Why didn’t Todd Bowles Bowles call a time out: MERGED

[bonkertons]

2 hours ago, Biggs said:

No doubt both Washington and New England out tanked us.  

Bowles made a mistake, he didn't quit.  He was embarrased to own up to it.

Are you related to Todd?

[slimjasi]

4 hours ago, bitonti said:

OK so let's say they play this last drive where they have a 2 percent chance and Wirfs blows out his knee 

There's something to be said for just ending the game without any other injuries 

[Biggs]

50 minutes ago, bonkertons said:

Are you related to Todd?

I like Bowles.  Don’t think he’s a great HC but always thought he was way better than the two guys that have followed him on the Jets.  He did a reasonable good job with a mediocre team this year.   Having seen Gase and now Saleh, I have no doubt that Sticking with Bowles and getting a good GM would have been better than the direction this team has taken.  Replacing him with Gase and letting Gase hire JD who hired Saleh looks idiotic in hindsight.

[bonkertons]

13 minutes ago, Biggs said:

I like Bowles.  Don’t think he’s a great HC but always thought he was way better than the two guys that have followed him on the Jets.  He did a reasonable good job with a mediocre team this year.   Having seen Gase and now Saleh, I have no doubt that Sticking with Bowles and getting a good GM would have been better than the direction this team has taken.  Replacing him with Gase and letting Gase hire JD who hired Saleh looks idiotic in hindsight.

I get liking him, but that sh*t yesterday was inexcusable.  Either he ****ed up and forgot how many timeouts he had in one of the most important games of his life, or he legitimately gave up.  Chances are that yes, it's the former, but the fact that he felt embarrassed about it to the point of giving a fake reason that makes him look worse is just....how could you ever get past that as a Bucs fan?

[y2k8]

 

Bowles didn't quit. He was oblivious. What he said in post game was a cover for his brain fart.

And while this would be the only thing anyone would be talking about today in NY if it were the Jets or Giants - literally no one is talking about it down here in Tampa.

This is a place where the local reporters ask questions about preparing for the cold weather during a game played indoors. 

They've already turned the page and are focused on Gasparilla next weekend. 

[Beerfish]

Bowles has quite numerous times given up in the past with the jets, numerous times.

It is maybe as bad or worse just making the mistake.

[Jet2020]

7 hours ago, bitonti said:

To be really honest the lions were kneeling early 

Goff kneeled on 2nd down with 16 seconds on the play clock 

Once Bowles didn't Take the first time out it was seen as a concession and everyone got sloppy 

To call the time out on 4th down is technically possible but it would be considered a dick move 

But let's walk that dog he calls time out the lions either kick a 48 yarder or punt them inside the ten. That leaves tbb about 25 seconds to go 90 yards plus a two point conversion to tie 

It's possible but highly unlikely 

The game was done. 

The third down knee was around 33 yard line. That makes it a 50-51 yard FG attempt. Not a given on any day, let alone a playoff game. “Wide right”. A punt can very easily end up in the EZ giving the ball at the 20. Two quick sideline passes against prevent D puts them around the 50 yard line with maybe 15 seconds left. That’s possibly two Hail Mary shots. Of course this is very optimistic but there’s a chance. Dick move or not. Dan Campbell is the one who messed up by not taking the whole clock and could’ve played out the clock without an issue. Can’t call TB a dick for it. 

[Jet2020]

7 hours ago, bitonti said:

The only reason this looks so bad is because Goff kneeled with 16 seconds on his play clock 

let's go through the math again but pretend Bowles was actually trying to get it back for real 

1:33 1st down at tbb 28. kneel. Last Time out. 

1:32 2nd down at the tbb 29. Kneel

Minus 40 seconds 

0:52 3rd down at the tbb 30. Kneel

Minus 40 seconds 

0:12 punt minus 5-6 seconds or FG minus 3 seconds plus a kick off 

We're basically talking about 5 or 10 seconds left if it's for real 

To go back on a concession is bad form and don't forget these hcs are all in the union together they all give each other jobs it's not like I hate you and want you dead (except for belly he's like that) 

But let's imagine Bowles doesn't concede. It comes down to less than 10 seconds or possibly nothing left after a squib kick off 

 

Dude why take all that time for this ridiculous input? We are just talking about taking the time out after realizing Dan Campbell messed up twice by not using the entire play clock. They had 36 seconds left, 4th down, ball at the 32-33. Bucs fans would love Dan to try a 50+ yard FG. Miss it and you’re already at the 40. Doesn’t matter what Dan did. What matters is what Bowles didn’t do that made him a quitter. You never quit in playoffs. 

15 seconds left and the ball 10 yards from the EZ, two possession game. You still try to score a TD even though you still need to recover an onside kick after the FG and then score another TD. 

Your theory suggests NFL should do away with Hail Mary. 

[bitonti]

21 minutes ago, Jet2020 said:

Dude why take all that time for this ridiculous input? We are just talking about taking the time out after realizing Dan Campbell messed up twice by not using the entire play clock. They had 36 seconds left, 4th down, ball at the 32-33. Bucs fans would love Dan to try a 50+ yard FG. Miss it and you’re already at the 40. Doesn’t matter what Dan did. What matters is what Bowles didn’t do that made him a quitter. You never quit in playoffs. 

15 seconds left and the ball 10 yards from the EZ, two possession game. You still try to score a TD even though you still need to recover an onside kick after the FG and then score another TD. 

Your theory suggests NFL should do away with Hail Mary. 

This "Todd Bowles had an extra time out" thing is not a real story. It only exists among butt hurt Jets fans 

Once the losing coach concedes it's over. There's no miracle moment here for Bowles that will save his season. Especially after baker is in full meltdown mode 

And to put it another way going against the concession is an unwritten rule you end up like mangini with that ra ra bullsh*t. Todd Bowles probably wants to work again after the bucs. To concede and then unconcede is a good way to get drummed out of the fraternity 

 

[Gen X Jet]

Bowles is limited.  We all know this.

[ScarletKnight89]

Fireable offense

I think Bowles and the Bucs coaching staff weren't paying attention to the fact that the Lions screwed up the kneel downs but their excuse was worse. Saying they were going to just kick a field goal and why prolong the inevitable was disgraceful. 

[Jet2020]

2 hours ago, bitonti said:

This "Todd Bowles had an extra time out" thing is not a real story. It only exists among butt hurt Jets fans 

Once the losing coach concedes it's over. There's no miracle moment here for Bowles that will save his season. Especially after baker is in full meltdown mode 

And to put it another way going against the concession is an unwritten rule you end up like mangini with that ra ra bullsh*t. Todd Bowles probably wants to work again after the bucs. To concede and then unconcede is a good way to get drummed out of the fraternity 

 

1. It wasn’t an “extra” time out. 

2. Dan Campbell pre maturely claimed victory 

3. TB was asked about it so clearly it’s a point of discussion. If we Jets fans are debating, Bucs fans are most likely pulling their hair. 

4. I doubt any FO would tell Todd “hey, how dare you call a time out and then try to win a game? We don’t do that in the NFL”. 

5. You should stop arguing this. Only makes you look worse. 

[HessStation]

Was the 2 pt conversation this game or the other game? Whoever did that yesterday was dumb. I’m old I can’t remember 

[Jetsfan80]

2 hours ago, bitonti said:

This "Todd Bowles had an extra time out" thing is not a real story. It only exists among butt hurt Jets fans 

Then why are there CBS, NBC, SI, NY Times, Fox News and Yahoo Sports articles about it when I type “Todd Bowles” into the search bar on Google?

This is absurd man.  If it was a 9+ point game you’d have a point.  It was 8.  One possession.  In the playoffs.  It doesn’t matter how low the odds are.  You take the damn timeout.  Arguing otherwise is loser talk.  

[Jet2020]

4 minutes ago, HessStation said:

Was the 2 pt conversation this game or the other game? Whoever did that yesterday was dumb. I’m old I can’t remember 

That was Todd the great as well. But I do give him props for being aggressive. 

[jamesr]

That was Todd the great as well. But I do give him props for being aggressive. 

He played to win the game!

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Sperm Edwards]

18 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Yes, both were completely idiotic mistakes.  For all the money these teams pay for players, coaches, etc, this type of stuff is completely inexcusable.  Teams have analytics nerds slicing and dicing up data yet they can't figure this type of stuff out?!  It doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

Where is Dick Curl when you need him?

[Dunnie]

Fireable offense
I think Bowles and the Bucs coaching staff weren't paying attention to the fact that the Lions screwed up the kneel downs but their excuse was worse. Saying they were going to just kick a field goal and why prolong the inevitable was disgraceful. 

Yeah but was his RB 6 yards shy of a 1000 yard season ? maybe the Jets lent the Bucs their sideline mathematician.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Sperm Edwards]

18 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

It's very unlikely the Bucs would have been able to tie the game if they called a timeout. That doesn't mean it wasn't a huge F up. They had a chance still and Bowles was like nah - we can't do it just let the clock run out.

loser.

7 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Then why are there CBS, NBC, SI, NY Times, Fox News and Yahoo Sports articles about it when I type “Todd Bowles” into the search bar on Google?

This is absurd man.  If it was a 9+ point game you’d have a point.  It was 8.  One possession.  In the playoffs.  It doesn’t matter how low the odds are.  You take the damn timeout.  Arguing otherwise is loser talk.  

Alternate timeline outcome:

Thanks to a shorter field after the blocked FG (or punt), Tampa has a miracle comeback, in improbable fashion as that's how they occur, and the Bucs somehow win (they certainly have the receivers, if the blocked kick wasn't returned for a TD outright).

After the fact, our resident contrarian would post not:

"Wow, Campbell is a Grade-A dumbass, and this was an all-time historical clock screwup."

Nope; it would be:

"Wow, that was both classless and really stupid of Bowles to even try there in the first place -- yeah sure they won, fans everywhere are talking about how Bowles outsmarted Campbell, people will talk about this game's ending forever, and now they're a game away from the Super Bowl. That's all well and good, but holy hell consider the risk he took there. I mean, Wirfs could've blown out his knee while they tried to win! With such low odds, Bowles should've just conceded like a gentleman. Now at age 60, after over 20 years on NFL sidelines, he's probably going to get kicked out of the glorious coaching fraternity because he showed up Dan Campbell. And the cherry on top is that there's no point of even suiting up to play in the NFCCG since they're just going to lose to San Fran anyway. Teams should know when they are beaten in advance, and shouldn't even bother trying."

(OK that's admittedly the extended/me-version of what he'd say in fewer words. I yam what I yam.)

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Alternate timeline outcome:

Thanks to a shorter field after the blocked FG (or punt), Tampa has a miracle comeback, in improbable fashion as that's how they occur, and the Bucs somehow win (they certainly have the receivers, if the blocked kick wasn't returned for a TD outright).

After the fact, our resident contrarian would post not:

"Wow, Campbell is a Grade-A dumbass, and this was an all-time historical clock screwup."

Nope; it would be:

"Wow, that was both classless and really stupid of Bowles to even try there in the first place -- yeah sure they won, fans everywhere are talking about how Bowles outsmarted Campbell, people will talk about this game's ending forever, and now they're a game away from the Super Bowl. That's all well and good, but holy hell consider the risk he took there. I mean, Wirfs could've blown out his knee while they tried to win! With such low odds, Bowles should've just conceded like a gentleman. Now at age 60, after over 20 years on NFL sidelines, he's probably going to get kicked out of the glorious coaching fraternity because he showed up Dan Campbell. And the cherry on top is that there's no point of even suiting up to play in the NFCCG since they're just going to lose to San Fran anyway. Teams should know when they are beaten in advance, and shouldn't even bother trying."

(OK that's admittedly the extended/me-version of what he'd say in fewer words. I yam what I yam.)

ur just a Todd Bowles hater

[heymangold]

21 hours ago, bitonti said:

They were at the tbb 30 that's a 45 yarder in a dome it's basically automatic 

i'd still take the chance.  obviously have seen kickers miss shorter than that.

[Adoni Beast]

16 hours ago, Biggs said:

I like Bowles.  Don’t think he’s a great HC but always thought he was way better than the two guys that have followed him on the Jets.  He did a reasonable good job with a mediocre team this year.   Having seen Gase and now Saleh, I have no doubt that Sticking with Bowles and getting a good GM would have been better than the direction this team has taken.  Replacing him with Gase and letting Gase hire JD who hired Saleh looks idiotic in hindsight.

I agree to a point. I do not think Bowles is the right guy to oversee the development of a rookie/young QB. He needs a vet at QB, with a good D and then he's a pretty good head coach.

He has struggled to bring in good OCs, but seemingly has finally made a good hire in Canales.

[Barry McCockinner]

 

 

Quote

 

Why did Todd Bowles give up?

Here’s the thing about situations that are the equivalent of catching lightning in a bottle. Slim as the chances of it happening might be, it definitely can’t happen unless you put the bottle in the street.

On Sunday, Buccaneers coach Todd Bowles failed to put the bottle in the street, conceding to the Lions with 36 seconds left and one timeout in hand (after the Lions bungled the two-minute clock management). If Bowles had called the final timeout, the Lions would have had to do something on fourth and 12 from their own 32.

With 36 seconds left, the choices for Detroit would have been punt, try a field goal, or go for it. The way Bowles addressed it after the game and on Monday, he was basically conceding that the Lions would have made a 50-yard field goal.

While kicks like that succeed far more often than they once did, they aren’t chip shots. (Just ask the Bills and Tyler bass.) A miss would have given the Buccaneers the ball on their own 39 with right around 30 seconds to play.

As noted by the folks at JoeBucsFan.com, who are demanding that Bowles admit his error and apologize for it, the Bucs got the ball back on a Thursday night in Buffalo on their own 20 with 21 seconds to play in a six-point game. And they nearly connected on a perfectly-thrown Hail Mary pass by quarterback Baker Mayfield.

Beyond the possibility of a missed field goal, what if the Buccaneers had blocked the kick? What if they’d picked it up and returned it for a touchdown?

If the Lions had chosen to punt, there could have been a bad snap. There could have been a bobble by the punter. There could have been a block. There could have been a return for a touchdown.

Frankly, it’s inexcusable to not empty the tank when the season is on the line. So what if the Lions had made a field goal and gone up by 11? Bowles forfeited the chance, slim as it might have been, to shock the world and advance to the NFC Championship.

Who does that? This is the same franchise whose head coach used to send defensive linemen into the legs of offensive linemen in the hopes of forcing a fumble in victory formation. While that tactic crossed the line, it underscores the fact that there should be no white flag. There should be no gimme putts. There should be no surrender.

While there’s no reason to believe Bowles is in trouble, it’s alarming to think he gave up with barely a shrug of the shoulders on what could have been one of the great finishes in NFL playoff history. And with offensive coordinator Dave Canales possibly getting some sniffs in Carolina, Bowles might want to think about what happened with Lovie Smith and Dirk Koetter before assuming that getting to the divisional round is more than enough to return for 2024.

 

 

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/why-did-todd-bowles-give-up

oNLy buTtHuRT JeTS fAnS!

[bitonti]

11 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

oNLy buTtHuRT JeTS fAnS!

It was a gentlemans agreement between two gentlemen who used to be players 

Not everyone will understand 

[bonkertons]

6 minutes ago, bitonti said:

It was a gentlemans agreement between two gentlemen who used to be players 

Not everyone will understand 

You keep saying this....can you find me any evidence of this?  Is this actually a thing in football?  Like the ref will go to one coach and ask if they plan on stopping the clock, and then relay that information to the other coach?  Or were they doing sign language from one sideline to the other?  

 

Even if this occurred, which I highly ******* doubt, why in God's name would you ever even take that risk if you're Campbell?  Who gives a **** if Goff has to wait an extra 15 seconds before taking a knee?  Is it really that important that you get out of the stadium 45 seconds early???  This reasoning is almost as dumb as what actually happened....the Lions/Goff didn't realize TB had another timeout, and Bowles either didn't realize either or he was so caught off guard by Detroit's clock mismanagement, that he failed to capitalize on their blunder.  

 

Enough of this "gentleman's agreement" conspiracy theory.  If this were a thing, you'd see this sh*t happen all the time.  You don't.  Again, maybe when it's a 2 score game(and it's not even an "agreement", one coach just decides it's not worth it to try to stop the clock to get the ball back with 15 seconds left needing two scores), but not when it's a one score game with your season on the line.  C'mon man.  Just admit you're wrong on this one.  

[Barry McCockinner]

6 minutes ago, bonkertons said:

You keep saying this....can you find me any evidence of this?  Is this actually a thing in football?  Like the ref will go to one coach and ask if they plan on stopping the clock, and then relay that information to the other coach?  Or were they doing sign language from one sideline to the other?  

 

Even if this occurred, which I highly ******* doubt, why in God's name would you ever even take that risk if you're Campbell?  Who gives a **** if Goff has to wait an extra 15 seconds before taking a knee?  Is it really that important that you get out of the stadium 45 seconds early???  This reasoning is almost as dumb as what actually happened....the Lions/Goff didn't realize TB had another timeout, and Bowles either didn't realize either or he was so caught off guard by Detroit's clock mismanagement, that he failed to capitalize on their blunder.  

 

Enough of this "gentleman's agreement" conspiracy theory.  If this were a thing, you'd see this sh*t happen all the time.  You don't.  Again, maybe when it's a 2 score game(and it's not even an "agreement", one coach just decides it's not worth it to try to stop the clock to get the ball back with 15 seconds left needing two scores), but not when it's a one score game with your season on the line.  C'mon man.  Just admit you're wrong on this one.  

Bowles was explicitly asked if any such agreement existed and he said no. It's just made up nonsense.

[Sperm Edwards]

23 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Bowles was explicitly asked if any such agreement existed and he said no. It's just made up nonsense.

I've lost count of the times Belichick exploited rules and situations by doing things coaches just never did to one another, and he got nationally fellated for it every time. He was the rule book master & stuff.

If not fellated then the x-rated gynecomastic moobs under his torn hoodie were certainly tickled and suckled-upon by sports media talking heads. Er, um, figuratively speaking.

BTW you're welcome in advance for that mental image.

[Dcat]

Really don't know but it sure looks like a big fat brain fart by Bowles.  And the media won't stop unless he admits it?  Ugly stuff.

[Biggs]

On 1/22/2024 at 4:28 PM, bonkertons said:

I get liking him, but that sh*t yesterday was inexcusable.  Either he ****ed up and forgot how many timeouts he had in one of the most important games of his life, or he legitimately gave up.  Chances are that yes, it's the former, but the fact that he felt embarrassed about it to the point of giving a fake reason that makes him look worse is just....how could you ever get past that as a Bucs fan?

Don't know I'm a Jets fan.  I've seen so much slap dick coaching over the years including this year and last, I'd have a hard time being pissed at Bowles getting my team to the second round of the playoffs with a mediocre team with a journeyman QB. 

[Jet Nut]

20 hours ago, bitonti said:

It was a gentlemans agreement between two gentlemen who used to be players 

Not everyone will understand 

The winning team doesn’t get to decide the games over.  There isn’t an unwritten law that you can’t use your last time out.  And if you do you’re a duck who gets thrown out of the HCing fraternity.  
You try to win when there’s a chance-you can no matter how long the odds are.  There’s was a chances .  Baker throwing a pick didn’t put him in full panic mode.  

[bitonti]

22 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I've lost count of the times Belichick exploited rules and situations by doing things coaches just never did to one another,

Belly has a bad reputation with other coaches he's not in the union and I guess that all works for him 

In the rest of the world coaches end games early all the time out of respect and run out the clock when they have other options 

I get what you guys are saying about having 30 seconds left but that only happened because Goff got sloppy bleeding the clock 

The original math says the game is over. For Bowles to go back on that agreement for a less than 1 percent chance of baker scoring a touchdown is foolish

[Scott Dierking]

7 minutes ago, bitonti said:

Belly has a bad reputation with other coaches he's not in the union and I guess that all works for him 

In the rest of the world coaches end games early all the time out of respect and run out the clock when they have other options 

I get what you guys are saying about having 30 seconds left but that only happened because Goff got sloppy bleeding the clock 

The original math says the game is over. For Bowles to go back on that agreement for a less than 1 percent chance of baker scoring a touchdown is foolish

A regular season game, I could see. But you owe it to your fan base of at least giving impression of doing everything you can, even if the odds are miniscule. 

But, miracle at the meadowlands, butt fumbles, holy roller, wide right, music city miracle, all happen. And you don't know if they will pop up.

If you force the field goal, it could get blocked and run back. Those things happen.

[bitonti]

13 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

A regular season game, I could see. But you owe it to your fan base of at least giving impression of doing everything you can, even if the odds are miniscule. 

But, miracle at the meadowlands, butt fumbles, holy roller, wide right, music city miracle, all happen. And you don't know if they will pop up.

If you force the field goal, it could get blocked and run back. Those things happen.

I get all this. It's possible he could have won the game somehow 

but at what personal cost? Todd Bowles will eventually need to work again. He's not belly.

To steal a win like that from Dan Campbell while technically possible is a bad EV career move. Chances are you call the timeout, you still lose and the rest of your colleagues remembers you're a dick forever. 

There are certain unwritten rules in the league and one of them is once you agree the game is over it's over 

To do otherwise is like that fake slide Zach wilson and Josh Allen love so much. Just gross low character shenanigans. 

 

[Jetsfan80]

7 minutes ago, bitonti said:

I get all this. It's possible he could have won the game somehow 

but at what personal cost? Todd Bowles will eventually need to work again. He's not belly.

To steal a win like that from Dan Campbell while technically possible is a bad EV career move. Chances are you call the timeout, you still lose and the rest of your colleagues remembers you're a dick forever. 

There are certain unwritten rules in the league and one of them is once you agree the game is over it's over 

To do otherwise is like that fake slide Zach wilson and Josh Allen love so much. Just gross low character shenanigans. 

 

Quadrupling down on your horrid take, I see.

Again.  If this was a 9+ point game in the regular season you’d have a point.  There’s no such stupid gentleman’s agreement with a one possession game in the playoffs.  You claw till the last second when you have a chance.  Always.  

No one is going to kick Bowles out of the fraternity purely for calling a friggin timeout there.   They might for other reasons - but not that.  

Just take the L.  Like Bowles did.  

[Barry McCockinner]

Bad EV career move 🤣🤣😭

The mental gymnastics are amusing.