Report: Ravens in trade discussions for Jamal Adams

[playtowinthegame]

Many many lifer Jets fans are virtually tailgating while waiting for Joe's huge haul for Jamal. 

[Barry McCockinner]

13 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I was pointing out that smart/contending teams can, and do, spend in splurges from time to time once they have an established core.  Money is money, whether you sign or trade for a player from another org.  

My preference would be to avoid spending draft capital to improve the roster, but it can be necessary at times.  I would gladly give up a high pick to acquire an elite EDGE rusher in his prime, something this franchise hasn't had since 2005.

Trading away Adams would help us in this hypothetical since we'd be adding draft capital from Adams then trading some away for an EDGE.  

The only problem I have with this is that Adams is a core type player. I know you'll never agree with that. 

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, Barry McCockinner said:

The only problem I have with this is that Adams is a core type player. I know you'll never agree with that. 

He would be if his demands were more like $12-13M per.  

[Prestige Worldwide]

2 hours ago, Big_Slick said:

Jets own JA for 3 more seasons, 4th year, 5th year option and franchise tag and there's not a damn thing he can do about it. Except bitch and cry like a dawg.

Current contract that was negotiated by the CBA
2020 4th year - 3.5M
2021 5th year - 9.9M
2022 Franchise tag 11-12M (current tag value for a SS)
25M over next three seasons

Conservative contract extension 5 year deal @ 17M per
2020 17M
2021 17M
2022 17M
51M over next three seasons

That's 25M that could be used on impact positions FA's or for Sam's contract extension.

I was going to post the same thing. Those are the breaks, this is what his union put in place. If he doesn't like it, take it up with the union. He is more than welcome to sit out, have a great time. As much as he may be "worth more" thems the breaks dude. It's a business and the Jets are running it as so. If they pay him fine, if not, oh well.

As much as I feel the players should get as much as they can, god bless them. Make that dough

the owners and GMs have the same right not to pay them. This is what the players union agreed to. To bad 

[HighPitch]

This thing .....I see both sides of the coin. I wouldnt mind keeping him but not for some kings ransom just because “good teams keep their good players”

I can see the dropoff on D be very minimal with him gone. 

[CTM]

On 5/26/2020 at 3:05 PM, T0mShane said:

settle down in a nice enclave in Brick Township

are you from Bricktown?

[Vader]

9 minutes ago, CTM said:

are you from Bricktown?

Great hockey program and football with warren wolf. 

i know - I went to Toms River high school south.

[CTM]

50 minutes ago, Vader said:

Great hockey program and football with warren wolf. 

i know - I went to Toms River high school south.

I'm from the area too, went to Walnut Street elementary, and yeah Jimmy Dowd. Brick Memorial was tops in wrestling back in my day too

[Vader]

23 minutes ago, CTM said:

I'm from the area too, went to Walnut Street elementary, and yeah Jimmy Down. Brick Memorial was tops in wrestling back in my day too

Ok I have friends that went to walnut street — that’s a TR HS south school.

i went to hooper ave elementary and was supposed to go to TR HS East but was recruited to play football at south (who won the NJ state championship the year before) and me and three friends decided to go to South instead of East. Freshman year I started both ways and we lost one game to ******* Lacey and sophomore season I was playing varsity CB. 

I did Toms River wrestling too with Mr Johnson - best coach ever. I didn’t do wrestling or baseball in HS though to focus on football and track. 

im in NY now but love getting down there to my folks. Cool to know tho CTM ??

 

[Lizard King]

10 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Signing Adams at 17/per doesn't prevent the Jets from locking up Darnold long term if he earns an extension. Funny people already have Darnold locked into his second contract and he hasn't come anywhere near earning one yet but the guy who has clearly outplayed his current deal needs to go.

?

You sound like young Ulysses S Grant on the history channel documentary that Leonardo DiCaprio just produced. 
 

“my Daddy says I have $20 to offer you for this colt and if you won’t take that, I can go up to $25”. 
 

Even back in those days, that wasn’t considered a good business tactic. 

[Lizard King]

7 hours ago, CTM said:

I'm from the area too, went to Walnut Street elementary, and yeah Jimmy Dowd. Brick Memorial was tops in wrestling back in my day too

Oh so you probably know Todd Frazier?

[slats]

14 hours ago, Big_Slick said:

Jets own JA for 3 more seasons, 4th year, 5th year option and franchise tag and there's not a damn thing he can do about it. Except bitch and cry like a dawg.

Current contract that was negotiated by the CBA
2020 4th year - 3.5M
2021 5th year - 9.9M
2022 Franchise tag 11-12M (current tag value for a SS)
25M over next three seasons

Conservative contract extension 5 year deal @ 17M per
2020 17M
2021 17M
2022 17M
51M over next three seasons

That's 25M that could be used on impact positions FA's or for Sam's contract extension.

As far as extending Adams now, this is it in a nutshell. 

Only one first round pick from his draft has signed an extension. It's not like the Jets are being unfair to him compared to how the rest of the league does business. I get that Adams wants his "long term security," but lets not lose sight of the fact that if the Jets do nothing at all with him the next two years, they will have paid him $32M. In his worst case scenario, I think he'll be able to get by. 

And the Jets could slap a second franchise tag on him in 2023, too, and still not be at the number that Adams is looking for! 

If Adams was saying, "hook me up long term, and I'll give you a team friendly deal," then fine. But he's not. He wants to reset the bar for safety contracts, and do it a year early. He can wait. 

[Losmeister]

13 hours ago, Vader said:

I put forward the last 8 games extrapolation — but not as a projection, like I am saying that is who he is. I am saying that’s a positive data set and I hope it is basis for his maturation. 

It’s simply a consecutive and consistent stretch of games that a young QB has put together that COULD show a real maturation into FQB. And IF that is the case — and that has to be the expectation for Darnold — then the last 8 games of 2019 do mean something.

No GM would ignore that progress in evaluating his roster. Because there is a lot riding on whether or not those last 8 games is the real Sam Darnold. 

let's hope the lower ints is a good sign...      and hope that good8 game stretches dont have him throwing for less than 250 yards in half of them

[EM31]

12 hours ago, Prestige Worldwide said:

I was going to post the same thing. Those are the breaks, this is what his union put in place. If he doesn't like it, take it up with the union. He is more than welcome to sit out, have a great time. As much as he may be "worth more" thems the breaks dude. It's a business and the Jets are running it as so. If they pay him fine, if not, oh well.

As much as I feel the players should get as much as they can, god bless them. Make that dough

the owners and GMs have the same right not to pay them. This is what the players union agreed to. To bad 

And if things had gone the other way.... that he was not worth the pick or he was often injured and not playing then he would feel no obligation to give the Jets a break on the deal that everyone signed 3 years ago.  

Why is this whole renegotiation idea only something that gets raised when it benefits the player?

If the player wants the the added protection that comes with a new long term deal and the signing bonus that goes along with that then the Jets can and should be willing to take on that risk. In return for accepting that risk, his side needs to give up something as well.  You know, the old give something to get something.  Let's say that they agree to split the difference on the projected $25 million over the first three years and pro-rate that split over the life of the deal.... All of which brings us to.... wait for it.... Around $13-$15 million per season.

If that is insulting then play out the current deal

or....

Sign a new six year deal today for $17 million per season.  We give him a signing bonus however big on day-1 and he agrees to give us a check on day-1 for the $25 million to compensate us for our lost value on the original contract.

Same difference.

It would be financial malpractice for JD to simply give that away for nothing.

 

[Barry McCockinner]

4 hours ago, Lizard King said:

You sound like young Ulysses S Grant on the history channel documentary that Leonardo DiCaprio just produced. 
 

“my Daddy says I have $20 to offer you for this colt and if you won’t take that, I can go up to $25”. 
 

Even back in those days, that wasn’t considered a good business tactic. 

I have no idea what you're talking about.

[Jet Nut]

17 hours ago, derp said:

And is down to 245 pounds.

Maybe he could switch to strong safety?

Kalil beefed up again and it worked out so well

[Lizard King]

14 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

I have no idea what you're talking about.

Why would you make a financially disadvantaged deal ..?

its not JD’s problem that Jamal is unhappy with his deal. Jamal should be asking his agent, and DeMaurice Smith, why he had to sign a deal that didn’t capture a better portion of his potential value. 

[Barry McCockinner]

8 minutes ago, Lizard King said:

Why would you make a financially disadvantaged deal ..?

its not JD’s problem that Jamal is unhappy with his deal. Jamal should be asking his agent, and DeMaurice Smith, why he had to sign a deal that didn’t capture a better portion of his potential value. 

I am not advocating for Adams to get re-signed this year. I prefer re-signing him to trading him but that likely isn't a 2020 thing. The post you quoted was me pointing out that a Jamal Adams highest paid safety deal wouldn't prevent the Jets from signing Darnold to his second deal. 

Your response to my comment makes no sense.

 

[HawkeyeJet]

I can't recall which Adams thread I posted this on, but this seems to be the most active current one so adding this here.

I mentioned a week or so ago that the 4-2-5/3-3-5 with the hybrid Safety/Linebacker has become huge in college football to counter modern offense(Air raid more specifically) but hadn't gained as much acceptance in the NFL yet.  I also said that it would eventually and whoever goes all in on a scheme like that may very well value players like Adams a ton.  Well my assertion about the likelihood of that defense coming to the NFL seems to be coming true, per below.  Does that mean the Browns would be interested in Adams?  I don't know.  But if I were Greg Williams and the defensive roster is the same at training camp as it is today, I'd give a long hard look at this as my base defense.

 

[ChuckkieB]

16 hours ago, Big_Slick said:

Jets own JA for 3 more seasons, 4th year, 5th year option and franchise tag and there's not a damn thing he can do about it. Except bitch and cry like a dawg.

Current contract that was negotiated by the CBA
2020 4th year - 3.5M
2021 5th year - 9.9M
2022 Franchise tag 11-12M (current tag value for a SS)
25M over next three seasons

Conservative contract extension 5 year deal @ 17M per
2020 17M
2021 17M
2022 17M
51M over next three seasons

That's 25M that could be used on impact positions FA's or for Sam's contract extension.

I've been on the trade Jamal bandwagon for a while now but this breakdown has changed my mind.  The Jets should just let the contract play out through year 5 and try to negotiate a long term deal at that point.  If that cannot get done, franchise him for one year and try to renegotiate after that.  He's wants top dollar now and will want top dollar in 3 years. Might as well get as much value out of him as possible. It's been a minute since the Jets had a player that produced at a high level that is UNDERPAID.  They should take advantage.  He has zero leverage now, and no matter what impact you think he has on a team, he plays the lowest salaried position on the field. We shouldn't be jumping through hoops for him because he certainly won't for the Jets. 

[Prez33]

22 minutes ago, Lizard King said:

Why would you make a financially disadvantaged deal ..?

its not JD’s problem that Jamal is unhappy with his deal. Jamal should be asking his agent, and DeMaurice Smith, why he had to sign a deal that didn’t capture a better portion of his potential value. 

Jamal Adams isn’t going to negotiate a deal on his rookie contract. The 2011 collective bargaining agreement sets the parameters of those deals.

[Losmeister]

14 minutes ago, ChuckkieB said:

I've been on the trade Jamal bandwagon for a while now but this breakdown has changed my mind.  The Jets should just let the contract play out through year 5 and try to negotiate a long term deal at that point.  If that cannot get done, franchise him for one year and try to renegotiate after that.  He's wants top dollar now and will want top dollar in 3 years. Might as well get as much value out of him as possible

am only for trade if the option is PAY NOW or trade..   the above is the way to go and the way it SHOULD

[Prestige Worldwide]

51 minutes ago, EM31 said:

And if things had gone the other way.... that he was not worth the pick or he was often injured and not playing then he would feel no obligation to give the Jets a break on the deal that everyone signed 3 years ago.  

Why is this whole renegotiation idea only something that gets raised when it benefits the player?

 

You're right,  he would be under no obligation to take any type of discount. And he shouldn't if that was the case. 

[Lizard King]

16 minutes ago, Prez33 said:

Jamal Adams isn’t going to negotiate a deal on his rookie contract. The 2011 collective bargaining agreement sets the parameters of those deals.

That’s why I lumped in Smith 

[Lizard King]

39 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

I am not advocating for Adams to get re-signed this year. I prefer re-signing him to trading him but that likely isn't a 2020 thing. The post you quoted was me pointing out that a Jamal Adams highest paid safety deal wouldn't prevent the Jets from signing Darnold to his second deal. 

Your response to my comment makes no sense.

 

You heavily inferred by referencing Darnold, that you could pay Jamal and pay Sam too. 

[Barry McCockinner]

28 minutes ago, Lizard King said:

You heavily inferred by referencing Darnold, that you could pay Jamal and pay Sam too. 

Yes - that's exactly what I'm saying. We can. It won't be an issue.

BTW - Darnold hasn't earned a second contract yet. Adams has outplayed his first contract.

[EM31]

JD can afford Caviar and JD is still able to afford champagne so the price of caviar must be a non issue.

Let's forget about the fact that JD has to buy food and drink for all the other times we need to eat and drink.  A budget needs to be planned for the entire organization and caviar is a non-essential.

[Barry McCockinner]

8 minutes ago, EM31 said:

JD can afford Caviar and JD is still able to afford champagne so caviar must be a non issue.

Let's forget about the fact that JD has to buy food and drink for all the other times we need to eat and drink.  A budget needs to be planned for the entire organization and caviar is a non-essential.

All-pro players in their prime are the exact type of players you want to pay.

[derp]

1 hour ago, HawkeyeJet said:

I can't recall which Adams thread I posted this on, but this seems to be the most active current one so adding this here.

I mentioned a week or so ago that the 4-2-5/3-3-5 with the hybrid Safety/Linebacker has become huge in college football to counter modern offense(Air raid more specifically) but hadn't gained as much acceptance in the NFL yet.  I also said that it would eventually and whoever goes all in on a scheme like that may very well value players like Adams a ton.  Well my assertion about the likelihood of that defense coming to the NFL seems to be coming true, per below.  Does that mean the Browns would be interested in Adams?  I don't know.  But if I were Greg Williams and the defensive roster is the same at training camp as it is today, I'd give a long hard look at this as my base defense.

 

I think some form of variation of the 4-2-5 makes a lot of sense as a base defense and have appreciated your posts on the topic.

That said, its mind boggling how many off ball LB’s the Jets have. Doesn’t seem super indicative of going in that direction yet.

[#27TheDominator]

15 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

All-pro players in their prime are the exact type of players you want to pay.

All-pro players in their prime on their rookie deals are the exact type of players you want.  

[68JET11]

14 hours ago, Prestige Worldwide said:

I was going to post the same thing. Those are the breaks, this is what his union put in place. If he doesn't like it, take it up with the union. He is more than welcome to sit out, have a great time. As much as he may be "worth more" thems the breaks dude. It's a business and the Jets are running it as so. If they pay him fine, if not, oh well.

As much as I feel the players should get as much as they can, god bless them. Make that dough

the owners and GMs have the same right not to pay them. This is what the players union agreed to. To bad 

Absolutely correct, This new system was put in place because Vets were unfairly being paid less than draft picks coming out. It also sets a team up for more success by making good draft picks. JD should not do anything and if Adams wants to pout, so be it. He's locked up with us for 3 more years at the designated tier from which he was drafted, and JD did the right thing by not declining his 5th year option.

[Prez33]

15 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

All-pro players in their prime are the exact type of players you want to pay.

You would think so. 
 

What is he asking for? For the team to make an exception on the 3rd year vs 4th year contract restructure based on performance that has exceeded what he’s being paid in relation to other top safeties. (And by a wide margin).  You DO NOT get named All Pro for mediocre play. You also don’t go to consecutive pro bowls either. 
 

I’ve said all along, if he’s asking for salary comparable to Byard, Jackson, Mathieu and Collins, that’s not unreasonable. But if he’s asking for significantly more than that, I’m done defending him. There are limits to what you pay a safety. 

[Barry McCockinner]

3 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

All-pro players in their prime on their rookie deals are the exact type of players you want.  

Well that's better for sure. But you also want to keep them for the second contract. The only time you should be getting rid of all-pro type players before their second contract is if you have the problem of choosing between guys in that category or if they're a total head case causing massive distractions. When you have too many top players in their prime you have to start picking and choosing based on positional value (among other things). We do not have that problem, lol.

[EM31]

18 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

All-pro players in their prime are the exact type of players you want to pay.

Have you addressed the question of the potentially $25 million we would be throwing away if we gave him a new deal now?

Make him the highest paid in the league by one dollar if we must and if that is what would make him fell less disrespected.  I would wince but OK I would take that deal.  However we would then need to get him to give back the $25 million we are losing by making him that deal today.  That would be like giving him $25 million on top of making him the highest paid player which is a firing offense for any GM

[Barry McCockinner]

1 minute ago, Prez33 said:

You would think so. 
 

What is he asking for? For the team to make an exception on the 3rd year vs 4th year contract restructure based on performance that has exceeded what he’s being paid in relation to other top safeties. (And by a wide margin).  You DO NOT get named All Pro for mediocre play. You also don’t go to consecutive pro bowls either. 
 

I’ve said all along, if he’s asking for salary comparable to Byard, Jackson, Mathieu and Collins, that’s not unreasonable. But if he’s asking for significantly more than that, I’m done defending him. There are limits to what you pay a safety. 

He will get a highest paid safety contract if he continues to play at an all-pro level and stays healthy. And that's fine. If he wants to be the highest paid defensive player or something stupid - that's another story.

But it probably shouldn't happen this year.