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Starting to Warm up to keeping Sam, Trading to 4 and taking Pitts (plus other draft assets)


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At first glance when I saw this on Kipers Mock, I was like, HELL NO!.   Then I started to think about it a bit.  Give Sam a weapon like Pitts plus Mims with a season under his belt.  Plus the addition

There have been two TE's drafted top 10 in the last decade, and both were by the Lions. No TE has ever been drafted top 5. This seems unlikely.

You simply do not have to commit to Darnold long term this year.  Most people on here feel he is totally shot but you would know for sure next year if the gase factor is real or not. You can

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8 minutes ago, y2k8 said:

You take the guy that you believe is the best pass catcher / offensive weapon available and you don't worry if that guy is a TE.

I get the draft history issue at the position but it's also less relevant given how modern offenses are being run. The position is far more valuable than it was 10 years ago.

I didn't want to call out anyone but IMHO this guy is the best receiving weapon in the draft.  Calling him a TE is just not observant.  

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Unless we’re getting Watson, I’d also prefer to stick with Darnold and build up the rest of the roster.
And I like the idea of Pitts in a trade down, but that’s if we make a move with Carolina dropping down to #8.
If we’re just dropping back two spots, then grab Smith/Chase.

IMO best case would be to trade back to 4, have fields slip to that spot and trade back again with a team like the panthers. Hell, I’d even trade back again to the 10-13 range and make my selection there. Guys like Pitts, Wyatt Davis, Vera Tucker, Paye and Bateman are all gonna still be sitting there. Gaining a few more 1sts, 2nds and 3rds while still coming away with a great plAyer would be the best reason to keep Sam.
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4 hours ago, GREENBEAN said:


IMO best case would be to trade back to 4, have fields slip to that spot and trade back again with a team like the panthers. Hell, I’d even trade back again to the 10-13 range and make my selection there. Guys like Pitts, Wyatt Davis, Vera Tucker, Paye and Bateman are all gonna still be sitting there. Gaining a few more 1sts, 2nds and 3rds while still coming away with a great plAyer would be the best reason to keep Sam.

I wouldn’t be overly shocked if fields fell to 23

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12 hours ago, Tranquilo said:

Also, some teams have him slotted as a WR. Can’t go wrong with Pitts.

I like Pitts too.  He’s a cross between Plaxico Burress and Evan Engram

 

but this draft is LOADED at WR.  All we have to do is see who falls to 23 there will be like 4-5 guys who are all going to good in the nfl

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6 hours ago, GREENBEAN said:


IMO best case would be to trade back to 4, have fields slip to that spot and trade back again with a team like the panthers. Hell, I’d even trade back again to the 10-13 range and make my selection there. Guys like Pitts, Wyatt Davis, Vera Tucker, Paye and Bateman are all gonna still be sitting there. Gaining a few more 1sts, 2nds and 3rds while still coming away with a great plAyer would be the best reason to keep Sam.

There’s another big positive to keeping Darnold that seemingly everyone is overlooking.

Say the draft comes and goes and Watson still hasn’t been traded.

If the Jets retain Darnold and move down with a team like Carolina, they could very realistically have three 1st round picks and two 2nd rounders in their back pocket in next years draft.

If you roll the dice on Wilson or Fields, that’s it. You’re out of the Watson sweepstakes. You’re committed to one of them for at least the next 3 years.

Hanging on to Darnold and moving down still gives you plenty of flexibility.

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At first glance when I saw this on Kipers Mock, I was like, HELL NO!.   Then I started to think about it a bit.  Give Sam a weapon like Pitts plus Mims with a season under his belt.  Plus the additional draft capital that can be used to add OL, RB and perhaps another receiver, especially if Crowder is traded or released.   We could also address the CB/Edge positions as well.   Maybe sign another vet quarterback to back up Sam and Morgan.   If Sam proves that he is just not the guy, we will still have 2 first round picks in 2022 plus whatever other assets and can focus on finding our quarterback in that draft whiling having a much better all around team for him to play for.    We might even have some additional trade possibilities available this time next year.   
Bottom line is we could build a really formidable team and if we are lucky, Sam shows signs of being that franchise quarterback we thought he was and if not, we are still in position to go get one next year.  


Great trade to 4. Now trade down and stay in the top 10. Maybe Carolina? We would get several picks with two trades and still pick in the top 10.


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Zach wilson is Drew Brees and Russell Wilson in one.   I have been watching tons if film on him , he is super accurate qb , can scramble,  and strong arm.  It will be a mistake to pass on him!!  He will make 20m less then Darnold and make players around him better ,  Darnold needs players to make him better.   Trade Darnold.  And if some how Pitts falls in draft to top 15 trade up for him. 

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21 hours ago, JetBlue said:

At first glance when I saw this on Kipers Mock, I was like, HELL NO!.   Then I started to think about it a bit.  Give Sam a weapon like Pitts plus Mims with a season under his belt.  Plus the additional draft capital that can be used to add OL, RB and perhaps another receiver, especially if Crowder is traded or released.   We could also address the CB/Edge positions as well.   Maybe sign another vet quarterback to back up Sam and Morgan.   If Sam proves that he is just not the guy, we will still have 2 first round picks in 2022 plus whatever other assets and can focus on finding our quarterback in that draft whiling having a much better all around team for him to play for.    We might even have some additional trade possibilities available this time next year.   

Bottom line is we could build a really formidable team and if we are lucky, Sam shows signs of being that franchise quarterback we thought he was and if not, we are still in position to go get one next year.  

I think there is a very good chance JD/Saleh go this route (retain Sam, trade down, and I'll add.....draft Defense as much or more than Offense).

I also think expecting the worst QB of the past three years to suddenly be a legit franchise QB, is very, very unlikely.

Basically means 2021, like all the years before it, is just a kick the can wasted season. 

And we'll be back here again in 2022 talking about which QB to draft, except we won't be picking #2, we'll more likely be #12 or #14 or the like.

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I think the Texans will realize that Fields is their next QB, and eventually will take the 2nd or 3rd pick to grab him and move on from Watson.  

I don’t think the Jets want Fields, so it is just a question of whether the Dolphins do the trade and Fields is there at 3, which I think is likely.   The Dolphins have a much better roster than the Jets, and Ross is a businessperson.  They can trade for Watson and be decent next year, and fill the stadium.  

For JD, it is a bit of game theory.  If Wilson tests well and shows the athleticism and size to be an NFL QB, I don’t know how you pass on him.  If there are not any red flags, if you pick him and he does not work out, I think people understand.  Of all of Macc’s bad moves, people are not really holding Darnold against him.  If JD passes on Wilson and he ends up to be a pro bowl (not all pro) QB, JD is toast. 

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19 minutes ago, varjet said:

If JD passes on Wilson and he ends up to be a pro bowl (not all pro) QB, JD is toast. 

If JD trades Sam Darnold to a playoff team where he becomes a star that's somehow worse than whatever happens to the non Trevor qbs in this draft 

One could make the argument that Mahomes would have busted here. But having a player and writing him off too early is a bigger risk for nfl gm. 

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20 hours ago, nycdan said:

If, worst case, the draft went (in any order) Trevor, Fields, Wilson, Sewell, Chase, Pitts, Waddle - would you take Smith at 8 and would you be happy with that?

I get most people think he's a stick, but he did play in the SEC, so I don't think I'd have a problem taking him with the 8th if he was still there.

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22 hours ago, Beerfish said:

You simply do not have to commit to Darnold long term this year. 

Most people on here feel he is totally shot but you would know for sure next year if the gase factor is real or not.

You can still trade darnold this year if you wish and still trade down.  There are placeholder QBs out there,

I'd rather have one of the top end Wr's than Pitts.

People feel you MUST get Watson or you MUST draft a QB at #2.  You do not have to do either and you can punt Darnold if you wish as well.

Have a good draft, add draft assets for next year, build the team and then add the final piece that being the QB.

I agree that you don't HAVE to take a QB at #2 or go after Watson. I agree that you don't HAVE to commit to Darnold if you decide not to draft a QB this year and that there are placeholders as you say.

HOWEVER, you don't address the biggest issue and that is how do you add that final, most critical piece- the QB. It's THE most important part of the offense. You can't just assume you will be able to trade up and snag a talented QB next year or the year after and he will work out. You can't just assume a great option at QB will hit FA. You can't just assume you will be able to trade for a great option at QB. Can you really rely on the model of "one of these Pro Bowl caliber vet QBs will be available and we will sign or trade for them"? Seems short-sighted to me. I know it worked with Tampa but I really view that as an outlier. I don't think the Colts had that much success with Rivers, I don't think Tenn had that much success with Tannenhill (in the grand scheme of things- that team was loaded and they were shut down in the wildcard). Now we shall see if it works for the Rams. They don't have much of a window.  

The Jets are in a good position but one of the worst ways things can go is if they build a solid team through the draft but fail to address the QB position and spend the next 3-4 years in mediocrity as they search for a legit FQB- going from placeholder to failed experiment to placeholder and so on. By taking a QB at #2 at least they are taking a legit shot at having one from the get go of Saleh's tenure. By getting Watson they immediately address the position and fast-forward the rebuild by light years, even if they have to give up 3 first rounders over the course of 2-3 upcoming drafts. 

 

*Disclaimer:

1. Obviously if JD does not believe Wilson/Fields/Lance have great NFL FQB potential the Jets should not take a QB 'just to take a QB'. 

2. By no means do I think the Jets should give up 'all of their draft assets' for Watson. However, I also don't think 3 first rounders, with the draft capital they have over the next 3 drafts is even close to 'all of their draft assets'.  And they should still have plenty of draft picks to build around Watson. Especially if they can net a 2nd rounder for Darnold. If the cost is something absurd like 3 first rounders, Quinnen, two second rounders and another defensive starter then I'm going to pass because that really does hurt the teams ability to build around Watson while fielding a competitive defense.  

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18 hours ago, Bronx said:

#4 has to be Sewell if we are rolling with Sam. 

The key to there is that you then release Fant, so from a cap perspective you break even-its a cap free 1st round pick.  

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3 hours ago, Warfish said:

I think there is a very good chance JD/Saleh go this route (retain Sam, trade down, and I'll add.....draft Defense as much or more than Offense).

I also think expecting the worst QB of the past three years to suddenly be a legit franchise QB, is very, very unlikely.

Basically means 2021, like all the years before it, is just a kick the can wasted season. 

And we'll be back here again in 2022 talking about which QB to draft, except we won't be picking #2, we'll more likely be #12 or #14 or the like.

Valid points no doubt but I would not call it a wasted season.  Even if he doesn't become a Franchise quarterback but shows decent improvement, we can still move him for a pick or two.  We still have Morgan who could surprise. 

I would personally expect this team to load up on offense as this is a offense driven league and still have enough assets to address the defense as well (plus free agency).  I mean what would be the point of bringing back Sam or even drafting a quarterback if you are not going to try to put the best pieces around him.  

Plus the quarterback that could be available at 12 might be a better player or fit for us than whomever we would have taken at 2 this year. We all talk about how many of the top quarterbacks were not even top 10 picks.  Every year is so different when it comes to quarterback prospects.     One thing is sure; whomever the quarterback is, he will have a much more talented team around him.  

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I'd rather take Devonta Smith at 4. Many people claim he's the best collegiate receiver they've ever seen. Pitts is an excellent selection just not at 4......

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I think there is a very good chance JD/Saleh go this route (retain Sam, trade down, and I'll add.....draft Defense as much or more than Offense).
I also think expecting the worst QB of the past three years to suddenly be a legit franchise QB, is very, very unlikely.
Basically means 2021, like all the years before it, is just a kick the can wasted season. 
And we'll be back here again in 2022 talking about which QB to draft, except we won't be picking #2, we'll more likely be #12 or #14 or the like.
In today's NFL you don't finish near the top half of the league with the worst QB in the league. If Sam really is that bad, they'll be picking in the top 5 again. And with the ammo they have and the fact that 4 or 5 QB-needy teams will have drafted a round 1 QB this year, they should be able to move up and grab someone- and hopefully they'll be able to put him in a better position after 2021 draft + FA.
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Been thinking about this option (drafting Pitts in the top 4), and I've decided that I'm squarely in favor of taking Chase, or Smith instead of Pitts if we trade down - unless it's around pick 8 or so. Been thinking that Pat Freiermuth at the top of Round 2 makes a lot more sense. If Sewell somehow were to slip to 4-6 range that'd be ok too.

Roll with Sam again with WR Chase, WR Smith-Schuster, WR Mims and TE Freiermuth, and maybe a RB Javonte Williams or Carter in the 3rd - draft the best OT/OG available at 23 + OG Thuney. Offense fixed. Sounds good to me.

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11 hours ago, Jamax99 said:

Zach wilson is Drew Brees and Russell Wilson in one.   I have been watching tons if film on him , he is super accurate qb , can scramble,  and strong arm.  It will be a mistake to pass on him!!  He will make 20m less then Darnold and make players around him better ,  Darnold needs players to make him better.   Trade Darnold.  And if some how Pitts falls in draft to top 15 trade up for him. 

He’s super accurate facing University of Reno.  Awesome 

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6 hours ago, NYJ1 said:

Not necessarily.We could use FA to address OL

There’s no one in FA or the draft even close to Sewell

 

Sewell is better than Becton and Becton is a stud

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5 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

There’s no one in FA or the draft even close to Sewell

 

Sewell is better than Becton and Becton is a stud

It's so weird to see descriptions of a guy who skipped this whole year making him out to be Anthony Munoz.  Not saying he won't be, but it really is a weird year.

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27 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

There’s no one in FA or the draft even close to Sewell

 

Sewell is better than Becton and Becton is a stud

Grow up under high tension power lines did we? 

He’s no where near the physically imposing or talent as Becton. 

Hasn’t played in a year.

Stop.


 

 

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24 minutes ago, nycdan said:

It's so weird to see descriptions of a guy who skipped this whole year making him out to be Anthony Munoz.  Not saying he won't be, but it really is a weird year.

It’s moronic. 

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