My take on Joe Douglas, and his future with the Jets.

[Alka]

Joe Douglas was a rookie General Manager when he came onto the Jets, and as a rookie, made many mistakes.  He learned on the job, and if you look at his overall record, you might say he is no better than average.  In fact, if you look at his overall record, you might even say he is a below average general manager.

I have a different take.  I believe that Joe Douglas has transformed himself into a very good General Manager, and I feel that the Jets should not wait too long to extend him well into the future.

I am not concerned about waiting to see what happens this year.  For me, if the Jets fail, then Robert Saleh should be on the hot seat, and be the one to take the fall.

I would hate to see Joe Douglas leave the Jets under any circumstances, and succeed somewhere else.  That would be the equivalent of taking a rookie player, training them, and then they go to another team to become an All-Pro player on another team.

I'm sure I will have many dissenters here.  For me, Joe Douglas has already succeeded in putting this team together.  I love what he has done.  If the Jets fail this year for whatever reason, I will not blame Joe Douglas.  He continues to ascend as a GM, and I believe he will only get better as time goes on.  With him, it is only time until the Jets go back to the Superbowl.

John Idzik was never going to be good enough.  Mike Maccagnan was never going to be good enough IMHO.  Joe Douglas has shown me that he is very good, and only getting better.

[MR.GANGGREEN28]

As a high school freshman teacher, I would give this short essay an 85. Strong thesis and conclusion. Great job.

[Larz]

I tend to agree. The talent is there.  If they fall short I think Saleh is gone and Ulbrich may get the chance at HC assuming JD is extended 

[Alka]

2 minutes ago, MR.GANGGREEN28 said:

As a high school freshman teacher, I would give this short essay an 85. Strong thesis and conclusion. Great job.

Damn, If I knew that I was being graded, I would have put more effort into my answer!

The goal of my thread is to put my thoughts out there, and to spur on a discussion for others to get involved.  I would like to read and respond to other people and other views.  I expect others have a strong opinion on this, in both the positive and the negative.

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

Only way I see them failing is if major injuries strike again.  

[Claymation]

I have said it before and I’ll say it again. This is a top 5 roster and if they fail, it will fall squarely on Robert and his staff. 
 

But I feel this team will contend for the Super Bowl.

[Beerfish]

No worries unless the jets totally shi* the bed this year he will get a fat extension.

He may or may not be a good enough gm to ever get us to the top, he makes a lot of good moves and also makes some huge blunders.

[Waka Flocka Flacco]

46 minutes ago, MR.GANGGREEN28 said:

As a high school freshman teacher, I would give this short essay an 85. Strong thesis and conclusion. Great job.

What do you give it for sentence structure?

[usapaw]

A bit early for this IMO.  He hired the HC but he gets no accountability? RS has had to put up with his horrible draft years, as well as the good ones. They produce or they exit. Next. 

[bicketybam]

10 minutes ago, usapaw said:

A bit early for this IMO.  He hired the HC but he gets no accountability? RS has had to put up with his horrible draft years, as well as the good ones. They produce or they exit. Next. 

Are you happy with the Tim Boyle addition? 

[Rhg1084]

Joe D missing on Zach is normally a fatal mistake for most GMs. The fact is he built a super talented roster top to bottom and that why he’s still here.

Obviously this year is a huge year but even if he’s snakebitten by injuries again and Jets have losing record I’d still be in favor to offer him an extension. His eye for talent is obvious and developing these UDFA has been something I’ve never seen before. Not to mention turning a waiver wire pickup into an All Pro.

So yes I’d give JD the extension today if I was Woody but I have no doubt the team will prove itself on the field this season and he’ll get one coming off a successful season. 

[BreeceHallofFame]

We are winning the Super Bowl and he is getting a 5 year extension.  Next 

[LockeJET]

This isnt a fire JD take  but I think he really failed the last two years in the draft. You don’t take first round pics that aren’t gonna contribute right away on win now teams. He’s too conservative in different spots. Sometimes you just gotta go for it. He should’ve either traded up or taken guys that would’ve contributed right away. 
 

[Rhg1084]

15 hours ago, LockeJET said:

This isnt a fire JD take  but I think he really failed the last two years in the draft. You don’t take first round pics that aren’t gonna contribute right away on win now teams. He’s too conservative in different spots. Sometimes you just gotta go for it. He should’ve either traded up or taken guys that would’ve contributed right away. 
 

I’ll never fault a GM for investing in the trenches. That’s where you need the most depth and games are won. 

[varjet]

17 minutes ago, LockeJET said:

This isnt a fire JD take  but I think he really failed the last two years in the draft. You don’t take first round pics that aren’t gonna contribute right away on win now teams. He’s too conservative in different spots. Sometimes you just gotta go for it. He should’ve either traded up or taken guys that would’ve contributed right away. 
 

He takes first round picks that have the traits to be pro bowl players, even if they have other issues.  He goes for high ceiling, low floor.  

I think they feel like the rest of the players are close to the same quality, and they can coach/scheme fit them up.  

They also feel like they can find players cut/let loose by other teams. 

Everyone says that the Jets have a great roster.  Their record over the past five years is terrible.  Let’s see if the Jets can win now.   JD must have a handshake deal with Woody. 

[Bronx]

1 hour ago, MR.GANGGREEN28 said:

As a high school freshman teacher, I would give this short essay an 85. Strong thesis and conclusion. Great job.

Chris Daddy,

will wait until we are eliminated.

 

[32EBoozer]

1 hour ago, SomebodytoAnybody47 said:

Only way I see them failing is if major injuries strike again.  

AAANNDDDD…..  Coaching!

Saleh and Hackett scare the heck out of me in crunch time!

Thankfully Rodgers can overcome some of Hackett’s play calling, but Saleh dealing with time management, time outs and challenges is frightening. Especially when we lost our “challenges” asst. to another team. 

[Joe W. Namath]

The only way this team falls short is if aaron rodgers misses extensive time again.  And if u r not going to blame Joe D for that, then u cant blame Saleh either.

Both these guys are getting monster contract extensions after the season.

Accept it jet fans!!!! 

[peekskill68]

He's good at assessing value - every GM has hits and misses.  He's terrible (so far) at risk management.  Going into last year without a decent backup for Rodgers and betting on Becton coming off major surgery was inexcusable...

 

 

[Warfish]

Win 10 or more, Extension

Lose 8 or more, Fired

Simple as that.

[Cyberjet]

Interesting take. How do you determine what is the effectiveness of a GM or the coach. Who gets credit? An average talented team can get coached up and win - but how do you truly know that’s the case? Same goes for the QB? 
 

is it the system? Is it the talent? Is it the QB.

I think the Jets and Douglas achieved that balance on defense fairly quickly. The offense not so much. JD failed the offense without a good QB and  inferior offensive line made worse by a bad QB.

This year the Jets have the offense talent in place and it totally depends on Rodgers. If for some reason he’s a wash it may be a long season 
 

[Jetsplayer21]

2 hours ago, Alka said:

Joe Douglas was a rookie General Manager when he came onto the Jets, and as a rookie, made many mistakes.  He learned on the job, and if you look at his overall record, you might say he is no better than average.  In fact, if you look at his overall record, you might even say he is a below average general manager.

I have a different take.  I believe that Joe Douglas has transformed himself into a very good General Manager, and I feel that the Jets should not wait too long to extend him well into the future.

I am not concerned about waiting to see what happens this year.  For me, if the Jets fail, then Robert Saleh should be on the hot seat, and be the one to take the fall.

I would hate to see Joe Douglas leave the Jets under any circumstances, and succeed somewhere else.  That would be the equivalent of taking a rookie player, training them, and then they go to another team to become an All-Pro player on another team.

I'm sure I will have many dissenters here.  For me, Joe Douglas has already succeeded in putting this team together.  I love what he has done.  If the Jets fail this year for whatever reason, I will not blame Joe Douglas.  He continues to ascend as a GM, and I believe he will only get better as time goes on.  With him, it is only time until the Jets go back to the Superbowl.

John Idzik was never going to be good enough.  Mike Maccagnan was never going to be good enough IMHO.  Joe Douglas has shown me that he is very good, and only getting better.

We know what the team is without a good qb. We saw last yr. Drafting a franchise qb at 2 overall, and putting all your weight behind him for 3 years, usually would sink a gm. The rodgers situation was pure luck, and very strong good gm work in Green Bay.  If Green Bay didn’t have a very good gm who drafted Love and let him develop on bench, they wouldn’t have let Rodgers go. It was luck most teams were not going to fight for rodgers. He wanted to play for Saleh/hackett. Vet qbs do not come to a team because they like a gm ha. The D was built mostly by Saleh’s endorsements. JD has been the Co-signer to what Saleh wanted to build on D. JD primary task was to build a strong OL. That was his supposed specialty. He definitely didn’t do that. That along with Zach Wilson disaster, would have got him easily fired if Rodgers didn’t come to his rescue. Bottom line is both Saleh and JD have a lot to prove still. No more excuses this yr. 

[batman10023]

1 hour ago, LockeJET said:

This isnt a fire JD take  but I think he really failed the last two years in the draft. You don’t take first round pics that aren’t gonna contribute right away on win now teams. He’s too conservative in different spots. Sometimes you just gotta go for it. He should’ve either traded up or taken guys that would’ve contributed right away. 
 

Most likely our first rounder this year will contribute. 
 

hard to go an entire year without o line injuries

[Jet_Engine1]

"Joe Douglas is not a 'Terrible GM'"

 

"**** you,  Jet_Engine1 you idiot!!!" 

 

"Joe Douglas is AWESOME!!"

 

"Great job, Alka! You're the best!!"

 

 

😆 🤣 😂 

[Jetsplayer21]

55 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

The only way this team falls short is if aaron rodgers misses extensive time again.  And if u r not going to blame Joe D for that, then u cant blame Saleh either.

Both these guys are getting monster contract extensions after the season.

Accept it jet fans!!!! 

Expectations are all time high.. Making the playoffs probably buys salah and JD another yr, but they need to accomplish a lot more for an extension. Last yr they got a pass because of Rodgers. They will not get another. Similar Farve’s year, will come down to Rodger's play whether they stay or go. Jets were 9-7 in 08, still canned mangini after missing playoffs. Which they definitely make if farve didn’t tear bicep. Jets were 8-3 until that. 

[sciond]

3 hours ago, Alka said:

Joe Douglas was a rookie General Manager when he came onto the Jets, and as a rookie, made many mistakes.  He learned on the job, and if you look at his overall record, you might say he is no better than average.  In fact, if you look at his overall record, you might even say he is a below average general manager.

I have a different take.  I believe that Joe Douglas has transformed himself into a very good General Manager, and I feel that the Jets should not wait too long to extend him well into the future.

I am not concerned about waiting to see what happens this year.  For me, if the Jets fail, then Robert Saleh should be on the hot seat, and be the one to take the fall.

I would hate to see Joe Douglas leave the Jets under any circumstances, and succeed somewhere else.  That would be the equivalent of taking a rookie player, training them, and then they go to another team to become an All-Pro player on another team.

I'm sure I will have many dissenters here.  For me, Joe Douglas has already succeeded in putting this team together.  I love what he has done.  If the Jets fail this year for whatever reason, I will not blame Joe Douglas.  He continues to ascend as a GM, and I believe he will only get better as time goes on.  With him, it is only time until the Jets go back to the Superbowl.

John Idzik was never going to be good enough.  Mike Maccagnan was never going to be good enough IMHO.  Joe Douglas has shown me that he is very good, and only getting better.

QFT

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, LockeJET said:

This isnt a fire JD take  but I think he really failed the last two years in the draft. You don’t take first round pics that aren’t gonna contribute right away on win now teams. He’s too conservative in different spots. Sometimes you just gotta go for it. He should’ve either traded up or taken guys that would’ve contributed right away. 
 

So he gets no credit for building a team so strong that it’s extremely difficult to draft a kid who will start.  
 

[Darnold's Forehead]

1 hour ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

"Joe Douglas is not a 'Terrible GM'"

 

"**** you,  Jet_Engine1 you idiot!!!" 

 

"Joe Douglas is AWESOME!!"

 

"Great job, Alka! You're the best!!"

 

 

😆 🤣 😂 

This thread = the Good

’Fire JD’ thread = the Bad

Your thread = the Ugly

[peebag]

The bar for the Jets GM role has been set so low that any modicum of success will seem gigantic.

Bottom line is thar the team needs extended success and that means multiple winning seasons.

So far Joe hasn't made a go of it.

[JKlecko]

When JD was hired, I was excited.  He was the most qualified GM candidate the team had ever hired. I had become very cynical and was ready to walk away from following the Jets.  He gave me hope, and I believed that he would bring about a new golden era of Jets football. 

I now have mixed feelings and don't know what to think about him.  On the positive side, he has made some great moves such as trading Adams and Darnold, cleaned up the cap, and in his first two drafts drafted an LT, potential franchise QB, began drafting positions that Mac had ignored, had the great draft class of 2022, has found good talent in the lower rounds and in UDFAs.  He has built a top 5 roster, which is no easy feat.  He made great FA signings like Reed and Quincy Williams.  He changed how the Jets scouts analyze draft prospects for the better.  He tried to help the team perform at a higher level by hiring the guy who had helped several of our Olympic teams and athletes maximize their ability, and also hired several others who specialized in that field.  It didn't work out, but it was innovative.  He also hired a pedagogy "coach" to help the CS to learn how to better coach players, to used varied approaches, and sound pedagogical methods. 

On the negative side both the LT and the QB he drafted wound up busting, and some of his FA acquisitions wound up being awful.  It's not his fault, but the team has had a lot of injuries.  He tried to sign several top OL FAs, and offered more than other teams, but they chose to sign elsewhere with better teams.  That's not really his fault. he can't help how sorry Jets' history has been before he was  hired. Also, perhaps his biggest FA signing Tomlinson, wound up being awful.  Again, however, that wasn't really his fault.  Tomlinson had been solid if not very good for the Niners, and in fact the year that JD signed him as a FA, he had made the Pro Bowl, or maybe All Pro.  He hired a former defensive coach as a rookie HC when he knew he was going to be drafting a young QB and probably starting him, then allowed that rookie HC to hire a rookie OC who had never even called plays, and hire a rookie QB. JD tried to improve the situation for Zach by adding Greg Knapp as a consultant, but imo that was not enough, as he would have no real power or control, and of course Knapp wound up dying before OTAs. To further make a bad situation worse, he didn't bring in a quality veteran QB to help mentor Zach and start until Zach was ready.  He promised to fix the OL, but has made a number of mistakes in the draft and in FA, and the OL still isn't really fixed except for this season, and if JD had had his way in the draft, we wouldn't have had a single young OT on the roster next offseason who was a capable starter.  Thankfully, luck was with us.  Last year he went into the season with 4 OTs, one of whom was Duane Brown who was old, and coming off a major injury and surgery;  Becton, who hadn't been able to stay healthy; Turner, who was old and awful; and Mitchell who wasn't very good and was raw.  He had added Warren in the draft but he was the PUP or IR list to begin the season.  He just doesn't seem to be able to evaluate OL talent and ability very well, and he overestimates the OL once they're on the team.  Perhaps he trusts too much in the OL Coach or chemistry making them better as a unit, but he has failed.

Every GM makes mistakes, but the problem is when he makes a mistake, it's a huge brain-numbing mistake.  He knew he would be drafting a rookie QB, but hired a defensive OC who had no experience in working with a QB, and allowed him to hire a rookie OC who had no experience in working with or developing a QB or even calling plays, and a rookie QB Coach.  To even make matters worse, he didn't acquire a veteran QB to help mentor Zach, and to start if Zach wasn't ready to play. If he had tried to think of a way to ensure that Zach would fail, he couldn't have done any more or any worse a job than he did.  Then after acquiring Rodgers, he didn't get a backup QB last year when Zach was supposed to sit.  At the end of last season I wanted both Saleh and JD gone.  Then JD did an amazing job in FA doing far more than I ever thought would be possible, and my thoughts and feelings started changing about him.

Then the draft comes along, and what did the dumbass try to do?  Trade up for a WR, when it was abundantly clear that he needed to draft an LT to back up Smith this year, learn from Smith, and then be our starting LT going forward.  There's no way we should have gone into next season without a single young OT who was capable of being a starter at either OTs spot.  If I had been Woody, I would have fired him on the spot and wouldn't even have allowed him to finish the draft.  Only by sheer luck did the Jets avoid the disaster that would have been trading up for Nabers or Odunze.  Not only would we not have had a capable backup when Smith inevitably goes down for a few games, and not had a starting LT for next year (which would have left the Jets having to try to add two starting OTs next year, in a year where there wouldn't be money to sign a quality FA, and would have had the Jets trying to find two starting OTs in the draf)t.  To make matters even worse, there's no way the Jets would have been able to pay both Wilson and Nabers/Odunze, and one or both would have been unhappy because their targets and opportunities would have been greatly reduced.  It's mind boggling to me that any GM could do something so stupid.

Then he wound up having a great draft, and we finally have a great and deep roster.

While I think he has learned and grown in some ways, the fact that he still was going to ignore the OL yet again and create a bad situation, possibly totally alienating Wilson, and potentially leading to Rodgers getting injured again once Smith went down with injury says that he just doesn't get it, can't be trusted, and should be fired.  I think part of the problem is that in the draft, he first and foremost considers BPA and pretty much ignores need, unless it coincides.  IMO there's no other resonable explanation for his trying to trade up for Nabers/Odunze rather than staying put and drafting an LT.  At the same time, however, he does have an eye for talent at other positions, although it seems to be inconsistent. His decision making is troublesome at best.  Last year going with no backup QB and two injured LTs was stupid.

The thing is I'm not sure if he should be trusted to draft another QB high or if Saleh gets fired, to hire another HC.  On the flip side, I know I don't trust Woody to hire another GM or HC.  So I kind of feel the Jets are damned if they fire him, but also damned if they don't.  Unless the Jets win big this year, I don't think he should get a 5-year extension.  The only way I'd want him to draft another QB early is if he hires an offensive HC, an experienced OC, and an experienced QB coach, and none of those may be available if/when Saleh is fired.  One thing is for certain, unless the quality of the Jets offensive coaches is greatly upgraded, it won't matter who he drafts, because the team will continue to struggle. 

If the team has a winning record this year and regardless of whether they make the playoffs, I think I would give JD a 2 or 3-year extension.  If Saleh is fired, JD would get one more chance to get it right with the HC and drafting a QB.  If he misses on either, he's gone.

[JKlecko]

4 hours ago, usapaw said:

A bit early for this IMO.  He hired the HC but he gets no accountability? RS has had to put up with his horrible draft years, as well as the good ones. They produce or they exit. Next. 

Your saying that RS had to put up with horrible drafts is absurd.  Everyone who knows anything about how how JD and the Jets operate, knows that they make draft decisions by consensus.  The whole CS, including RS, has a lot of input, and are totally involved in the final decision of whom they will target.  Other coaches have won with less. Unless they win 10+ games, Saleh should go.  I haven't made up my mind yet regarding JD.  Seemingly for every great move or draft pick he makes, he turns around and does something equally stupid.

[JKlecko]

2 hours ago, Jetsplayer21 said:

We know what the team is without a good qb. We saw last yr. Drafting a franchise qb at 2 overall, and putting all your weight behind him for 3 years, usually would sink a gm. The rodgers situation was pure luck, and very strong good gm work in Green Bay.  If Green Bay didn’t have a very good gm who drafted Love and let him develop on bench, they wouldn’t have let Rodgers go. It was luck most teams were not going to fight for rodgers. He wanted to play for Saleh/hackett. Vet qbs do not come to a team because they like a gm ha. The D was built mostly by Saleh’s endorsements. JD has been the Co-signer to what Saleh wanted to build on D. JD primary task was to build a strong OL. That was his supposed specialty. He definitely didn’t do that. That along with Zach Wilson disaster, would have got him easily fired if Rodgers didn’t come to his rescue. Bottom line is both Saleh and JD have a lot to prove still. No more excuses this yr. 

You don't know that the D was built mostly by Saleh's endorsements.  For the draft, JD has everyone work independently and come up with whom they think the team should draft.  Then they sit down, discuss, and come to a consensus.  Based on what I've read, much of the time they all agree on whom they should draft and what their priorities should be. I have mixed feelings about that.  One one hand, I think it's good that JD involves the CS, and it keeps them all on the same page, but JD is the boss, and the buck stops with him. At times I think he should make the final call, even if it's diametrically opposed to what the CS wants.

I agee that both Saleh and JD still have a lot to prove.  For JD to stay, imo he has to cut out the stupid decisions and big mistakes.  For Saleh to stay, imo the team must win at least 10 games, he must stop coaching so conservatively, playing not to lose, and be more aggressive, and do a better job of clock and game management.  The team must play smart, hard, disciplined football. If not, he should go.

[Plen T]

Extension 

you can Bobby The Bozo and let him pick a real Head Coach after learning from his mistake!

[jamesr]

4 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

So he gets no credit for building a team so strong that it’s extremely difficult to draft a kid who will start.  
 

Catch 22 - NFL GM style.  

[jetfan61]

I'm a Jets fan for 45 years.  I can't remember a GM that packed the roster like this.  Like darts, there's going to be some misses along the way but Woody should lock him up with an extension ASAP. 

As a side note, the coaching staff also plays a significant part in developing talent and I'm confident we're in good hands.