step" and become solid starter material.  I do think the situation isn't good, because we're one ACL/MCL tear away from last year's secondary status at LB.

It's a nice position of need for a mid first round pick next season. *crosses fingers*

[Joe W. Namath]

This is how you build sustained success.  Overpaying for Jags like Kwon Alexander and Reilly Reiff is how you have a franchise like we have the past 10 years.  All the stuff Joe D is doing now is setting us up for sustained success like the Pats, Ravens, Steelers etc.

Jet fans are having a tough time seeing this and just think give this guy an extra 2 mill here, that guy an extra 3 mill there etc.  

 

[FidelioJet]

8 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

So that is your prediction?  Without an average nfl linebacker who is oft injured, we are giving up 150 rushing yards a game.  And with him that problem is shored up?

Why does it have to be all or not?

Kwon will make the defense better.  He will bring competence to the position.

How has Hamsah Injury history been? Mosley? Quincy?  

LB is the weakest unit on this team - and Kwon will make it better.  

[FidelioJet]

6 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

This is how you build sustained success.  Overpaying for Jags like Kwon Alexander and Reilly Reiff is how you have a franchise like we have the past 10 years.  All the stuff Joe D is doing now is setting us up for sustained success like the Pats, Ravens, Steelers etc.

Jet fans are having a tough time seeing this and just think give this guy an extra 2 mill here, that guy an extra 3 mill there etc.  

 

Where is that being said?

The Jets are in fine a position - but the LB position is truly lacking.  Paying an extra $2mm for fill out the remaining truly weak spot on the roster, IMO, is a good idea.

I don't see people running around saying an extra $2mm here, an extra $3mm there...

[Joe W. Namath]

4 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Why does it have to be all or not?

Kwon will make the defense better.  He will bring competence to the position.

How has Hamsah Injury history been? Mosley? Quincy?  

LB is the weakest unit on this team - and Kwon will make it better.  

I agree.  But how much he would make the team better doesnt justify the money he wants.  You cant just make any move that would make your team better.  If that was the case, being a GM would be easy.

[Joe W. Namath]

1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

Where is that being said?

The Jets are in fine a position - but the LB position is truly lacking.  Paying an extra $2mm for fill out the remaining truly weak spot on the roster, IMO, is a good idea.

I don't see people running around saying an extra $2mm here, an extra $3mm there...

That is exactly what they are saying.  You want Kwon here so we should toss him and extra 2 or 3 mill to get it down.  Fans wanted Reiff here and we should have tossed him a few extra mill.

That is not how long term success is bulit.  I get it, you want to be a better team today.  But build your franchise like that and your out of a job in 4 years.

[Jimmy 2 Times]

If only they held onto Damario Davis. 
He’s the thumper we’re missing. 

[FidelioJet]

2 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

I agree.  But how much he would make the team better doesnt justify the money he wants.  You cant just make any move that would make your team better.  If that was the case, being a GM would be easy.

I think this is where, I accept, my argument is kinda silly. - in that I have no idea what he's actually asking for or what the Jets are willing to pay.

I've been simply making an educated guess that it's around a $2mm gap -but no idea the numbers. 

We know the Jets would like him at a certain price - but I really don't know what that price is.  

I haven't seen it anywhere - did I miss it?

[slats]

11 minutes ago, SickJetFan said:

I think they went into season with intent to play more 4-3 on early downs but obviously with the percentages they backed off of that.  Interesting to go back and look at the games see when that happen...probably around same time they gave up on Nas experiment?

If you look at Nas’s game logs, he played 45% week one, 30% week two, and didn’t see the field again until week 17. Could’ve been a failure of the player or the scheme, but they made a hard adjustment and didn’t look back. Now this year with upgrading with new #1 & #2 CBs, they’ve freed up one safety to exist in the box just about full time.

 

10 minutes ago, rtnelson said:

I like Mosley, but I don't think he is the answer beyond this season at LB.  I like Quincy, but we are still hoping that he can take that "next step" and become solid starter material.  I do think the situation isn't good, because we're one ACL/MCL tear away from last year's secondary status at LB.

It's a nice position of need for a mid first round pick next season. *crosses fingers*

I thought they would’ve drafted one, too, but they felt trading up for JJ and Breece was better use of those picks. Mosley’s coming off one of his more productive seasons but, yeah, he’ll be 31 next year. I don’t know how that’s gonna play out but I do know that Joe Douglas isn’t going to pay him anything close to what Mac signed him for. He has a $17M salary due next year, but not a penny is guaranteed. 
 
Don’t really see a first rounder being spent on a LB, either, but that’s a long way away. I do not think they’re done at the position this year, and I do think it’ll need to be addressed next year. 

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

This is the last spot on the team where the Jets are lacking competence.  Not spending the extra money for him is a bit of a head scratcher.

 

We don’t have lots of cap room, I think we’re at $8 mil and you need room for the season. 

[FidelioJet]

14 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

That is exactly what they are saying.  You want Kwon here so we should toss him and extra 2 or 3 mill to get it down.  Fans wanted Reiff here and we should have tossed him a few extra mill.

That is not how long term success is bulit.  I get it, you want to be a better team today.  But build your franchise like that and your out of a job in 4 years.

What I'm saying is a GM's most basic job is to have, at worst, competence at every starting position.   The Jets currently are lacking that at LB.

I've accepted JD's first three years as he had to clean the absolute mess in which Mac left this franchise.  But that time is over and we should expect competence at every position.  I have not and will not advocate spending big money for high priced, aging FA's...

But JD missed here and needs to accept the reality and bring in a LB that can compete on an NFL level.

[Joe W. Namath]

9 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

What I'm saying is a GM's most basic job is to have, at worst, competence at every starting position.   The Jets currently are lacking that at LB.

I've accepted JD's first three years as he had to clean the absolute mess in which Mac left this franchise.  But that time is over and we should expect competence at every position.  I have not and will not advocate spending big money for high priced, aging FA's...

But JD missed here and needs to accept the reality and bring in a LB that can compete on an NFL level.

Joe D had to prioritize fixing the offense.  The offense side of the ball has been neglected through the draft the last 20 years.

The offense is now complete.  Joe D just needs 1 more draft to complete the D.  You will see a stud lb taken in round 1 next year.

[CTJetsFan]

38 minutes ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

If only they held onto Damario Davis. 
He’s the thumper we’re missing. 

This. And we let him go twice!

[derp]

1 hour ago, SickJetFan said:

if you go back and watch that Carolina game they had Nas in there on 1st and 2nd downs.  He was getting pushed around a lot but also made a play or too but on one play he was destroyed by a WR block.

That was the first game, the rest of the season is more reflective and the third linebacker really didn’t play a ton last year. Base is nickel now.

[derp]

1 hour ago, slats said:

The plan will be a steady rotation of fresh legs on the DL and Whitehead living in the box. Last year Mosley played 92% of the snaps, Quincy played 74%, and no other LB played more than 18%. Be nice to have a solid depth piece but LB is a much bigger problem on this board than it is in reality. 

Agree. The improvements to the corner position should allow them to allocate more resources to the run game. Hopefully the DL can stay healthy, the defensive end position got pretty rough last year. Much better depth there will be nice.

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, SickJetFan said:

I think they went into season with intent to play more 4-3 on early downs but obviously with the percentages they backed off of that.  Interesting to go back and look at the games see when that happen...probably around same time they gave up on Nas experiment?

People see 3 LB as starting positions.  I do not believe they see it that way.  I think that is why they drafted these S tweeners.  If they play 3 LB, at least one will be more S than LB.  I think that is why early in the season you saw more 4-3.  Because a 4-3 with Nas or Sherwood is actually a nickel.  When those guys got injured and seemed to fail you end up with more DBs on the field.  It also may have contributed to the safeties dropping like flies.  

[Skeptable]

10 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

People see 3 LB as starting positions.  I do not believe they see it that way.  I think that is why they drafted these S tweeners.  If they play 3 LB, at least one will be more S than LB.  I think that is why early in the season you saw more 4-3.  Because a 4-3 with Nas or Sherwood is actually a nickel.  When those guys got injured and seemed to fail you end up with more DBs on the field.  It also may have contributed to the safeties dropping like flies.  

3rd safety is more important....  A tweener is exactly what you are looking for, that is exactly what Nas is studying to be... but they also have Pinnock at safety and Parks which can also fill that tweener roll... Now an injury is a bigger issue, but Kwon's best days are behind him... there will be other cuts that can fill this backup roll.

[PepPep]

On 4/19/2022 at 7:29 AM, Jetlife33 said:

Would be some nice linebacker depth, should be cheap if it gets done

Not depth. He would be the starting Will and if he stayed healthy and proved that he still has plenty left in the tank I think he would influence how much 4-3 vs Nickel Saleh runs. 

Note- Having read more of this thread I want to add that he WILL NOT solve our porous run D problems. Like, that is not what this signing is about. If anything he will improve our ability to cover when we are in a 4-3. Nonetheless, considering we only have Sherwood and Nas at Will, Kwon would be the starter and improve the LB corps. It would probably make Saleh feel more comfortable running 4-3 more often.    

[GreenReaper]

All teams have weaknesses.  Some an Achilles heal.  Ask the Bills what happened in those last 13 seconds in last year's divisional playoff against the Chiefs.

You can't take the Mac approach and spray $$$ everywhere and solve problems by overspending.  Mac would've signed Riley Reiff for 12 Mil.  Probably overspend for Kwon too.  

JD will keep his CAP powder dry.  He gave Kwon a take it or leave it offer...now it's up to him to accept backup money for a backup depth role. 

JD will be looking for veteran backups with starting experience with pickups via TC cuts or waivers. 

Again...all teams have weaknesses.  It's up to the HC-CS to find ways to hide them and compensate for them.  

 

[varjet]

8 minutes ago, GreenReaper said:

All teams have weaknesses.  Some an Achilles heal.  Ask the Bills what happened in those last 13 seconds in last year's divisional playoff against the Chiefs.

You can't take the Mac approach and spray $$$ everywhere and solve problems by overspending.  Mac would've signed Riley Reiff for 12 Mil.  Probably overspend for Kwon too.  

JD will keep his CAP powder dry.  He gave Kwon a take it or leave it offer...now it's up to him to accept backup money for a backup depth role. 

JD will be looking for veteran backups with starting experience with pickups via TC cuts or waivers. 

Again...all teams have weaknesses.  It's up to the HC-CS to find ways to hide them and compensate for them.  

I agree with most of this, but for many teams, if they want to "go for it" they will need to overpay for players.   I don't think the Jets are there yet, and the schedule in 2022 is daunting.

If the Jets are Kwon away from making the playoffs in 2022 and don't make it, I think we have grounds to complain.  But teams like the Bears are spending foolishly-we all wanted Reiff as T3, but at Moses money (home run) not what Reiff got paid.  

I think JD is hoping that someone breaks free, like Quincy Williams did, who is better than the LBs we have on the roster.  Whitehead will also held overall.  

[#27TheDominator]

34 minutes ago, Skeptable said:

3rd safety is more important....  A tweener is exactly what you are looking for, that is exactly what Nas is studying to be... but they also have Pinnock at safety and Parks which can also fill that tweener roll... Now an injury is a bigger issue, but Kwon's best days are behind him... there will be other cuts that can fill this backup roll.

I think they know Alexander's best days are behind him and that is why they made him a take it or leave it offer which, for the time being at least, he is leaving.  They may well find more guys that can fill that role, but with the new CBA, they don't get those early rounds of cuts to add players before the deadline.  I think that also cuts down on the trades since you don't get to bring guys in until the eve of the season. 

I think people are sleeping on some of the lower tier moves they made.  Marcell Harris played about 350 snaps a year for these guys in SF.  He was a 6th in 2018 and came here when his rookie deal expired.  They also poached Javin White from the Raiders practice squad.  Raiderholic keeps touting him.  Another freak athlete that was a college S playing LB.  Del'Shawn Philips was there last year and played 150 snaps and is a core special teamer.  They also signed DQ Thomas from Middle Tennessee to an UDFA contract with a decent guarantee/bonus like Yeboah and Isaiah Dunn who both stuck last year.  He is an ILB but looked like a S and wore #20.  Listed at 218, but supposedly weight 226 at his pro day.  Long and athletic enough and all of that is in addition to Nas and Sherwood.

I don't think the cupboard is really that bad.  They will probably upgrade with some money or a real draft pick next year with Mosley coming off the books.

[jgb]

3 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

This is how you build sustained success.  Overpaying for Jags like Kwon Alexander and Reilly Reiff is how you have a franchise like we have the past 10 years.  All the stuff Joe D is doing now is setting us up for sustained success like the Pats, Ravens, Steelers etc.

Jet fans are having a tough time seeing this and just think give this guy an extra 2 mill here, that guy an extra 3 mill there etc.  

 

Whiffing on 3 “QBs of the future” doesn’t help, either.

[Dunnie]

Whiffing on 3 “QBs of the future” doesn’t help, either.

2 and a '?'

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

[jgb]

1 minute ago, Dunnie said:

2 and a '?'

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk
 

Sanchez, Geno, Darnold is who I was referring to

[bitonti]

 really like Quincy Williams, both as a player and the "Williams brothers" vibe in the Jets defensive locker room 

no one fights for each other like family

[MykePM]

6 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

 

If there were really "multiple teams trying to scoop him up", he would have signed with one of them already (like Riley Reiff did)... unless these "multiple teams" don't value him any higher than the Jets do.

This comes across as a weak attempt to get the Jets to increase their offer.  

[Jethead]

3 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

I think they know Alexander's best days are behind him and that is why they made him a take it or leave it offer which, for the time being at least, he is leaving.  They may well find more guys that can fill that role, but with the new CBA, they don't get those early rounds of cuts to add players before the deadline.  I think that also cuts down on the trades since you don't get to bring guys in until the eve of the season. 

I think people are sleeping on some of the lower tier moves they made.  Marcell Harris played about 350 snaps a year for these guys in SF.  He was a 6th in 2018 and came here when his rookie deal expired.  They also poached Javin White from the Raiders practice squad.  Raiderholic keeps touting him.  Another freak athlete that was a college S playing LB.  Del'Shawn Philips was there last year and played 150 snaps and is a core special teamer.  They also signed DQ Thomas from Middle Tennessee to an UDFA contract with a decent guarantee/bonus like Yeboah and Isaiah Dunn who both stuck last year.  He is an ILB but looked like a S and wore #20.  Listed at 218, but supposedly weight 226 at his pro day.  Long and athletic enough and all of that is in addition to Nas and Sherwood.

I don't think the cupboard is really that bad.  They will probably upgrade with some money or a real draft pick next year with Mosley coming off the books.

Good post. Kwon is a recognized name but has done nothing to merit being given starter's money. In fact, he's kinda slow and lacks the "ultimate" ability. Now if they could acquire Roquan for a price that does not include a premium draft pick, that would be another story.

[Jetsfan80]

Kwon Alexander is a below average LB in pass coverage.

Yet even he has as many INTs over the last 3 seasons (2) as Jamal Adams.