Go on the record for a Jamal Adams trade (with analysis)

[Lurker89]

1 hour ago, heymangold said:

Man, thank goodness for another Jamal Adams thread.

The draft is almost here which will give us plenty of other topics to discuss.... Can't wait.

[Rolloffjet]

Just think we can trade Jamal for a first and in 3 years if that player becomes a star we can trade that player because he will cost to much, better yet that pick we get for Jamal becomes ok so we just over pay a little bit for him in 3 years and we’re all happy then. Sooner or latter you have to pay top dollar for stars.don’t care that he’s a safety he’s the best in the game right now. Jets just can’t have nice things. If we ever win a super bowl we’d have fans say we didn’t do it the right way ?‍♂️ 

[Guilhermezmc]

4 hours ago, nico002 said:

If it’s a draft day trade that allows us to get a top WR and OT I pull the trigger 

Cant agree more, get Dallas on the phone we need tyron smith and that 1st.

[14 in Green]

1 hour ago, Lizard King said:

He’s not a top 20 safety in any meaningful metric and if recent events in the economy have taught us anything its maybe not paying 90 million for a player who’s worth 30 

Your post is so bad, it's laughable. Ten words into it you lost all credibility. 

 

[Vader]

Keep Troy Jamalomalu

[Dcat]

Most polarizing Jet since Keyshawn Johnson.  Vote split right down the middle.

[JoJoTownsell1]

4 hours ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

Who needs another analysis when you've got Jets drafting evidence as proof in the pudding? 

Roger Vick (1st). 

Dave Cadigan (1st). 

Blair Thomas (1st). 

Johnny Mitchell (1st). 

Kyle Brady (1st). 

Anthony Becht (1st). 

Bryan Thomas (1st).

James Farrior (1st and traded way too soon, lol). 

Dewayne Robertson (1st). 

Vernon Gholston (1st). . 

Mark Sanchez (1st). 

Kyle Wilson (1st). 

Quinton Coples (1st). 

Dee Milliner (1st). 

CALVIN PRYOR (1st). 

Darron Lee (1st). 

Alex Gordaon (2nd). 

Terry Williams (2nd). 

Browning Nagle (2nd). 

Kurt Barber (2nd). 

Coleman Rudolph (2nd). 

Ryan Yarborough (2nd).

Dorian Boose (2nd). 

Matt O'Dwyer (2nd). 

Alex Van Dyke (2nd).

Rick Terry (2nd).

LaMont Jordan (2nd). 

John McGraw (2nd). 

Victor Hobson (2nd). 

Justin Miller (2nd). 

Mike Nugent (2nd). 

Kellen Clemens (2nd). 

Vlad Ducasse (2nd). 

Stephen Hill (2nd). 

Geno Smith (2nd). 

Jace Amaro (2nd). 

Devin Smith (2nd). 

Christian Hackenberg (2nd). 

Yeah. Right. Great idea.

 Let's trade away our All-Rookie, 2x Pro Bowler and 2x All-Pro (3 years) and future HOF Safety (already Jets greatest Safety All-Time) for more draft picks and more busts lol

It's hard to argue with that and I am not in the "LOL safeties are worthless" crew but if we can get a 1st/3rd and a 2021 3rd (maybe more) it would be tough to pass considering the greater need of improving our offense around Darnold. No matter how good Darnold is or isn't, he doesn't have as good of a chance to develop with a crap OL and Perriman/Crowder as his WRs. 

I also have more faith in Douglas than I have had in Mr. T/Idzik and Mac. I always gave those guys a chance but there is a sense that Douglas already gets it. Maybe we are wrong, but if we are wrong about Douglas than having Adams, or not, won't really matter. 

[Mogglez]

3 hours ago, Lith said:

You thinking of Jalen Ramsey?  He went for two 1s and a 4.

Probably, which I realize now is unreasonable as Jalen is a CB, not a safety.

3 hours ago, Darnold Schwarzenegger said:

 Dallas has the 17th pick

Dolphins have the 18th pick from Pitt. 

So not sure what your talking about

Apparently I'm talking nonsense, because my memory is totally betraying me.  Carry on lol.

[Jetsfan80]

4 hours ago, varjet said:

If we trade Jamal we will need to use a relatively high draft pick for his replacement. 

No, we don't.  There's plenty of decent free agent Safeties available for cheap and its not an important position.  

• Tony Jefferson
• Eric Reid 
• Reshad Jones
• Clayton Geathers
• Tavon Wilson
• Morgan Burnett

[Jetsfan80]

4 hours ago, Mogglez said:

That haul isn't enough, IMO.  Not after what Minkah Fitzpatrick got.  That's my starting price.

Huh?  The Dolphins traded Minkah, a 4th and 2021 7th for a 1st, 5th, and 2021 6th.

A 1st and 3rd for Adams would be more than enough if you're using the Fitzpatrick deal as a baseline.

[Jetsfan80]

3 hours ago, Dupe said:

No man. The guy who is really good. Ths is stupid.  Why send negative vibes that we dont want him. 

The negative vibes will be coming either way my man.  There's a storm coming and it begins with Jamal coming to the table demanding $18-20M per season.  

[Jetsfan80]

3 hours ago, JetFan20 said:

I want to Douglas to acquire more picks, but not at the expense of trading Jamal Adams. To me that’s counterproductive.

Also I don’t see how cap space is a selling point. The Jets have ample cap space and nobody to pay with the exception of Jamal. 

Darnold's 2nd contract is coming up very fast.

The Jets don't have "ample" cap space.  That was assured the moment Maccagnan signed CJ Mosley.  

[Jetsfan80]

36 minutes ago, Dcat said:

Most polarizing Jet since Keyshawn Johnson.  Vote split right down the middle.

If Jamal is as good as many here say he is, it shouldn't be split.  Hell, we shouldn't even need a poll like this.

No one would be starting threads talking about trading T.J. Watt or Nick Bosa right now.  

[CTM]

why is the savings only 10M?

[CTM]

5 hours ago, Larz said:

If he’s worth 2 high picks...........

This isn't being done in a vacuum. This team has a struggling neophyte Qb with limited talent around him entering what's getting close to a make or break type year*. Dumping the overly self promotional and sensitive safety to bring in 2/3 talented offensive players (2 picks + more FA dough) is a no brainer.

*yeah i know he's young but Douglas would have to bring in legit camp competition next offseason is Darnold puts up another bottom 5 type season.

[Big_Slick]

Trade him for 1st this year and a 3rd next year or make him play out his contract; 4th year, 5th year option and franchise him the year after.  Eff him if he holds out because that will show his true character.

No way in heck do you pay a box safety 17-19 million (50 million guaranteed.) on a long term contract.

I've said this before and I firmly believe that allocating that much cap space to a non essential position is a foolish waste of resources and will handicap the Jets from signing Sam and other key positions; LT, CB, edge, WR1 & WR2 down the road.

[JohnnyLV]

5 minutes ago, CTM said:

why is the savings only 10M?

Have to pay the 2 additional draft picks

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

Have to pay the 2 additional draft picks

We also avoid paying Jamal his new contract.  Helluva lot more than $10M in eventual savings there.  Unless you're suggesting we keep Jamal until the end of his rookie deal, then let him walk.  

Probably would have been best to just leave $$$ savings out altogether than throw out an unknown figure.

[Defense Wins Championships]

THE IMPACT OF INTERCEPTIONS: An overrated topic of discussion. 

Interceptions are without question (and by far) the very worst way that you could ever possibly judge a Player on Defense by (I'll explain below).

• Think about it; if we were to have ever judged a younger and prime Darrelle Revis based off of solely interceptions alone; he would not be considered as one of the greatest man to man coverage Cornerbacks of All-Tim (he just wouldn't be).  

One of Jamal Adams biggest criticisms have been due to a lack of turnovers (by way of Interception). 

However, and imo, it's moreso Marcus Maye's responsibly to watch the Quarterbacks eyes @ all times, as Marcus Maye is the one who's playing deep zone coverage (out in Center Field) more times than not; which is why your FS usually will always end up with more career INTs than your SS did (due to just that one example above - as your SS does all of the dirty work within the trenches and protects the middle of the field with physicality and strength).

Despite having a lower amount of INTs and being criticized for it, Jamal Adams does force and create turnovers, however his only job is not to focus on purely INTs; due to the fact that he's asked by his coaches to roam the entire defense while playing each and every possible position (not named Defensive Line). He's extremely versatile. 

Adams has combined for 10 career Forced fumbles/Fumble recoveries, a total of 12 career defensive turnovers throughout a 3 year period, including two (2019) TD returns; a 25 yard forced fumble/fumble recovery/strip sack of Daniel Jones along with a 61 yard pick six returned the other way against N.E's backup to Tom Brady (an average of 4.0 turnovers per season, thus far).

(when in comparison to the likes of Troy Polamalu who combined for 53 career turnovers at an average of 4.4 turnovers per session after 12 years or one of the best to ever do it in regards to creating turnovers in Ronnie Lott, who had a crazy average of over 7 turnovers forced per season ala it's almost impossible to create over 10 turnovers on a yearly basis out of an individual player, because it's not easy to accomplish; regardless of position)

Yes.

We've all loved impactful Cornerbacks and Safetys who've made a living and a name for themselves off of interceptions - however INT ability is only one attribute that they've got going for themselves - as it takes more than just a couple of interceptions (per season) to be considered as an all around and an overall great defensive football player; as you can not be known as being a one trick pony but yet still be considered as being overall greatness).

That's what makes Lawrence Taylor the greatest to ever do it. He never picked off a lot of passers (wasn't within his job description) however he did feature the greatest combination of run stopping ability and pass rushing ability combined that we've ever witnessed (the opposite of a one trick pony). 

For a better example and this goes for anyone who's ever played the game, not just Revis himself. 

• You could take Darrelle's 4 primetime years of 2008-2011 (61 games/15 INTs) and if only looking into box score numbers for interception; Revis would've been looked at as being nothing more than a 3.75 INT per year type of player (who had 0 INTs in 2010) despite accomplishments such as becoming a 3x First-team All-Pro with 3 Pro Bowl selections throughout 2008-2011 (as we do not look back to the greatness of #24's legendary run between 2008-2011 in order to talk about and discuss his 0.24 INTs per game (you just, don't). 

I'm sorry but Darrelle Revis impacted his side of the field and his position way more than just "0.24 ints per game". 

If you were to simply focus on Darrelle's box score int numbers (easy to do), you would then get an inaccurate reading of his true dominance and all around greatness; because you wouldn't notice his never been seen before man to man coverage ability, you wouldn't take note of his tackling abilities as an outside CB who could takle like an MLB or Strong Safety, you wouldn't have appreciated how he studied WR's movements (pre-snap) as only a legend could, you wouldn't have given him credit for completely eliminating a QBs favorite target etc, etc and you would've also missed out on topic of discussions on how Revis would literally follow his #1 WR around (one on one and on an island) quite like no other, ever. 

(and none of the above had anything to do with Interceptions and/or what truly made #24 special, which was his coverage ability - along with everything else not named I-N-T's). 

• My only problem with judging a player within a secondary (regardless if FS, CB, SS) based off of INTs (alone) is that the All-time single season record for most INT's during a single season is held by Dick Night Train Lane - with only 14 - as a rookie (1952). 

However that was back in the 50's and the game has changed a lot since then, it's almost a completely different game, a record that may never be broken; because Quarterbacks of the 50's did not have the type of awareness or accuracy that we see as of today.  

(let's look into the last 20 years as being more recent (2018/2019 specifically). 

• The most INT's during a single season over the past 20 years has been 10 (0.6 per game) and the last time it was done was back in 2007, by Antonio Cromartie of SD.

•Two years ago (2018) the league leader in INTs only had 7 and last year (2019) Gilmore had 6 INT'S as league leader; and Gilmore is not known as the NFL's #1 CB due to only 0.23 INTs per game; as he's respected for everything else he's able to do (multiple attributes that do not go unnoticed).  

Statistics and Accomplishments:

Jamal Adams has played in a possible 46/48 games and has already recorded throughout (only 3 years of developing)...

✓ 273 Tackles (210 solo) as he's always around the football (90+ tackles per year).

✓ 28 Tackles for Loss behind the L.O.S (more tackles for loss than any secondary player within the league) and is the best DB @ playmaking within an offenses backfield. 

✓ 25 passed defended (with only 3 TD's allowed) as a SS who can line up on the outside @ CB (1st career INT was on the outside), has lined up against quicker slot receivers @ both Nickel & Dime and was drafted as a key players to help defend against bigger TE's such as Gronk over the middle of the field. 

✓ 23 QB hits and 12 QB sacks (both rank #1 of any secondary player within the league over 3 years) as he is without question the best blitzing Defensive Back in the game today. 

✓ 6 forced fumbles (he can hit as hard as anyone). 

✓ 4 fumble recoveries (always around the ball). 

✓ 2 TD returns (can score off of turnovers due to athleticism - as some players have played entire careers without a TD return).  

✓ 2 INTs (only) but he does have a pass coverage rating of 74.9; which ranks 7th highest of amongst all NFL Safety's (FS/SS) and even higher than a lot of NFL starting CB's on the outside. 

✓ One of the very best run stopper in the game and has A+ excellence in pursuit (he just led a Gregg Williams led Defense that ranked (I believe) 1st in average yards per rush against, 1st in tackles for loss and 2nd in total run defense (I've watched him during his bowl game go sideline to sideline and hawk down LAMAR JACKSON for a loss behind the LOS; as his pursuit and closing ability is unreal). 

✓ 1x All-Rookie team. 2x Pro Bowler. 2x All-Pro (that is very rare to see after only 3 years of play). 

• When talking about an individuals overall and all around defensive ability, I just do not feel and believe that it's right to focus on box score Interception numbers; while completely overlooking and ignoring everything else within the box score (goes for any defensive player, not just Jamal). 

Just as I hate to see Sam Darnold Quarterbacking behind historically bad offensive lineman along with a lack of receiver options...

I'd also like to have an opportunity to see Jamal Adams surrounded by a couple of proven CB's (Trumaine Johnson wasn't the one) and an actual outside pass rusher to cause havoc on opposing QB's (haven't featured one since John Abraham of 2000-2005) before I notice topics of conversation surrounded by lack of interceptions, while overlooking everything else (cherry picking). 

In Closing...

Last year we were robbed of having an opportunity to watch C.J Mosley within the trenches (while absolutely dominating his front seven) and it's hard to imagine just how fun it'll become to root for and watch a dynamic trio of Quinnen Williams, C.J Mosley and Jamal Adams throughout the middle of a Gregg Williams NYJ led Defensive attack. 

I'm not willing to trade all of that away and risk another 1st round bust (I'm just not). 

[Wonderboy]

9 hours ago, Beerfish said:

I am one of the guys harsh critics, a 1st and a 3rd is not enough.

1,3 and a 3 next year at least.

And I want the pom poms back he stole from the Jets cheerleaders 

[long time suffering Jets f]

4 hours ago, Guilhermezmc said:

Cant agree more, get Dallas on the phone we need tyron smith and that 1st.

Make the call on draft night. Jerry Jones wants to make a splash. I think he would bite with that offer. 

[68JET11]

6 hours ago, Guilhermezmc said:

Cant agree more, get Dallas on the phone we need tyron smith and that 1st.

Been saying that with @jetstream23 for a while now.  If we can bag Tyron and a 1st or 2nd, I'd make that trade in a heartbeat.

OMG, @Defense Wins Championships your posts are just way to long to even begin reading...  2nd, just because all the previous GM's had horrible track records of bad 2nd round picks, doesn't mean the streak continues....

 

[Dunnie]

 

 

 

 

[Butterfield]

2 first rounders, or a first rounder and a good player, or I would just wait it out for now. 

[Dunnie]

1st rounder this year, 2nd rounder this year and a pro bowl Lineman.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using JetNation.com mobile app

[T0mShane]

You aren’t getting Tyron Smith for 61 tackles and a garbage time pick. The whole reason Dallas might give you draft picks at all is because they have a two year window to win the Super Bowl and they think Adams can help them do that. You don’t trade your stud OLT while making a run for a title.

[jgb]

The draft is like getting a pack of baseball cards as a kid. You already know the price up front (due to draft slot salaries). You may get that Jose Canseco or Ken Griffey Jr. rookie card. But you'll probably get a pack of commons.

[JetFan20]

5 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Darnold's 2nd contract is coming up very fast.

The Jets don't have "ample" cap space.  That was assured the moment Maccagnan signed CJ Mosley.  

The Jets are in fine shape from cap perspective. Especially if they cut Bell, Crowder, and reach an injury settlement with Enunwa (his contract is guaranteed for 2021). 
 

You are correct-Almost 40 percent of our 2020 cap is dedicated to McCagnan signings (all whom are coming off injuries/ineffective seasons with the exception of Crowder):

CJ Mosely

Leveon Bell

Trumaine Johnson (dead cap hit)

Jamison Crowder

Henry Anderson

Avery Williamson

Quincy Enunwa 

The good news is all those guys can be cut next year with the exception of Mosley and Enunwa.

As for Jamal I’m fine trading him but I need two first round picks. I can’t rely on a bad drafting organization to pick a player in the third round. 

[68JET11]

You might be right about that which is why they wouldn't do Zack Martin, but maybe you can convince them to do Tyron and their 2nd this year instead... I think JD will do the right thing and hold out for something like that.

[Barry McCockinner]

Don't mind trading him I just think the value is closer to 2 first round picks. 

[YankeeJet22]

1st and 3rd definitely NOT enough.  Two first rounders, or take a hike. 

[NYJ1]

Option 1 Jamal Adams and a great, big, fat new contract. Option 2 will not only NOT happen, but it's a good fairy tale that gets many posters panties in a bunch.

[Untouchable]

11 hours ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

Who needs another analysis when you've got Jets drafting evidence as proof in the pudding? 

Roger Vick (1st). 

Dave Cadigan (1st). 

Blair Thomas (1st). 

Johnny Mitchell (1st). 

Kyle Brady (1st). 

Anthony Becht (1st). 

Bryan Thomas (1st).

James Farrior (1st and traded way too soon, lol). 

Dewayne Robertson (1st). 

Vernon Gholston (1st). . 

Mark Sanchez (1st). 

Kyle Wilson (1st). 

Quinton Coples (1st). 

Dee Milliner (1st). 

CALVIN PRYOR (1st). 

Darron Lee (1st). 

Alex Gordaon (2nd). 

Terry Williams (2nd). 

Browning Nagle (2nd). 

Kurt Barber (2nd). 

Coleman Rudolph (2nd). 

Ryan Yarborough (2nd).

Dorian Boose (2nd). 

Matt O'Dwyer (2nd). 

Alex Van Dyke (2nd).

Rick Terry (2nd).

LaMont Jordan (2nd). 

John McGraw (2nd). 

Victor Hobson (2nd). 

Justin Miller (2nd). 

Mike Nugent (2nd). 

Kellen Clemens (2nd). 

Vlad Ducasse (2nd). 

Stephen Hill (2nd). 

Geno Smith (2nd). 

Jace Amaro (2nd). 

Devin Smith (2nd). 

Christian Hackenberg (2nd). 

Yeah. Right. Great idea.

 Let's trade away our All-Rookie, 2x Pro Bowler and 2x All-Pro (3 years) and future HOF Safety (already Jets greatest Safety All-Time) for more draft picks and more busts lol

We can’t possibly get rid of 2x pro-bowler, 2x all-pro safety Jamal Adams.

What would we ever do without our 2x pro-bowler, 2x all-pro safety Jamal Adams?

Did I mention that he’s a 2x pro-bowler and 2x all-pro? And he’s only going into his 4th year!

 

[68JET11]

Doesn't make much sense that most want him traded, but yet they think they can get 2 first's for him. If he's worth 2 first's then he should be worth the money he's looking for from us as his value on this team. I don't think that's true in my book, as I think QB, LT and EDGE are worth more to a team then a SS. I'm not thinking we'll ever get 2 first's for him either. One good player for another and a high draft pick is all I think we'll get for him.

[JustInFudge]

A 1 and 3 is not enough for the most versatile defender in all of the league.  Odds are extremely high neither pick will ever amount to what Jamal Adams provides to a team.  If it's between that and a new contract, I'd rather hold on to the best player on the team.  Only a fool of a GM couldnt sign Adams and still build an elite roster.