Kyle Hamilton - can a reasonable case be made?

[slimjasi]

1 minute ago, section314 said:

FWIW, the mocks I have been doing, he might not even be there with our 1st first rounder. 

I haven't looked at mocks at all. I figured the run on edge rushers and QBs (QBs almost always rise these days would get Hamilton to us)

Interesting. 

[section314]

3 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

I haven't looked at mocks at all. I figured the run on edge rushers and QBs (QBs almost always rise these days would get Hamilton to us)

Interesting. 

I’ve been on PFN simulator.The two edges go 1&2 and 3 is either Neal or Hamilton. It’s early though, and lots will change. We need a couple of the QB’s to light up their bowl games, Sr. Bowl, and the combine. 

[Sammybighead]

No. Absolutely no case can be made for a safety that early. No, no way, not happening. 

[Jethead]

Hamilton and Stingley make me nervous because of player specific concerns not because of the positions they play. I don't really buy the premium position argument. I would happily pick Ed Reed or Troy Polomalu, regardless of position.

Edge and LB are huge Jets needs and there are very talented options at both. I also like a top tier WR as a choice. TE with late 2 or 3rd round pick also makes sense to me.

[#27TheDominator]

I'm not sure that safety isn't that important for these guys.  The Legion of Boom paid two and they drafted Earl Thomas in the 1st half of the round.  Whether it makes sense will depend on his size and how well he runs.  If he can cover some and is actually 220 he will be bigger than the 2 LB/S hybrids they drafted this year and might be the exact type of move him around piece these guys would want.  Yes they probably want pass rush first, but after that it is all about versatility and they are already spending a decent amount on that line.  They paid Marcus Maye over $10M for this season and some were suggesting they tag him again.

[ZachEY]

1 hour ago, slimjasi said:

Ok, so we all (hopefully) understand that we desperately need an edge rusher with one of our two first round picks. Time to reopen the sack exchange. That's a given. 

 

The question is - what do we do with the other first round pick? Now, you could always take a stud offensive lineman. You could always take another weapon for Wilson. Those are also pretty standard answers that most of us could get behind. You could also take a stud LB who does a little bit of everything. We have all kinds of holes. 

But what about . . . safety? Now, before you ask me for my address so you can throw a bomb through my window, let me just leave this here:

 

Obviously, we are all scarred from taking Adams over Mahomes/Watson. But, unlike Adams, this guy is not allergic to interceptions and is something of a ball hawk. Seems like an awesome player. Would you consider taking him with our second first round pick? Normally, I am a firm believer in only using top 10 picks on premium positions, but I admit that I am intrigued by this guy. I also like the idea of aiming for an elite prospect at every level of the defense (DL, LB, secondary) and our secondary desperately needs an impact player.  It's probably still a bad idea, but I don't know, I just have a feeling about this player. 

What say you?

I WILL CUT YOU

[UntouchableCrew]

I don't think so. Draft premium positions or trade down.

Somebody will want Matt Corral.

[slimjasi]

Just now, ZachEY said:

I WILL CUT YOU

I may cut myself when I reread this thread in a month or two. It's probably a terrible idea but I am in a mood today

[slimjasi]

1 minute ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I don't think so. Draft premium positions or trade down.

Somebody will want Matt Corral.

Definitely. 

Please let this be the last December that we are talking about the draft and free agency for at least a few years. 

[slimjasi]

More yes votes than I anticipated so far!

 

I'm pleasantly surprised I haven't been banned yet

[GreenFish]

Absolutely not! We’ve gone through this with DTs and S before. The bar is too high for them to live up to the pick. 

[K_O_Brien]

10 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I don't think so. Draft premium positions or trade down.

Somebody will want Matt Corral.

Or this guy. 

 

 

[Jethead]

I would hold the fact that he comes from Notre Dame against him more than the position he plays. ND players generally are overrated, IMO. Q Nelson and Z Martin being exceptions.

[KRL]

I just don't see it.  With two top 10 picks there's got to be pass rushers,
OLinemen, CB or even a LB that will impact this team more than a safety.
Constant front 7 pressure is what we're looking for or a shutdown corner

[doitny]

i cant see us doing it in the 1st rd but i would draft a safety in the 2nd rd.

if he is as good as people say were not going to pay a safety. what did Adams get, 72 mil. he is supposed to be better, so we give him what? 90 mil in 5 years. i cant see that so why waste the pick.

use it on an Edge, LB , CB, TE, or even a WR.

you know by the time draft day comes there will be at least one WR who will make people drool. and we could be in position to get that guy. 

the one good thing about this defense being so bad is that it has killed for the most part of drafting a OL with a 3rd first rd pick. 

 

[Maynard13]

1 hour ago, slats said:

I imagine a world where they potentially trade up for the Edge, but then trade back with the second first for a package that includes a 2023 first. 
 
I just don’t see JD taking a safety, of all positions, that high. 

As long as we can get an edge and Devin Lloyd, I’m in. 

[bla bla bla]

I was so against this to begin with but I have come around to Hamilton. We need Blue Chippers.

[Jethead]

4 minutes ago, Maynard13 said:

As long as we can get an edge and Devin Lloyd, I’m in. 

How about Nakobe Dean if he comes out?

[Bowles Movement]

1 hour ago, slats said:

I imagine a world where they potentially trade up for the Edge, but then trade back with the second first for a package that includes a 2023 first. 
 
I just don’t see JD taking a safety, of all positions, that high. 

Not saying what youre suggesting couldnt happen but I just read that this draft is light on true first round talent.  According to a draft guru there are only 8-10 true first rd talents so Id hope the Jets would factor that into any trade valuation they are offered.

[redlichtie]

2 hours ago, slimjasi said:

Ok, so we all (hopefully) understand that we desperately need an edge rusher with one of our two first round picks. Time to reopen the sack exchange. That's a given. 

 

The question is - what do we do with the other first round pick? Now, you could always take a stud offensive lineman. You could always take another weapon for Wilson. Those are also pretty standard answers that most of us could get behind. You could also take a stud LB who does a little bit of everything. We have all kinds of holes. 

But what about . . . safety? Now, before you ask me for my address so you can throw a bomb through my window, let me just leave this here:

 

Obviously, we are all scarred from taking Adams over Mahomes/Watson. But, unlike Adams, this guy is not allergic to interceptions and is something of a ball hawk. Seems like an awesome player. Would you consider taking him with our second first round pick? Normally, I am a firm believer in only using top 10 picks on premium positions, but I admit that I am intrigued by this guy. I also like the idea of aiming for an elite prospect at every level of the defense (DL, LB, secondary) and our secondary desperately needs an impact player.  It's probably still a bad idea, but I don't know, I just have a feeling about this player. 

What say you?

Yes, we desperately need talent and playmakers on defense(we could do with a few on offense too but the D is priority No 1 No 2 & No 3)….if he’s that good, if he’s more than just hype, if he play the run and can cover and has the knack for making plays in coverage that guys like Ronnie Lott, Ed Reed or Polamalu did (and that JA didn’t) then yes absolutely, but only after we’ve drafted an elite pass rusher…sick and tired of QB’s picking us apart with all day to throw, if we have to package picks to get one of the top guys, then so be it 

[derp]

Hamilton isn't Adams. He's actually a plus athlete for a safety and created turnovers in college.

I'd think about it, but the risk-reward is pretty mediocre there. You're taking a safety that high he needs to be elite. Same deal with AVT last year as a guard that high. Take an edge or a tackle there and he's merely very good and you're happy. Add in that he's missed some time due to injuries, I lean no.

This free agent safety class looks pretty strong. I think they should start there first. The defense needs legitimate good veteran football players and I think that's a solid spot to attack in free agency. If not, this safety class is pretty deep and I think it would be better addressed later.

Wouldn't be a complete Jamal Adams I need to talk myself into the pick situation, but I don't think taking Hamilton would be a great decision.

[Maynard13]

34 minutes ago, Jethead said:

How about Nakobe Dean if he comes out?

Rather have Lloyd. He is faster than a speeding bullet.

[maury77]

2 hours ago, Untouchable said:

He’s probably one of the 2 or 3 best overall players in the draft.

I get that he doesn’t play a “premium” position, but like you said, in this specific defense, you could make the argument that quality safety play is the most important facet outside of getting pressure with your front 4.

I’d sure as hell take Hamilton over a constantly banged up corner like Stingley who is still living off his freshman season.

Honestly, the Jets need elite players ..... pretty much every where. If you have a chance to grab one, do it because as we have seen, elite players rarely make it to free agency and when they do, they don't want to sign with the Jets unless its $$$ they can't refuse (which isn't going to happen with Douglas's cheap ass). 

[Larz]

Free agency comes first 

[Barry McCockinner]

3 hours ago, Darnold's Forehead said:

As long as he doesn’t call himself “Best in the nation” or “Vice Prez”, then yes I would consider it.

I mean he is best in the nation. Sorry - NAY tion

[Be_a_Jet]

2 hours ago, Bowles Movement said:

Not saying what youre suggesting couldnt happen but I just read that this draft is light on true first round talent.  According to a draft guru there are only 8-10 true first rd talents so Id hope the Jets would factor that into any trade valuation they are offered.

Hmm. You got a link on that?

[slimjasi]

3 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

I clicked Maybe, which admittedly is a cop out but my answer is based on a situation where perhaps JD trades down with one of those 1st round picks and Hamilton drops.  I really don't want to use a premium pick on a Safety but there's a point where value jumps off the tape at you.  IF this guy somehow drops and JD has traded back to accumulate more picks then there's a point at which the combination of a premier defender intersects with an obvious need in the Secondary for the Jets.  Maye and Joyner are goners.  Davis is an average/below average starter and we've plugged in a street guy in Riley.  We should never again double-dip at Safety like the Jets did with Adams/Maye but Hamilton would be a solid infusion at that third level.... again, only in a situation where he drops into the Jets lap.

My preference is for an Edge Rusher and OLineman with our two 1st round picks.  In a dream world the Jets land one of Hutchinson, Kayvon or Karlaftis at the Edge and also grab a guy like Evan Neal or Tyler Linderbaum (perhaps by trading down a few spots).

I voted "yes" but "maybe" is probably more in line with what I am thinking. I think your basic plan makes a lot of sense. 

[#27TheDominator]

2 hours ago, doitny said:

if he is as good as people say were not going to pay a safety. what did Adams get, 72 mil. he is supposed to be better, so we give him what? 90 mil in 5 years. i cant see that so why waste the pick

Are you seriously considering how much you will have to pay the guy in 5 years as a negative?  The fact that Adams go so much money is an indication that maybe the positional value is there. 5 years is an eternity.  The only real consideration to me about that is whether guys are worth a 1st or 2nd based on wanting to lock them up for an additional year.

My concern with positional value is when you take a guy because his floor is high.  A good safety will start for his contract, but if the guy is able to cover ground he can be a playmaker.  Let's see his 40 and let them rate his cover skills.  Assomugha was a safety in college and he was a top 3 corner for years.

[T0mShane]

4 hours ago, K_O_Brien said:

Or this guy. 

 

 

cc: @Mogglez hell yeah

[BurntDice]

5 hours ago, Maynard13 said:

No way does Saleh/JD take a safety that high. Ain’t happening. Edge and LB are going with our first 2 #1’s.  If JD traded back with one of them and gets an extra #2&3, I can see him grabbing Linderbaum. 

Earl Thomas disagrees. Dl safety and lb are high priorities in this d. Last is cb 

[BurntDice]

3 hours ago, Jethead said:

How about Nakobe Dean if he comes out?

Love dean. I really want him, Hamilton, and ojabo 

[jgb]

I don't start scouting prospects until Jets draft them then I rip 'em to shreds.

#closetpatsfan

[Maynard13]

12 minutes ago, BurntDice said:

Earl Thomas disagrees. Dl safety and lb are high priorities in this d. Last is cb 

You can get Vernon McKinley in round 3-4. Here is a read up. And Saleh's defense is predicated on the pass rush. Hence, JD drafted like  20 CB's and safties in the late rounds last year. He's not drafting a safety with one of the 2 top picks.  Maybe in round 2 if he can add a 2nd rounder. An edge and a LB will be JD's targets with those first 2 picks.

A bit slight in frame, Verone McKinley III understands how to use his speed and athleticism to track ball carriers and find the football in coverage. He has some of the draft class’ best instincts in coverage, but he’s shown an ability to stuff run fits all the same. McKinley has taken a stepforward this season, helping to elevate the Oregon defense that lost a ton of talent over the years. He’s recorded 4 interceptions and has as many forced incompletions. Understanding his role, McKinley should add value as an Earl Thomas-type free safety in coverage at the next level. 

[Bowles Movement]

1 hour ago, Be_a_Jet said:

Hmm. You got a link on that?

Tony Pauline quoted in NY Post

[freestater]

Sure, but only if we double down on safety with our next highest pick too.