Longterm Lurker more frustrated with SOJ FANS

[SAR I]

10 minutes ago, Sir Speez said:

Uhmmm yeah so not sure who the YOU you are referring to maybe you can find some context to support that narrative though I highly doubt it, however Saleh nor LaFleur play OL which is what I was specifically talking about.  Oh and yeah our coaches do need more time as well before the pitchforks come out in my opinion.

The tsunami of stoner college dropouts gave Adam Gase 4 GAMES and that was without his franchise quarterback.

They better hold Robert Saleh to the same standard.  He's got a better quarterback.  He's got a better coaching staff.  He's got a better GM.  He's got an easier schedule.

SAR I

[Sir Speez]

1 minute ago, SAR I said:

The tsunami of stoner college dropouts gave Adam Gase 4 GAMES and that was without his franchise quarterback.

They better hold Robert Saleh to the same standard.  He's got a better quarterback.  He's got a better coaching staff.  He's got a better GM.  He's got an easier schedule.

SAR I

Uh okay I wasn’t part of that brigade so not sure why you used the singular or all-inclusive ‘you’ in your retort.  That’s sorta like me sayin* - You should stop giving out sixth place and participation trophies because it prevents a lot of kids from knowing what it feels like to suck and therefore strive to be better so one day they can play offensive line for the NYJs.

[freestater]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I'm not as close to the cliff, looking down off it, as you are. But yeah I fail to see how fan complaints after losses have the slightest thing to do with the team's performance in said loss. 

Just for you, because I know you're one of a handful that reads this crap I babble here , I think I've been pretty fair with Douglas:

• His trade transactions have been shockingly good on balance. He's done a good job of getting rid of players on expiring contracts whom he wasn't going to re-sign/extend anyway. Especially when they were made with the team having no serious chance at a playoff spot (1-6 and 0-7, respectively) when the trades were made. Those are like free draft picks.
• His first draft got a whole lot of early accolades, but that Jets draft class is looking as weak as any right now. There's still plenty of time for more of those picks to turn it around (they're 1 week into their 2nd seasons) but it's not looking good yet. Becton in particular; JD got so much credit from fans for making this great LT pick. In reality with a starting tackle hole, there were only two picks he could have made, and thus far it clearly looks like he made the wrong one. I liked the pick fine myself (though I'm the last one to rate/rank prospects), while acknowledging it's not like he pulled a rabbit out of his hat. It's true Wirfs is playing RT not LT, but at the level he's playing, there's no indication he'd be falling on his face if he were playing on the other side. It seems he's playing RT because Tampa already had a LT, not because he isn't good enough to play there. Becton's ceiling is higher; hopefully he realizes it when he gets back on the field. Then the genius move of trading down and still getting Mims? He's not looking too great either. One can feel he should be higher on the depth chart, but c'mon if he was crushing it in practices the coaches wouldn't keep him on the bench for spite. Then his next safety pick I think was just so he'd have a name to fill in so he could more seriously seek trade partners for Adams. If that's all the pick did, that adds to the value even if he almost never plays, and stinks when he does. 
• JD's second draft looks much better (though in fairness, people were giving him high marks for his draft last year also, where the only picks they were so majorly sour on already on/after opening day were 4th rounders Morgan & Clark). 
• It's opinion not fact yet as the correct move, but I like that he didn't just sit tight on Darnold and hoard even more picks; he's got plenty of picks already, plus they're starting plenty of rookies & 2nd yr players as it is, plus without trading down he's already got almost an entire draft's worth of extra picks next year, too. Many wanted him to do just that, and I'm glad he didn't. Like in 2017: take the FQB when you've got the chance; you don't play BAP and take a safety (or this year, a TE) like a puss, and assume that in the next draft an equal or better QB will fall into your lap. That's like an older-generation GPS sending you down stupid back roads for an hour because the current ETA was a minute faster that way. There are legit arguments he should have drafted a different QB based purely on talent, whether right or wrong in the end; but that's only if the reason is if one feels the other QB is outright superior, not because of hoarding yet another extra draft pick (especially since we didn't know where that allegedly-better QB would get drafted until it actually happened with the benefit of hindsight). 
• I'm ok with him trading up for AVT, but just ok. Honestly it's only a good move if he turns into a truly great one. As much of a hindsight-playing copout as that sounds, that's the truth. That draft class was so deep on the OL (with so few taken at that point, and none going at their projected higher slot), it's hard to justify a 1st rounder plus two more 3rd rounders for him unless he's that great. His week 1 performance was pretty bad, but in fairness he's just getting back to action and ffs it's just 1 week yet. I'm definitely no college film or draft junkie, so I'm just going by what others said, which is that he's supposed to be an "it" level talent at guard. If he's not "it" level performance, then this was poor allocation of high/higher picks. We'll see; hopefully he's all that on the field.
• I still think not extending Anderson, and then turning down a draft pick for him, was a mindless mistake, even if only as a transaction judgment. RA's '19 numbers were down through mid/late Oct, and was excited to not get traded away, making that an ideal time to make him an extension offer in the Enunwa price range (give or take). If he turns that down, as well as anything near that $, then go back to that last top offer and make a deal. Waiting until after the trade deadline - and then further, until after he had some bounce back games - to even address Anderson's contract is classic Maccagnan-level GMing. In 5 years I'm not sure that dope extended one starter until his final game under contract had been played, giving away all the leverage a team has. Though not definitively provable, one could certainly argue if he re-signed Anderson he wouldn't have signed Corey Davis. IMO we should have both.
• Last but not least... Considering the number of individual personnel attempts, and their cumulative investment amounts, his FA pickups on the OL have been a disaster. IMO he's gone the route of trying to get a little bit pregnant. He paid a significant amount (top 10 money) for a couple of those starters at RT and C; but in doing so he saved relatively little over available all-pro FAs (Conklin last year & Linsley this year). Then he signs starter-priced backups to make the total starter+backup cost the same as going for the gold in the first place. It's totally bizarre, honestly. 

So there are definitely some things I really like about Douglas, but in the end no matter where he started and no matter how many great trades he pulls out, in the end he's got to make good decisions on those he brings in with those new additional resources he's accumulated. If Wilson is as good as advertised it'll go a long way, though. If he doesn't get crippled & concussed repeatedly. 

Good read, I agree on almost all points. I'm not on any cliff, my posts are always a little tongue in cheek, but the honeymoon is swiftly running into the bill. Lot's of checks out that nobody's cashed yet. It appears (to anyone willing to remove the green shades) that JD might not be the drafting guru he was once touted as. Whether or not any amount of us has any doubt about his acumen though, will have no effect on whether his tenure here will be successful or not. Its that premise that got me to respond to the OP. It's not our fault these guys fail. It's not our lack of faith that makes them incompetent. Its just who these guys are. JD still has a shot to go either way. Whether or not Zach is the real deal will go a long way towards determining that.

[Sperm Edwards]

4 minutes ago, freestater said:

Good read, I agree on almost all points. I'm not on any cliff, my posts are always a little tongue in cheek, but the honeymoon is swiftly running into the bill. Lot's of checks out that nobody's cashed yet. It appears (to anyone willing to remove the green shades) that JD might not be the drafting guru he was once touted as. Whether or not any amount of us has any doubt about his acumen though, will have no effect on whether his tenure here will be successful or not. Its that premise that got me to respond to the OP. It's not our fault these guys fail. It's not our lack of faith that makes them incompetent. Its just who these guys are. JD still has a shot to go either way. Whether or not Zach is the real deal will go a long way towards determining that.

yeah I agree with all of this

[freestater]

12 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

yeah I agree with all of this

When your posts are this short I can tell you're lying. 

[C Mart]

2 hours ago, Maynard13 said:

Bullcrap. When you jeopardize your prized possession in his first game it’s highly concerning. If things aren’t immediately adjusted, we’ll be on yet another rebuild off the rebuild that we were rebuilding. 

JFC people. Saleh just said Becton has barely practiced the past few weeks. AVT only has a couple of weeks of practice with yesterday being his first game. Lewis retired. Clark got injured.  Edoga just started practicing after being out a month from knee surgery. 

[Jet_Engine1]

8 hours ago, Sir Speez said:

I understand that we live in a society where everyone needs instant gratification, but these are not the SOJ - however the Jets still have the SOJ FANS.  We have needed to tear it down completely for years and we are in the midst of the next phase which is the rebuild that and will have many growing pains along the way.  Basically a new everything from top to bottom, dealing with major and minor injuries, false expectations based on vanilla pre-season, too much beer and brautwurst.  If you cant see both the positives and negatives from yesterdays game and that this is an ongoing process then you are part of the SOJ FANS Club and part of the problem.

 

I have been here from before 2007 when I decided to join and check in daily, so Im not new to this.  I am optimistic and realistic at the same damn time so maybe that doesnt make me a Fan as in a FANATIC who has unrealistic expectations and pontificates ad nasueum, vacillating between Love and Hate, Hope and Despair, Chicken Little and Willam Wallace.

 

I like the direction we seem to be going in and will be rooting for success, not hoping for failure or being an internet tough guy admonishing players who put their lives at risk for the sake of my pleasure in watching this barbaric sport which I played but have trepidation about letting my Sons play because of the known risks.

 

As we used to say back int he day - SOME OF YALL NEED TO TAKE A CHILL PILL.

 

Ok, Im going back in to Lurker Supreme Mode.

 

 

Absolutely...

[Maynard13]

9 minutes ago, C Mart said:

JFC people. Saleh just said Becton has barely practiced the past few weeks. AVT only has a couple of weeks of practice with yesterday being his first game. Lewis retired. Clark got injured.  Edoga just started practicing after being out a month from knee surgery. 

Another good reason to be ultra conservative until they get their sheet together.

[y2k8]

 

SOJ fans are the ones with very low expectations that are consistently never met.

I don't think they are the ones who are freaking out over yesterday.

Yesterday was one of the most encouraging losses I've seen in a long time. Rookie QB, HC and OC and we saw flashes.  But more importantly, the team was actually competitive. 

If you have higher expectations than just seeing improvement through the year and finishing 6-11 or 7-10, you are going to be in for a very long year.

[shawn306]

4 hours ago, Bungaman said:

People here react like we lost by 20+ points - an all too common affair under the last coaching regime. We lost by less than a touchdown.

We will lose more close ones this year. But I expect to see effort, progress, and adjustments by coaches and players. I saw that yesterday. Having rooted for this team since watching Mike Lucci blow out Namath's knee, I don't want to be patient, either. But this was the first game, with probable jitters for all the team and coaches. Let's actually see how the season progresses.

Ugly dude

[Bugg]

Think it comes down to Becton and Viera. If this was simply growing pains, then yesterday is no big deal. 

Becton worries me in the sense there are guys with his physcial gifts that become HoFers like Pace, Ogden, Walter Jones. There's guys who manage to hang around for a bit like Robert Gallery simply because they're so damn big. And then in his own draft class is the likes of  Isiah Wilson, a Titans 1st round pick who's already washed out. To get into anywhere near that HoF group, would like to see and hear he's in the gym 24/7 and looking at tape all the time. And you aren't hearing that.Is it happening and it's not spoken of, no idea.  Now he's obviously not a dumbass like Wilson, but is his ceiling the HoFers, or Gallery? 

[Ian Fleming]

10 hours ago, DonCorleone said:

IMO, he has something similar to abused spouse syndrome.....

I will not spare a team from criticism after more than a decade of no playoffs. They deserve all that they have coming their way. I am not part of the problem, I am part of a loyal fanbase that has been receiving an inferior product for too long. 

Unfortunately for us fans, we keep returning to the subpar product despite knowing and complaining for years about its inability to deliver. What does that make us?

[Jimmy 2 Times]

3 minutes ago, Ian Fleming said:

Unfortunately for us fans, we keep returning to the subpar product despite knowing and complaining for years about its inability to deliver. What does that make us?

Loyal? 

[Matt39]

Last years draft looks like a wash out already. The expectations around here have gone so far down. Wilson isn’t going to be able to compensate for everything. Draft picks are supposed to contribute. The line should be able to block etc etc. If anything the fans haven’t been hard enough in the last 10 years. Hell the owner took a different job and left the team and put his brother with no experience in anything take over a billion dollar corporation and the fanbase went along with it.

[Ian Fleming]

3 minutes ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

Loyal? 

To a fault.

But according to some here, we logically should not be fans after being consistently disappointed. But, we’re human after all.

[Jimmy 2 Times]

2 minutes ago, Ian Fleming said:

To a fault.

But according to some here, we logically should not be fans after being consistently disappointed. But, we’re human after all.

I've debated quitting the team years ago, but know they'd win it all just to spite me if I did.  

Having your team suck, well sucks, but it really lessens the stress of watching meaningful games.  

We have that going for us!  

[RoadFan]

The issue for all, maybe most, of us is that after two off-seasons to improve the OL… what we saw yesterday looked like zero progress.

 

[BloodGreen]

The tsunami of stoner college dropouts gave Adam Gase 4 GAMES and that was without his franchise quarterback.
They better hold Robert Saleh to the same standard.  He's got a better quarterback.  He's got a better coaching staff.  He's got a better GM.  He's got an easier schedule.
SAR I

To be fair, Gase had a pretty long established reputation of odd behavior and overall sucking before he came here.


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[nickfoshizal]

The new regime has my support as long as Zachs not getting ******* slaughtered in the pocket play after play. Unfortunately that’s what we got week one, once Zach gets better protection maybe fans won’t be so mad. I guarantee Zachs dad feels exactly the same as any of the “Sojf’s” complaining atm. Most of which are happier with zachs performance than those with expectations through the roof anyways. 

[Jetsfan80]

2021:  6-win season or so.  Steady signs of improvement over the course of the season, particularly by the Offensive Line and young players/rookies.

2022:  Playoffs or else we're screwed until the Johnson's sell the team.

That's really the bottom line here.  The trio of Douglas, Saleh and Wilson simply has to work out or else there's no hope for a very long time.

[jgb]

Is there anything more ridiculous than accusing Jets fans of having an instant gratification mindset?

I know mountains with less patience than Jets fans.

[jgb]

On 9/13/2021 at 8:09 PM, Sperm Edwards said:

I'm not as close to the cliff, looking down off it, as you are. But yeah I fail to see how fan complaints after losses have the slightest thing to do with the team's performance in said loss. 

Just for you, because I know you're one of a handful that reads this crap I babble here , I think I've been pretty fair with Douglas:

• His trade transactions have been shockingly good on balance. He's done a good job of getting rid of players on expiring contracts whom he wasn't going to re-sign/extend anyway. Especially when they were made with the team having no serious chance at a playoff spot (1-6 and 0-7, respectively) when the trades were made. Those are like free draft picks.
• His first draft got a whole lot of early accolades, but that Jets draft class is looking as weak as any right now. There's still plenty of time for more of those picks to turn it around (they're 1 week into their 2nd seasons) but it's not looking good yet. Becton in particular; JD got so much credit from fans for making this great LT pick. In reality with a starting tackle hole, there were only two picks he could have made, and thus far it clearly looks like he made the wrong one. I liked the pick fine myself (though I'm the last one to rate/rank prospects), while acknowledging it's not like he pulled a rabbit out of his hat. It's true Wirfs is playing RT not LT, but at the level he's playing, there's no indication he'd be falling on his face if he were playing on the other side. It seems he's playing RT because Tampa already had a LT, not because he isn't good enough to play there. Becton's ceiling is higher; hopefully he realizes it when he gets back on the field. Then the genius move of trading down and still getting Mims? He's not looking too great either. One can feel he should be higher on the depth chart, but c'mon if he was crushing it in practices the coaches wouldn't keep him on the bench for spite. Then his next safety pick I think was just so he'd have a name to fill in so he could more seriously seek trade partners for Adams. If that's all the pick did, that adds to the value even if he almost never plays, and stinks when he does. 
• JD's second draft looks much better (though in fairness, people were giving him high marks for his draft last year also, where the only picks they were so majorly sour on already on/after opening day were 4th rounders Morgan & Clark). 
• It's opinion not fact yet as the correct move, but I like that he didn't just sit tight on Darnold and hoard even more picks; he's got plenty of picks already, plus they're starting plenty of rookies & 2nd yr players as it is, plus without trading down he's already got almost an entire draft's worth of extra picks next year, too. Many wanted him to do just that, and I'm glad he didn't. Like in 2017: take the FQB when you've got the chance; you don't play BAP and take a safety (or this year, a TE) like a puss, and assume that in the next draft an equal or better QB will fall into your lap. That's like an older-generation GPS sending you down stupid back roads for an hour because the current ETA was a minute faster that way. There are legit arguments he should have drafted a different QB based purely on talent, whether right or wrong in the end; but that's only if the reason is if one feels the other QB is outright superior, not because of hoarding yet another extra draft pick (especially since we didn't know where that allegedly-better QB would get drafted until it actually happened with the benefit of hindsight). 
• I'm ok with him trading up for AVT, but just ok. Honestly it's only a good move if he turns into a truly great one. As much of a hindsight-playing copout as that sounds, that's the truth. That draft class was so deep on the OL (with so few taken at that point, and none going at their projected higher slot), it's hard to justify a 1st rounder plus two more 3rd rounders for him unless he's that great. His week 1 performance was pretty bad, but in fairness he's just getting back to action and ffs it's just 1 week yet. I'm definitely no college film or draft junkie, so I'm just going by what others said, which is that he's supposed to be an "it" level talent at guard. If he's not "it" level performance, then this was poor allocation of high/higher picks. We'll see; hopefully he's all that on the field.
• I still think not extending Anderson, and then turning down a draft pick for him, was a mindless mistake, even if only as a transaction judgment. RA's '19 numbers were down through mid/late Oct, and was excited to not get traded away, making that an ideal time to make him an extension offer in the Enunwa price range (give or take). If he turns that down, as well as anything near that $, then go back to that last top offer and make a deal. Waiting until after the trade deadline - and then further, until after he had some bounce back games - to even address Anderson's contract is classic Maccagnan-level GMing. In 5 years I'm not sure that dope extended one starter until his final game under contract had been played, giving away all the leverage a team has. Though not definitively provable, one could certainly argue if he re-signed Anderson he wouldn't have signed Corey Davis. IMO we should have both.
• Last but not least... Considering the number of individual personnel attempts, and their cumulative investment amounts, his FA pickups on the OL have been a disaster. IMO he's gone the route of trying to get a little bit pregnant. He paid a significant amount (top 10 money) for a couple of those starters at RT and C; but in doing so he saved relatively little over available all-pro FAs (Conklin last year & Linsley this year). Then he signs starter-priced backups to make the total starter+backup cost the same as going for the gold in the first place. It's totally bizarre, honestly. 

So there are definitely some things I really like about Douglas, but in the end no matter where he started and no matter how many great trades he pulls out, in the end he's got to make good decisions on those he brings in with those new additional resources he's accumulated. If Wilson is as good as advertised it'll go a long way, though. If he doesn't get crippled & concussed repeatedly. 

Totally agree and have made many/most of these points myself. Of course when I made them I was butt fumbled badly but as usual, the board eventually catches up to reality.

Called Bechton a bad pick on draft night over Wirfs. Still time to be wrong, but not looking good. 

Slammed JD for penny wise pound foolish dump of Anderson. Suggested exactly what you do now a year ago — should’ve gotten Enunwa money. To be fair to JD, Macc is the one who squandered the best moment to extend Anderson.

His money saving games with OL are now incompetent. As you said he could’ve spent the same money for a good line. He’s screwing the pooch.

He has been bad at drafting. Yeah ok he’s good at trading away players. Well so was Idzik. 
 

I gave him a shot but I’m definitely turning on him. He has no marquee draft hit on his resume. None. Mel Kiper would’ve been better. If Zack isn’t the obvious man by year end, he should be fired and we should bring in the next GM to take another QB high in 2022. Of course cheapo Johnsons will never fire with 3 years left on deal no matter how bad he is.

 

[jgb]

On 9/14/2021 at 3:19 AM, Jetsfan80 said:

2021:  6-win season or so.  Steady signs of improvement over the course of the season, particularly by the Offensive Line and young players/rookies.

2022:  Playoffs or else we're screwed until the Johnson's sell the team.

That's really the bottom line here.  The trio of Douglas, Saleh and Wilson simply has to work out or else there's no hope for a very long time.

2022 playoffs is a pipe dream. Look, I know there can be wild swings in the NFL from year to year but man we are far away. We have no pass rush, no running game, our OL is putrid, a terrible secondary, and our LBs are pretty bad unless Mosely shakes the rust off. Obviously QB is a huge question mark.

Even if Zach is a smash hit, those are likely too many problems to solve in one off season. Not suggesting we need to be great in all of them, but right now we are hovering around league worst in each. Also JD has zero confirmed draft hits... asking a lot for him to have the kind of transformational, immediate-impact draft class in 2022 that would be an absolute prerequisite to contending next year. And yes, we have cap space too, but JD's FA record also been no bueno. Corey Davis had a nice first game and hopefully he becomes JD's first real success story in acquiring talent (along with Wilson).

Not to mention there are no pushovers in our division. I ranked Mac Jones above Wilson in pre-draft and I'm sticking with that for now. Nothing has happened to challenge that assessment at this time. Mac Jones superficially looked like Brady out there. Not calling him a HOFer but he might be a perfect fit for what little Bill wants to do. Also Tua is dramatically underrated on this board. If Sam had any 10-game streak like Tua's 10 starts as a rookie, he'd still be a Jet. And Tua was coming off a devastating knee injury. 

Not saying impossible, just extraordinarily unlikely. If Zach is a hit, I'm hoping we can contend in 2023.

[Irish Jet]

On 9/13/2021 at 5:49 PM, Sir Speez said:

ZDub doesnt throw for 400 yards 4 TDs and no Interceptions in his 1st NFL Game - He Sucks.  

Citation needed.

[Jolot]

On 9/13/2021 at 8:32 AM, DonCorleone said:

IMO, he has something similar to abused spouse syndrome.....

I will not spare a team from criticism after more than a decade of no playoffs. They deserve all that they have coming their way. I am not part of the problem, I am part of a loyal fanbase that has been receiving an inferior product for too long. 

100%. Every year people dump on “ SOJ fans “ who don’t deserve a good team because we are such terrible fans …what a joke . Who “ deserves “ to have a good team ? All of the 27 year old New Orleans Saints “ fans “ living in New York ? Or the 23 year old Chiefs “ fans “ maybe the those 21 year old Rams “ fans “ that are suddenly everywhere I go …yea that’s it ….us 40-50 year old Jets fans that have stuck through decades of this ?…we are SOJ fans who are the “ problem “ …get lost with this nonsense, there is nothing worse than that narrative. 

[jgb]

1 hour ago, Jolot said:

100%. Every year people dump on “ SOJ fans “ who don’t deserve a good team because we are such terrible fans …what a joke . Who “ deserves “ to have a good team ? All of the 27 year old New Orleans Saints “ fans “ living in New York ? Or the 23 year old Chiefs “ fans “ maybe the those 21 year old Rams “ fans “ that are suddenly everywhere I go …yea that’s it ….us 40-50 year old Jets fans that have stuck through decades of this ?…we are SOJ fans who are the “ problem “ …get lost with this nonsense, there is nothing worse than that narrative. 

Sports leagues and teams have cleverly marketed "loyalty" as some sort of virtue. Actually, I'm a consumer of entertainment. When it stops being entertaining, I stop consuming. Last week's game was the first Jets game I've watched beginning to end since Darnold's rookie year.

[neckdemon]

On 9/13/2021 at 7:36 PM, Matt39 said:

Last years draft looks like a wash out already. The expectations around here have gone so far down. Wilson isn’t going to be able to compensate for everything. Draft picks are supposed to contribute. The line should be able to block etc etc. If anything the fans haven’t been hard enough in the last 10 years. Hell the owner took a different job and left the team and put his brother with no experience in anything take over a billion dollar corporation and the fanbase went along with it.

i was totally in opposition of this. i even voiced my displeasure a multitude of times and tried my best to veto it. alas, woody didn't give a crap about my opinion and went ahead with it anyway. not sure if he considered any other fans input or not......

[jgb]

On 9/13/2021 at 6:49 PM, Sir Speez said:

Criticism is part of it and I get that...I am talking moreso of the Chicken Little - THE SKY IS FALLING mentality.  Not every move is going to be that DESTINY CHANGER.  It should and hopefully be a measured process.  SAleh coaches one game - FIRE HIM.  JD signed Lawson but he got a season ending injury in preseason - FIRE HIM.  ZDub doesnt throw for 400 yards 4 TDs and no Interceptions in his 1st NFL Game - He Sucks.  AVT has no preseason due to injury and the line hasnt had the chance to properly gel - They Suck!!!

If we can all agree that the Jets make it challenging to be a fan with the lack of success then why do you think that it should change overnight - where there no rays of sunshine or hope?

Except no one said any of these things. You're arguing against a hypothetical caricature of a Jet fan that doesn't actually exist.

[Biggs]

1 minute ago, jgb said:

Except no one said any of these things. You're arguing against a hypothetical caricature of a Jet fan that doesn't actually exist.

I'm willing to except the Chicken Little label if he's willing to wear the kick me I'm stupid sign on his back. 

[jgb]

 

On 9/13/2021 at 7:37 PM, southparkcpa said:

Because Woody and Chris have no concept of how to hire.  If a restaurant or any business had the same problem, you wouldn't go there.

When an owner is turning over GM and HC every 3 years maybe it's the owner and not them.

The only thing either of them ever managed before running the Jets were butlers and maids. Yet until recently they refused to let their GMs even manage their HCs. After all, they don't know how to clean an oven or make a dry martini and they manage their household staffs just fine. How much harder can this be??

 

On 9/13/2021 at 7:10 PM, C Mart said:

Not with the constant turnover of regimes (GM, coaching staff).

You're confusing correlation with causation. Good teams don't have a lot of turnover because they hire well in the first place.

[Biggs]

1 minute ago, jgb said:

 

The only thing either of them ever managed before running the Jets were butlers and maids. Yet until recently they refused to let their GMs even manage their HCs. After all, they don't know how to clean an oven or make a dry martini and they manage their household staffs just fine. How much harder can this be??

 

You're confusing correlation with causation. Good teams don't have a lot of turnover because they hire well in the first place.

It's much tougher they actually have to have a guy to run payroll for the Jets.  The Butlers and maids are paid cash off the books. 

[Jetsfan80]

11 hours ago, jgb said:

2022 playoffs is a pipe dream. Look, I know there can be wild swings in the NFL from year to year but man we are far away. We have no pass rush, no running game, our OL is putrid, a terrible secondary, and our LBs are pretty bad unless Mosely shakes the rust off. Obviously QB is a huge question mark.

Even if Zach is a smash hit, those are likely too many problems to solve in one off season. Not suggesting we need to be great in all of them, but right now we are hovering around league worst in each. Also JD has zero confirmed draft hits... asking a lot for him to have the kind of transformational, immediate-impact draft class in 2022 that would be an absolute prerequisite to contending next year. And yes, we have cap space too, but JD's FA record also been no bueno. Corey Davis had a nice first game and hopefully he becomes JD's first real success story in acquiring talent (along with Wilson).

Not to mention there are no pushovers in our division. I ranked Mac Jones above Wilson in pre-draft and I'm sticking with that for now. Nothing has happened to challenge that assessment at this time. Mac Jones superficially looked like Brady out there. Not calling him a HOFer but he might be a perfect fit for what little Bill wants to do. Also Tua is dramatically underrated on this board. If Sam had any 10-game streak like Tua's 10 starts as a rookie, he'd still be a Jet. And Tua was coming off a devastating knee injury. 

Not saying impossible, just extraordinarily unlikely. If Zach is a hit, I'm hoping we can contend in 2023.

 

Fair enough.  I rescind my 2022 playoff mandate.  But with the resources we have available to us in 2022 we at least need to be an 8+ win team next year. 

This offseason is going to be the offseason to spend money.  There's no use in waiting anymore for home grown players to pay until being buyers in free agency.  We need to add as much talent as we can via both the draft and free agency this offseason, at a lot of different positions.  If they need to be 2 or 3-year deals that we can get out of quickly, fine.  But Douglas will need to spend.

[maury77]

On 9/13/2021 at 8:03 AM, Sir Speez said:

I understand that we live in a society where everyone needs instant gratification, but these are not the SOJ - however the Jets still have the SOJ FANS.  We have needed to tear it down completely for years and we are in the midst of the next phase which is the rebuild that and will have many growing pains along the way.  Basically a new everything from top to bottom, dealing with major and minor injuries, false expectations based on vanilla pre-season, too much beer and brautwurst.  If you cant see both the positives and negatives from yesterdays game and that this is an ongoing process then you are part of the SOJ FANS Club and part of the problem.

 

I have been here from before 2007 when I decided to join and check in daily, so Im not new to this.  I am optimistic and realistic at the same damn time so maybe that doesnt make me a Fan as in a FANATIC who has unrealistic expectations and pontificates ad nasueum, vacillating between Love and Hate, Hope and Despair, Chicken Little and Willam Wallace.

 

I like the direction we seem to be going in and will be rooting for success, not hoping for failure or being an internet tough guy admonishing players who put their lives at risk for the sake of my pleasure in watching this barbaric sport which I played but have trepidation about letting my Sons play because of the known risks.

 

As we used to say back int he day - SOME OF YALL NEED TO TAKE A CHILL PILL.

 

Ok, Im going back in to Lurker Supreme Mode.

 

 

Yeah, Catholicism has drained whatever unconditional faith my soul had left to give (and even that is hanging by a thin thread). No need to get frustrated with other people who are pessimistic about the Jets, just ignore them like I ignore probably 90% of the board at this stage. I'm mostly just here for my old Jetsinsider message board buddies that I've known for over a decade at this point. 

[southparkcpa]

On 9/13/2021 at 2:10 PM, RedBeardedSavage said:

Regardless of how you classify yourself or in what bucket of Jets fandom you belong, yesterday should've scared the sh*t out of you.

Zach Wilson getting hit all day and absolutely no running game. 

New England next week and the Broncos D after that... if we couldn't block anyone on Carolina...

I’m with you, furthermore, for those arguing against us, Look at this photo…. Me with the Namath name covered and a SELL THE TEAM WOODY message and a girl, unknown, with a WE SUCK Tee.

I would argue we are the best fans. brutally honest, spent hundreds on this dumpster fire team.  I would NEVER dare question her honesty.  SHE is at the game etc… I blew a shlt ton of money last weekend. met great fans.  We are a 2 and 14 team with no Oline and little talent.  Now it’s a sin to speak the truth???  

[Snell41]

Instant gratification? Patience? We have sucked enormous balls for decades. I’ve lived through it patiently. Your premise is dependent on the idea this is finally the right rebuild….. I’ve seen this movie before. I promise you, everything that seems slightly fishy now (our suspect OL, underwhelming draft pics, and well respected GM who really hasn’t added anything of value yet) will come up smelling like a fresh rotting corpse in 2 years. And then I’m sure there will be you, or another you like you that comes along saying we have no patience…… again.


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