We are not going anywhere, not next year or the year after...time to face facts

[GangGreened]

7 hours ago, Maxman said:

This team has flaws for sure. They get the offseason to fix them. Backup QB, fix the oline and WR2.

That is as short of a needs list as the Jets have had in 50 years.

We’ve been waiting 4 years for Douglas to “fix the o line” like that’s some easily achievable task that can be done now in one offseason. His idea of a WR2 was a healthy scratch in games this year.

its much easier said on paper than done 

[Jimmy 2 Times]

This team can win it all. 
Rebuild the line and add one high end receiver.

 

Play power football with Rodgers torching anyone that tries to creep up in the box with play action.  

[The Crusher]

8 hours ago, dbatesman said:

[from the back row, barely audible]

what if the defense regresses

Why would the defense regress? It’s not like we are letting the best pure pass  rusher we had since Abe just walk for nothing. Oh wait… damn it! 

[Claymation]

10 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Zach Wilson beat the Bills and would have beat the Chiefs in Arrowhead if not for a bullsh*t PI call on Sauce.

They played in MetLife, my daughter was pissed because TSwizel was at the game and I went.

[Lupz27]

10 hours ago, Alka said:

We tried to make it a 1st rounder, but Rodgers got hurt.  If Rodgers didn't get injured, the Jets would have still missed the playoffs, due to our horrible offensive line, and we'd be out of a 1st rounder this year, instead of a 2nd rounder.

Or maybe the O-line was putrid because there was no General out there letting them know their assignments and when they need to change.

How many times do you see Mahomes (yes Rodgerd does the same thing for a decade) literally walk up to the line and scream at his O-line hey 48 is coming not once like 7 times then adjusts the hot route to absolutely expose the open area the blitz came from while one of his O-line guys picks up said blitzer to slow him just enough to get the ball out.

Not one Jets QB could do this since Favre heck maybe he couldn’t even do it might have been Pennington.

They had Mangold who was able to adjust but it’s just not the same if it isn’t coming from the QB.

That is the most important thing Rodgers will bring to this team next season period.

Now will he still be physically capable to play at high level to keep up with his brain?

I think so, but time will tell.

[68JET11]

If we have an OL that can control the LOS, we solve many problems... 

[WeCantDraftGoodQBs]

9 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

So when AR8 comes back, we don't need help at OL?

If we don’t fix our OL we can expect the same outcome again for AR. It might not happen in the first 4 plays again, but I would be shocked if he wasn’t hurt by the end of our first game next season with our current OL.

[TuscanyTile2]

4 minutes ago, WeCantDraftGoodQBs said:

If we don’t fix our OL we can expect the same outcome again for AR. It might not happen in the first 4 plays again, but I would be shocked if he wasn’t hurt by the end of our first game next season with our current OL.

I agree with you.  I made that comment to challenge T0m's point that "Mahomes and Allen are better protected than Zach Wilson because you can’t blitz Mahomes and Allen without getting torched".  

 

His point is basically:

It's all ZW's fault and that once AR8 comes back, all of our problems on offense will be solved.  We don't need an OL or additional WRs.

[oatmeal]

10 hours ago, Beerfish said:

I am gloomy, I just have not seen anything from the whole Rodgers thing to be a positive at all.

In his very small exhibition play he did not look totally great, in his only 4 plays he looked shell shocked and froze. 

His play fell off a lot his last year with the packers.

Will we be better with him at QB than ZAch and the awful backup crew?  Yes.  I just do not see a good story to this whole episode.

The Hackett love is bewildering and terrible.  The guy is a brutally terrible oc.

On to the draft!

When is the combine?  Mid February?

@Beerfish is on a epic roll, yall need to really read this again 👆👆👆👆👆

[Augustiniak]

3 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I agree with you.  I made that comment to challenge T0m's point that "Mahomes and Allen are better protected than Zach Wilson because you can’t blitz Mahomes and Allen without getting torched".  

 

His point is basically:

It's all ZW's fault and that once AR8 comes back, all of our problems on offense will be solved.  We don't need an OL or additional WRs.

The better the qb the worse your skill positions can be on average.  The big question for the jets is, who is the backup qb?  They’ll be competitive with rodgers but not wiht a lot of other qbs

[slimjasi]

10 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

 

 

His point is basically:

It's all ZW's fault and that once AR8 comes back, all of our problems on offense will be solved.  We don't need an OL or additional WRs.

It's not all Zach Wilson's fault. Not even close. It's just that, when you don't have a good QB, that is always the biggest issue you have on offense. 

 

Obviously the Jets also need major upgrades at OL and WR. 

[Jetpain]

Fix all the positions you want, Saleh is getting outcoached by everyone of these other coaches.  Do we honestly think he's game planning or out coaching Andy Reid or Harbaugh or is capable of being a winning playoff coach   ? 

[TuscanyTile2]

2 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

It's not all Zach Wilson's fault. Not even close. It's just that, when you don't have a good QB, that is always the biggest issue you have on offense. 

Obviously the Jets also need major upgrades at OL and WR. 

I agree.  I'm just not willing to say ZW couldn't be a good QB, considering the crap he had to work with last year.  This offseason will obviously be all about upgrading the offense.   If JD feels we badly need to upgrade the OL and weapinzz for a HOF QB then what does that say about what he gave ZW to work with?

[TuscanyTile2]

2 hours ago, Lupz27 said:

Or maybe the O-line was putrid because there was no General out there letting them know their assignments and when they need to change.

How many times do you see Mahomes (yes Rodgerd does the same thing for a decade) literally walk up to the line and scream at his O-line hey 48 is coming not once like 7 times then adjusts the hot route to absolutely expose the open area the blitz came from while one of his O-line guys picks up said blitzer to slow him just enough to get the ball out.

Not one Jets QB could do this since Favre heck maybe he couldn’t even do it might have been Pennington.

They had Mangold who was able to adjust but it’s just not the same if it isn’t coming from the QB.

That is the most important thing Rodgers will bring to this team next season period.

Now will he still be physically capable to play at high level to keep up with his brain?

I think so, but time will tell.

And how much of that is related to coaching?  Btw, how did Mahomes do in that Super Bowl against Tampa when his OL was awful?

[Cut Jet Penalty Makers]

3 hours ago, neckdemon said:

epiphany - a moment of sudden "revelation" or insight

revelation- an act of revealing or communicating divine truth. 

[nj meadowlands]

9 hours ago, Maxman said:

The Jets have a shot at winning the Super Bowl next year. 

We gotta stop with this stuff lol.  How about we aspire to finish 9-8 or better first?

I can't do the Super Bowl hope thing this offseason.  I won't.  No.

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

12 hours ago, Cut Jet Penalty Makers said:

Just watching these playoff games, it's apparent that we are so woefully behind being competitive to the Chiefs, Ravens, Bills, even the Browns in games that really matter. Our offensive schemes, OL, lack of quality receivers, an incompetent GM and HC, poor drafting, a ghastly OC, a 40 year old rickety QB, not to mention Woody. To think that we have even have a sliver of hope that this gets turned around in Rodger's tenure here is delusional. To top it off, we traded away our 2nd rounder and have so many needs and a bloated salary cap with a plethora of dead weight. There's no way we catch up with this regime. at the helm  Prove me wrong.

[rangerous]

12 hours ago, Cut Jet Penalty Makers said:

Just watching these playoff games, it's apparent that we are so woefully behind being competitive to the Chiefs, Ravens, Bills, even the Browns in games that really matter. Our offensive schemes, OL, lack of quality receivers, an incompetent GM and HC, poor drafting, a ghastly OC, a 40 year old rickety QB, not to mention Woody. To think that we have even have a sliver of hope that this gets turned around in Rodger's tenure here is delusional. To top it off, we traded away our 2nd rounder and have so many needs and a bloated salary cap with a plethora of dead weight. There's no way we catch up with this regime. at the helm  Prove me wrong.

Can’t prove anything until they finally get back on the field.  I will say I thought purdy is not an elite qb.  He’s good as long as he has mccaffery running and being his short receiver.  Mahomes is still a magician.  I didn’t see any qb have as much field awareness.  Allen is very good but needs receivers besides diggs.  Goff?  He was killed here when he was drafted but he’s pretty competent. Jackson? The guy is one of the top guys. Stroud?  Not quite there. Love?  Not quite there.  Mayfield? Proved why should’ve been drafted before darnold.

 What does this have to do with the jets?  The jets have a few holes they need to I’ll to get on par with these playoff teams.  But the thing they are missing is an inspirational head coach.  I was watching a Blewitt tape on the Miami game that focused on becton and Tomlinson.  In the tape there was one play where Zach was completely blown up by a helmet to helmet hit yet there was no flag.  Did saleh do anything? I can’t remember but I suspect he did a Bowles cigar store Indian pose.  And this is the thing.  When one of your guys gets blown up like that then you gotta act.  I believe saleh is holding this team back.

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

9 hours ago, Maxman said:

The Jets have a shot at winning the Super Bowl next year. This will be as good as a shot as they have had in a very long time. 

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

12 minutes ago, rangerous said:

Can’t prove anything until they finally get back on the field.  I will say I thought purdy is not an elite qb.  He’s good as long as he has mccaffery running and being his short receiver.  Mahomes is still a magician.  I didn’t see any qb have as much field awareness.  Allen is very good but needs receivers besides diggs.  Goff?  He was killed here when he was drafted but he’s pretty competent. Jackson? The guy is one of the top guys. Stroud?  Not quite there. Love?  Not quite there.  Mayfield? Proved why should’ve been drafted before darnold.

 What does this have to do with the jets?  The jets have a few holes they need to I’ll to get on par with these playoff teams.  But the thing they are missing is an inspirational head coach.  I was watching a Blewitt tape on the Miami game that focused on becton and Tomlinson.  In the tape there was one play where Zach was completely blown up by a helmet to helmet hit yet there was no flag.  Did saleh do anything? I can’t remember but I suspect he did a Bowles cigar store Indian pose.  And this is the thing.  When one of your guys gets blown up like that then you gotta act.  I believe saleh is holding this team back.

Saleh cares about his golf game and not getting fined.

He lacks genuine courage and will never say or do anything meaningful publicly to stand up for anybody but himself if it means sacrificing anything personally.

Bro won’t even eat a 10K fine to stand up for his players / fans / organization after the refs stole that KC game.

He said whatever BS he could think of during the JD CJ Hymie HC Zoom interview to try and get CJ all excited:

“They have to deal with our technique, our violence.”

And that somehow got him the job.

LOL

I mean did they even interview Dan Campbell?

You want to talk about a “leader of men”?

Saleh has been completely exposed as a fraud.

Looks like Tarzan, coaches like Joe Walton.

[jetspenguin]

To go with your wine

 

[bonkertons]

Yeah I dunno.  We already went to back to back AFCC games with Woody as the owner.  Granted it was forever ago, but it still happened.  Not sure if we'll ever win anything while he runs things, but at the very ******* least we should be able to make the playoffs next year.  Health is really our biggest problem, even moreso than our needs at OL and WR.  I'm pretty confident those will all be addressed.  Even just one big signing and a top-10 pick should put us way above where we were this past season.  What I'm not confident in is Rodgers and AVT staying healthy next year(and our success depends on those two guys).

 

We're due for some luck in the health department.

[Sperm Edwards]

32 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

And how much of that is related coaching?  Btw, how did Mahomes do in that Super Bowl against Tampa when his OL was awful?

Meh you're talking about one game under extreme circumstances, and the most extreme example isn't indicative of anything typical.

KC starting 5 backups & backup-types on the OL against the league's top D all playing in a zone, while Brady kept his own D so well-rested, is a tall order for anyone.

When he was merely down to 1 OL starter at LT, plus 4 backups next to each other to his right, Mahomes was still picking the league apart, otherwise losing only 1 game on the whole season through the prior two playoff games.

[Jet Nut]

59 minutes ago, Jetpain said:

Fix all the positions you want, Saleh is getting outcoached by everyone of these other coaches.  Do we honestly think he's game planning or out coaching Andy Reid or Harbaugh or is capable of being a winning playoff coach   ? 

Guess you missed the Jets Chiefs game at MetLife.  

[doitny]

29 minutes ago, rangerous said:

In the tape there was one play where Zach was completely blown up by a helmet to helmet hit yet there was no flag.  Did saleh do anything? I can’t remember but I suspect he did a Bowles cigar store Indian pose.  And this is the thing.  When one of your guys gets blown up like that then you gotta act.  I believe saleh is holding this team back.

i dont remember that play but i have seen Saleh blow up on the sidelines plenty of times when a call goes against us.

the "cigar store indian pose" is when our guys make a penalty to screw us. 

i dont think he is holding us back. he definitely isnt holding the defense back.

he should get more credit than he does. 7 wins with Zach, Boyle and Sieman is a accomplishment. 

Zach was 30th in QBR. the guys around him were...

32th Young 2-14

31th Mac 2-9

29th Howell 4-13

28th Dobbs 3-9

27th Pickett 7-5

26th Ridder 6-7

25th O Connell 5-5

24th Levis 3-6

how can you win with such a bad QB. nobody can except for Tomlin. Zach was holding everyone back. next year it will be different. 

[GangGreened]

Too much “just fix the o line” 

If Douglas was capable, he would have by now. Keeping Keith Carter around isn’t going to help matters either.

[PepPep]

12 hours ago, Cut Jet Penalty Makers said:

Just watching these playoff games, it's apparent that we are so woefully behind being competitive to the Chiefs, Ravens, Bills, even the Browns in games that really matter. Our offensive schemes, OL, lack of quality receivers, an incompetent GM and HC, poor drafting, a ghastly OC, a 40 year old rickety QB, not to mention Woody. To think that we have even have a sliver of hope that this gets turned around in Rodger's tenure here is delusional. To top it off, we traded away our 2nd rounder and have so many needs and a bloated salary cap with a plethora of dead weight. There's no way we catch up with this regime. at the helm  Prove me wrong.

This could be true. It could not. 

The Jets beat the Bills with Zach while Allen played. To suggest that somehow that game didn't matter to the Bills and so they did not play as hard as they did against the chiefs in the playoffs is preposterous. 

The Jets SHOULD have beat the Chiefs is they were not robbed by the refs. TWO of the worst calls this season. Of many. Again, with Zach. I say again, to suggest that THAT game didn't matter as much to the Chiefs - also preposterous. The Jets did not play the Ravens this season. But if I was to guess, they would have probably hung in there until the half because of their defense and ended up losing because they could not score any points down the stretch. The Jets beat the Eagles, how easily we forget. Still a good team. The Browns beat up on the deflated Jets with Siemian starting. So I'll give you that. But the way they were bounced from the playoffs, I'm also not using the Browns as much of a measuring stick for what a great should be. 

WILL the Jets be competitive with the likes of the Ravens, Chiefs and Bills next year? Maybe. CAN they? Absolutely, positively, definitely they can. I think people forget how dangerous Rodgers is in this awful offensive system. Why? Because he IS the offensive system. It's built that way and the reason most other QBs fail in it. You just have to get him one more weapon and protect him. The defense is already there. You don't need coaching. He IS the coach on offense. Coaching is there to support him and coach the rest of the team (specials, defense, critical judgement calls), Rodgers will run the offense and make adjustments on the fly. 

JD just needs to bring in the big uglies to protect Rodgers and add a QB2 and playmaker. We have two solid o-linemen (yes, I'm counting AVT even though he is coming off injury) and some decent depth. We have a high draft pick. JD can and HAS to do it. Then this team will be competitive against EVERY other team in the NFL. 

[Wit]

Being that most of the teams left have high powered offenses with young, explosive QBs other than Goff, that’s not a stretch. However, we can’t find one of those. So I’ll take this.


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[Biggs]

12 hours ago, Hex said:

You saw the time to throw for Allen and Mahomes. OL is everything.

Did you see how big and athletic Allen and Mahomes are?   Take a look at the 4 teams left.  QB's in their prime, great offensive lines.  Detroit has a less mobile QB than the other 3 teams but they also have invested in a great OL and a two back offense.

Rodgers is going to be 41 by the time next years playoffs come around.  He's coming off a major injury.  He's less mobile and less protected than any of the 4 teams remaining in the NFL championship games.  

Not to mention the quality of the HC's left in the 4 remaining games. 

OL isn't everything.  It's certainly something.  The Jets don't have the OL, don't have the number of weapons, don't have the mobility at QB and don't have the HC and staffing to compete for a SB.

They also set up a culture this year.  Mulligan for everyone 4 plays into the season.  

 

[Augustiniak]

7 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Did you see how big and athletic Allen and Mahomes are?   Take a look at the 4 teams left.  QB's in their prime, great offensive lines.  Detroit has a less mobile QB than the other 3 teams but they also have invested in a great OL and a two back offense.

Rodgers is going to be 41 by the time next years playoffs come around.  He's coming off a major injury.  He's less mobile and less protected than any of the 4 teams remaining in the NFL championship games.  

Not to mention the quality of the HC's left in the 4 remaining games. 

OL isn't everything.  It's certainly something.  The Jets don't have the OL, don't have the number of weapons, don't have the mobility at QB and don't have the HC and staffing to compete for a SB.

They also set up a culture this year.  Mulligan for everyone 4 plays into the season.  

 

The jets model is flawed b/c rodgers is too immobile and the OL isn’t close to being able to protect someone like that.  Even if rodgers plays 12 games next year and goes 8-4, they still need a backup qb and ideally someone who can move.  But these playoff teams have built good OLs and also have OCs who can scheme guys open.  

[Alka]

2 hours ago, Lupz27 said:

Or maybe the O-line was putrid because there was no General out there letting them know their assignments and when they need to change.

How many times do you see Mahomes (yes Rodgerd does the same thing for a decade) literally walk up to the line and scream at his O-line hey 48 is coming not once like 7 times then adjusts the hot route to absolutely expose the open area the blitz came from while one of his O-line guys picks up said blitzer to slow him just enough to get the ball out.

Not one Jets QB could do this since Favre heck maybe he couldn’t even do it might have been Pennington.

They had Mangold who was able to adjust but it’s just not the same if it isn’t coming from the QB.

That is the most important thing Rodgers will bring to this team next season period.

Now will he still be physically capable to play at high level to keep up with his brain?

I think so, but time will tell.

I hear your argument but still disagree.  Rodgers got sacked an average of 2 times per game in 2022, and that was with a much better offensive line than the Jets had.  Yes, he is more decisive than who we had, but not as mobile as Mahomes is, and even with his being a much better QB than Zach or anyone on the Jets, the end result is that the Jets maybe win 2 more games, and end up 9-8, missing the playoffs once again.

[bitonti]

10 hours ago, Maxman said:

This team has flaws for sure. They get the offseason to fix them. Backup QB, fix the oline and WR2.

That is as short of a needs list as the Jets have had in 50 years.

Yeah dude but they need 3 linemen 

[TuscanyTile2]

29 minutes ago, doitny said:

i dont remember that play but i have seen Saleh blow up on the sidelines plenty of times when a call goes against us.

the "cigar store indian pose" is when our guys make a penalty to screw us. 

i dont think he is holding us back. he definitely isnt holding the defense back.

he should get more credit than he does. 7 wins with Zach, Boyle and Sieman is a accomplishment. 

Zach was 30th in QBR. the guys around him were...

32th Young 2-14

31th Mac 2-9

29th Howell 4-13

28th Dobbs 3-9

27th Pickett 7-5

26th Ridder 6-7

25th O Connell 5-5

24th Levis 3-6

how can you win with such a bad QB. nobody can except for Tomlin. Zach was holding everyone back. next year it will be different. 

But if JD spends all offseason upgrading the offense (tbd if that happens), despite knowing AR8 is going to be back next year then what does it say about what he thinks of the supporting cast that ZW played under this past year?

In other words, if the only problem was ZW then there would be no reason to feel like he'd need to badly upgrade the rest of the offense.

[TuscanyTile2]

47 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Meh you're talking about one game under extreme circumstances, and the most extreme example isn't indicative of anything typical.

KC starting 5 backups & backup-types on the OL against the league's top D all playing in a zone, while Brady kept his own D so well-rested, is a tall order for anyone.

When he was merely down to 1 OL starter at LT, plus 4 backups next to each other to his right, Mahomes was still picking the league apart, otherwise losing only 1 game on the whole season through the prior two playoff games.

So does that mean that if AR8 has only a healthy AVT and Tippmann, we don't need an upgrade of the OL?

[Jet2020]

13 hours ago, Cut Jet Penalty Makers said:

Just watching these playoff games, it's apparent that we are so woefully behind being competitive to the Chiefs, Ravens, Bills, even the Browns in games that really matter. Our offensive schemes, OL, lack of quality receivers, an incompetent GM and HC, poor drafting, a ghastly OC, a 40 year old rickety QB, not to mention Woody. To think that we have even have a sliver of hope that this gets turned around in Rodger's tenure here is delusional. To top it off, we traded away our 2nd rounder and have so many needs and a bloated salary cap with a plethora of dead weight. There's no way we catch up with this regime. at the helm  Prove me wrong.

We had KC beat with our garbage team if it wasn’t for a couple of boneheaded fumbles. Yeah, those games matter cuz that’s how you reach the playoffs to begin with. It’s important we stay healthy. That’s the key. We have no depth. If our depth doesn’t get tested, this offense and defense is capable of winning in January. Just need to get a #2 WR and maybe an extra dependable versatile OL to provide depth support. 

Again, injuries need to be minimal and last few years, we’ve had really bad luck. Law of averages suggest we should be healthier next year.