3 Reasons the Jets Must Keep Darnold

[Alka]

13 hours ago, STLuLu said:

There's been a lot of hype on sports talk media and social media on the Jets parting ways with Sam Darnold in favor of drafting Zack Wilson with the #2 pick. If you're done with Darnold and think Wilson is a better option and you're rooting for Joe Douglas to make this happen, here are three reasons why you should be begging Douglas to pump the brakes:

1) Wilson can't be just better than Darnold, he has to be exceptional. The Jets have massive holes everywhere so signing a few free-agents and crossing your fingers on draft day isn't going to patch up all the holes. Because of the lack of talent, he has to possess Andrew Luck or Aaron Rogers like talent to place this team on his shoulders and ascend them out of the basement clown's club and up into the high-rise members only club.

2) Do you believe Wilson's odds are greater for him to make the Jets a better team vs keeping Darnold and trading out of the #2 spot in exchange for a boatload of picks? Even if you're a believer in Wilson, you can post all the videos of his fabulous incomplete passes you want, you still have to honest with yourself and think hard on this one. Even if Douglas only hits on 50% of his picks in the upcoming 2021 draft, the odds are still in favor of Darnold plus those picks.

3) 5 teams in the 2020 season made the post season dispite the performance of their QBs: The Steelers, the Browns, the Rams, the Bears, and the Washington football team. If we keep Darnold and trade out of the #2 slot and load up on talent to surround around him with, don't you believe we can be better than a team like the Steelers or the Titans and possibly make the playoffs? Or do you believe we would have a better chance with Wilson minus a void in talent? If you're a Wilson supporter these  are questions you have ask yourself and be honest about. My bet is on Dornald plus an above average supporting cast. I hope the Jets does the right thing and keep Darnold.

 

I have saying what you are saying for a few months now.  The Jets will keep Darnold and use the #2 draft pick to get the top offensive lineman or top wide receiver in the draft.  At #23, get one of the top 2 running backs in the draft.  with the #34 pick in the draft, get a high quality interior lineman for the line. Imagine now, you have the top wide receiver in the draft, the second best running back in the draft, and a starting interior lineman, perhaps getting a guy like Thuney in free agency, and now let's see what Darnold can do.  Darnold can now become a game manager instead of the guy that must carry the team on his back.  He will gain confidence and become the QB that we envisioned when he came out of college.

This is what I would do if I was the GM of the Jets.  I believe that I have missed my calling in life!

[undertow]

2 hours ago, Creepy Lurker said:

I have a better plan which takes us even further back at QB. Let trade Darnold for picks AND trade down from #2 so we have extra picks to trade for Geno Smith to be our starting QB. 

The funny part is historically it's far more likely a QB chosen after the top 5 will turn into a franchise QB.  So your snarky comment minus Geno Smith has a better chance of working out then Zach Wilson does.  Trade Darnold, trade down and maybe Fields drops or take Mac Jones or Trey Lance.  Excellent plan!

[section314]

19 minutes ago, genot said:

No on that one. Morgan is a pocket passer. Really doesn't fit this WCO. 

We'll see. I'll leave it at that. But don't say you weren't warned.?

[Biggs]

48 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

Wouldn’t that be something if the actual plan was to trade Sam, trade down and run with Morgan? Obviously bring in aver too  but that’s pretty much off most people’s radar. 

Look at what Indy just did.  they built a team and signed a veteran QB two years in a row.  Arians went to TB that already had drafted Winston and kept building and added a veteran QB and won the SB.  

[Jetsfan80]

46 minutes ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

I guess the broader point is - good for him! He's better than Sam. To play like that as a rookie? Guy is probably special.

• We had the 29th ranked offensive line.
• We didn't have have Keenan Allen, Mike Williams and Hunter Henry.
• We had Adam Gase. 

So while Herbert's offensive line was slightly worse, his #weapinz were a lot better, Adam Gase is the worst coach in the sport, and yea, Herbert is just a beast.

 

You're helping my point.  Yes, Herbert is a beast.  So the conclusion we need to come to is we need to try to find another Herbert and not settle for what Darnold brings to the table. 

There's no reasonable argument to be made that the only thing keeping Darnold from being, say, even a top 20 QB in the league are a weapons group on the caliber of Keenan Allen, Mike Williams and Hunter Henry.  The trio of Mims, Crowder and Perriman was not on that level, but it wasn't bad either.  Mims and Perriman in particular looked solid with Flacco under center, and Darnold defenders were saying things like "I can't wait to see Darnold play with this WR group!"  Then he fell flat on his face.

[section314]

8 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

You're helping my point.  Yes, Herbert is a beast.  So the conclusion we need to come to is we need to try to find another Herbert and not settle for what Darnold brings to the table. 

There's no reasonable argument to be made that the only thing keeping Darnold from being, say, even a top 20 QB in the league are a weapons group on the caliber of Keenan Allen, Mike Williams and Hunter Henry.  

I agree, we need an upgrade. My question is, do you think any of these guys, other than TL, are any good?  Will they be difference makers in the NFL? I'd say that's a toss-up, at best. We  definitely need an upgrade at QB, it might just not be any of these guys.

[The Crusher]

54 minutes ago, section314 said:

Crush....I agree with you. Been saying for months that I think Morgan is a way bigger part of this thing than anyone is letting on.

That some spooky shit right there. In the end I would 100% watch Morgan, not sure I can watch Sam anymore. 

[RedBeardedSavage]

53 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

So, the exact reasons everybody incorrectly assessed Mark Sanchez? 

I don't understand - are you saying that Mark Sanchez was overrated?

The guy had no excuses and simply wasn't very good.

Whatever your thoughts on Darnold are, you've got to admit he's been in the worst situation in the league.

It's fair to think he sucks, and would suck regardless. It's also reasonable to speculate that he might play better if he wasn't playing around a bunch of XFL level players. 

Up to interpretation I guess?

[Biggs]

12 minutes ago, section314 said:

I agree, we need an upgrade. My question is, do you think any of these guys, other than TL, are any good?  Will they be difference makers in the NFL? I'd say that's a toss-up, at best. We  definitely need an upgrade at QB, it might just be any of these guys.

How is that an argument to keep Darnold?  We might be able to get a 2 or a 3 for him and improve the team.  It's not keep Darnold or draft a QB.  We actually have lots of options and I suspect a GM and coaching staff that can think this through.  We can look at the draft and say we don't want to use a high pick on any of these QB's.  We can also trade Darnold if another team values his potential more than we do and we can get good value.

There are so many options and ways to build this team.  We have so many needs and practically a blank slate as far as need for quality starters.  We have draft picks, cap space and at least on paper a quality group of coaches, scouts and GM.  

This is going to be a real interesting offseason to grab the popcorn, sit back and watch it play out.  The Jets are rebuilding with draft picks and cap space.  It's a clean slate and hopefully that's how management is looking at the rebuild.  Maybe another team panics and offers us a 1 for Darnold and we take it and still don't draft a QB in round 1.   It wouldn't shock me if that happened.  

Don't get hung up on the quality of this draft class.  

[The Crusher]

26 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Look at what Indy just did.  they built a team and signed a veteran QB two years in a row.  Arians went to TB that already had drafted Winston and kept building and added a veteran QB and won the SB.  

Indy has won nothing and until they do not sure it matters. Tampa signed Tom Brady, he’s kind of the exception of vet QBs not the rule. 

[section314]

9 minutes ago, Biggs said:

How is that an argument to keep Darnold?  We might be able to get a 2 or a 3 for him and improve the team.  It's not keep Darnold or draft a QB.  We actually have lots of options and I suspect a GM and coaching staff that can think this through.  We can look at the draft and say we don't want to use a high pick on any of these QB's.  We can also trade Darnold if another team values his potential more than we do and we can get good value.

There are so many options and ways to build this team.  We have so many needs and practically a blank slate as far as need for quality starters.  We have draft picks, cap space and at least on paper a quality group of coaches, scouts and GM.  

This is going to be a real interesting offseason to grab the popcorn, sit back and watch it play out.  The Jets are rebuilding with draft picks and cap space.  It's a clean slate and hopefully that's how management is looking at the rebuild.  Maybe another team panics and offers us a 1 for Darnold and we take it and still don't draft a QB in round 1.   It wouldn't shock me if that happened.  

Don't get hung up on the quality of this draft class.  

If you don't think that any of the other QB's are any good, you can't take them, period. It's not saying that you may not want to replace Sam, it's saying that I'm not going to waste a high pick on a guy who I don't think is that good to do it with.

[#27TheDominator]

10 minutes ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

I don't understand - are you saying that Mark Sanchez was overrated?

The guy had no excuses and simply wasn't very good.

Whatever your thoughts on Darnold are, you've got to admit he's been in the worst situation in the league.

It's fair to think he sucks, and would suck regardless. It's also reasonable to speculate that he might play better if he wasn't playing around a bunch of XFL level players. 

Up to interpretation I guess?

Yep, I was saying Sanchez was overrated and got an excessive contract.  

I am not so sure that Darnold's situation was "worst in the league:" but that point is valid.  I do not like the way he responded ot that advsersity.

If we can get anything decent for him, we have to move on because I do not want to pay him $25M+ going forward.   Better to start over and ruin another rookie. 

[RedBeardedSavage]

37 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

You're helping my point.  Yes, Herbert is a beast.  So the conclusion we need to come to is we need to try to find another Herbert and not settle for what Darnold brings to the table. 

There's no reasonable argument to be made that the only thing keeping Darnold from being, say, even a top 20 QB in the league are a weapons group on the caliber of Keenan Allen, Mike Williams and Hunter Henry.  The trio of Mims, Crowder and Perriman was not on that level, but it wasn't bad either.  Mims and Perriman in particular looked solid with Flacco under center, and Darnold defenders were saying things like "I can't wait to see Darnold play with this WR group!"  Then he fell flat on his face.

 

All of Flacco's 'success' last season (if we're calling it that) came in one outlier game, whatever the reasons for that may be. Personally, I think JC Jackson had a Blue Chips "looking at the clock" game, but that's entirely conspiratorial. Guy fell down twice on big plays that resulted in touchdowns.

As for Herbert, well first I respect anyone that uses the debate tactic of "you've proven my point for me" even when it doesn't apply... it's a baller move. 

But if the argument is that Herbert is an upgrade over Darnold.... yea, we definitely agree. Do you see a Herbert in this year's draft class?

I do. His name is Trevor Lawrence. So unless he drops to 2... well... we're sh*t out of luck. 

Wilson or Fields or Lance; all these dudes are low floor/high ceiling players with question marks. I respect if there's one you believe in and want to take, but I'm not sold yet.

I'd prefer taking Sewell or Chase @ 2, or trading down, acquiring picks and taking Pitts, Waddle or the second best offensive tackle. 

I'm good to roll it back one more year with Sam, an improved roster, a better coaching staff and a scheme that actually suits his talents. 

I think we can both agree, none of this sh*t is ideal. Unless you're a Fields > Lawrence guy or Wilson > Lawrence guy, then we basically f***ed ourselves by winning two meaningless games.

Best not to compound on that mistake by taking the scraps at quarterback in the Trevor Lawrence draft because we're desperate. 

[Jetsfan80]

37 minutes ago, section314 said:

I agree, we need an upgrade. My question is, do you think any of these guys, other than TL, are any good?  Will they be difference makers in the NFL? I'd say that's a toss-up, at best. We  definitely need an upgrade at QB, it might just not be any of these guys.

I don't know, hence why I want to go after Watson aggressively.

Barring that, I'd take Fields at 2 and see what happens.  Drafting a QB at 2 and having it fail won't kill us as long as Douglas shows a willingness to keep drafting QB's until he finds one.  

[Biggs]

16 minutes ago, section314 said:

If you don't think that any of the other QB's are any good, you can't take them, period. It's not saying that you may not want to replace Sam, it's saying that I'm not going to waste a high pick on a guy who I don't think is that good to do it with.

Exactly we don't have to take a QB and we can trade Sam.  The Jets will have a QB even if we don't draft one and trade Sam. 

[Jetsfan80]

30 minutes ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

I don't understand - are you saying that Mark Sanchez was overrated?

The guy had no excuses and simply wasn't very good.

Whatever your thoughts on Darnold are, you've got to admit he's been in the worst situation in the league.

It's fair to think he sucks, and would suck regardless. It's also reasonable to speculate that he might play better if he wasn't playing around a bunch of XFL level players. 

Up to interpretation I guess?

 

Sanchez was a bad QB with great talent around him.

Surround Darnold with great talent, and he'd also just be a bad QB with great talent around him.

The problem here is that no matter what, people are focusing on the surrounding talent.  The surrounding talent hid Sanchez's flaws well, and kept him around as the Jets QB for far too long.  The same thing would happen with Darnold if they upgrade across the board.  He'd go from the # 36 QB to, say, the # 26-28 ranked QB.  And that would fool people into thinking he's showing "progress" and is worthy of an extension.

Honoring a sunken cost on a bad QB just doesn't work in this league outside of extremely rare situations.  Josh Allen being one of them.  And Darnold has 3 years of terrible play in this league while Allen had 2.  Allen also had superior athleticism that Darnold simply doesn't have.

[peekskill68]

3 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

We will find out a lot about JD with this decision.  I honestly hope we take a QB but if JD feels Wilson or Fields is not the guy, then he should stick with Sam, but if he thinks one of the two will be a quality  NFL QB, he should take the player. It is just the better decision on many fronts. As I have said before, the upside to keeping Darnold is not as high as taking a QB in this draft. Keeping Darnold means we pickup a great prospect  or more picks in a trade down and have to hope it was all Gase and his horrible handling of Sam but if it turns out Sam is just a poor NFL QB, the downside is much worse than if the rookie QB busts. Neither  outcome is actually  any good but their is a book on Darnold. The Jets are supposed to know what we have in him after 3 seasons. If we keep him and he continues  to regress with the new CS, that is a huge mark of continued dysfunction in the organization.  If we trade Sam and the new QB develops, we have a window to get to a championship on the cheap rookie deal. We will be able to load up on FA and hopefully hit on a few draft picks along the way. That os a lot better than watching Sam improve with a better supporting cast and having to pay him a huge contract. Havi g a cheap QB with similar or better ability for another 4 or 5 years just makes more sense for the Jets right now if there is a QB that makes sense in the draft

 

Very good write up.  Even as a pro Sam guy its hard for me to argue that resetting that rookie QB clock with an equal and/or potentially superior talent is a huge factor

[DoubleDecker]

I believe this is akin to our "Sanchez Moment" when we could have just let him play it out(bench him if he sucked) or go a new direction, instead we re-upped and the rest is history.  The only way I keep Sam is if I STILL let him battle it out with a high round QB i drafted.  Let the best man win.  We've usually had terrible back up QBs anyway so whether it is Sam or the rookie, i'd be ok with that.  Let me reiterate that this is THE ONLY scenario I keep Darnold and really worst case scenario for the Jets in my my mind.  You lose out on future draft assets and risk having to let Darnol walk for a 3rd if he sucks, or use the franchise tag next year if he shows promise.

[Creepy Lurker]

1 hour ago, undertow said:

The funny part is historically it's far more likely a QB chosen after the top 5 will turn into a franchise QB.  So your snarky comment minus Geno Smith has a better chance of working out then Zach Wilson does.  Trade Darnold, trade down and maybe Fields drops or take Mac Jones or Trey Lance.  Excellent plan!

I do want to trade down IF we can get a good haul and stay in the top 10. Just take Geno out of the equation. 

[LIJetsFan]

2 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

While I don't agree with the argument that we should forego a QB and trade down, I get it. We need a talent infusion and more picks equals more shots at talented players.

That's not really the same thing as we must keep Darnold. We can trade down, accumulate picks, and move off Darnold anyway. Pick a QB in the 2nd, bring in a veteran, etc.

My thinking on this subject changes weekly but as of now I'm with you on the bold:

I'd like us to trade down even if that only nets us fare value and not a haul.  So, trade down and see where that lands us and then address the QB situation from there.  Drafting a QB or keeping Sam, I don't care.  That is JD's call.  I'm just all in on the trade down.      

[Jetsfan80]

6 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Exactly we don't have to take a QB and we can trade Sam.  The Jets will have a QB even if we don't draft one and trade Sam. 

Correct.  There's no end result of this offseason where it would be a bad idea to trade Darnold.  At bare minimum, we'd sign a veteran bridge guy (like, say, Jameis Winston) plus have Morgan.  That's better than holding onto Darnold and foregoing the draft capital we'd gain by trading Darnold.  Letting him walk as a FA after 2021 for nothing makes absolutely no sense regardless of the Jets' QB situation.  

[section314]

6 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I don't know, hence why I want to go after Watson aggressively.

Barring that, I'd take Fields at 2 and see what happens.  Drafting a QB at 2 and having it fail won't kill us as long as Douglas shows a willingness to keep drafting QB's until he finds one.  

What if he already did it??

[prime21]

The #2 pick(worth multiple ones) and a #1 next year for Watson.  Give them take it or leave it offer.  Throw in a "if we win a Superbowl in the next 5 years you can have our #1  

[Jetsfan80]

22 minutes ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

 

All of Flacco's 'success' last season (if we're calling it that) came in one outlier game, whatever the reasons for that may be. Personally, I think JC Jackson had a Blue Chips "looking at the clock" game, but that's entirely conspiratorial. Guy fell down twice on big plays that resulted in touchdowns.

As for Herbert, well first I respect anyone that uses the debate tactic of "you've proven my point for me" even when it doesn't apply... it's a baller move. 

But if the argument is that Herbert is an upgrade over Darnold.... yea, we definitely agree. Do you see a Herbert in this year's draft class?

I do. His name is Trevor Lawrence. So unless he drops to 2... well... we're sh*t out of luck. 

Wilson or Fields or Lance; all these dudes are low floor/high ceiling players with question marks. I respect if there's one you believe in and want to take, but I'm not sold yet.

I'd prefer taking Sewell or Chase @ 2, or trading down, acquiring picks and taking Pitts, Waddle or the second best offensive tackle. 

I'm good to roll it back one more year with Sam, an improved roster, a better coaching staff and a scheme that actually suits his talents. 

I think we can both agree, none of this sh*t is ideal. Unless you're a Fields > Lawrence guy or Wilson > Lawrence guy, then we basically f***ed ourselves by winning two meaningless games.

Best not to compound on that mistake by taking the scraps at quarterback in the Trevor Lawrence draft because we're desperate. 

 

Yet Flacco was still better than Darnold, even when taking ALL of his play into account.  And that's sad.  Joe Flacco is a 35-year old QB who very clearly had one foot in retirement.  Darnold needed to be clearly better than Flacco, and he wasn't.  Under the same set of sh*tty circumstances, Flacco outperformed Darnold. 

My point with comparing Darnold to Herbert was to suggest we need to significantly raise our standards for acceptable QB play.  A rookie QB should not be playing at an elite level with a bad OL and HC, and yet Herbert did.  So those excuses need to go away for Darnold.  He didn't play at an acceptable level for 3 straight seasons, let alone at an elite level.  Isn't that enough to suggest Year 4 won't be much better, even with significant improvements at HC, the OL, and WR group?

Meanwhile, there doesn't have to be a Justin Herbert in this draft class to justify moving on from Darnold this offseason.  Even if we don't believe in any of the QB's in this class, I'd rather trade Darnold for a 2nd rounder or even a 3rd than keep him.  The rookie class doesn't have any impact on that decision, for me.  Take the draft capital.  And if need be, roll with a veteran option and James Morgan.  Rolling it back with Sam Darnold makes no sense.  It's not going to work, and we'd get nothing for him. 

[UnknownJetFan]

15 hours ago, Augustiniak said:

At what point does everyone evaluate darnold by what he does on the field and not by what people think he can be?

I guess, for those who follow the Knicks and how Thibs has turned Randle into an All Start when he was awful last year, if the new Jets coaching staff does something Similar for Darnold it could be he can not only get better but grow into a very good QB. And Thibs has done this with essentially the same talent level as the year before. We expect with a #2 trade down and all the Jets draft picks and money they should have more talent than last year. 

[UnknownJetFan]

1 hour ago, Alka said:

I have saying what you are saying for a few months now.  The Jets will keep Darnold and use the #2 draft pick to get the top offensive lineman or top wide receiver in the draft.  At #23, get one of the top 2 running backs in the draft.  with the #34 pick in the draft, get a high quality interior lineman for the line. Imagine now, you have the top wide receiver in the draft, the second best running back in the draft, and a starting interior lineman, perhaps getting a guy like Thuney in free agency, and now let's see what Darnold can do.  Darnold can now become a game manager instead of the guy that must carry the team on his back.  He will gain confidence and become the QB that we envisioned when he came out of college.

This is what I would do if I was the GM of the Jets.  I believe that I have missed my calling in life!

Only comment is that instead of 1 player at #2 that is OT Sewel or WR Smith, if we can trade down and get like 6 additional picks and players the odds favor 3-4 of them being more valuable then 1 player. I feel unless you go QB at #2 you should trade down.

[Jetsfan80]

6 minutes ago, UnknownJetFan said:

I guess, for those who follow the Knicks and how Thibs has turned Randle into an All Start when he was awful last year, if the new Jets coaching staff does something Similar for Darnold it could be he can not only get better but grow into a very good QB. And Thibs has done this with essentially the same talent level as the year before. We expect with a #2 trade down and all the Jets draft picks and money they should have more talent than last year. 

So now we're going with NBA examples to defend Darnold?  lol.

And I mean, its not like Randle was a stiff prior to Thibs.  Look at his numbers in New Orleans the year before and last season:

• 2018-19 (NO):  21.4 ppg, 8.7 rpg
• 2019-20 (NYK):  19.5 ppg, 9.7 rpg

Compare that to his numbers so far this season:  23.2 ppg, 10.9 rpg.  Yes, his 3-pt % has gotten much better (.407 this season) but 2 years ago he shot .344.  Not bad.  Clearly he's been working to develop that part of his game and take more 3's.

There was upward progression prior to this season that suggested a big year might be coming.  

[UnknownJetFan]

1 hour ago, undertow said:

The funny part is historically it's far more likely a QB chosen after the top 5 will turn into a franchise QB.  So your snarky comment minus Geno Smith has a better chance of working out then Zach Wilson does.  Trade Darnold, trade down and maybe Fields drops or take Mac Jones or Trey Lance.  Excellent plan!

That would be a good plan in order to not put all your eggs in one basket with Darnold.

[RedBeardedSavage]

3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Yet Flacco was still better than Darnold, even when taking ALL of his play into account.  And that's sad.  Joe Flacco is a 35-year old QB who very clearly had one foot in retirement.  Darnold needed to be clearly better than Flacco, and he wasn't.  Under the same set of sh*tty circumstances, Flacco outperformed Darnold.

Meanwhile, there doesn't have to be a Justin Herbert in this draft class to justify moving on from Darnold this offseason.  Even if we don't believe in any of the QB's in this class, I'd rather trade Darnold for a 2nd rounder or even a 3rd than keep him.  The rookie class doesn't have any impact on that decision, for me.  Take the draft capital.  And if need be, roll with a veteran option and James Morgan.  Rolling it back with Sam Darnold makes no sense.  It's not going to work, and we'd get nothing for him. 

I'm happy to bring in a vet too, but the idea that we have to trade Sam Darnold away seems like an emotional decision not a business decision.

He's 23 and absolutely nobody would've succeeded here last season. Even your boy Joe 'Footsteps' Flacco didn't win a game and suffered the only shutout of the season. 

We're not the Rams with superstars in their prime and clearly in a window. We're the 2-14 Jets. It's gonna be a while. We need help everywhere. We can afford to give Sam one more shot because if he fails, it's not like we were SB contenders, even playoff contenders, next year and the window is now closing fast. 

[addage]

15 hours ago, rayzor said:

Do we want a QB that can barely take us to the playoffs at his best or one that can go all the way?  There's a reason why teams traded away their decent QB's recently.  They know you need to be better at that position to get them to the next level.  I don't think there will be any takers for Darnold so that will be an interesting decision at 2.

Gee, if I am going to vote, I'll vote for a QB who can take us all the way.  BTW, who is that QB?  Is Wilson/Fields the guy who can take us to the promised land?  I don't know, and doubt you do either.

But if you take a rookie with stars in your eyes and end up exactly where you are now--a QB that can barely take us to the playoffs at his best--then you miss the opportunity to take a potential all-pro like Sewell, the WR of your choice or to trade down for additional picks.

So taking a QB a 2 has the chance of hurting the Jets for years to come.  Is it worth the risk?

[Jetsfan80]

Just now, RedBeardedSavage said:

I'm happy to bring in a vet too, but the idea that we have to trade Sam Darnold away seems like an emotional decision not a business decision.

He's 23 and absolutely nobody would've succeeded here last season. Even your boy Joe 'Footsteps' Flacco didn't win a game and suffered the only shutout of the season. 

We're not the Rams with superstars in their prime and clearly in a window. We're the 2-14 Jets. It's gonna be a while. We need help everywhere. We can afford to give Sam one more shot because if he fails, it's not like we were SB contenders, even playoff contenders, next year and the window is now closing fast. 

Yes, we need help everywhere.  Hence why I want that 2nd round pick (maybe even a 1st, if some rumors are true) for Darnold rather than getting nothing but a 2023 comp pick out of him.  If resource allocation is so important in this discussion, then keeping a failed QB who has just 1 year left on his deal makes zero sense.  Like you say, it's going to be a while.  The team isn't going to be ready to contend next season, so why build around Darnold for 1 year?  

[THE BARON]

15 hours ago, rayzor said:

Do we want a QB that can barely take us to the playoffs at his best or one that can go all the way?  There's a reason why teams traded away their decent QB's recently.  They know you need to be better at that position to get them to the next level.  I don't think there will be any takers for Darnold so that will be an interesting decision at 2.

A top QB is the most important ingredient, but why let that push you into making a bad decision in the draft ?  Fields and Wilson are both busts wanting to happen.  

The QB ship already sunk when the Jets blew their shot at Trevor Lawrence...

Take the top WR at number 2 and install an offense that puts Darnold in a good place to use his best skills

Use the second first round pick to upgrade the interior of the offensive line *unless* there is a sure-fire DB there for the taking.. 

[RedBeardedSavage]

Just now, Jetsfan80 said:

Yes, we need help everywhere.  Hence why I want that 2nd round pick (maybe even a 1st, if some rumors are true) for Darnold rather than getting nothing but a 2023 comp pick out of him.  If resource allocation is so important in this discussion, then keeping a failed QB who has just 1 year left on his deal makes zero sense.  Like you say, it's going to be a while.  The team isn't going to be ready to contend next season, so why build around Darnold for 1 year?  

I think usually, Herbert/Watson Ubermensch aside, quarterbacks are a product of their situation. 

I'm happy to spend this year improving the situation, giving Darnold his last chance, and if he doesn't have a Josh Allen type redemption, then we've at least made the team and situation better for the next guy. 

[Jetsfan80]

8 minutes ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

I think usually, Herbert/Watson Ubermensch aside, quarterbacks are a product of their situation. 

I'm happy to spend this year improving the situation, giving Darnold his last chance, and if he doesn't have a Josh Allen type redemption, then we've at least made the team and situation better for the next guy. 

If that were really true, then Mark Sanchez wouldn't have been a terrible QB even with a loaded roster.  Yet he was.  He was terrible in 2009-10 and also terrible in 2011-12.  The situation around him changed drastically, but he did not.  He also didn't go on to success elsewhere, despite numerous chances with good teams post-Jets.

There's a massive pile of evidence that suggests good QB's make the team around them better more than the other way around.  Look at a guy like even, say, Matthew Stafford.  Not a great QB, not a terrible one.  Just a good one or a pretty good one.  He has very rarely had a good team or coaches around him, yet he produces.  Every single season.  

Joe Burrow walked into a lousy situation in Cincy last season as a rookie.  Didn't stop him from a tremendous rookie season prior to his unfortunate injury.  Are we really going to say Tee Higgins is the reason why Burrow looks like such a good QB?

Meanwhile, Jared Goff has been given tremendous coaching and a terrific roster around him since his 2nd season in the league.  He was just unceremoniously dumped by the team that drafted him.  Even though his productivity was MUCH better than Sam Darnold's.  

Kirk Cousins was set up with a great roster in Minnesota.  He hasn't won d**k.  Probably because he's only good enough to beat up on bad teams but folds against defenses in the top half of the league.

On and on it goes.

[BROOKLYN JET]

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