Jets begin contract extension talks with Jamal Adams

[mrcoops]

We hear this "positional value" thing every time a good non-QB wants to get paid.

Keyshawn was "just a WR", Abraham was "just a LB", Revis was "just a CB", etc.

Adams may be annoyingly outspoken (which he is), but he's also a damn good player, who is young and a home-grown star.

Those are the kinds of guys that smart teams lock up before they get near FA.

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, JiF said:

I've seen Jamal make some pretty spectacular plays that would indicate he's a pretty damn good athlete.  

On tackling ball-carriers, sure. 

I've also seen him a step slow in coverage constantly.  Particularly on throws over the middle when he's in standard Cover-2.  That's where the limited athleticism hurts him. 

It's the difference between a completion + tackle / incompletion  and an interception.  He can maybe get a hand in there to break up the pass.  He isn't quick enough to get in front and make the pick, no matter how good his football instincts are.  

And those milliseconds make a huge difference in whether a player is worth top 5/10 defensive player in the NFL money.  

[82nd Airborne]

Jamal has two years left on his rookie contract as a safety. Dak Prescott played a critical position throughout his rookie contract providing the Cowboys the necessary cap to build their team.  

Jamal is an outstanding player, but I think we should wait until the end of the next season.  The critical aspect is that the Jets have control right now and they should maintain firm on priorities to help the OL/Sam. If Jamal is all-in on this team, he should understand the team's priority and have a selfless approach about his future with the team.  

[ChuckkieB]

8 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

- Lock him in before new CBA, I guarantee the players will get a larger portion of the revenue sharing and believe contracts will be far bigger come 2021

 

......at which point Jamal and many other "elite" players with an undervalued contract will insist on redoing their contract to meet the higher salary thresholds.  This dance never ends....

[Beerfish]

Here is the issue with giving him a big long term contract.

Is he going to get better (be a bigger producer for the team) or at the very least maintain his level of this past year.

I say no he won't.  The reason?  Due to talent deficiency on this team the defense has in effect been designed around him and his strengths.  Once the team gets a legit edge rusher which we have been looking for for years his sack totals drop, probably his tackle totals drop as well as he is not line up at the edge of the line so often.

My prediction for his career from here on out?  See Deone Buchanon who was the poster boy for hybrid safeties not more than about 2-3 years ago.

In any case, I think the people that love Adams have nothing to even worry about, he will get extended (after a whole bunch of angst ridden social media negotiations) to a large lucrative deal.  (In which he will be the highest paid or near highest paid safety in the league but will make sure every one knows he 'left money on the table' to be a jet).

His contract won;t be an issue going forward if the jets draft like crap as usual, if lo and behold douglas drafts well the contract may be an issue.

[SR24]

I wish it was March 18th already 

[Jetsfan80]

5 hours ago, InstantClassic said:

So if Jamal were ever to reach or approach the level of some of those legends we talked about earlier..you’re saying it wouldn’t matter and he wouldn’t have an impact?

He'll never be on the level of Reed/Polamalu/Taylor/etc.  He'll need to generate turnovers to get there.  And he has limitations that prevent him from doing that in the modern NFL.  
 

But to answer your question, yes, if Adams reached the level of play of those legends, yes he would make an impact.  Currently he has no business being mentioned in the same breath.  

[Jetsfan80]

9 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

I mean I think he's a difference maker already but I think we could see a special defense with an edge rusher. Moving Jamal would definitely help us rebuild quickly and I'm really not opposed to it. I just think you have to start retaining your own guys and to dismiss Jamal due to poor positional value probably is a bad look for the rest of the team.

IF they're worth keeping.  Macc's poor drafting prevented us from having homegrown talent worth giving a 2nd contract to.  But that doesn't mean you pay the few good ones because of scarcity.  That just leads to problems down the road.

Having said that, I'd pay Jordan Jenkins.  

[Matt39]

3 hours ago, JiF said:

Possibly but most cases where this was the obvious push, the Jets handed out some of the most ridiculous contracts in the history of this league to bozos who suck and were clearly just going to cash it in.  We can argue all day long about importance/impact/salary cap implications etc, but at least you're not going to get burned by Jamal.  He will continue to be who he is after a deal.  I'm very confident in that and that's actually a nice change for once when it comes to this franchise. 

I thought this about Mosely tbh and they still got burned.

[InstantClassic]

5 hours ago, T0mShane said:

So, today, right now, you still think it was the right call to draft Jamal Adams over Mahomes, Watson, etc? It wasn’t even the right call to draft Jamal Adams over Tre’Davious White or TJ Watt.

Of course not! I’d take Mahomes ALL DAY over Jamal..anyone would..that’s not the argument though. 
Many people here have said on multiple occasions that Jamal hasn’t won us any games and therefore in not valuable to the team. The way that this roster is constructed, in my opinion of course, I don’t think having Pat these past 3 years makes much of a difference on our team. I don’t think he has the same success here because of the way our roster is built. That’s all I’m saying. 

 

[InstantClassic]

31 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

He'll never be on the level of Reed/Polamalu/Taylor/etc.  He'll need to generate turnovers to get there.  And he has limitations that prevent him from doing that in the modern NFL.  
 

But to answer your question, yes, if Adams reached the level of play of those legends, yes he would make an impact.  Currently he has no business being mentioned in the same breath.  

I think it’s too early to make that claim. Those guys are absolute legends..so to ask him to play at that level is unfair. But I do think he has the ability to generate turnovers..and solidifying an edge rusher and generating some pass rush would definitely go a long way in aiding that.

I get what you’re saying..we could pay someone less money in the meantime and try and shore those other areas up..I just feel the draft is too unpredictable and you try and retain the talent you have. Perhaps you and I differ on what Jamals value to the team is..and that’s cool. 
 

In the end, my hope is JD knows how to draft and put together a team that can consistently win. Where they allocate those resources I’m not too worried about it..but drafting well is a great step. Have quality players under friendly deals. 

[Philc1]

17 hours ago, T0mShane said:

No f*cking chance he takes a mere $15mm over five. 

The Jamal-lovers don’t realize the guy is going to want the same contract Wilkerson got

[Jetsfan80]

9 minutes ago, InstantClassic said:

I think it’s too early to make that claim.

Nope, its not.  

3 years into their careers, these are the numbers those 3 guys had put up:

• Ed Reed: 23 INTs, 44 PDs,  4 FFs, 2 FRs
• Polamalu:  7 INTs, 26 PDs, 3 FFs, 2 FRs
• Taylor:  7 INTs, 29 PDs, 7 FFs, 1 FR

The Sacks (12) and TFLs (28) Adams produces are nice.  But they're not sustainable areas to help a team win out of the Safety spot.  You HAVE to get some INTs.  You HAVE to force more turnovers.  Those are areas where he's not likely to show improvement.  

[Warfish]

9 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

- Pay your good players

Pay the best available players at impact positions.

9 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

- I understand positional value but IDC when it comes to Jamal

You can't argue with IDC.

9 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

- Cap is going to keep increasing

True.

9 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

- Lock him in before new CBA, I guarantee the players will get a larger portion of the revenue sharing and believe contracts will be far bigger come 2021

Also likely true.

9 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

- If the perfect soldier in Jamal can't earn a contract extension with the Jets then who will?

Quarterbacks.  Offensive skill position players.  O-linemen.  Edge players.  Impact Linebackers.  Elite Cornerbacks.  Maybe D-linemen if special (if not Edge).

9 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

Have to show the team this is the kind of player you need to be

The kind of player I would want the ones I give big money deals to are the kind who, by there mere presence, ensure we are not the 32nd ranked Offense in the NFL.

[Philc1]

7 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Nope, its not.  

3 years into their careers, these are the numbers those 3 guys had put up:

• Ed Reed: 23 INTs, 44 PDs,  4 FFs, 2 FRs
• Polamalu:  7 INTs, 26 PDs, 3 FFs, 2 FRs
• Taylor:  7 INTs, 29 PDs, 7 FFs, 1 FR

The Sacks (12) and TFLs (28) Adams produces are nice.  But they're not sustainable areas to help a team win out of the Safety spot.  You HAVE to get some INTs.  You HAVE to force more turnovers.  Those are areas where he's not likely to show improvement.  

Bottom line: Adams is going to want $90 million

 

Let him get that contract elsewhere while we get draft picks

 

[Vader]

On 1/30/2020 at 8:46 AM, Jetsfan80 said:

He's supposed to be the leader of the defense and the best player.  What are examples of him elevating the defense as a whole?  The numbers on D have remained fairly consistent from before he arrived and the years since he's arrived.  And while the Sacks are nice, he creates a hole and added stress on the secondary every time he blitzes.  

And the minute you pay him, it creates a catch-22 where you restrict the ability to get him the "help" he needs on defense.  We're not paying Mosley $17.5M per, Adams $15M per, THEN also going out and getting new CBs and EDGE rushers.  It's really not possible.

I think he had more TDs and yards than entire offense one point this year

[InstantClassic]

56 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Nope, its not.  

3 years into their careers, these are the numbers those 3 guys had put up:

• Ed Reed: 23 INTs, 44 PDs,  4 FFs, 2 FRs
• Polamalu:  7 INTs, 26 PDs, 3 FFs, 2 FRs
• Taylor:  7 INTs, 29 PDs, 7 FFs, 1 FR

The Sacks (12) and TFLs (28) Adams produces are nice.  But they're not sustainable areas to help a team win out of the Safety spot.  You HAVE to get some INTs.  You HAVE to force more turnovers.  Those are areas where he's not likely to show improvement.  

He has 6 FF, 4 FR and 25 PD. So your only argument here is he doesn’t intercept passes?

[bla bla bla]

2 hours ago, Warfish said:

Pay the best available players at impact positions.

You can't argue with IDC.

True.

Also likely true.

Quarterbacks.  Offensive skill position players.  O-linemen.  Edge players.  Impact Linebackers.  Elite Cornerbacks.  Maybe D-linemen if special (if not Edge).

The kind of player I would want the ones I give big money deals to are the kind who, by there mere presence, ensure we are not the 32nd ranked Offense in the NFL.

I have no argument with all your points. I just think we will have a hard time attracting FAs so if we aren't landing some top guys I'd prefer to hold onto Jamal. 

That said I'm still listening for a monster trade offer. You just have to make sure you hit on those picks.

[JustInFudge]

6 hours ago, Matt39 said:

I thought this about Mosely tbh and they still got burned.

Meh, that was an injury for one year and I don’t think Mosey is the type to mail it in.  He was dominant in that half.  Haha

I don’t fear him retiring on the field the way Revis, Tru, Mo, etc. did.  

[Smashmouth]

6 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Here is the issue with giving him a big long term contract.

Is he going to get better (be a bigger producer for the team) or at the very least maintain his level of this past year.

I say no he won't.  The reason?  Due to talent deficiency on this team the defense has in effect been designed around him and his strengths.  Once the team gets a legit edge rusher which we have been looking for for years his sack totals drop, probably his tackle totals drop as well as he is not line up at the edge of the line so often.

My prediction for his career from here on out?  See Deone Buchanon who was the poster boy for hybrid safeties not more than about 2-3 years ago.

In any case, I think the people that love Adams have nothing to even worry about, he will get extended (after a whole bunch of angst ridden social media negotiations) to a large lucrative deal.  (In which he will be the highest paid or near highest paid safety in the league but will make sure every one knows he 'left money on the table' to be a jet).

His contract won;t be an issue going forward if the jets draft like crap as usual, if lo and behold douglas drafts well the contract may be an issue.

So what you're saying is if the Jets get a bad ass Pass Rusher they are going to dial back Jamal ? This makes no sense because, if anything, a pass rusher will open things up even more and make Jamal an even more disruptive force on this defense. It will also help with some of his few shortcomings like coverage, where I see him as average but thats why hes not a free safety who are better at coverage. So no way sack totals drop, they just get enhanced because if a team has to worry about 3 elite players in every facet of this defense that's going to spell trouble for most offenses. Meaning we have Jamal roaming around, 2 outside pass rushers in Jenkins and hypothetical pass rusher we hopefully obtain and Mosely roaming the middle of the field and creating pressure up the middle with Williamson.

Mark my words this league is going to start focusing on the run once again and moving the chains with big possession type WR's,,,,, think of the Cowboys in the early 90's that should be the blueprint. Running the ball keeps the ball away from the high powered offenses and out of Elite QB's hands. Why do I bring this up ? Because in a league of trends this is very possible as we saw in this years playoffs that running teams had nice success . If The Niners run the ball down KC's throat and keep Mahomes off the field it will enhance this type of thinking even more. That brings us back to Jamal who is the type of defender that will excel defending those type of Offenses.

If the Jets break the bank for Jamal that will say a lot as to how Douglas plans to enhance and build this defense and also how the trends in this league will start to change once again just like they always have. 

[Smashmouth]

21 minutes ago, JiF said:

Meh, that was an injury for one year and I don’t think Mosey is the type to mail it in.  He was dominant in that half.  Haha

I don’t fear him retiring on the field the way Revis, Tru, Mo, etc. did.  

Exactly !

And if we keep Williamson along with Mosely this defense is going to be special if we get a good pass rusher in here. Also keep in mind the players that filled in did a pretty damn good job which opens things up for rotations in the defense keeping players fresh. Greg Williams is going to have quite a lot of players to design his defense and keep his players from getting worn out and tired which at times also leads to injury. Suddenly we have incredible depth on defense with only 1 piece of the puzzle missing. Pair this up with a smashmouth  offense (with enhanced OL and WR's) and a solid QB and you have a nice 4 -5 year run at a possible championship

[Beerfish]

1 hour ago, Smashmouth said:

So what you're saying is if the Jets get a bad ass Pass Rusher they are going to dial back Jamal ? This makes no sense because, if anything, a pass rusher will open things up even more and make Jamal an even more disruptive force on this defense. It will also help with some of his few shortcomings like coverage, where I see him as average but thats why hes not a free safety who are better at coverage. So no way sack totals drop, they just get enhanced because if a team has to worry about 3 elite players in every facet of this defense that's going to spell trouble for most offenses. Meaning we have Jamal roaming around, 2 outside pass rushers in Jenkins and hypothetical pass rusher we hopefully obtain and Mosely roaming the middle of the field and creating pressure up the middle with Williamson.

 

That is exactly what i am saying.  Look at any number of his sacks this year he was essentially on the outside lining up as an olb pass rusher thus leaving guys like hewitt to have to cover.

When you bring your SS up into the box as often as the Jets do either from necessity of because they are tailor making the defense for him you are giving something up in a big way.

 

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

28 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

That is exactly what i am saying.  Look at any number of his sacks this year he was essentially on the outside lining up as an olb pass rusher thus leaving guys like hewitt to have to cover.

When you bring your SS up into the box as often as the Jets do either from necessity of because they are tailor making the defense for him you are giving something up in a big way.

 

So if the defense gets better, Adams will get worse. If the defense sucks, Adams will stay good. 

[RutgersJetFan]

You guys figure this one out yet? Our report is due over to Douglas soon, no?

[slimjasi]

8 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Nope, its not.  

3 years into their careers, these are the numbers those 3 guys had put up:

• Ed Reed: 23 INTs, 44 PDs,  4 FFs, 2 FRs
• Polamalu:  7 INTs, 26 PDs, 3 FFs, 2 FRs
• Taylor:  7 INTs, 29 PDs, 7 FFs, 1 FR

The Sacks (12) and TFLs (28) Adams produces are nice.  But they're not sustainable areas to help a team win out of the Safety spot.  You HAVE to get some INTs.  You HAVE to force more turnovers.  Those are areas where he's not likely to show improvement.  

I think this is partially true, but I also think both of those guys (Polamalu in particular) benefited from having a legit pass rush in front of them.

I don’t think Adams is as good as either of those guys, but I wouldn’t mind seeing Adams play behind a legit edge rusher or two.

 

[Smashmouth]

1 hour ago, Beerfish said:

That is exactly what i am saying.  Look at any number of his sacks this year he was essentially on the outside lining up as an olb pass rusher thus leaving guys like hewitt to have to cover.

When you bring your SS up into the box as often as the Jets do either from necessity of because they are tailor making the defense for him you are giving something up in a big way.

 

Well then you are seeing flaws in the design of the defense from your perspective that really have nothing to do with Adams, your gripe here seems to be with Greg Williams. Also keep in mind guys Like Hewett who are good football players won't be on the field as much as they would if Mosley and Williamson were here which they will be next year.

[Smashmouth]

1 hour ago, RutgersJetFan said:

You guys figure this one out yet? Our report is due over to Douglas soon, no?

I sent Joe the report a few days ago man

[Beerfish]

1 hour ago, Samtorobby47 said:

So if the defense gets better, Adams will get worse. If the defense sucks, Adams will stay good. 

Adams will get no better or worse, he will just have to play as a safety with more normal responsibilities than poaching at the line all the time.  thus the numbers people are trumpeting like sacks and tfl will be less.

[Beerfish]

14 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

Well then you are seeing flaws in the design of the defense from your perspective that really have nothing to do with Adams, your gripe here seems to be with Greg Williams. Also keep in mind guys Like Hewett who are good football players won't be on the field as much as they would if Mosley and Williamson were here which they will be next year.

Mosley and Williamson will also not be able to cover slot guys and wrs.

Adams value is at an all time high right now, we are not a playoff team.  He is not going to have any more of an impact than he has now, as a matter of fact his impact will be less going forward (positional value) and we are going to give him a mammoth contract.

Anyway, no worries, the Jets will pay him the big dollars and give him a long term contract.  It's going to happen.

[Dunnie]

Revis 2.0

Let's hope so ... Pre injury Revis that is.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

[Dunnie]

Slow down, nothing has been signed yet.  My guess is Douglas is going to make him a fair offer, Adams is going to rebuff him, and then we'll either be off and running towards:  1) A trade, 2) a holdout, and/or 3) An endgame where Adams ends up walking as a free agent at the end of his deal.  
Of course I could be wrong here, and JD could be a total dumbass who thinks you pay a SS $15M+ per season.  We'll see.  But either way it's not likely Adams was going to be willing to play for "just" $7M next season without causing some trouble.  

Adams 15 Mill per . . Or Skeletor 10 mill per ...

I'll pay Adams every freaking time

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[Barry McCockinner]

1 hour ago, Dunnie said:

Adams 15 Mill per . . Or Skeletor 10 mill per ...

I'll pay Adams every freaking time

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

$15mm/year will seen like nothing in a couple of years

[bla bla bla]

28 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

$15mm/year will seen like nothing in a couple of years

Once the new CBA hits it's really going to look like a good deal. I don't think people realize just how much money is up for grabs.

[T0mShane]

7 minutes ago, bla bla bla said:

Once the new CBA hits it's really going to look like a good deal. I don't think people realize just how much money is up for grabs.

So we should give $10 per to Jordan Jenkins, who is likewise a solid, home grown talent. And then Marcus Maye $9 mil per.

[Dunnie]

So we should give $10 per to Jordan Jenkins, who is likewise a solid, home grown talent. And then Marcus Maye $9 mil per.

I don't remember any of the aforementioned players making the pro bowl

 

But I would pay both reasonably

 

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