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Trade for Bortles?


drsamuel84
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3 hours ago, Jets Voice of Reason said:

Think the realisticness boils down to how desperate are the Jags to make cap space and how good do they think the Team is with a different Qb. 

On the Jets side, i think it’s a no brainer to take draft assets for a contract that really isn’t that bad and we can eat dead money. However, i think there is basically no way the Jets do this because Mac is in job preservation mode to a degree and would rather try to pick up a juicy veteran corner or something. 

If they keep Mac, and I feel pretty strongly they will, they will almost have to extend him 2 years.  Don't see any one taking a HC  job with a lame duck GM...............No one worth anything anyhow

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30 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

I stand by what I said no reason whatsoever to waste cap money, reminds me of paying Fitzpatrick when he wasn't even on this team.

NO 

Waste cap money?  If you are getting draft assets you are not wasting it.

Wasting cap money is overpaying for mediocre free agents or our own crappy free agents just to use up the dollars.

Do we have a history of signing quality free agents that are good?    

FA that are good are resigned or franchised.  The odd good FA has a dozen teams after him.

We are ALREADY paying mccown (a backup)10 million.

If they gave us enough I'd trade cap for draft capital easily.  The browns were very smart when they did it.

Want to know who Cleveland got for taking on Oswiler for a year?  Nick Chubb.

"For the Browns, the acquisition of Osweiler was a strategic way to spend the team’s more than $100 million in cap space. By trading for him, Cleveland added a second-round pick in the 2018 draft, continuing the front office’s quest to acquire as many assets as possible."

 

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13 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Waste cap money?  If you are getting draft assets you are not wasting it.

Wasting cap money is overpaying for mediocre free agents or our own crappy free agents just to use up the dollars.

Do we have a history of signing quality free agents that are good?    

FA that are good are resigned or franchised.  The odd good FA has a dozen teams after him.

We are ALREADY paying mccown (a backup)10 million.

If they gave us enough I'd trade cap for draft capital easily.  The browns were very smart when they did it.

Want to know who Cleveland got for taking on Oswiler for a year?  Nick Chubb.

"For the Browns, the acquisition of Osweiler was a strategic way to spend the team’s more than $100 million in cap space. By trading for him, Cleveland added a second-round pick in the 2018 draft, continuing the front office’s quest to acquire as many assets as possible."

 

I understand the concept but this is the NY Jets and do not trust the brain trust here to accomplish anything in this venture. 

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It's really not a bad idea.  The Browns ended up eating about 15 million in that Osweiller contract.  For Bortles, we're looking at 21 million, so it'd be a bit worse.  Houston traded a 2018 second rounder with Osweiller for a 2017th 4th rounder.  

That trade:

Cleveland got:

Nick Chubb

Elijah McGuire (We traded for that pick)

Houston got:

Carlos Watkins 

Now it also turned out great for the Browns that Watson got injured and the Texans fell apart because it got them a high 2nd.   

It's a decent idea, but a risky one, considering it's a new coach coming in, and he doesn't want to raise the red flag of trading for a glorified bench player.  

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14 hours ago, drsamuel84 said:

I saw this posted on twitter so I can't take credit for the idea but we obviously have a ton of cap space this off season and probably won't be able to spend it all wisely so why not make a similar trade that the Browns made with Osweiler and take that contract off their hands for possibly a 2nd and 6th rd pick?  With all the cap space it should not hinder us for signing any of out targets and may even hinder us from making a bad shortsighted deal in an effort to spend money.  And while Bortles is obviously not a starter in this league he would give us a decent option at backup, we don't need a mentor as a backup QB that's what coaches are for.  It's an outside the box thought that actually makes some sense especially considering with JAX record it'll be a decent 2nd rd. pick.

from your lips to MacSuck's ears.

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2 hours ago, win4ever said:

It's really not a bad idea.  The Browns ended up eating about 15 million in that Osweiller contract.  For Bortles, we're looking at 21 million, so it'd be a bit worse.  Houston traded a 2018 second rounder with Osweiller for a 2017th 4th rounder.  

 

This is inaccurate. The Browns had to eat the guaranteed portion of Osweiler's contract, which was $16M, that's true. But the Bortles contract only has $6.5M guaranteed left on it. I don't see them giving up any picks to clear $6.5M. 

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OP - I love the concept.  Apparently it won't work in this deal due to only $6.5M being guaranteed but I like the way you're thinking.  Use our cap space to get as many draft assets as possible.  Bortles wouldv'e been fine as a backup QB too btw.

I hope the Jets get #1 overall and trade down to recoup extra draft picks.  But then I hope we also do the Belichick thing where we're constantly trading some of the current draft for assets in the following draft.  (e.g. a 3rd rounder this year for a 2nd rounder the following year).  Teams always pay a premium in draft position in exchange for being able to draft their guy "this year".  I'd like to set things up where the Jets always have extra assets each year.  We've been so bad for so long though that it's hard for our GM to not use all our draft picks (and trade future ones).  We have our QB now though so we have an opportunity for this to change.  And Darnold is still young and the expectations are not that high yet (he's only in his 2nd year).  Let's set this baby up so that, by the time he's ready to really win, we have things in a good position to help him out. 

Get a top pick.  Trade down.  Go heavy on the OL in the draft.  Trade down with our 2nd rounder and one of our 3rd rounders for assets the following year.  Then sign a couple of FA weapons for Darnold.  That keeps Darnold upright in year 2 and gives him some weapons to rely on.  Yes our defense will take a hit but we've spent so heavily on defense the past decade that it's time for them to "be more resourceful" rather than us throwing 1st rounders at everything.

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The problem I see with a trade like this is that it might upset darnold as he would be doing the bulk of the work while making far less than the guy warming the bench for him (I know that is already the case this year) the other thing I think is maybe we could take this one further and offer up our first for theirs so they could move up for a qb and maybe ask for Ramsey who has been a headache for them in return

Sent from my LGUS991 using JetNation.com mobile app

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15 minutes ago, bealeb319 said:

The problem I see with a trade like this is that it might upset darnold as he would be doing the bulk of the work while making far less than the guy warming the bench for him (I know that is already the case this year) the other thing I think is maybe we could take this one further and offer up our first for theirs so they could move up for a qb and maybe ask for Ramsey who has been a headache for them in return

Sent from my LGUS991 using JetNation.com mobile app
 

He wouldn’t be upset at all if you drafted him an offensive lineman or WR with that pick. I’m sure he understands that he has to put in the time and earn his money. Rookie deals are slotted so why would he be upset over something that he can’t control?

If he’d be upset about someone getting paid more than they are worth, all he has to do is look across the lockeroom at Trumaine Johnson. 

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Was just playing around on overthecap with a scenario in which the Jags trade Bortles and I'm not seeing as much of a savings as I initially thought. The Jags will still be on the hook for the $10M still owed from his signing bonus that will accelerate all to next year. They'd still create $11M in cap space but to give up a 2nd rounder and only get $11M back may not be worth it. They have some fat they'll be able to cut as most of their big contracts have no guaranteed money left.

Malik Jackson - $11M

Marcell Dareus - $10.5M

Barry Church - $6.3M

Brandon Linder - $6M

Jermey Parnell - $6M

Carlos Hyde - $4.7M

Abry Jones - $4M

 

These cuts would leave them with $40M in cap space roughly. They will have 38 players under contract + 7 draft picks (plus more if they move Ramsey) so they will have to fill 8 slots with about $30M if my math makes sense. I'm still mad at the Jags for not taking Bridgewater for Fowler, would have made so much sense for both teams involved but noooooooo they had too much faith in Bortles.

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22 hours ago, drsamuel84 said:

I saw this posted on twitter so I can't take credit for the idea but we obviously have a ton of cap space this off season and probably won't be able to spend it all wisely so why not make a similar trade that the Browns made with Osweiler and take that contract off their hands for possibly a 2nd and 6th rd pick?  With all the cap space it should not hinder us for signing any of out targets and may even hinder us from making a bad shortsighted deal in an effort to spend money.  And while Bortles is obviously not a starter in this league he would give us a decent option at backup, we don't need a mentor as a backup QB that's what coaches are for.  It's an outside the box thought that actually makes some sense especially considering with JAX record it'll be a decent 2nd rd. pick.

LMAO 

great thread for a laugh

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Say Jax remains a mere 1 game better than the Jets at season's end, and earns roughly the 5th-8th overall selection. If you think the $ is badly needed elsewhere, would you "trade" rights to Leo (with 1 year remaining at $14m) for overall pick #37-40-ish? To make up for the Bortles $16m we could decline the 5th year option on Leo. Net choice:

Leo at $14m (plus first dibs on an overpayment extension Maccagnan will surely pay) + FA backup QB at $5-8m

vs

Bortles 1 yr at $16m + top 40 pick at ~$1.5m per x 4 yrs (but not all guaranteed)

The question is whom they'd use the $ on instead of Leo, if they made it a binary choice (this trade or keep Leo, but not both Leo and Bortles and another veteran FA QB and the 2nd rounder at a total nut of ~$40m for 2019 alone). If Leo's $ is going to be used to bring in another veteran dog, using the Jets as the suckers who'll fund his last big payday, then I'd rather just stick with Leo and hope the light goes on in a big way under a different HC. 

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This is inaccurate. The Browns had to eat the guaranteed portion of Osweiler's contract, which was $16M, that's true. But the Bortles contract only has $6.5M guaranteed left on it. I don't see them giving up any picks to clear $6.5M. 


How?

He carries a dead money cap hit of 16.5 million in 2019 and 5 million in 2020. So if we cut him in 2019, dead money is 16.5 million on the cap. It's not 21 million because I added them together last night, but I don't see how it's 6.5 million.

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23 minutes ago, win4ever said:

 


How?

He carries a dead money cap hit of 16.5 million in 2019 and 5 million in 2020. So if we cut him in 2019, dead money is 16.5 million on the cap. It's not 21 million because I added them together last night, but I don't see how it's 6.5 million.
 

 

If the Jets trade for him and keep him on the roster, he'll cost $16M against the Jets cap ($14M salary, $2M roster bonus). But only $6.5M of that is guaranteed, so that if the Jets were to do the same as the Browns and cut him before opening day, they would only be on the hook for that guaranteed $6.5M. The other $10M is the Jags problem. Any team trading for Bortles would not inherit the signing bonus cap debt. 

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10 minutes ago, slats said:

If the Jets trade for him and keep him on the roster, he'll cost $16M against the Jets cap ($14M salary, $2M roster bonus). But only $6.5M of that is guaranteed, so that if the Jets were to do the same as the Browns and cut him before opening day, they would only be on the hook for that guaranteed $6.5M. The other $10M is the Jags problem. Any team trading for Bortles would not inherit the signing bonus cap debt. 

lol I only looked for a second before posting, kind of assuming that it was all guaranteed because after 3 pages I figured that had to be the conundrum. 

Looking again now, after reading your post, it's $6.5m guaranteed. The other $10m of prorated bonus being a sunk cost because they've already paid it, as you allude to.

If they're parting with Bortles, it's because someone is actually giving them a pick for him, or if there are no takers and they don't want to give him another chance, they're just going to cut him.

There's no way Jacksonville is surrendering a 2nd round pick to save $16.5m instead of only $10m. 

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On 12/5/2018 at 1:00 PM, Beerfish said:

Many people will blast this concept just because of the QB.  I do not think mac will consider it because he needs to improve the team with his spending.  But, I think it would be worth looking into for the following reasons.

We are going to have a ton of money but will have a tough time spending it all as the Jets are not a desirable location.  Any really good FA's will have a dozen teams after them.  Mac will feel pressure to actually spend the money so he will either overpay for medium fas from other teams or just as bad grossly overpay some of our own fa's.

I would rather spend cap money on getting more draft picks as you suggest than overpay robbie anderson, leo, or enunwa.  Or some other teams jags.

imo the idea has merit. they would have to pay bortles 21 m for next season and take a cap hit of 5 m if they cut him the following season.  for this they get a 2nd rounder (maybe) who would earn about 7 m for 4 years of contract.  so the total money for the 4 years is about 33 million.  the question is; will the 2nd round pick be worth 6.3 million per season?  this has to be weighed against who they could possibly sign as a free agent instead.  it almost sounds like a good deal.  not great, good.

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This thread proves that the average JN poster is 10x more clever than anyone in the Jets FO. Here’s how this conversation would go on One Jets Drive.

Heimerdinger: Hey Macc, I was crunching the numbers and we could do some interesting things in a trade for Bortles.

Macc: Bortles!?! (Rips huge fart). Silence, HeimerDingDong! It does not speak unless it is asking, “Cream and sugar?”

Bowles (thought bubble): I’m going to wait to see how this plays out and then tattle to woody and call manish and leak that I was for it before I was against it.

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If the Jets trade for him and keep him on the roster, he'll cost $16M against the Jets cap ($14M salary, $2M roster bonus). But only $6.5M of that is guaranteed, so that if the Jets were to do the same as the Browns and cut him before opening day, they would only be on the hook for that guaranteed $6.5M. The other $10M is the Jags problem. Any team trading for Bortles would not inherit the signing bonus cap debt. 


Ah ok, I see it now. I'm an idiot, apparently I can't read, lol.

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On 12/5/2018 at 1:25 PM, jetstream23 said:

There's something in the water around here lately.  I think our minds have been poisoned in recent weeks.  We've got people trading for Blake Bortles and hiring Mike McCarthy.  We should bring Revis back too....but only pay him $11M per year.

We could pay him with Knuckle Sandwiches.

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