What are the Long Term Pieces of the Jets Offense Already In-Hand?

[HighPitch]

Wilson?

avt

becton

carter

mims?

and after this draft:

C tyler linderbaum

TE jaylen windermeyer

[Green Ghost]

6 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

Were you entertained by our Orange win over the undefeated Hoosiers last night? ?

Yes I was!

we needed it, especially after last weeks “tournament” performances.

[Long Island Leprechaun]

Draft Neal at Left Tackle. Move Becton to Right Tackle. Giant bookends. Pick up a Right Guard or Center in a later round. You've got a dominant OL for the future.

[Greenbloodblitz]

30 minutes ago, KRL said:

QB - Wilson, White
RB - Carter, Johnson, Walter(??? Familiar with the system, Darren Sproles type)
FB - Bawden
WR - Davis, Moore, Berrios, Mims(???)
TE - Yeboah
OL - Becton, Vera-Tucker, McGovern, Laurent-Tardiff, Fant   

 

25 minutes ago, slats said:

Ty Johnson is under contract for 2022 and an RFA after that. I'd resign Coleman and Berrios. Fant is signed thru next year, I’d extend him, too. They have some players to work with. 

I agree with this and overall I don't think we have a bad Offense. In fact we have a locker room full of stand-up guys for the most part. Douglas and Saleh are building with high character, smart and tough guys.

They're easy to root for. Come on man Elijah Moore? Michael Carter? For all the guys that were crapping on George Fant, you don't hear his name much, as an O'lineman that means he's doing his job.

Obviously Zach needs to learn how to put a little touch on the ball and the game really hasn't slowed down for him yet. I think he's hyper intelligent and in that way maybe he's his own worst enemy? You can't buy experience.

OP said this is about the offense, but I like all three phases. I think we got good players all around not that we're by any means complete or done yet.

First you crawl, then you walk, then you run. Like Steven Tyler said you got to lose to learn how to win. Saleh says this every week.

It's frustrating for all of us including the players, the stupid mistakes, injuries etc. I think they've got a good plan and I think they're going to grow up together.

 

[Barry McCockinner]

27 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

Not bad just Uhhhh, errrr, baby…

 

 

Crusher when someone posts about Becton:

[Hael]

Has anyone noticed the alarming tendency by fans to overvalue their 1st year players and of course to completely write off their 2nd-3rd year guys.

This thread this time last year would have said (with great certainty) that Becton, Perrine and Mims were guaranteed studs.

It wasn't too long ago that Hansen, Steward and McGuire were the future Moss, Welker and Emmitt Smiths.

[IndianaJet]

If Wilson, Carter, Moore, AVT and Becton become young studs, that's more then you can ask for.  You build around those guys.

You simply cannot field an NFL team with superstars at every position.  Find your five guys and then work around them.

 

[The Crusher]

53 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Crusher when someone posts about Becton:

Is that soft serve?

[Hex]

Fant could also be long term depending on contract crap. He's impressed everybody, and apparently himself too, because he compared his job as pitching with the wrong arm.

[Warfish]

1 hour ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Crusher when someone posts about Becton:

Becton.....or Bacon?

@The Crusher

[jetstream23]

9 minutes ago, Warfish said:

QB - Wilson, TBD?

RB - Carter perhaps?  Anyone else?

WR - Moore?  Berrios as the Returner+bottom of roster WR?  Anyone else?

OL- AVT seems likely.  Becton, opinions seems split of long-term/health.  Are any of the others long-termers foundations at this point?

TE - ?  No one yet?

In terms of future-planning for a successful, top-10 type productive Offense, what pieces do you think we already have in-place to build around?

 

Good thread idea.  The question you're really asking is what percentage of this rebuild could realistically be considered complete, and I think that's fair at this point.

On offense there seems to be no doubt that AVT, Moore and Carter are keepers and starting caliber, perhaps much more than that in the cases of the first two guys.  With regard to Carter I do get the sense that his value as a RB lies more in his fit for the system than his outright talent.  Let's face it, if he was a blockbuster talent he wouldn't have slipped to Day 3.  That said, he's quick, he's tough for his size, and he goes where the play is designed to go.... three things this coaching staff wants!  Similarly, Ty Johnson is a good fit as well.  I think both are keepers.

Besides Moore at WR, it's clear that Davis is a hired gun for a couple years and is really more like an elite WR2 than a WR1.  Just my opinion.  Keelan Cole is similar, solid veteran and a WR2/3 type guy.  I think the WR group is solid but Crowder will depart, Mims may never be more than a WR5 to this coaching staff and Berrios ideally is a backup slot WR and punt returner.  What this all means to me is that the Jets should still be in the WR market, maybe even on Day 2 of the Draft.

TE needs a talent infusion.  I'd both draft a guy and add one in FA.

The OLine is a bit muddy but at least stable at the moment.  Becton concerns me.  Love the talent but will he ever play more than 8-12 games per year?  Fant has been excellent but has just one more year under contract.  Moses will be a FA.  LDT looks promising but is he the longterm answer.... or are we simply excited that he's better than GVR?  I think the Jets need to add both an OT and a future Center.

QB is the most important question and is a true TBD.

So, the question I asked above about how rebuilt the offense is... the answer is 54.5%.

 

 

[UntouchableCrew]

1 hour ago, Hael said:

Has anyone noticed the alarming tendency by fans to overvalue their 1st year players and of course to completely write off their 2nd-3rd year guys.

This thread this time last year would have said (with great certainty) that Becton, Perrine and Mims were guaranteed studs.

It wasn't too long ago that Hansen, Steward and McGuire were the future Moss, Welker and Emmitt Smiths.

Well larger sample sizes give you more information.

Granted, I think the people writing off Becton are premature, even if the injuries are scary. Mims is just an issue of the coaching staff. It's a new regime and they clearly hate him. Nobody ever though Perine was a stud.

[CSNY]

One person that we are overlooking is Mike LaFluer. When experienced QBs where under center offense moved the ball effectively  It looks like his offensive schemes will be successful let’s all hope Zach is the one to run it for quite a long time 

[TuscanyTile2]

[JohnnyLV]

Moore is a foundational piece.

Zach will be a foundational piece or everything blows up anyway

AVT is a foundational piece

Fant should be offered an extension at plugged in full time at LT. (I doubt JD does this and will force Becton back in and Fant will go back to RT where he is less effective as a lame duck)

That's pretty much it. I still focus on offense and try and create the best OL possible. The best teams in football have elite QBs and good to great OL. This idea that we are close to complete on offense especially OL is bonkers. Yeah we put up some big yards in utter blowouts where they essentially stopped playind defense.

We have essentially no TEs.

I hear people say "you can get guards and centers later" yet the teams that invest in G and C early seem to have more long term OL success.

Other than Moore what long term receivers do we really have? I am offense heavy early again. Pick up some defensive pieces in FA, draft some linebackers and corners in middle rounds. Depending on position it seems there could be a cant pass defensive player with our first pick and that is fine.

[The Crusher]

29 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Becton.....or Bacon?

@The Crusher

Both!

[JoeDouglasFart]

3 hours ago, jetscanes331 said:

I'm not worried about Becton in the slightest

Agree. He won't be seeing the field as much. 

[varjet]

OL:

Fant-under contract for 2022 and can play LT or RT.  Would keep at LT.

AVT-done at LG

CM-under contract for 2022.  I would not assume drafting Linderbaum unless he is there in the second round.  When was the last time a 280 lb C was drafted top 10?  Any C?

LDT- NOT under contract.  If he looks good the rest of the season I would extend him.   The more players helpful to ZW that can be locked up without needing to draft or rely on the FA market (the Jets have not done well the last few years on FA OL), the better.

Becton-I would bring him back to RT and see how he does.  He can move to LT if Fant falters or gets hurt.   The question is whether we need Moses too.  He may be too expensive.  

FA/Draft-I think the call is value players who can play C, RG, RT in 2023 and beyond, and compete.  

QB:

ZW-will get another full year as the anointed starter.  If he fails the season goes down the tubes and JD/RS get fired early.

MW-do we tender him $millions to keep him as backup/competition or try for another FA/competition.  I don't know the answer to this one.  

FA/Draft-could see another QB.  I am not feeling they draft one.

RB:

MC-stays, but he is being overused and won't be around when the Jets are supposed to be good.

Others-the Jets need more of these in FA and the draft, which is why I think we should extend LDT and maybe Moses.

WR:

EM, CD, DM (gets another real change), BB (why not).

FA/Draft-I would expect that the Jets could sign a serious WR and maybe draft one.

TE:

Just find more players.  More players to draft (see OL), but TEs typically take a while to develop.  Could see the Jets spend real money on TEs like NEP did.  That is why NEP did it. 

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

4 hours ago, Augustiniak said:

Fluke injuries do occur, but bechton was bad prior to that anyway.  I think one of the interesting draft debates here will be, should the jets take Neal from Alabama if he’s clearly BAP.

When was Becton bad?   In practices in shorts this preseason based on tweets from beat writers?  He was good last season.  You can argue that he has been injury prone, but the injury this season was from a player falling on the back of his leg and would have put every single NFL lineman on the shelf.  He has not been bad in games that count though.  That is just a false narrative.

[jgb]

4 minutes ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

When was Becton bad?   In practices in shorts this preseason based on tweets from beat writers?  He was good last season.  You can argue that he has been injury prone, but the injury this season was from a player falling on the back of his leg and would have put every single NFL lineman on the shelf.  He has not been bad in games that count though.  That is just a false narrative.

Big men heal slow from lower body injuries. Someone (@kevinc855?) opined immediately after the injury we wouldn't see Becton again this year.

[munchmemory]

5 hours ago, Uncle Nicco said:

Moore is a piece,  he’s not a #1 target. This team is desperately missing a big go to reliable target. Mahomes and Allen can literally lock in to Kelce and Diggs for critical downs. We need that 

Thank you.  Dead on.   Imagine this team with Evans and Godwin as #'s 1 and 2 with Moore as 3?    That level of talent is scary/impressive.   Moore with the current group of receivers will get lost in wash.

[CanadienJetsFan]

WR: we need a deep threat to spread the field. Not sure he’s on the roster 

TE: this is the sore spot. We actually need 2 big and fast studs. That’s not asking for much, lol

OL: Fant has really impressed and to me, he’s earned a starting spot at tackle,  Probably RT.  The LVT experiment is still in progress at RG. He would have to be re-signed. Maybe they won’t want to pay and would rather draft a guard. So, I’ll put this in the TBD 

back up QB: I think they’ll bring in a Case Keenum type back. It’ll cost some bucks though.

In the end, it all comes down to  Zach.  Good QBs make mediocre players around him better.

[Vudu]

I like KEELAN Cole

[Jethead]

Biggest hole by far on offense is at TE. I expect a FA acquisition and a high draft pick (top 4). I also think we will take a WR in our top 4 draft picks. Also think we need a power RB to add to the stable, maybe 3rd rounder. Hopw we find a way to keep Fant and Moses, add another developmental OL.

Spent the rest of our $ and picks on Defense.

 

 

[rangerous]

i think you need to define how long long term is.  is it 2 seasons? 3? 4?  i think if we're talking 3 seasons, on offense there's carter, avt, wilson, becton and moore.  maybe the doc, mcgovern, ty johnson.  the rest they'll be moving on from.  so in the next 2 seasons they need to pick up a tackle and guard/center, te, wr and then the cycle starts right over again.

[TuscanyTile2]

1 minute ago, rangerous said:

i think you need to define how long long term is.  is it 2 seasons? 3? 4?  i think if we're talking 3 seasons, on offense there's carter, avt, wilson, becton and moore.  maybe the doc, mcgovern, ty johnson.  the rest they'll be moving on from.  so in the next 2 seasons they need to pick up a tackle and guard/center, te, wr and then the cycle starts right over again.

This is the argument to just trade down and acquire more picks (and keep doing that every year).  That allows us to replace pieces each year as needed.  And it also reinforces the importance of Zach living up to billing.  If the strength of your team is depth, you're going to lose players as it comes time for their 2nd contracts.  You can (and have to) pay your QB but, once he's on his 2nd contract, you lose flexibility to re-sign your other players.

[Doggin94it]

5 hours ago, Beerfish said:

I keep whining about this one issue, the jets were doing well on the offensive rebuild after a decade or more of neglect.  After taking a pass rusher with their 1st pick we are set up to add another high end oline, add one of he better tight ends and perhaps a good wr after.

 

then along comes our atrocious defense for our defenscentirc head coach and all that is going to go out the window.  We will be drafting ilbs and safeties this coming draft when we should keep going offense.  That is my fear.

 

Have we added some good players on O?  yes, are we done?  no

The reality is that our needs on defense are not actually that wearing. We need to get better at linebacker and safety which are two of the easiest positions to draft or find in free agency. I doubt we'll be spending premium pics there

[jgb]

2 minutes ago, Doggin94it said:

The reality is that our needs on defense are not actually that wearing. We need to get better at linebacker and safety which are two of the easiest positions to draft or find in free agency. I doubt we'll be spending premium pics there

Maybe I'm in the minority but I think our defense is much farther from being fixed than our O. I really do we believe we are competent or better QB play away from being entertaining and competitive on offense. The defense, bigger project IMHO.

[Beerfish]

31 minutes ago, Doggin94it said:

The reality is that our needs on defense are not actually that wearing. We need to get better at linebacker and safety which are two of the easiest positions to draft or find in free agency. I doubt we'll be spending premium pics there

I hope you are right mccganan seemed to think they were prime postilions.

[#27TheDominator]

I think everybody is blowing the TE thing way out of proportion.  Will they have a new TE next year?  I'm sure at least one.  Do I think it is a huge hole?  Nah.  I think it is more important to get another playmaker.  Doesn't matter if it is WR, RB or TE.  I tend to think it unlikely that they find a TE that will move the needle without a ton of luck.  If they are looking at Pitts?  Sure, but I'm not sure there is anybody like that in this class.  

I like Carter a bunch, but still think it's pretty likely they will draft another back later on.  Moore seems like a very nice piece.  Hopefully they keep them coming.   

[Hex]

1 minute ago, #27TheDominator said:

I think everybody is blowing the TE thing way out of proportion.  Will they have a new TE next year?  I'm sure at least one.  Do I think it is a huge hole?  Nah.  I think it is more important to get another playmaker.  Doesn't matter if it is WR, RB or TE.  I tend to think it unlikely that they find a TE that will move the needle without a ton of luck.  If they are looking at Pitts?  Sure, but I'm not sure there is anybody like that in this class.  

I like Carter a bunch, but still think it's pretty likely they will draft another back later on.  Moore seems like a very nice piece.  Hopefully they keep them coming.   

The reason the TE hole seems so big is because the Shanahan system being ran relies on a good TE

[Doggin94it]

6 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

I hope you are right mccganan seemed to think they were prime postilions.

Douglas has made very clear he doesn't share that view

[jgb]

9 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

I hope you are right mccganan seemed to think they were prime postilions.

If Mel Kiper said a parking attendant was "The Best Player in the Draft!" Macc would've made him a Jet. Would not surprise me if teams drafting after the Jets ran misinformation campaigns to build buzz around guys they had no interest in as "the best player in the draft" to get Macc to bite. Kind of like how you always nominate guys you don't want in auction re-draft leagues to get other owners to blow their wads.

[slimjasi]

40 minutes ago, jgb said:

Maybe I'm in the minority but I think our defense is much farther from being fixed than our O. I really do we believe we are competent or better QB play away from being entertaining and competitive on offense. The defense, bigger project IMHO.

Absolutely. 

The defense needs a lot of work. The offense has some guys I am really excited about. 

[Beerfish]

5 minutes ago, Doggin94it said:

Douglas has made very clear he doesn't share that view

So far so good but as I've said when your prize head coach who is a D guy has his D be epically bad things change