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****OFFICIAL JETS VS SAINTS ATTRITION BOWL GAME THREAD****

T0mShane

By T0mShane
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Beaver
Beaver

I’ll save you guys some time today.   Watch this and you won’t need to watch the game.  

doitny
doitny

thats not cool man, she gave birth to you

Jetlife33
Jetlife33

Wilson is so terrified of any contact 

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Bleedin Green

Bleedin Green

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32 minutes ago, heymangold said:

I do agree with you that he hasn’t looked good.  I’m not arguing that.  I’m just not ready to throw away a #2 overall pick so quickly.  As much as it hurts, he’s gotta have at least next year too.

Certainly no reason to outright cut him, or even trade him away unless they get a shockingly good offer.  With that said, there's also absolutely no reason to hand him the job unearned either.  Make him have to fight for it and win it next year.

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heymangold

heymangold

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17 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Wilson hasn’t led a receiver properly more than a handful of times in his career thus far.  

Even if those receivers caught those throws, Wilson costs the offense yards that a replacement level QB would have been gotten, because the ball isn’t going where it needs to go. 

Ok sure.  But you can’t pin every single thing that happens solely on the QB. Both drops Ty Johnson had today hit him directly in the hands and they would have been for first downs.  Cole dropped a pass, that while was a bit over thrown, still hit him in the hands - and I’ve seen tons of WRs make that catch.  The ball slight behind, how many times have you seen a a Wr make that catch and still gain yards?

I know that he has to be better and I’m not arguing he’s been good.  But the board goes absolutely bonkers for every little thing and it’s not fair to blame wilson for literally everything. It’s a team sport!

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Bleedin Green

Bleedin Green

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22 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Wilson hasn’t led a receiver properly more than a handful of times in his career thus far.  

Even if those receivers caught those throws, Wilson costs the offense yards that a replacement level QB would have been gotten, because the ball isn’t going where it needs to go. 

This is a significant part that the apologists want to keep ignoring, and was the most significant difference with White in at QB.

Even when receivers are catching Wilson's terrible throws, they're regularly coming to a dead stop to reach back, or diving down to scoop it up from the turf, rather than getting hit in full stride and able to turn the ball up field.  It's a rather significant difference that impacts the entire offense.

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Jetsfan80

Jetsfan80

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18 minutes ago, heymangold said:

Ok sure.  But you can’t pin every single thing that happens solely on the QB.

I'll stop you right there, because I never did that.  

However, its the far more concerning thing than the receivers dropping throws.  We knew the receivers weren't going to be good today.  That doesn't excuse the many extremely off-target throws Wilson has been making every week.  This wasn't a one-week anomaly.  It's been a season-long trend.

The receivers will get better after getting healthy and additional resources spent this offseason.  But the QB we invested a # 2 overall pick is very, very unlikely to be able to fix his many flaws if history is any guide at the position.  

And as we know, it doesn't require elite #Weppinz to see if a QB has it or not.  We were told for 3+ years that the only reason Darnold failed was because of a bad supporting cast and coaching.  That was proven to be very wrong.  Wilson's supporting cast and offensive coaching all season, even today, was better than Darnold's, and yet Wilson has been decidedly worse than Darnold.  

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Bleedin Green

Bleedin Green

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28 minutes ago, heymangold said:

Ok sure.  But you can’t pin every single thing that happens solely on the QB. Both drops Ty Johnson had today hit him directly in the hands and they would have been for first downs.  Cole dropped a pass, that while was a bit over thrown, still hit him in the hands - and I’ve seen tons of WRs make that catch.  The ball slight behind, how many times have you seen a a Wr make that catch and still gain yards?

I know that he has to be better and I’m not arguing he’s been good.  But the board goes absolutely bonkers for every little thing and it’s not fair to blame wilson for literally everything. It’s a team sport!

The problem is not the individual plays, the problem is the high frequency at which Wilson has those terrible throws.

Every single QB has to deal with outright drops or near misses, that's just a simple reality of the game and position.  Yet some want to act like he is the one poor innocent victim of it all, when the reality is if every QB were to be graded on the significant curve some want to give to Wilson, it would still net out to him being among the worst.  That's why it's relevant to look at everything on a larger scale and on a comparative basis, however those all reflect extremely poorly on Wilson, so some prefer to get hung up on individual plays they hope can fit a narrative.

Issues that may not be 100% his fault don't wash away his repeated failures, and it's the constant stream of excuse-making that is the reason for the need to point out the awfulness of his throws once a single lack of catch is claimed by some to absolve him of all blame.  That's shown by those clinging onto the excuses of a few drops from the very beginning and ignoring instances that followed where he couldn't hit the broad side of a barn, highlighted by stunningly bad plays like wildly missing a totally uncovered Griffin a few yards away, or throwing it into the dirt well short of Berrios on a WR screen, the kind of things that even the very worst of backups should be able accomplish.

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Maynard13

Maynard13

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I think Zach will be ok. The team should be able to improve in practically every aspect next year. They’ll have a better defense and a better OL. He really needs a #1 WR and a #1 RB. Think about that. A cow bell RB like Spiller, TE like McBride, C like Linderboom, G like Schreff, WR like Allen Robinson. That’s a serious upgrade in talent. And he’d be able to put this miserable learning curve rookie season behind him. Conversely, the defense will be better-how could it possibly be any worse! Lawson will be back and JD will add an elite edge prospect in the draft. JD has tons of cash and picks to get a couple LB’s and CB’s and safeties. Bet your butt on it. Again, that will be a huge upgrade in talent. Still very young, but definitely more competitive than the mess we’ve seen this year. All this translates into Zach being able to relax and do what he needs to rather than forcing things. 

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Greenbloodblitz

Greenbloodblitz

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4 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I'll stop you right there, because I never did that.  

However, its the far more concerning thing than the receivers dropping throws.  We knew the receivers weren't going to be good today.  That doesn't excuse the many extremely off-target throws Wilson has been making every week.  This wasn't a one-week anomaly.  It's been a season-long trend.

The receivers will get better after getting healthy and additional resources spent this offseason.  But the QB we invested a # 2 overall pick is very, very unlikely to be able to fix his many flaws if history is any guide at the position.  

And as we know, it doesn't require elite #Weppinz to see if a QB has it or not.  We were told for 3+ years that the only reason Darnold failed was because of a bad supporting cast and coaching.  That was proven to be very wrong.  Wilson's supporting cast and offensive coaching all season, even today, was better than Darnold's, and yet Wilson has been decidedly worse than Darnold.  

Painfully I have to agree with you. I always say I really like this kid in interviews he doesn't seem like an idiot and he doesn't throw the same week in week out each and every play cliches..

But he better come out with some crap like I've been playing with a separated shoulder or I'm legally blind or something, cause my 8-year-old daughter could make those throws left-handed-

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Green Ghost

Green Ghost

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1 hour ago, RSJ said:

 


Bro they are worse than last season. They had an offseason with the most cap in the league and two first round picks. They arent going to get close to the Vegas over/under of 6 wins. This is a colossal failure on every level. The defense is much much worse. The QB play and offense, worse. Huge failure. You honestly think this is the first year of a potential rebuild? Lol


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

 

Such a terrific post. ????????????

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Big_Slick

Big_Slick

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1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said:

The Cards gave up on Rosen in 13, and Wilson has been nearly as bad as Rosen.

I read in an Cimini article last week that Rosen was one of three rookie QB's who ranked lower on ESPN's QBR rating scale looking at rookie QB's who started since 2000. That doesn't include today's masterpiece.

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T0mShane

T0mShane

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1 hour ago, Green Ghost said:

T0m, this kid is a bust. I got bounced around for ripping Darnold early and often, but he was never as bad as Wilson.

This is a mess. The guys in the locker room have to see it. They’re going to run this kid out there again next year and he’s going to set this team back 5 years.

He is a mess, and I feel legitimately bad for him because he’s been mishandled from the start. There’s clear potential there, but he’s being coached by a bunch of dummies who are being told what to do by dummy executives. Whoever it was that made the call to start him right away should be fired tomorrow, because that was criminal malfeasance. You can see how raw he is even today, and how many bad habits he picked up that they’re going to have to coach out of him as fast as they can. I don’t think LaFleur is hopeless as a play caller, but he might have to be demoted for someone who can specifically work with Wilson and coach him up. Maybe someone like Doug Pederson, who can shield Zach from Saleh, etc, and turn him into a functional player. What a disgrace. 

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Jetsfan80

Jetsfan80

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10 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

He is a mess, and I feel legitimately bad for him because he’s been mishandled from the start. There’s clear potential there, but he’s being coached by a bunch of dummies who are being told what to do by dummy executives. Whoever it was that made the call to start him right away should be fired tomorrow, because that was criminal malfeasance. You can see how raw he is even today, and how many bad habits he picked up that they’re going to have to coach out of him as fast as they can. I don’t think LaFleur is hopeless as a play caller, but he might have to be demoted for someone who can specifically work with Wilson and coach him up. Maybe someone like Doug Pederson, who can shield Zach from Saleh, etc, and turn him into a functional player. What a disgrace. 

If you're going to draft a QB at # 2 overall, you're doing so with the expectation that he has enough tools to get by in the NFL that you can play him right away, or at least, maybe after sitting just a few games.

If he's not ready to play right away or early on in his rookie season, then you don't draft him # 2 overall in the first place unless perhaps you already have an established starter in place and can afford to wait a bit (No, not Darnold). 

Wilson looks like a 4th round project QB out there.  That's terrible QB evaluation and that's the even bigger problem than their plan when he arrived here. 

Yes, he should have been sitting the first few weeks.  No, that wouldn't have matter one iota when it comes to at least like 80 % of his flaws.  Sitting a few weeks wasn't going to prevent him from throwing dirtballs to checkdown receivers.  

And unlike with Darnold, the offensive coaching and supporting cast wasn't an enormous issue.  In both of those areas, the Jets are at least acceptable.  This is just Zach Wilson sucking at playing the position, plaing and simple.

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RoadFan

RoadFan

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5 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

He is a mess, and I feel legitimately bad for him because he’s been mishandled from the start. There’s clear potential there, but he’s being coached by a bunch of dummies who are being told what to do by dummy executives. Whoever it was that made the call to start him right away should be fired tomorrow, because that was criminal malfeasance. You can see how raw he is even today, and how many bad habits he picked up that they’re going to have to coach out of him as fast as they can. I don’t think LaFleur is hopeless as a play caller, but he might have to be demoted for someone who can specifically work with Wilson and coach him up. Maybe someone like Doug Pederson, who can shield Zach from Saleh, etc, and turn him into a functional player. What a disgrace. 

The OL has improved.  Lafleur has improved.

Wilson, whom I actually was high on, has been abysmal.

The throws he is missing would be frowned upon by a H.S coach. 
 

Embarrassing and sad…

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T0mShane

T0mShane

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Just now, TuscanyTile2 said:

That's how you took that post?  

He’s referring to cutting a bunch of guys he dislikes and bringing in guys he likes. He’s going to find out that this is the NFL and he’s not going to get very far with a roster full of Braxton Berrioses and Ronald Blairs. The difference between being a popular coordinator and and a successful head coach is that the head coach has to coach 53 guys and he has to be mean to some of them and some of them are going to challenge him. It’s like going from being the cool uncle to becoming the full-time parent. Saleh has to grow the **** up and take some personal accountability for what’s going on on the field. This is his team whether he likes it or not, and he has to get the 53 he has to compete. Get off the ******* stairs and coach your goddamn team, Bob.

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Jetsfan80

Jetsfan80

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4 minutes ago, Barton said:

Receivers today were throwing their hands up in the air after Zach threw them a garbage pass. Pretty bad when that happens.

We're headed into the "mutiny" segment of the season.  You cannot continue to roll Wilson out there at the expense of the 52 other guys in the locker room.  You just can't.  Any QB but Wilson needs to be under center right now. 

I mean, what is Wilson gaining out of being on the field anyways?  He's only getting worse.  

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